The Origin of Marriage

[Nick]

Ok, let's give this another go.

 

[stovebolts]

Re: Chick-fil-A: True Censorship

I want to say somewhere from page 215-219. Sorry. I read the same book but yeeeeears ago

Hope that helps

Fantastic, it was on page 219
I would note that this was written between 1685-1647 BC which comes by way of archological evidence that dates King Samsuiluna.

The document reads,

Ama-sukkal, the daughter of Ninurta-mansum, has been taken in marriage by Enlil-izzu, the high priest of Enlil, the son of Lugal-azida: Ama-Sukkal has brought 19 shekels of silver to Enlil-izzu, her husband (as dowry).

If Enlil-izzu ever says to Ama-sukkal, his wife, "You are no longer my wife," he shall return the 19 shekels of silver and he shall aslo weigh out 1/2 mina as her divorce-settlement. On the other hand, if Ama-Sukkal ever says to Enlil-izzu, her husband, "You are no longer my husband," she shall forfeit the 19 shekels of silver and she shall also weigh out 1/2 mina of silver. In mutual agreement they have sworn together by king.

(The names of eight men, two women, the scribe, and the notary as witnesses, each prededed by the witness-sign.)

(Sealed with two seals, twice each.)

The month of Nisan, the 28th day, the year Samsuiluna, the king, by the command of Enlil brought Kissurra and Sabum to obedience.
***********************************************************

I would note that Abram was much older than this document, as Abram would have come from the third dynasty. 2135-2025 BC

http://www.theology.edu/abraham.htm

That being said, the Sumarian picture of marriage is very different than the Biblical picture of marriage. Actually, the Sumarian picture looks more like the picture of an typical American marriage.

On page 217 we see a divorce under the heading, "New Summarian" which dates 2038-1990 which puts us a little closer to Abram. It simply reads,

Final Judgment: Lu-Utu, the son of Nig-Baba, divorced Geme-Enlil. Dugidu, and officer and official, took oath that Geme-Enlil had taken her stand. (and) said, "By the King! Give me 10 shekels of silver (and) I will not enter a claim against you," (and) that she made him forfeit 10 shekels of lilver. Ur-.. (was) teh deputy: Ur-Lama (was) the governor.

The year Harshi and Humurti were sacked.

 

[stovebolts]

That is your view, and you have a right to your view. What you don't have a right to do is minimize God's word in the presence of people who hold God's word with esteem. It is rude and abrasive.

How would you like me to tell you that unless you bow to our mighty doctrines and our Holy Book that you shalt burn in hell for all of eternity. Doesn't rub you the right way does it? Try having a little respect would ya and stop asserting yourself as authoritive on something you know little to nothing about.

Respect is earned, and I do have respect for the your Holy Book, it is just infuriating when you throw it around at me like it is suppossed to convince me of your argument.

My Daddy taught me that respect was earned too... But I found out that my Dad was wrong. An example that I could use would be the Presidency. Whether or not you agree with the current President, you give that President the respect that Title commands. This is a Biblical principal as well as the commandment is: Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

It doesn't matter if your parents are honorable or not...

I believe we have lost this idea in our society, although you do see it down south where you are spoken to as sir and mam out of respect by children.

You said earlier that you wanted to take the high road. The high road would have included respect. Perhaps you could have said, "I understand and respect that Christians exalt the Bible as your final authority and not to take away from Biblical principals, but I believe xy and z."

As far as being family, you are extended family and the Bible affirms this in many places including genesis 1:27 and Ecclesiastes 3:11 , Ecclesiastes 3:18-21 However, you are not immediate family ie a Brother in Christ and as such, it's best you not interfere with our family squablings, especially when you don't respect our scriptures to begin with.

I do hope that I don't sound too harsh, it is not my intent. But I do hope that you start to understand a little bit more on respect.

 

[Atothetheist]

My Daddy taught me that respect was earned too... But I found out that my Dad was wrong. An example that I could use would be the Presidency. Whether or not you agree with the current President, you give that President the respect that Title commands. This is a Biblical principal as well as the commandment is: Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

It doesn't matter if your parents are honorable or not...

I believe we have lost this idea in our society, although you do see it down south where you are spoken to as sir and mam out of respect by children.

You said earlier that you wanted to take the high road. The high road would have included respect. Perhaps you could have said, "I understand and respect that Christians exalt the Bible as your final authority and not to take away from Biblical principals, but I believe xy and z."

As far as being family, you are extended family and the Bible affirms this in many places including genesis 1:27 and Ecclesiastes 3:11 , Ecclesiastes 3:18-21 However, you are not immediate family ie a Brother in Christ and as such, it's best you not interfere with our family squablings, especially when you don't respect our scriptures to begin with.

I do hope that I don't sound too harsh, it is not my intent. But I do hope that you start to understand a little bit more on respect.

I can respect the Title, I do not, However, have to respect the person. The Title earned the respect by the context in which the Title is used. The person using it has to earn my respect.

 

[Atothetheist]

My Daddy taught me that respect was earned too... But I found out that my Dad was wrong. An example that I could use would be the Presidency. Whether or not you agree with the current President, you give that President the respect that Title commands. This is a Biblical principal as well as the commandment is: Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

It doesn't matter if your parents are honorable or not...

I believe we have lost this idea in our society, although you do see it down south where you are spoken to as sir and mam out of respect by children.

You said earlier that you wanted to take the high road. The high road would have included respect. Perhaps you could have said, "I understand and respect that Christians exalt the Bible as your final authority and not to take away from Biblical principals, but I believe xy and z."

As far as being family, you are extended family and the Bible affirms this in many places including genesis 1:27 and Ecclesiastes 3:11 , Ecclesiastes 3:18-21 However, you are not immediate family ie a Brother in Christ and as such, it's best you not interfere with our family squablings, especially when you don't respect our scriptures to begin with.

I do hope that I don't sound too harsh, it is not my intent. But I do hope that you start to understand a little bit more on respect.

" I understand( but don't respect) the fact that Christians use the Bible as an authority.

I don't have to respect the Bible to keep my mouth shut about it. I can easily understand the Bible.

Unfortunetly, you( and by that I mean Christians) keep throwing it at me like it somehow matters to me. People expect me to instantly take the Bible as evidence, when I don't consider it to be.

The smart thing would be to NOT use it as a counter argument against me.

Since you are talking about the High Road, lets edit the quote and lets see how you like it:

"I Understand, and Respect, that Atheists don't use the [insert Holy Book here] as a valid point, and should not be used as an argument for God,even though I believe x."

 

[Mike]

Since you are talking about the High Road, lets edit the quote and lets see how you like it:

"I Understand, and Respect, that Atheists don't use the [insert Holy Book here] as a valid point, and should not be used as an argument for God,even though I believe x."

Or... you could understand that on a Christian discussion board, Christians will no doubt use scripture. You may not be convinced by this tactic when used to support their point or refute yours, but you shouldn't become angry about it! Good grief, man! Take and leave what you want from someone's response, but don't allow your emotions to overwhelm you.

Hebrews 4
"<sup class="versenum">12 </sup>For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. <sup class="versenum">13 </sup>Nothing in all creation is hidden from God’s sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account."

There's power in thems words. Take it or leave it, but we believe this verse is true, and we will use scripture at times. Dismiss it if you choose, but don't get angry.

 

[stovebolts]

Since you are talking about the High Road, lets edit the quote and lets see how you like it:

"I Understand, and Respect, that Atheists don't use the [insert Holy Book here] as a valid point, and should not be used as an argument for God,even though I believe x."

Hello Friend.
I never staked claim as to taking the high road...

I know that you don't believe the Bible, but we do so when you come in and dismiss the Bible, it's not being respectful.

So it wasn't as much about you giving me respect as it was what we believe in. If I were in an Athiest forum, then I wouldn't expect anyone to respect the Bible. But this is a Christian site and we hold that the Bible is our authority. I do hope that you will be able to understand this because I certainly don't think you would go to church on Sunday and say the things you've said here. It's just not being respectful.

Anyway,
This is what Peter said about God's word, and we believe it.

NIV 2 Peter 1:19 We also have the prophetic message as something completely reliable, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. 20 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things. 21 For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

Grace and Peace.

 

[stovebolts]

Re: Chick-fil-A: True Censorship

Alex,
I would enjoy discussing this further with you if your still around.

Fantastic, it was on page 219
I would note that this was written between 1685-1647 BC which comes by way of archological evidence that dates King Samsuiluna.

The document reads,

Ama-sukkal, the daughter of Ninurta-mansum, has been taken in marriage by Enlil-izzu, the high priest of Enlil, the son of Lugal-azida: Ama-Sukkal has brought 19 shekels of silver to Enlil-izzu, her husband (as dowry).

If Enlil-izzu ever says to Ama-sukkal, his wife, "You are no longer my wife," he shall return the 19 shekels of silver and he shall aslo weigh out 1/2 mina as her divorce-settlement. On the other hand, if Ama-Sukkal ever says to Enlil-izzu, her husband, "You are no longer my husband," she shall forfeit the 19 shekels of silver and she shall also weigh out 1/2 mina of silver. In mutual agreement they have sworn together by king.

(The names of eight men, two women, the scribe, and the notary as witnesses, each prededed by the witness-sign.)

(Sealed with two seals, twice each.)

The month of Nisan, the 28th day, the year Samsuiluna, the king, by the command of Enlil brought Kissurra and Sabum to obedience.
***********************************************************

I would note that Abram was much older than this document, as Abram would have come from the third dynasty. 2135-2025 BC

http://www.theology.edu/abraham.htm

That being said, the Sumarian picture of marriage is very different than the Biblical picture of marriage. Actually, the Sumarian picture looks more like the picture of an typical American marriage.

On page 217 we see a divorce under the heading, "New Summarian" which dates 2038-1990 which puts us a little closer to Abram. It simply reads,

Final Judgment: Lu-Utu, the son of Nig-Baba, divorced Geme-Enlil. Dugidu, and officer and official, took oath that Geme-Enlil had taken her stand. (and) said, "By the King! Give me 10 shekels of silver (and) I will not enter a claim against you," (and) that she made him forfeit 10 shekels of lilver. Ur-.. (was) teh deputy: Ur-Lama (was) the governor.

The year Harshi and Humurti were sacked.