The Gap Theory

[Pard]

I hate to DP, but...

Josh,

I don't think the Bible gives enough information to draw a solid conclusion to your question.

"surface of the deep" is the key word here. If you look in the margins of your NASB (I'm doing it right now) you will see that "deep" has an asterisk which says "wastelands". From some of the more extensive commentaries I have found that many scholars think "water" and "deep", in this passage, are one and the same. So water is another word for deep.

My other feeling here is that Genesis 1:2 is describing the state of earth at the moment before God began making things and so this is the form in which the earth was created, that is covered in a "wasteland" of waters.

I agree Jason. Why I like to get a gauge on peoples thoughts about creation and the flood and such. I can kind of figure out what stage of spiritual life they are at.

 

[freeway]

As far as I can see, the only real reason for the gap theory (as well as the day=age theory) is to reconcile the biblical creation account with the theory that the earth is billions of years old. The only reason for that, in turn, is to accomodate the theory of evolution. I don't see anything in the text itself that supports either the gap or day=age theories.

Agree... If the gap theory is true, then there was death before the fall of man. But the bible says sin/death enter in thought the fall of man... So was God just joking about death came in because of Adam??? I think not.... no gap for me...

 

[Scotth1960]

Who here believes in The Gap Theory

Dear Lewis W. No. I do not believe in "The Gap Theory". Who was the first person to teach it, and why teach it? Isn't it useless, pointless speculation?
In Erie PA Scott Harrington

 

[Pizzaguy]

As far as I can see, the only real reason for the gap theory (as well as the day=age theory) is to reconcile the biblical creation account with the theory that the earth is billions of years old. The only reason for that, in turn, is to accomodate the theory of evolution. I don't see anything in the text itself that supports either the gap or day=age theories.

I don't see how you can say that the ONLY reason to make the earth billions of years old is the theory of evolution. Evolution needs billions of years, you are right, but God can do it in ten minutes or a billion years.

Four billion years sounds like infinity to my mind... and God is infinite to my mind as well. 6,000 years my mind can grasp - just seems odd that people think they can grasp what God did.

God lives outside of space and time, time means little to him. And how long He "took to create" means little to me.

 

[Theofilus]

I don't see how you can say that the ONLY reason to make the earth billions of years old is the theory of evolution. Evolution needs billions of years, you are right, but God can do it in ten minutes or a billion years.

Four billion years sounds like infinity to my mind... and God is infinite to my mind as well. 6,000 years my mind can grasp - just seems odd that people think they can grasp what God did.

God lives outside of space and time, time means little to him. And how long He "took to create" means little to me.

He said in His word that He did it in 6 literal 24 hour days and that death entered the world as a result of sin. The first sin happened sometime (we don't know exactly how long) after the sixth day (i.e. after the entire creation was finished).

 

[Elijah674]

I don't see how you can say that the ONLY reason to make the earth billions of years old is the theory of evolution. Evolution needs billions of years, you are right, but God can do it in ten minutes or a billion years.

Four billion years sounds like infinity to my mind... and God is infinite to my mind as well. 6,000 years my mind can grasp - just seems odd that people think they can grasp what God did.

God lives outside of space and time, time means little to him. And how long He "took to create" means little to me.

Hey, God spake & it stood fast say's David, Job say's that God hung the Earth on nothing!
OK: You go get a piece of rock from the heavens that God just spake into existeance, how old is it? Well, back to earth then!
OK: Then say Adam has just been created? How old was he then?

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

He said in His word that He did it in 6 literal 24 hour days and that death entered the world as a result of sin. The first sin happened sometime (we don't know exactly how long) after the sixth day (i.e. after the entire creation was finished).

We know that God cannot lie, therefore it is imperitive that we have a correct understanding of what is ment in scripture in texts like the one pinned by Paul in Romans about death through Adam and life through Jesus. Clearly death entered the human arrangement or world due to the action of Adam, BUT that has no bearing on when and if death had entered the prior creation of God through perhaps the sin of another, the satan maybe. Adam's sin is LIKELY not the first sin, although his sin marks the beginning of human sin (did Eve not sin when she first partook of the forbidden fruit BTW?).

We know this:

1 In the beginning The God created the heavens and the earth. 2 But the earth was unsightly and unfinished, darkness covered its depths, and God’s Breath moved over its waters. 3 Then,

The question is how quickly after the heavens and earth were created did God begin His 6 days of activity.

 

[Theofilus]

The question is how quickly after the heavens and earth were created did God begin His 6 days of activity.

There is nothing in the Bible that indicates any time at all. The only reason, like I said, for inserting such a pause in God's creative activity, is to reconcile the biblical account of creation with the theory of evolution. People are, apparently, not ready to say that the scientists are wrong, so they change the Bible instead to fit what evolution teaches.

 

[Scotth1960]

There is nothing in the Bible that indicates any time at

all. The only reason, like I said, for inserting such a pause in God's creative

activity,

is to reconcile the biblical account of creation with the theory of evolution.

People

are, apparently, not ready to say that the scientists are wrong, so they change

the

Bible instead to fit what evolution teaches.

Dear Theofilus, There is no reason to doubt God's Word in Genesis. 6 days. 1

day of rest. 24 hour days. No macroevolution. Some microevolution WITHIN

species, not between species. Variation within a species, micro-evolution, yes.

God did it all, which is the important thing to note.

And it was (is) all good, very good. Then God rested.

Piltdown men shows the evolutionists will manufacture fake evidence, which

is no real evidence at all, in search of missing links and alleged common ancestors

of apes and men. No real ape-men, only "ape-men" (sic) so-called. Man is not

an ape. Or from ape/men hybrids. In Erie Scott

 

[reba]

One of the really cool teachings of dispensationalism is the time in Gen 2 is not
literal


Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.


Yet it is in Rev

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,



Love the continuity :yes

 

[Tailgunner]

I don't believe the Gap Theory. For one thing, it assumes too much that's not mentioned in the Bible, and it also seems to contradict Scripture when it says that "God saw that it was good". As Freeway mentioned in post #22, the Gap Theory assumes the existence of sin and death before the creation of Adam.

Josh mentioned that the Gap theory could be viable because it's mentioned nowhere that God created water. While that's true, in the first verse it says God created the heavens and the earth. That includes water, and also there's some doubt about what that means exactly. Does the face of the water, or deep, mean the earth? Does it mean something larger? Because it also mentions in verse 6 that God said "let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters".

Another reason I take the first chapters of Genesis to be literal history is that when the Law was delivered to Moses at Sinai, the commandment to remember the sabbath and keep it holy gives the reason why we are to do so. Exodus 20:8-11.

Overall, an interesting discussion, and I look forward to seeing more.

TG

 

[jasoncran]

we are trying to reconcile bible with science, the account maybe literal but its so lacking in how the lord did it that we are told that means how he did it,just that he did it.

we cant fully understand how the lord did it, i dont think he wanted to tell us.

 

[Scotth1960]

Agree... If the gap theory is true, then there was death

before the fall of man. But the bible says sin/death enter in thought the fall of

man... So was God just joking about death came in because of Adam??? I think

not.... no gap for me...

Dear freeway, Genesis 1:1-5 reads the same, whether you read the KJV (King

James Version), the RSV (Revised Standard Version), the OSB (Orthodox Study

Bible), the NIV (New International Version), the ESV (English Standard Version),

the NASB (New American Standard Bible), or any other legitimate version of

Genesis in English. Here is Genesis 1:1-5 in the OSB (Orthodox Study Bible):

"In the beginning God made heaven and earth. The earth was invisible and

unfinished: and darkness was over the deep. The Spirit of God was hovering

over the face of the water. Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there

was light. God saw the light; it was good; and God divided the light from the

darkness. God called the light Day; the darkness He called Night; and there

was evening and morning, one day".


[page 3: THE ORTHODOX STUDY BIBLE: Prepared under the auspices of

the Academic Community of St. Athanasius Academy of Orthodox Theology,

Elk Grove, California. Fr. Jack Norman Sparks, Ph.D., Dean. Nashville, TN:

Thomas Nelson, Copyright 2008 St. Athanasius Academy of Orthodox Theology.

].


God bless all of you. Genesis is the same for every Bible-believing, orthodox

Christian. Evolution, therefore, is a false, unacceptable theory. No death

before man, before Adam and Eve.

In Erie Scott

 

[Tailgunner]

we are trying to reconcile bible with science, the account maybe literal but its so lacking in how the lord did it that we are told that means how he did it,just that he did it.

we cant fully understand how the lord did it, i dont think he wanted to tell us.

Agreed, Jason. We can't understand fully how the Lord did it. What I'm saying, though, is I believe the opening chapters of Genesis to be true as to the 24 hour days. And I'm not really trying to reconcile science to the Bible. In many ways they agree. Where they appear not to agree, there is much room for debate and discussion, as we're having here.

TG

 

[jasoncran]

that is why if we are honest both creationism and evolution are merely conjectures on how it got to be as neither can be proven or disproven via the scientific method.

its ones world view that shapes the conclusion of said data from findings.

 

[reba]

Is it against the TOS to hate Scofield?


For me it is real simple by faith i believe genesis and if i dont believe genesis how can i believe John 3 16.

 

[Tailgunner]

For me it is real simple by faith i believe genesis and if i dont believe genesis how can i believe John 3 16.

Thanks, Reba. You nailed it right there.

TG

 

[jasoncran]

Is it against the TOS to hate Scofield?


For me it is real simple by faith i believe genesis and if i dont believe genesis how can i believe John 3 16.

there are christians on this forum who dont take genesis literally,

many of the catholics here dont. they take its as an allegory in some parts.

 

[watchman F]

there are christians on this forum who dont take genesis literally,

many of the catholics here dont. they take its as an allegory in some parts.

And like she said, if they do not take Genesis literally, why do they take John 3:16 literally?

 

[Pizzaguy]

the Gap Theory assumes the existence of sin and death before the creation of Adam.

But do you see any way the earth can be 3.8 billion years old and yet, no sin or death before Adam?

Because it also mentions in verse 6 that God said "let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters".

That statement has to be mis-translated. I have never read any explanation of that statement that made any sense.

Overall, an interesting discussion, and I look forward to seeing more.

Good to hear that, I am writing a long opening post on Old Earth creation (what I, for the most part, believe in.) It will be a thread on it's own.