Bible Study The Unforgivable Sin?

[precepts]

What is the unforgivable sin? Some say it's not receiving God's word, which I think is ridiculous. I've quoted some scriptures that I think defines what this sin onto death is. This is my arguement.

Jhn 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgement I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Jhn 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Jhn 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Is seeing the unforgivable sin?



In Isaiah's message of judgement on Jerusalem:

Isa 29:10 For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered.
Isa 29:11 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:
Isa 29:12 And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: And he saith, I am not learned.
Isa 29:13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
Isa 29:14 Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, even a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid.
Isa 29:15 Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their counsel from the Lord, and their works are in the dark, and they say, Who seeth us? and who knoweth us?
Isa 29:16 Surely your turning of things upside down shall be esteemed as the potter's clay: for shall the work say of him that made it, He made me not? or shall the thing framed say of him that framed it, He had no understanding?
Isa 29:17 Is it not yet a little while, and Lebanon shall be turned into a fruitful field, and the fruitful field shall be esteemed as a forest?
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.Isa 29:19 The meek also sall increase their joy in the Lord, and the poor among men shall rejoice in the Holy One of Israel.
Isa 29:20 For the terrible one is brought to nought, and the scorner is consumed, and all that watch for iniquity are cut off:
Isa 29:21 That make a man an offender for a word, and lay a snare for him that reproveth in the gate, and turn aside the just for a thing of nought.

Isa 29:24 They also that erred in spirit shall come to understanding, and they that murmured shall learn doctrine.

I think it's obvious that God is referring to Christ's time, but what is meant by the Pharisees and the Sadducees seeing? Could it be witchcraft? Could it be they were sorcerers/seers, that caused their sin to remain unforgiven?

Mat 12:22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.
Mat 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David?
Mat 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
Mat 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:
Mat 12:26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?
Mat 12:27 And if I By Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? Therefore they shall be your judges.

Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

Not the difference between Matthew' and Mark's account:

Mar 3:22 And the scribes which came down from Jerusalem said, He hath Beelzebub, and by the prince of the devils casteth he out devils.
Mar 3:23 And he called them [unto him], and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan?
Mar 3:24 And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand.
Mar 3:25 And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.
Mar 3:26 And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end.
Mar 3:27 No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house.
Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
Mar 3:30 Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.

So how were they casting out demons? Were they working false miracles in those times too? Blasphemy against the Holy Host must be possession of a devil/familiar spirit eventhough there are instances in the new testament that proves otherwise.


Another verse that I think proves my arguement is:

Rev 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

As for whoremongers and murderers, I define them as pimps and serial killers!! Go figure!

The defense rests, your honor.

 

[Ret]

What is the unforgivable sin? Some say it's not receiving God's word, which I think is ridiculous. I've quoted some scriptures that I think defines what this sin onto death is. This is my arguement.

Jhn 9:39 And Jesus said, For judgement I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
Jhn 9:40 And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
Jhn 9:41 Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Is seeing the unforgivable sin?

Note the profession they say of themselves WE SEE...

Had they seen spiritual things clearly, they would have recognized Jesus as the Messiah of God.

 

[LanceEh]

Christ was not saying that they were casting out spirits by Beezlebub,

He was making a point because they were accusing Him of casting out spirits by the Devil, and He was saying that it was not possible to do this because then a kingdom would be divided and could not stand, which includes the kingdom of darkness too.

I have never, in all my experience seen a devil cast out another devil, but I have seen the Spirit of God do so ;)

God bless.

 

[Photosmith]

In other words they did not recognize Christ as the Lord. Since He is the way, the truth, and the life, denying Christ as Lord cannot coexist with salvation.

 

[freeway]

The unforgivable sin..... rejecting Christ and what He did at the cross.... all else is works, and we know where that gets us....................

 

[Lee100]

I agree, the only unforgivable sin is not accepting Jesus Christ as savior and Lord. All else can be forgiven.

 

[precepts]

Ret's

Note the profession they say of themselves WE SEE...

Had they seen spiritual things clearly, they would have recognized Jesus as the Messiah of God.

Thanks for your opinion, but you missed the bus in my opinion.


Lance's

Christ was not saying that they were casting out spirits by Beezlebub,

Mat 12:27 And if I By Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? How were they casting them out? Based on the context the children of the Pharisees and Sadducees were casting out demons. The question is, by what power?

He was making a point because they were accusing Him of casting out spirits by the Devil, and He was saying that it was not possible to do this because then a kingdom would be divided and could not stand, which includes the kingdom of darkness too.

He didn't say it was impossible, only that it had no power and would not be able to stand against God.


Joe's

I have never, in all my experience seen a devil cast out another devil, but I have seen the Spirit of God do so

God bless.

In your opinion, in mines it's the opposite.


Photosmith's

In other words they did not recognize Christ as the Lord. Since He is the way, the truth, and the life, denying Christ as Lord cannot coexist with salvation.

And it can't be the unforgivable sin either. Mark 3:30 clearly states that it was because they said he had a unclean spirit.
Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:
Mar 3:30 Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit. Try again.


freeway's

The unforgivable sin..... rejecting Christ and what He did at the cross.... all else is works, and we know where that gets us....................

I wonder what will happen to righteous people that reject christianity because of false teachings and doctrine. Who's going to pay the price, the false teacher or the sinner? Wow!


Lee's

I agree, the only unforgivable sin is not accepting Jesus Christ as savior and Lord. All else can be forgiven.

I suppose the first person that reads your mind and claim to be working for Christ, you will have to accept because if you don't you'll be damned to hell. Wow, go figure!

 

[freeway]

freeway's
The unforgivable sin..... rejecting Christ and what He did at the cross.... all else is works, and we know where that gets us....................

precepts says:
I wonder what will happen to righteous people that reject christianity because of false teachings and doctrine. Who's going to pay the price, the false teacher or the sinner? Wow!

Only by the Grace of God through Jesus that I can have any hope of eternal life. There is nothing I can do to add one second to my salvation other than just asking Jesus to forgive me and save me. nothing.. as far as false teachers, Jesus says to test the spirits to see if they are from God, so if a sinner wants to believe something that goes against what we learn in the bible without checking it out. Then they both are going to pay. is there a hotter spot in hell for those that mislead someone, I don't know. Again just thinking something is right does not make it right. So yes dig dig and then dig some more to make sure the path your on is the right path... and for me that path goes straight through JESUS....

 

[precepts]

freeway's

Only by the Grace of God through Jesus that I can have any hope of eternal life. There is nothing I can do to add one second to my salvation other than just asking Jesus to forgive me and save me.

That's probably what the unwise virgins thought until they ran out of oil. I need nothing else but calling on his and asking for forgiveness, no wisdom.


Freeway's

nothing.. as far as false teachers, Jesus says to test the spirits to see if they are from God, so if a sinner wants to believe something that goes against what we learn in the bible without checking it out.

Such as?


Freeway's

Then they both are going to pay. is there a hotter spot in hell for those that mislead someone,

I don't know about any hot spots in hell but i'll bet there's probably some gold there.


Freeway's

I don't know. Again just thinking something is right does not make it right. So yes dig dig and then dig some more to make sure the path your on is the right path... and for me that path goes straight through JESUS....

First you said to make sure, sure is the key word. Then you assumed that for you that path goes thru Jesus. Which is it?

 

[mechanicdb]

Blasphemy against the Lord God. ...according to the Bible.

 

[precepts]

Mech's

Blasphemy against the Lord God. ...according to the Bible.

According to the bible or according to your interpretation?

 

[freeway]

freeway's
Only by the Grace of God through Jesus that I can have any hope of eternal life. There is nothing I can do to add one second to my salvation other than just asking Jesus to forgive me and save me.

precepts says
That's probably what the unwise virgins thought until they ran out of oil. I need nothing else but calling on his and asking for forgiveness, no wisdom.

I don't think its about oil in the lantern per say, but more about 5 of them did not truly put their faith in Jesus, and did not think He would really return. these few short words by no means explains the whole story..

Freeway's
nothing.. as far as false teachers, Jesus says to test the spirits to see if they are from God, so if a sinner wants to believe something that goes against what we learn in the bible without checking it out.

precepts says
Such as?

Such as, see above!

Freeway's
Then they both are going to pay. is there a hotter spot in hell for those that mislead someone,

precepts says:
I don't know about any hot spots in hell but i'll bet there's probably some gold there.

See you have hell confused with leprechauns. All that deny Jesus, goes there "hell", sorry if that doesn't jive with your beliefs. This is what Jesus said, you know, He's the only way, truth and life..

Freeway's
I don't know. Again just thinking something is right does not make it right. So yes dig dig and then dig some more to make sure the path your on is the right path... and for me that path goes straight through JESUS....

precepts says:
First you said to make sure, sure is the key word. Then you assumed that for you that path goes thru Jesus. Which is it?

What? see all above...

 

[Bick]

There are no "unforgivable sins".

John the baptiser proclaims "Behold! the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world" upon seeing Jesus the next day after he baptized Jesus. KJV.

Isaiah prophecies in 53:6, "We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way, and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us ALL." NIV. Capitals mine.

Paul, the apostle and teacher to the Gentiles writes in 2 Cor.5:17-19, NIV:

"Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men's sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

John declares in 1 John 2:2, "He (Jesus Christ) is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world." NIV.

Bick

 

[mechanicdb]

Mech's

Blasphemy against the Lord God. ...according to the Bible.

According to the bible or according to your interpretation?

You need to read "The Book. A History of the Bible."

it would do you good.

 

[precepts]

I just had to bring back up this topic. As for studying the history of the bible, research the name "Yahweh", the word "bible' which comes from Biblios in Baal worshipping Lebanon, and the "Asherim" wife of God.

 

[sherri2]

I'm not sure if this has already been mentioned, but the only unforgiveable sin that I've seen mentioned in the bible (and this one comes up pretty regularly on christian forums) is the passage you mentioned in matthew talking about blasphemy against the holy spirit.

if you look at it in context, the pharisees were accusing jesus of performing his miracles through the power of satan. now a genuine misunderstanding in that area could be forgiven. if you make a mistake, sure. but the pharisees were jealous of christ and were trying to murder him. if you know that someone is performing their miracles by the power of god (because it's obvious) but you deliberatly accuse them of working through the power of satan because your attitude stinks - how can God trust someone like that with eternity?

to 'blaspheme' against the holy spirit can only be interpreted as a deliberate act. you cannot accidently blaspheme (in the full sense of the word) against God. jesus called the pharisees some horrible names because they deserved them. he described them as 'whitewashed tombs' full of 'dead mens bones', 'sons of hell', vipers etc.

they wern't nice people (although not all were wicked, some were just decieved, like Paul)

to deliberatly call the holy spirit the power of satan because you feel threatened by the persons influence is pretty breathtaking in terms of wickedness. especially to the point of murdering the person.

 

[Elijah674]

You need to read "The Book. A History of the Bible."

it would do you good.

Elijah here: Here is part of Psalms 19 with your answer.. IF you prayerfully read it slowly! And when you get to verse 13 stay away from the Jer. 17:5 Arm Of Flesh & just let the Holy Spirit LEAD you. Rom. 8:14

Psalms 19 (in part)
[7] The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

[8] The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart: the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.

[9] The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.

[10] More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold: sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.

[11] Moreover by them is thy servant warned: and in keeping of them there is great reward.
[12] Who can understand his errors? cleanse thou me from secret faults.

[13] Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the [great transgression.]

And what is the great transgression then? Did you get that?

--Elijah

PS: when we KNOW that sin is sin, and we just keep on doing the same thing, regardless of it being the sin of commision or omission, (or teaching false doctrines!) in time this open 'presumption' is fully Matured & there becomes no way for the Holy Spirit to convict us, and we are cut loose. Gen. 6:3 + Rev. 17:1-5

 

[Nathan]

PS: when we KNOW that sin is sin, and we just keep on doing the same thing, regardless of it being the sin of commision or omission, (or teaching false doctrines!) in time this open 'presumption' is fully Matured & there becomes no way for the Holy Spirit to convict us, and we are cut loose. Gen. 6:3 + Rev. 17:1-5

[/COLOR][/SIZE]

See, I knew you could type in complete sentences. lol.

This is very true. Thank you for addressing it in a clear and precise way.

I think that it might be helpful for those who are curious, if you wanted to expound upon the idea of "presumptuous sin." That is, when does committing sin become "presumptuous"?

Sometimes we sin under the full knowledge of us doing wrong. So some might think that means they are being "presumptuous", and which we are under certain circumstances, but you address it as becoming "mature". When does it become mature? See what I mean?

I understand what you are saying, and I could expound on it, but I would like to hear your thoughts.

 

[Elijah674]

See, I knew you could type in complete sentences. lol.

This is very true. Thank you for addressing it in a clear and precise way.

I think that it might be helpful for those who are curious, if you wanted to expound upon the idea of "presumptuous sin." That is, when does committing sin become "presumptuous"?

Sometimes we sin under the full knowledge of us doing wrong. So some might think that means they are being "presumptuous", and which we are under certain circumstances, but you address it as becoming "mature". When does it become mature? See what I mean?

I understand what you are saying, and I could expound on it, but I would like to hear your thoughts.

Presumptuous is.. 'taking liberties' 'overstetepping due grounds' (according to Webster's dictionary)

And according to God, 'to him that knoweth to do good and doeth it not, to him it is sin.' (James 4:17

Gods Word is our roadmap. He lays out the conditions for Eternal life from Gen. on through Rev.
It is leading up to the Great Transgression when anyone of us will not follow on as in Rom. 8:1 first, (No Condemnation) and then verse 14 of being [LED]. This is presumption leading up to the Great Transgression. In time, us'ins would be near impossible for the Holy Spirit to be able to move us. And there is nothing to prevent us from going forward [IF] we will!
Christ inPhil. 4:13 + 2 Cor. 12:9 supplies ALL THAT IS NEEDED!. (compare James 2:8-12 for our standard of judgement)

--Elijah

 

[Nathan]

Presumptuous is.. 'taking liberties' 'overstetepping due grounds' (according to Webster's dictionary)

And according to God, 'to him that knoweth to do good and doeth it not, to him it is sin.' (James 4:17

Gods Word is our roadmap. He lays out the conditions for Eternal life from Gen. on through Rev.
It is leading up to the Great Transgression when anyone of us will not follow on as in Rom. 8:1 first, (No Condemnation) and then verse 14 of being [LED]. This is presumption leading up to the Great Transgression. In time, us'ins would be near impossible for the Holy Spirit to be able to move us. And there is nothing to prevent us from going forward [IF] we will!
Christ inPhil. 4:13 + 2 Cor. 12:9 supplies ALL THAT IS NEEDED!. (compare James 2:8-12 for our standard of judgement)

--Elijah

Thanks.

So if you were to sum up the "unforgivable sin" into a few sentences, what would it be? Or would it be just one word, "presumption"?