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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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The Bible Doesn't Say Anything
- Thread starter Papa Zoom
- Start date
th1b.taylor
Member
MarkT,
It is sad that you have not eated yourself under a teacher that will teach you the truth of the Bema Seat Judgement and the differences between it and the Great White Throne Judgments but you can find the teaching with a Strongs and the scriptures but it takes an intense will to do it.
It is sad that you have not eated yourself under a teacher that will teach you the truth of the Bema Seat Judgement and the differences between it and the Great White Throne Judgments but you can find the teaching with a Strongs and the scriptures but it takes an intense will to do it.
After being taught by God, I don't need another teacher. Christ is my Teacher.
Papa Zoom
CF Ambassador
That is well said Douglas. Jesus washed the feet of the Disciples. The lowest job there was in that culture: a lowly servant's job. Then Jesus said, go and do likewise. It's clear He wasn't saying to go out and wash people's feet. He was teaching them something about humility for one, and service for another. No act is to lowly for a follower of Jesus. Give a cup of cold water in Jesus' name can be a literal thing, or it can be spiritualist. I think God wants us to see both.
Papa Zoom
CF Ambassador
This thread has lost it's way now and may have to be closed. I think the "lawn" example is exhausted. My original point in the OP had to do with how we as humans with biased filters, read the Bible and can often walk away with the wrong understanding. Some read it "plainly" and do nothing further than a superficial reading. Some dig deep. You cannot get a solid theology from verses. You get a solid theology from the whole counsel of God. That's Old and New working together. It takes years to understand some of the concepts the Bible lays out. Some ideas take minutes to get.
Speaking for myself, the person I trust least when it comes to fully understanding God's word is me. No I do not discount the Holy Spirits work in my life. But maybe the Holy Spirit will be able to help me more if I see the council of those who have studied the deeper things of the faith. Iron sharpens Iron.
Speaking for myself, the person I trust least when it comes to fully understanding God's word is me. No I do not discount the Holy Spirits work in my life. But maybe the Holy Spirit will be able to help me more if I see the council of those who have studied the deeper things of the faith. Iron sharpens Iron.
th1b.taylor
Member
MarkT,
I sought not to offend but I could make the same snarky remark in the opposite but I have promised the mods to cease with the practice. God ordains Preachers, Deacons and Teachers and all manor of servants in His service. If you have not the zeal for humility, you might have an issue. I have taken the pulpit in times of need but I was ordained of God to be a teacher and nothing more. A good example of the submission God desires from each of us, is unknown to the members of these forums is my reaction to being rebuked by the mods here.
Very recently I was banned and I said nothing about and then the mod that banned me reversed their decision because they had misread the posts, a common human error.
Your answer placing you over everybody else is not supported by the whole of the scriptures and I pray you will do a study o the issue. May God bless that study.
th1b.taylor
Member
Great and timely post Papa.
The Bible does not talk to us!!
We tend to say things like, "The Bible says", or even "Me reading the Bible is God talking to me." Of course that is wrong and we need to understand what does actually happen. The Bible is a book, or you can call it a collection of books in a single book, but it is not God talking to you! However it tells you that God wants to talk to you, and God wants you to listen to Him. That is the main point in the book.
The Lord once told me, "Karl, we don't have understanding because we don't read the Bible is understanding but our understanding, understand?"
Now we see that different Christians have different things to say. One of the reasons, and it's not the only reason, is that we don't seek the Lord when we read and study the Bible. In that case we wind up leaning on our own understanding, instead of His. Of course that is not the only reason, but we should understand that can and is a problem. The Bible explains that we should not lean on our own understanding, but perhaps we didn't read it or take it to heart. So we call ourselves an expert, and started drawing people to ourselves instead of telling them to seek the Lord for understanding.
Again, there are other reasons that all Christians are not saying the same thing. Another reason is that we all know in part. We do communion and we break apart the bread and each of us eats a different piece, yet sometimes we still think that all Christians should sound the same. Jesus, the Word of God, said that He was the bread that came down out of heaven, and we have and partake of different pieces. So I have pieces, like the little piece on understanding I quoted above.
That brings us to another reason that Christians don't always say the same thing. We have different purposes in the body. Paul talked about there being different members of the body. And God uses His body. For example, we see that God corrects those He loves so it is not surprising that God had someone write the OP, about the Bible not speaking. If I see Christians thinking the Bible actually speaks to us, instead of God being able to speak to us, then a correction is needed, because they are not actually looking to God but to the Bible which is a valuable bit of writing from God, but it is not God. It should be obvious, and it would be if we were actually listening to the Lord like we should.
If we do sit down and seek the voice of the Lord while reading the Bible, and listen to Him talking to us about the Bible, how then could you ever think the Bible is God speaking to you? The first words He ever told me were, "Read Your Bible!", so He obviously was not the Bible but the One who says "Read your Bible". The difference is obvious, when you start listening to Him. If also becomes obvious that those people who wrote the Bible were listening to the same One that tells us to read it, but that means the Bible doesn't talk to us, God does.
Nice OP.
Yes, I agree.
My only point in this thread is that we ought to recognize our role in interpretation. Call it whatever you like. I read the Bible and it "says" something to me. But it's my brain that is decoding the words and my brain that is assigning meaning to the text. Yes, the Holy Spirit is a guide toward truth but most of us get something wrong in our theology. Most of us have slightly changed or altered our view on something in the Bible. I used to believe that baptism was part of what saves a person. I no longer do. What changed? We all get in the way of fully understanding what God has communicated in that book.
If you think this title is provocative, wait until the next one. I'll probably get burned at the stake!2
I like this post, but is it our role in interpretation or God's role in interpretation?
We have been given life and the ability to think, and God gives us choices, which require us to think. So we do have thoughts and ideas, but our thoughts are not His thoughts! We need to seek His voice, which is not the Bible. His voice was spoken to those who wrote the Bible, so it is certainly worth reading and studying, but that does not and should not replace a personal relationship with Him.
The Lord once told me, "Karl, we hear wisdom but is it hearing it or acting upon it that makes a man wise?"
Those who wrote the bible heard wisdom also, and they acted upon it. They wrote down what they were told to write down. They wrote down things like:
Prov 1:20 Wisdom shouts in the street, She lifts her voice in the square.
and Prov 1:23 Turn to my reproof, Behold, I will pour out my spirit on you; I will make my words know to you.
So if we turn to Him (Wisdom) He will send He will pour out His spirit on you and then He will make His words know to you. Therefore the reading the Bible (which is not spirit) is not His words poured out on you, but the those words that come from His Spirit (the small voice of God) is His words poured out on you. And we find those words, in our heart and on our lips (Rm 10:8), and that is the "word of faith" which we are preaching. (also Rm 10:8)
So if on our lips, then of course we would hear wisdom in the street, and in the square, just like king Solomon, who listened to the voice of the Lord, explained. Yet some insist that it is in a book and not in our heart and on our lips like the Bible explains. So they read the Book but did not find wisdom because they were looking in the wrong place. They were seeking the Book instead of the Lord.
Jesus explained this to them, Jn 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me, and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.
So again, I really liked the OP and what Papa Zoom has to say, including "we ought to recognize our role in interpretation". But our role is to seek the Lord for His interpretation!! That is why we can not think the Bible is God talking to us, and instead must understand that God talks to us, but are we seeking Him? Do we understand the God speaks? Or are we seeking the Scriptures thinking in them we have life, instead of going to Him?
Is 1:2 Listen, O heavens, and hear, O earth; For the Lord speaks
Note: it does not says the Bible speaks, it says the Lord speaks!
So does the Bible say? Well, in the sense used above, but the Bible does not speak and talk to us. The Lord does that.
th1b.taylor
Member
In mulling it over, just your statement screams for God to intervene and to lead you to a good teacher and couple that with you statement that there is not a First or the Bema Seat Judgment proclaims your need for a learned Teacher/Preacher. And humility is a learned trait, it is not natural to any man.
Jim Parker
Member
So, in your opinion, slander of believers in other denominations is "truth."
If a major doctrine of the church you attend is "What's wrong with them damn KATH-licks", I suggest you find a church that preaches the Gospel that says "love one another" instead of "hate those people".
It would be really nice to find a "Christian" forum where there are no people who practice hatred of other Christians as essential to their "Christian witness."
Just my opinion.
Also, please consider from the ToS:
7) Do not post opinions of another member's claim of Christian faith. (ToS 2.4)
Publicly judging someone as not being a Christian and/or not following Christ unless they themselves claim not be a Christian is disallowed. That's between them and the Lord. This includes judgments against collective beliefs or groups in general.
Maybe this tread has run its course.
Have a great day.
iakov the fool
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Jim Parker
Member
be still my heart
ezra
Member
do you need cheese and crackers with that whine ? do you believe in a work based salvation do you believe in praying to anyone else other than Jesus ? your getting pretty brass i pointed out the post was made in sept 3rd this is october 19. i asked why it was brought up again . might i draw your attention to the fact i had not commented on that post since. . so why was it dug up ? { with them damn KATH-licks",} would you be swearing ? i am not afraid to address the issue
Jim Parker
Member
I believe what Jesus said:
John 5:28-29 (NKJV) … the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.
I believe what Jesus said:
Mat 6:9 In this manner, therefore, pray: Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name.
That's Jesus telling us to pray to the FATHER, not to Him.
Yes. I see that you do not hesitate and are not at all afraid to show your hatred for people who do not practice their faith exactly as you do. And you show your hatred in spite of the fact that Jesus commanded that we love one another; (Jhn 13:34) love our neighbors; (Mat 22:39 )and even love our enemies. (Mat 5:44)
Maybe you haven't read the following: (1 John 2:10-11) He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
And:
(Mat 7:1-2) Judge not, that you be not judged. For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.
But, as you have pointed out, you are not afraid to tell people how to act in direct opposition to the command of Jesus whom you are not afraid to call your Lord. Apparently, you think you have superior knowledge than the wisdom and truth of the Lord and are eager to share it.
Good luck with that.
iakov the fool