The bible is about God's power not man's

[jasoncran]

I dont accept the calvinstic view, but i do believe that the Lord does know our choices ere we make them, Peter was told that he would deny jesus, did he still have that choice or did God do it for him. God has the ability to see where we cant where our decision will lead. Think about it this way. We watch the cops videos and then listen to the mistakes or good these they(cops) did, they video is much like how God sees it. He knows the scene but doesnt intervene in the choices made. However without making this too complicated he can change the outcome.

for example if I choose to sin right now and take a trusty m-16 and shoot say sparrowhawke, i still love ya had to think something, God could stop the act, yes, or no, his right, or he could allow the bullet to take sparrow home. My choice to sin isnt stopped. Now we could go on and on with this, but yall get the point. We still have the choice to sin or not sin, especially in christ, ie liberty. An unbeliever will sin because of his/her unredeemed nature but he's still held accountable in the judgement. So free will is never overridden but the power and desire to do good is given to the believer. The spanish word for will is the word PODER(POWER), and in latin it's almost the same. Though the Lord does gives the desire to do his will, but still we must have the choice and be willing to obey. If the will isnt there then the why is there obediance, as we would be ( i hate to use robot, so i say something from a sci-fi show)replicators, whose will was controlled by humanoid queen replicator.

jason

 

[Sparkey]

for example if I choose to sin right now and take a trusty m-16 and shoot say sparrowhawke, i still love ya had to think something, God could stop the act, yes, or no, his right, or he could allow the bullet to take sparrow home. My choice to sin isnt stopped.

:shocked!
<<Sparrow's choice to sin would be though>>
:

 

[follower of Christ]

Mans limited free will
Wm Tipton

Assertions/Conclusions of this Article
To show that it is impossible that God forcibly 'controls' the actions of all men and women.

Supporting Evidence.
Here we see Jesus telling Peter that he would deny Him three times before the next morning came.

Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.
(Mat 26:34 KJV)

G720
á¼€ÃÂνέομαι
arneomai
ar-neh'-om-ahee
Perhaps from G1 (as a negative particle) and the middle of G4483; to contradict, that is, disavow, reject, abnegate: - deny, refuse.

Now, some false doctrines teach that God 'controls' mans actions and that man has no free will of himself.
One internet source I recent came across said this

Forum poster: "And here is an example of God's will:
34 Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, That this night, before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.

So in this persons mind GOD is the source of Peters denying Christ. Rather than simply understanding that God foreknew it would happen, this person and their doctrine basically say that Peter did it for lack of choice in the matter. Meaning that GOD had to be the one causing Peter to deny Christ, ie God 'denied' Himself THROUGH the man Peter.
Im certain few will agree to the obvious conclusion, that their doctrinal view states that, but the conclusion is clear enough.

But we see that scripture says that He CANNOT deny Himself.

If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
(2Ti 2:12-13 KJV)


G533
ἀÀαÃÂνέομαι
aparneomai
ap-ar-neh'-om-ahee
From G575 and G720; to deny utterly, that is, disown, abstain: - deny.

Notice that 'deny' in the second verse is from G720, the word used in the first verse cited, so these words are very much related in intent. They arent two entirely different concepts.

Christ is faithful. GOD is faithful. He CANNOT deny Himself....yet *IF* these false doctrines were true then we have a situation where GOD is directly 'denying' Himself THROUGH Peter *IF* GOD is controlling Peter in any way. This simply cannot be the case given that God CANNOT deny Himself.

God CANNOT go against His own nature and He cannot lie.

in hope of eternal life which God, who cannot lie, promised before time itself,
(Tit 1:2 EMTV)

So it is against His nature to deny Himself, therefore He was not causing Peter to deny Him. He simply foreknew that it would occur.

http://assembly-ministries.org/studies/ ... d=1&t_id=5

 

[follower of Christ]

Mans choice to sin

Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone.
But each one is tempted by his own lusts, being drawn away and being seduced by them.
Then lust, when it conceives, gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
(Jas 1:13-15 )

What then shall we say? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Let it not be! We who died to sin, how shall we still live in it? Or are you ignorant that all who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?
Therefore, we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, so also we should walk in newness of life.

For if we have been joined together in the likeness of His death, so also shall we be in the resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be nullified,so that we no longer serve sin. For the one that died has been justified from sin.

But if we died with Christ, we believe that also we shall live with Him, knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more; death no longer lords it over Him. For in that He died, He died to sin once for all; but in that He lives, He lives to God. So also you count yourselves to be truly dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Then do not let sin reign in your mortal body, to obey it in its lusts.
Neither present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as one living from the dead, and your members instruments of righteousness to God. For your sin shall not lord it over you, for you are not under Law, but under grace.

What then? Shall we sin because we are not under Law, but under grace? Let it not be!

Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves as slaves for obedience, you are slaves to whom you obey, whether of sin to death, or obedience to righteousness?

But thanks be to God that you were slaves of sin, but you obeyed from the heart the form of doctrine to which you were delivered.
And having been set free from sin, you were enslaved to righteousness.
I speak as a man on account of the weakness of your flesh. For as you presented your members as slaves to uncleanness and to lawless act unto lawless act, so now yield your members as slaves to righteousness unto sanctification. For when you were slaves of sin, you were free as to righteousness.

Therefore what fruit did you have then in the things over which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. But now having been set free from sin, and having been enslaved to God, you have your fruit unto sanctification, and the end everlasting life. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is everlasting life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
(Rom 6:1-23 LITV)

http://assembly-ministries.org/studies/ ... d=1&t_id=4

 

[follower of Christ]

"Thy people shall be willing"
Wm Tipton

Assertions/Conclusions of this Article
To further show the free will of man

Supporting Evidence
The 'free will' offering was mentioned a time or two in scripture, so I got to looking to see if this word was presented in any context other than an offering

H5071
נדב×â€
nedâbâh
BDB Definition:
1) voluntariness, free-will offering
1a) voluntariness
1b) freewill, voluntary, offering
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by BDB/Strong’s Number: from H5068
Same Word by TWOT Number: 1299a

Oddly there are verses that contain it that show it relating to God....and some also to MAN outside of offerings..

Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
(Psalms 110:3 KJV)

"People shall be WILLING".
Same root word "nedâbâh" that is used for free will offerings in many other verses.
Apparently even OUTSIDE of offerings the word IS USED concerning man.
And what is interesting in the passage above is how the word is used and what the verse says.

A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. The LORD shall send the rod of thy strength out of Zion: rule thou in the midst of thine enemies. Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.
(Psalms 110:1-3 KJV)

Just as PAUL shows in Romans 6, we willingly SUBMIT ourselves....
His people WILLINGLY subject themselves to His rule. They dont have to be forced as some falsely preach here.

The word is also used here in reference to GOD whom we KNOW has free will....

I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him.
(Hosea 14:4 KJV)

In the SAME manner that GOD FREELY loves them MAN can FREELY be willing to subject himself to Gods rule...

http://assembly-ministries.org/studies/ ... m.php?id=1