The earth restored
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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J
Joe Domingo
Guest
You agree with the 7 days as 7000 years or that we see it differently? Not sure which you meant.
When we say a day is as a 1000 years doesn't if follow that what we call a year is 365 days or 365,000 years?
You agree with the 7 days as 7000 years or that we see it differently? Not sure which you meant.
I agree with you that 7 days is 7000 years.
The seventh day of rest is the 7000 th year from Adam.
Which ties in with -
After two days He will revive us; On the third day He will raise us up, That we may live in His sight. Hosea 6:2
JLB
You agree with the 7 days as 7000 years or that we see it differently? Not sure which you meant.
I agree with you that 7 days is 7000 years.
The seventh day of rest is the 7000 th year from Adam.
Which ties in with -
After two days He will revive us; On the third day He will raise us up, That we may live in His sight. Hosea 6:2
JLB
I see the scripture in Hosea as after the 2-1/2 years of tribulation, God will raise Israel back up after they are corrected very severely. They will be given some respite during the Day of the Lord (the last year of the 3-1/2) because they have repented and returned to God.
J
Joe Domingo
Guest
According to my chart, every year is accounted for in the Bible until Christ. From then on we use the Julian/Gregorian calendar to keep track.
So we have another 89 years to go before the Millenium.
Think my wife and I will get that 2013 528 BMW after all;)
If you haven't already done so, click on the link below, see it's my signature, to see my chart.
I AM NOT SETTING DATES!!!!!!!!!!
It is very possible that there will be one more president in the U.S. -
Isa 3:12 As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.
But, it is also possible that the current conditions could precipitate a war between Israel and Hezbollah that will result in a reset of conditions in the Mid-East. This could bring about a peace agreement brokered by a peace loving Pope, who would then go down to Jerusalem.
1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
Mat 24:16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
Mat 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
Mat 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
The the G.T. will break out.
It is very possible that there will be one more president in the U.S. -
Isa 3:12 As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.
But, it is also possible that the current conditions could precipitate a war between Israel and Hezbollah that will result in a reset of conditions in the Mid-East. This could bring about a peace agreement brokered by a peace loving Pope, who would then go down to Jerusalem.
1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
Mat 24:16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
Mat 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
Mat 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
The the G.T. will break out.
Says NOTHING about removing a curse, says He won't curse the ground again. Means He won't curse the ground for a second time...
Gen 8:21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done.
Gen 8:22 While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.
Also states that He will not destroy every living thing. It nowhere says the orignal curse was lifted...
Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
Ever pick blackberries? Ever seen a crabapple tree? I have to fight thistles in my yard every year. The curse is not lifted yet.
The prophets you quoted pertained to the national covt people of the temporary time of of Israel, not as a foundational axiom for all the earth.
Re: droughts in the Midwest; and cursing God for this present life and earth; perhaps one could take an example from Job.
If the kingdom of the Creator and of life had been declared to be entrusted among men and Jesus taught the binding and loosing in heaven and thus earth, could the "droughts" be as much the result of mens [the futurist "church" and atheists] false doctrines of cursing the present earth and present life as well as other practices stemming from disbelief , disregard for and denial of the creator as anything else???
Or could it just be a 2-3 weather pattern to cause reconsideration of possible abuse of the land and resources.
Not saying it is; but that a couple yrs of drought is NOT confirmatory of a continuation of a cursed earth, especially in light of the action and declaration of God to the contrary. Perhaps a call to consider the population and mans stewardship of the land.
Thanks for the discussion and exposure.
Re: droughts in the Midwest; and cursing God for this present life and earth; perhaps one could take an example from Job.
If the kingdom of the Creator and of life had been declared to be entrusted among men and Jesus taught the binding and loosing in heaven and thus earth, could the "droughts" be as much the result of mens [the futurist "church" and atheists] false doctrines of cursing the present earth and present life as well as other practices stemming from disbelief , disregard for and denial of the creator as anything else???
Or could it just be a 2-3 weather pattern to cause reconsideration of possible abuse of the land and resources.
Not saying it is; but that a couple yrs of drought is NOT confirmatory of a continuation of a cursed earth, especially in light of the action and declaration of God to the contrary. Perhaps a call to consider the population and mans stewardship of the land.
Thanks for the discussion and exposure.
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It always makes one think and delve into God's Word when we read viewpoints that are not in line with our own. Thanks for that.
As far as the prophets only writing to Israel for that time, there are many references to gentile nations that has never occurred...
Isa 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
H1471
גּי גּוי
gôy gôy
go'ee, go'-ee
Apparently from the same root as H1465 (in the sense of massing); a foreign nation; hence a Gentile; also (figuratively) a troop of animals, or a flight of locusts: - Gentile, heathen, nation, people.
Isa 66:18 For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.
This has not occured in the history of China or India or any number of nations.
Zec 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Same word here H1471. Now there are many gentile nations that do not keep the Feast of Tabernacles.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
How much of al flesh is keeping the Sabbath today? Not much (I am tempted to throw in a "you" here. If you are a fan of NPR you will get this, if not it pertains to a weekly radio program.) but it says here that ALL flesh will keep the Sabbath. Currently you find a few here and a few there.
And thanks for the acknowledgment.
This is where one's hermeneutic foundations come into play and a consideration of the time constraints of the prophets to national Israel. [Acts 3:22-24; 1 Cor 10:11]
Most of the prophets being in a form of poetry need to be considered in their genre as poetic language which are not, nor intended to be as literal or concise as if they were a historical narrative. They also are intended to be most understood to the people whom experience their fulfillment and in the intent and spirit of their fulfilment. 2 cor 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
I'll give a couple examples which I've recently considered.
Regardless of what fulfillment one applies or understands from this passage, the section in vs 20 if demanded to be literal would imply that at the time of this fulfillment, either the peoples beds will shorten or they would find themselves in a land [such as in the aborigine tribes] where the peoples beds are shorter than their bodies. But from the viewpoint of the soul and spirit, those who are ruling over [Jews/Judaizers] this people [christians] in Jerusalem [the oppression of the judaizers (Isaiah 59)] would become so insecure during the final events as to curl up in a fetal position due to the premonitions of the signs during those days.
Another:
Was the moon prophesied to actually speak it's confusion and the sun it's shame... or is this poetically referring to leaders of the unbelieving group.?
So also is the fulfillment of the verses you mentioned. They are [were] fulfilled from the subjective perspective of the believing group and from their mindset and at the time of the establishing of the Everlasting Covenant by the Creator incarnate. Example; keeping the feast of tabernacles can poetically and subjectively refer [to the believing and freed soul and spirit] to 'keeping' the meaning that the feast of tabernacles prophesied and fore-typed. Part of that is the indwelling of the intent, spirit and truth of God made known through Christ within the tabernacles of the living tents of our bodies. [Feast of tabernacles] It may not have to refer to a physical 'going up' and keeping the feast of tabernacles, but of God keeping the feast of tabernacles through the indwelling of His spirit life after and through the Worship of God due to the freedom FROM continued religious rituals [such as the feast of tabernacles] experienced in the New Covenant.
This principle is established in Isaiah 29:4. Vss 1-4 speak of the seige through the Romans and then later in the middle of the chapter, I believe talks both about the retribution on the nations for their warfare against national Israel AND prophecies protection for those who continue to war against the sons/daughters of faith [Spiritual children of Jesus/Israel] in the Creator and blesser of all life.
Here in vs 4 he says:
4 And thou [ARIEL or Jerusalem] shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be, as of one that hath a familiar spirit, out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust.
Here DESOLATE Jerusalem [of the ended mosaic covenant] is said to SPEAK from the Dust. The poetic understanding of "SPEAKING" is that the events which transpired there [including the teachings and work of Christ and the desolation of the temple/city and judgment upon those principles, elements] become JERUSALEM in the subjective perspective of the hearts of the individual believers of those days. Elsewhere [Is 65] he says that he will make Jerusalem a 'rejoicing'. It's due to the incarnation and visitation of the Prince of Peace as well as the judgment and ending on the temporary militant, ritualistic, conditional law. See also Isaiah 61:2,3 where the beauty of the lives [tabernacles] of the freed and beloved, and the ashes of the temple/city would be joy, oil, garment of praise and the glorification of the Lord.
The last verse in that Isaiah 29 says that those who erred would come to understanding.
This is a most applicable verse for today as we seek to come to the unity of the faith and seek to come under the ONE HEAD
2 other verses you mentioned come from Isaiah 66 which along with Is 65, I find to have first century application.
Is 66:1-3; Though the temple is still standing at that time, and though he established their temporary ordinances for his purposes in their time, Now, [after Christ fulfilled the purposes of the rituals and eradicated the law of sin/death] to sacrifice a lamb is as if one killed the family dog. He that kills an ox, as if he kills a man; ...... to continue in the mosaic covt blood sacrifices is an abomination. But the resisters [Christians] would be 'cast out' of national Israel by their 'brothers' saying that they were 'glorifying the Lord'. He [Jesus/God] would appear [Heb 10:37; 9:28] to their joy, but the judaizers, sacrificers and persisters in the hope of the mosaic covt ritualism or participants in the continuation and re-invention of the ordinances of the nation, would be ashamed.
VS 5: According to Josephus' accounts. in the years before the desolation, a man named "Jesus" roamed through the city proclaiming woe to it and it's inhabitants....... and a voice was heard from the temple saying something like "let's get out here".
The birth of the man-child is the birth of the new covenant ordinances and 'christian nation' [with a new name Is 65:15] out of the mosaic covenant "Mother". [Isaiah 66:7-10] I believe it's called a 'man-child' because there was a 40 yr gestation period, pre-typed and anti-typed by the 40 yrs of the formation of the mosaic covt under Moses.
One other interesting verse which flies in direct contradiction to the perspective that the global earth and mankind remains 'cursed' is in Isaiah 65:16,17ff.
Remember, Jerusalem from the mosaic covenant speaks from the Dust of the earth, [Is 29:4] and the rejoicing and Glorification of God in Isaiah 61 is the new temple of the lives of sons/daughters in place of the ashes of the old temple.
Several sections [if not most of the whole book] of Isaiah are rich, if not devoted to prophecies pertaining to the transition time between the ending of the mosaic covt and the fulfilled establishment of the Everlasting covt and the proving of the entity of God of peace to all peoples.
Is 29:24 They also that erred in spirit shall come to understanding, and they that murmured shall learn doctrine;
Is 65:16 That he who blesseth himself in the earth shall bless himself in the God of truth; and he that sweareth in the earth shall swear by the God of truth; because the former troubles are forgotten, and because they are hid from mine eyes.
Have a good weekend. Will check back later.
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This would certainly be true of Jesus as His role as The Prophet when speaking to the generation that will see Him coming in the clouds, in Matthew 24.
Especially since he is the One being referred to in His prophecy.
...and that He may send Jesus Christ, who was preached to you before, 21 whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began. Acts 3:20-21
whom heaven must receive until ...
By saying until, there is a pointing to of a time when He will return and restore all things.
These restoring indicates first the removal of those that would cause the need for restoring.
As Jesus teaches us in His Olivet Discourse -
31 "When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. Matthew 25:31-32
All the nations will be gathered before Him!
41 Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
By removing those who are cursed, the restoration of all things can commence.
Something to look forward too when comes in His glory and is admired among the saints.
JLB
These objections were addressed in previous posts and other threads.
Perhaps these perspectives are part of the erring in spirit in order to learn correct doctrine and understanding.
Isaiah 29:24 They also that erred in spirit shall come to understanding, and they that murmured shall learn doctrine.
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Where the spirit of error seems to dominate the preterist doctrine is in the fact that preterism teaches that the resurrection is past, as well as jesus Christ has returned in 70 AD.
The simple truth is found in Daniel 9:26-27.
JLB