The Dispensationalist 144,000
Followers of dispensationalism cannot easily get out of their mindset which demands a literal and physical interpretation of Revelation 7: 1-8 and Revelation 14: 1-5. Dispensationalists have long been saying that the 144,000 are to be all male Jewish virgins. I briefly looked on the Internet for "144,000" and all the sites did not follow the dispensationalist interpretation that the group will be made of only of Jews. Yet many Christians still believe the 144,000 will be all Jews.
God began his chosen people, or Israel, in the physical, that is, in the flesh. The chosen people were first those who were physical descendants of Abraham. Circumcision, which is in the flesh of men, was the sign of the Old Covenant. First, the Temple of God was a physical building. When God "turned things upside down" (Isaiah 29: 16), began the new Covenant (Jeremiah 31: 31-33, required everyone, including Jews, to be born again to enter into his kingdom (John 3: 1- 8) , translated about three thousand Jews on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2: 41), he then changed Israel from the physical or literal to the spiritual. He also fully revealed that Christ and the Holy Spirit operate in the
Godhead in dealing with believers. Entry into Israel was then no longer by genetics, but by belief in Christ. Circumcision was done away with as a mark of being an Israelite. God's temple became his people.
Physical Israel was translated into a new Israel. Dispensationalists will point out that the New Testament does not talk about a "spiritual Israel." Paul says in I Corinthians 10: 18 that "Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the alter?." If there is an Israel after the flesh, then there must be one not after the flesh.
There is an Israel not after the flesh, as Paul explains in Romans 9:8. He calls this Israel not after the flesh the children of the promise who are counted as the seed. In Romans 9: 8 that they which are the children of the flesh, talking about Israel, these are not the children of God.
The dispensationalists do not seem to want to be spiritual Israel, or Israel not after the flesh. I don't know what they do with I Peter 2: 9, which affirms that Christians are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation. Maybe they claim this verse applies only to Jewish Christians.
If you follow what Paul is saying in Romans 2, Romans 9 and Romans 11, you can see that God did not replace physical Israel with the "Church." Instead, he transformed physical Israel into Israel reborn in Jesus Christ. In Israel reborn in Christ there is neither Jew nor gentile, nor male or female, because anyone can enter in by belief, and must have a love of the truth to be saved (II Thessalonians 2: 3)
The key verses here are Romans 2: 28-29, Romans 9: 6-8 and all of Romans 11.
So, if "'they are not all Israel, which are of Israel" and "they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed" then all who are born again in Christ are Israel. That is, Paul is saying there are two Israels, one physical Israel which is not reborn and not saved, and Israel which is reborn and transformed in Christ and saved.
Since there is no longer a distinction between a physical Jew reborn in Christ and a Gentile reborn in Christ, then all saved people are of Israel. As in most other verses in the Book of Revelation which cannot be seen as being literal, verses 4 to 8 of Chapter seven can be viewed as saying that the 144,000 are the children of Israel, but not of physical Israel who have almost entirely rejected Christ, i.e. the Jews.
The issue of the dispensationalist claim that Romans 11: 26, saying all Israel shall be saved, means that all Jews will be saved, is part of the teaching by this theology that God has two distinctly different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in different ways. To the dispensationalists Israel cannot mean anything but the Jews. It also flows from the literalist system of the dispensationalists. Israel to them must always be ethnic Israel, saved or unsaved. In addition, for Paul to mean that all ethnic Israel will be saved contradicts what he says about unbelieving Jews being cut out of the good olive tree in Romans 11, and it also contradicts Matthew 8: 11-12.
Lets look at what the classical dispensationalists say.
Although there have been modifications made in this theology, what is called classical dispensationalism is most influential in the Churches and the most popular among Church members. Lets look at some of the statements made by classical dispensationalists.
On http://www.realapologetics.org/blog/...lism/#_ftnref3
they quote C. I. Scofield, the first classical American dispensationalist.
C.I. Scofield says "Israel is earthly, the church heavenly. One is natural the other spiritual. What pertains to Israel is to be interpreted in literalistic fashion. But what pertains to the church need not be so interpreted.[4]"
Jerusalem is always Jerusalem, Israel always Israel, Zion always Zion…Prophecies may never be spiritualized, but are always literal.[6]"
In 1936, Lewis S. Chafer, a classical dispensationalist, defined Scofield's literalism as "The outstanding characteristic of the dispensationalist is ... that he believes every statement of the Bible and gives to it the plain, natural meaning its words imply."
From: L. S. Chafer, ‘Dispensationalism,’ Bibliotheca Sacra, 93, October (1936), pp410, 417.
Charles C. Ryrie (born 1925) says of classical dispensationalism that the: "basic primise of Dispensationalism
is two purposes of God expressed
in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction
throughout eternity." Charles C. Ryrie, Dispensationalism Today, 1966,
pp.44-45.
J. Dwight Pentecost is another dispensationalist theologian who in his
book Things To Come ( 1965) says "The church and Israel are two
distinct groups with whom God has a divine plan. The church is a
mystery, unrevealed in the Old Testament. This mystery program must be
completed before God can resume His program with Israel and bring it
to completion. These considerations all arise from
a literal method of interpretation." (page 193, J. Dwight Pentecost,
Things To Come, Zondervan, 1965).... See More
For dispensationalists Christians cannot be spiritual Israel. The
classical dispensationalists - John Darby, C.I. Scofield, Lewis S.
Chafer and Charles C. Ryrie - insist that "Israel" in the Old
Testament always means physical or ethnic Israel, the descendants of
Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And - the Catholic Church did not replace
ethnic Israel. Ethnic Israel was reborn in Jesus Christ. It was
transformed rather than replaced.
The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church off the earth before the terrible events of the
tribulation begin is another well established doctrine of classical dispensationalism.
So is the doctrine that the Jews remain even now God's chosen people a central
teaching of dispensationalism.
Lets focus for now on the dispensationalist distinction between Israel, or the Jews, and the Church.
The teaching of this theology is that God has two different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in very different ways.
Followers of dispensationalism cannot easily get out of their mindset which demands a literal and physical interpretation of Revelation 7: 1-8 and Revelation 14: 1-5. Dispensationalists have long been saying that the 144,000 are to be all male Jewish virgins. I briefly looked on the Internet for "144,000" and all the sites did not follow the dispensationalist interpretation that the group will be made of only of Jews. Yet many Christians still believe the 144,000 will be all Jews.
God began his chosen people, or Israel, in the physical, that is, in the flesh. The chosen people were first those who were physical descendants of Abraham. Circumcision, which is in the flesh of men, was the sign of the Old Covenant. First, the Temple of God was a physical building. When God "turned things upside down" (Isaiah 29: 16), began the new Covenant (Jeremiah 31: 31-33, required everyone, including Jews, to be born again to enter into his kingdom (John 3: 1- 8) , translated about three thousand Jews on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2: 41), he then changed Israel from the physical or literal to the spiritual. He also fully revealed that Christ and the Holy Spirit operate in the
Godhead in dealing with believers. Entry into Israel was then no longer by genetics, but by belief in Christ. Circumcision was done away with as a mark of being an Israelite. God's temple became his people.
Physical Israel was translated into a new Israel. Dispensationalists will point out that the New Testament does not talk about a "spiritual Israel." Paul says in I Corinthians 10: 18 that "Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the alter?." If there is an Israel after the flesh, then there must be one not after the flesh.
There is an Israel not after the flesh, as Paul explains in Romans 9:8. He calls this Israel not after the flesh the children of the promise who are counted as the seed. In Romans 9: 8 that they which are the children of the flesh, talking about Israel, these are not the children of God.
The dispensationalists do not seem to want to be spiritual Israel, or Israel not after the flesh. I don't know what they do with I Peter 2: 9, which affirms that Christians are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation. Maybe they claim this verse applies only to Jewish Christians.
If you follow what Paul is saying in Romans 2, Romans 9 and Romans 11, you can see that God did not replace physical Israel with the "Church." Instead, he transformed physical Israel into Israel reborn in Jesus Christ. In Israel reborn in Christ there is neither Jew nor gentile, nor male or female, because anyone can enter in by belief, and must have a love of the truth to be saved (II Thessalonians 2: 3)
The key verses here are Romans 2: 28-29, Romans 9: 6-8 and all of Romans 11.
So, if "'they are not all Israel, which are of Israel" and "they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed" then all who are born again in Christ are Israel. That is, Paul is saying there are two Israels, one physical Israel which is not reborn and not saved, and Israel which is reborn and transformed in Christ and saved.
Since there is no longer a distinction between a physical Jew reborn in Christ and a Gentile reborn in Christ, then all saved people are of Israel. As in most other verses in the Book of Revelation which cannot be seen as being literal, verses 4 to 8 of Chapter seven can be viewed as saying that the 144,000 are the children of Israel, but not of physical Israel who have almost entirely rejected Christ, i.e. the Jews.
The issue of the dispensationalist claim that Romans 11: 26, saying all Israel shall be saved, means that all Jews will be saved, is part of the teaching by this theology that God has two distinctly different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in different ways. To the dispensationalists Israel cannot mean anything but the Jews. It also flows from the literalist system of the dispensationalists. Israel to them must always be ethnic Israel, saved or unsaved. In addition, for Paul to mean that all ethnic Israel will be saved contradicts what he says about unbelieving Jews being cut out of the good olive tree in Romans 11, and it also contradicts Matthew 8: 11-12.
Lets look at what the classical dispensationalists say.
Although there have been modifications made in this theology, what is called classical dispensationalism is most influential in the Churches and the most popular among Church members. Lets look at some of the statements made by classical dispensationalists.
On http://www.realapologetics.org/blog/...lism/#_ftnref3
they quote C. I. Scofield, the first classical American dispensationalist.
C.I. Scofield says "Israel is earthly, the church heavenly. One is natural the other spiritual. What pertains to Israel is to be interpreted in literalistic fashion. But what pertains to the church need not be so interpreted.[4]"
Jerusalem is always Jerusalem, Israel always Israel, Zion always Zion…Prophecies may never be spiritualized, but are always literal.[6]"
In 1936, Lewis S. Chafer, a classical dispensationalist, defined Scofield's literalism as "The outstanding characteristic of the dispensationalist is ... that he believes every statement of the Bible and gives to it the plain, natural meaning its words imply."
From: L. S. Chafer, ‘Dispensationalism,’ Bibliotheca Sacra, 93, October (1936), pp410, 417.
Charles C. Ryrie (born 1925) says of classical dispensationalism that the: "basic primise of Dispensationalism
is two purposes of God expressed
in the formation of two peoples who maintain their distinction
throughout eternity." Charles C. Ryrie, Dispensationalism Today, 1966,
pp.44-45.
J. Dwight Pentecost is another dispensationalist theologian who in his
book Things To Come ( 1965) says "The church and Israel are two
distinct groups with whom God has a divine plan. The church is a
mystery, unrevealed in the Old Testament. This mystery program must be
completed before God can resume His program with Israel and bring it
to completion. These considerations all arise from
a literal method of interpretation." (page 193, J. Dwight Pentecost,
Things To Come, Zondervan, 1965).... See More
For dispensationalists Christians cannot be spiritual Israel. The
classical dispensationalists - John Darby, C.I. Scofield, Lewis S.
Chafer and Charles C. Ryrie - insist that "Israel" in the Old
Testament always means physical or ethnic Israel, the descendants of
Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And - the Catholic Church did not replace
ethnic Israel. Ethnic Israel was reborn in Jesus Christ. It was
transformed rather than replaced.
The pre-tribulation rapture of the Church off the earth before the terrible events of the
tribulation begin is another well established doctrine of classical dispensationalism.
So is the doctrine that the Jews remain even now God's chosen people a central
teaching of dispensationalism.
Lets focus for now on the dispensationalist distinction between Israel, or the Jews, and the Church.
The teaching of this theology is that God has two different peoples, the Jews and the Church, with whom he deals in very different ways.
