The true Israel

[Shilohsfoal]

1-Can anyone tell me who this is called by the name of Israel?
2-When did he recieved that name?
3-And what does the nation that abhorrs this one called Israel,call itself?




Isaiah 49


1 Listen to Me, O islands, And pay attention, you peoples from afar. The LORD called Me from the womb; From the body of My mother He named Me.
2 He has made My mouth like a sharp sword, In the shadow of His hand He has concealed Me; And He has also made Me a select arrow, He has hidden Me in His quiver.
3 He said to Me, “You are My Servant, Israel, In Whom I will show My glory.”
4 But I said, “I have toiled in vain, I have spent My strength for nothing and vanity; Yet surely the justice due to Me is with the LORD, And My reward with My God.”
5 And now says the LORD, who formed Me from the womb to be His Servant, To bring Jacob back to Him, so that Israel might be gathered to Him (For I am honored in the sight of the LORD, And My God is My strength),
6 He says, “It is too small a thing that You should be My Servant To raise up the tribes of Jacob and to restore the preserved ones of Israel; I will also make You a light of the nations So that My salvation may reach to the end of the earth.”
7 Thus says the LORD, the Redeemer of Israel and its Holy One, To the despised One, To the One abhorred by the nation, To the Servant of rulers, “Kings will see and arise, Princes will also bow down, Because of the LORD who is faithful, the Holy One of Israel who has chosen You.”

 

[savedbygrace57]

vs 3 is speaking of Christ, He is the True Israel of God, The Firstorn Son.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

vs 3 is speaking of Christ, He is the True Israel of God, The Firstorn Son.

Ty Saved,

Genesis 32;28
And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

Rev 3;12
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God,and he shall go no more out;and I will write upon him the name of my God,and the name of the city of my God,which is new Jerusalem,which cometh down out of heaven from my God;and I will write upon him my new name.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Israel was typical of Christ, Gods First born Son..ex 4:22

And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:

Now if God called Israel, My Son, even my First Born, then why is It difficult to understand that God views His First born Son Jesus Christ as Israel ?

 

[savedbygrace57]

Ty Saved,

Genesis 32;28
And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

Rev 3;12
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God,and he shall go no more out;and I will write upon him the name of my God,and the name of the city of my God,which is new Jerusalem,which cometh down out of heaven from my God;and I will write upon him my new name.

rev 5:5

And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

 

[Strangelove]

3-And what does the nation that abhorrs this one called Israel,call itself?

The Zionist Nation 'State of Isreal'.

Imposter of Jacob.

Edomites.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

The Zionist Nation 'State of Isreal'.

Imposter of Jacob.

Edomites.

So the nation which opposes Israel is today in the land that belongs to Israel(Christ)claiming to be Israel.

 

[Strangelove]

So the nation which opposes Israel is today in the land that belongs to Israel(Christ)claiming to be Israel.

I'm not sayin' your wrong with that statement but can you show me the scripture that says that particular stretch of land belongs to Christ?

DoC.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

I'm not sayin' your wrong with that statement but can you show me the scripture that says that particular stretch of land belongs to Christ?

DoC.

Sure,The land was promised to Abraham and his seed.

Gen 13;15
For all the land which thou seest,to thee will I give it,and to thy seed for ever.


Galatians 3;16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made.He saith not,And to thy seeds,as of many;but as of one,And to thy seed,which is Christ.


Jesus said it was his in the gospel.
Mark 12;7
But those husbandmen said among themselves,This is the heir;come,let us kill him,and the inheritance shall be ours.

 

[Strangelove]

Sure,The land was promised to Abraham and his seed.

Gen 13;15
For all the land which thou seest,to thee will I give it,and to thy seed for ever.


Galatians 3;16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made.He saith not,And to thy seeds,as of many;but as of one,And to thy seed,which is Christ.


Jesus said it was his in the gospel.
Mark 12;7
But those husbandmen said among themselves,This is the heir;come,let us kill him,and the inheritance shall be ours.

Cool.

So now we just sit tight and wait for someone to storm in and declare that the nation State of Isreal is the true Isreal correct?

Or have you got deeper stuff you wanted to go into?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Cool.

So now we just sit tight and wait for someone to storm in and declare that the nation State of Isreal is the true Isreal correct?

Or have you got deeper stuff you wanted to go into?

The goverment called itself Israel and it claims that land belongs to it.
Why would anyone need to storm in and claim that goverment is Israel?
99.9% of the world doesnt know who Israel is.The king of Babylon has got most of the world thinking that land belongs to him already.99% of christians agree with him.

 

[Strangelove]

The goverment called itself Israel and it claims that land belongs to it.
Why would anyone need to storm in and claim that goverment is Israel?
99.9% of the world doesnt know who Israel is.The king of Babylon has got most of the world thinking that land belongs to him already.99% of christians agree with him.

Huh? If 99% of Christians think the State of Isreal is the true Isreal then wouldn't you expect someone to come into the thread claiming as such?

 

[savedbygrace57]

The True Israel is Jesus Christ and all who are one with Him, His Church, His Body..

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Huh? If 99% of Christians think the State of Isreal is the true Isreal then wouldn't you expect someone to come into the thread claiming as such?

Maybe they are just stearing clear if this thread.I hear people all the time saying the promised land belongs to Israel(that nation state).Last time I made a thread like this about a year ago,it got no replies at all.I dont think anyone knew what I was talking about which happens quite often.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

The True Israel is Jesus Christ and all who are one with Him, His Church, His Body..

Yes ,Thats true.
So what do you think of the deciever who is in Jerusalem today?
He seems to have gatherd quite a few followers who are predominatly antichrist by nature.

 

[Strangelove]

Yes ,Thats true.
So what do you think of the deciever who is in Jerusalem today?
He seems to have gatherd quite a few followers who are predominatly antichrist by nature.

Yes and those antichrist followers are dispersed all over the globe and hold the reigns of nearly every nations power structure

 

[The Word]

1-Can anyone tell me who this is called by the name of Israel?
2-When did he recieved that name?
3-And what does the nation that abhorrs this one called Israel,call itself?




Isaiah 49


1 Listen to Me, O islands, And pay attention, you peoples from afar. The LORD called Me from the womb; From the body of My mother He named Me.
2 He has made My mouth like a sharp sword, In the shadow of His hand He has concealed Me; And He has also made Me a select arrow, He has hidden Me in His quiver.
3 He said to Me, “You are My Servant, Israel, In Whom I will show My glory.â€
4 But I said, “I have toiled in vain, I have spent My strength for nothing and vanity; Yet surely the justice due to Me is with the LORD, And My reward with My God.â€
5 And now says the LORD, who formed Me from the womb to be His Servant, To bring Jacob back to Him, so that Israel might be gathered to Him (For I am honored in the sight of the LORD, And My God is My strength),
6 He says, “It is too small a thing that You should be My Servant To raise up the tribes of Jacob and to restore the preserved ones of Israel; I will also make You a light of the nations So that My salvation may reach to the end of the earth.â€
7 Thus says the LORD, the Redeemer of Israel and its Holy One, To the despised One, To the One abhorred by the nation, To the Servant of rulers, “Kings will see and arise, Princes will also bow down, Because of the LORD who is faithful, the Holy One of Israel who has chosen You.â€

God uses mostly symbolism and figurative writing in the scriptures. He likes to use names of prophets and numbers to symbolize people and his main people are those who were called the prophets, saints and Jesus. These people were chosen by him before creation while he was making his plans. These people were created as the Word so anywhere in the Bible, you will be able to see these people but with many different names to describe them. A few of the names are the Holy Spirit, the Word, Kingdom of God, Kingdom of Heaven, Kingdom of Jesus Christ, Counselor, Remnant of Israel, Jacob, Judah, Two Sticks, Jerusalem, and many more.

The rest of God's created people he calls Israel so Israel means all God's created people and the remnant of Israel is the Word who used the flesh of Jesus, the prophets and us saints. All the people besides the Word were the disobedient sinners during this age so God needed to kill all the flesh of man to stop these genetic sins that cause his sinners to reject the Word. This is the tribulation that has been going on for 6,000 years but it's soon going to end in this destruction. Jesus died for the forgiveness of all sins and to fulfill the law that condemns the sinners to death. The wages of sin are death but the created souls of everyone remains alive to live in new immortal bodies in paradise.

 

[Ashua]

For thou hast confirmed to thyself thy people Israel [to be] a people unto thee for ever: and thou, LORD, art become their God.

And now, O LORD God, the word that thou hast spoken concerning thy servant, and concerning his house, establish [it] for ever, and do as thou hast said.

And let thy name be magnified for ever, saying, The LORD of hosts [is] the God over Israel: and let the house of thy servant David be established before thee. -2 Samuel 7:24-26

I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you. -Genesis 17:7

Romans 11

1I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

2God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

3Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

4But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

5Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

7What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

8(According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear; ) unto this day.

9And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:

10Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

11I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

12Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

13For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

14If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

15For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

16For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.

17And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

18Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

19Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

20Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

21For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

22Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

24For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

25For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

33O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

34For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

35Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?

36For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

Either Israel is God's nation forever or he is a liar. Which way will you have it?

 

[Drew]

Either Israel is God's nation forever or he is a liar. Which way will you have it?

Things are not this simple. For starters, lets talk about the Genesis 17 text.

The following text from Genesis 17 is often used to argue that God promised the land of Canaan to the Jews forever:

I will give the whole land of Canaan – the land where you are now residing – to you and your descendants after you as a permanent possession. I will be their God.”

The Hebrew word that is translated as “permanent” is the word “owlam”. Note how the definition of this word is fluid – embracing the eternality that would support the common reading of this text (that Canaan has been promised to the Jews forever), but also allowing for a reading that does not denote eternality:

Definition (from Net Bible): 1) long duration, antiquity, futurity, for ever, ever, everlasting,
evermore, perpetual, old, ancient, world

And here we have an example from Isaiah 42 of this same word used in a context where eternality is certainly not intended:

The LORD emerges like a hero,
like a warrior he inspires himself for battle;
he shouts, yes, he yells,
he shows his enemies his power.
I have been inactive for a long time;
I kept quiet and held back.
Like a woman in labor I groan;
I pant and gasp.
I will make the trees on the mountains and hills wither up;
I will dry up all their vegetation.
I will turn streams into islands,
and dry up pools of water.

Clearly God is talking about talking action after a long period of “inactivity”. So here, the word “owlam” does not denote an everlasting period of time – it denotes a limited duration of time.

So one cannot simply assume that Genesis 17:8 entails a promise of Canaan to the Israelites forever. That is one reading that needs to be considered, but there are others as well.

 

[The Word]

Either Israel is God's nation forever or he is a liar. Which way will you have it?

You're the liar because you're a sinner who can't interpret the scriptures with the truth.

The nation Israel is all God's created people and the remnant of Israel are those chosen and created to be the Word. They are the prophets, Jesus and us saints.