The Wages of Sin is ..... Eternal Life in Hell!

[John the Baptist]

Obadiah KJV
For as ye have drunk upon my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yea, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.

John
This section of scripture is one I am not real familiar with, but none the less,
Here is a commentary I just read at crosswalk.com.. I read the entire chapter to grab the context.. I hope you know that this chapter is speaking of nations.

***
John here: I realize that there are things that one does not understand. And are not familiar with. (such as 2 Peter 3:16) But if I can, let me mention 'man's commentaries'. In Jeremiah 17:5 we are told.. "Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the Lord.' Do you believe this??? I do. But what have you just done? And they are right & God is wrong? Now, you are familiar with the verse, huh?

For one to be safe to save surely needs the Matthew 4:4 verse on any given doctrinal subject for Truth. And 2 Timothy 3:16 say's to use All Scripture for understanding Doctrine.

Does it make any sense for God to change His way (?Red flag) & just blot one sinful nation out of existence while all others of Revelation 17:5 ones are PURELY STATED, THE ABOMINATION OF THE EARTH ONES??? That would violate many verses of the Word of God. Ecclesiastes 1:9-10 & Ecclesiastes 3:15 Documents Truth.

There are many commentaries, most are written by the ones of Revelation 17:5. Now, go and see how they botch that up! Surely that is not them, huh? Where hardly any two agree on doctrine.

God does not change. What Obadiah says under Inspiration is Eternal Gospel (Revelation 14:6) not just for a nation, but for MANKIND. They, if lost, will cease to exist!! You need to get this right! (WE DO) I suggest that we stay with the Word of God alone for Their own hermeneutics.

 

[jgredline]

Though Christ was the principal teacher of eternal punishment, Which many of you seem to ignore and that Jesus really did not mean what he said in Matt 25; this doctrine is also clearly taught in the Epistles. Sudden destruction is predicted for those whom the Day of the Lord will overtake (1 Thess. 5:3). They are said to be recipients of divine wrath (5:9), and “they will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power†(2 Thess. 1:9).


Hebrews 6:2 refers to “the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment,â€Â
Eternal judgment refers to the belief that everyone will be judged by the great Judge. The Scriptures indicate that there are two judgments: one for believers, in which Jesus determines every believer's reward (1 Cor. 3:12), and the other a judgment of condemnation on unbelievers (Rev. 20:11).



Hebrews 10:26–27 speaks of “a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.â€Â
With no hope of forgiveness (v. 26), all that one can expect is judgment, described here as a fiery indignation. Those who choose to disobey God become His adversaries (see James 4:4).

Hell is a place of “blackest darkness†(2 Pet. 2:17).


The present judgment of angels who are confined after their original sin will end in judgment: “For...God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment†(2:4). The Book of Jude refers to the same concept, namely, that bound fallen angels, presently confined in darkness, are awaiting judgment (Jude 6).


In describing those who worship the Beast in the Great Tribulation, a word of warning is given by an angel: “If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the hand, he, too, will drink of the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name†(Rev. 14:9–11).
Though the word gehenna is not found in the Book of Revelation, it is clear that the Book of Revelation continues the New Testament teaching about eternal, conscious punishment.
The most comprehensive statement on eternal punishment is found in connection with the judgment of the Great White Throne. “The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. Then death and hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death†(20:13–14).
Physical death separates an individual from his or her body; the second death separates the individual from the grace and mercy of God. The lake of fire will not annihilate the unsaved, for Revelation 20:10 states that the devil will be “thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.†Along with the fallen angels, they will suffer punishment forever. While people may dispute whether the Word of God is true, fulfillment of these prophecies will demonstrate that when God speaks He does so in complete accuracy and literalness.

The Bible clearly teaches that eternal punishment will be by fire. This was repeated so often from the lips of Jesus as well as by several New Testament writers that interpreters are not free to arbitrarily say it must mean something else. Since you have a problem with this, you can take it up with him when you meet him face to face........

The question as to whether eternal fire will annihilate those suffering in it is answered by the experience of the Beast, the False Prophet, and Satan, whose torment will last forever. Also the unsaved, from the moment of their death (which in some cases will be thousands of years before the Great White Throne judgment) will suffer, as described in Luke 16:19–31. However, the souls of believers who die are instantly transported into the presence of God.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Though Christ was the principal teacher of eternal punishment, Which many of you seem to ignore and that Jesus really did not mean what he said in Matt 25; this doctrine is also clearly taught in the Epistles. Sudden destruction is predicted for those whom the Day of the Lord will overtake (1 Thess. 5:3). They are said to be recipients of divine wrath (5:9), and “they will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power†(2 Thess. 1:9).

Why do you keep arguing with yourself, jg? You just stated above that 'they will be punished with everlasting destruction ...' Does that not tell you anything? You know what destruction is, don't you? You know what everlasting is, don't you? You know that this means that the lost will be 'everlastingly destroyed' ...um, don't you ...?

Hebrews 6:2 refers to “the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment,â€Â
Eternal judgment refers to the belief that everyone will be judged by the great Judge. The Scriptures indicate that there are two judgments: one for believers, in which Jesus determines every believer's reward (1 Cor. 3:12), and the other a judgment of condemnation on unbelievers (Rev. 20:11).

Could be.

Hebrews 10:26–27 speaks of “a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.â€Â
With no hope of forgiveness (v. 26), all that one can expect is judgment, described here as a fiery indignation. Those who choose to disobey God become His adversaries (see James 4:4).

Okay. I believe that that raging fire will also be the raging fire that will purify the earth. Everything old (that includes sin and sinners) will be made new.

Hell is a place of “blackest darkness†(2 Pet. 2:17).

Hell is a concept. Hell is NOT an ACTUAL 'place'.

The present judgment of angels who are confined after their original sin will end in judgment: “For...God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment†(2:4). The Book of Jude refers to the same concept, namely, that bound fallen angels, presently confined in darkness, are awaiting judgment (Jude 6).

The above is figurative.

In describing those who worship the Beast in the Great Tribulation, a word of warning is given by an angel: “If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the hand, he, too, will drink of the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name†(Rev. 14:9–11).

The above is figurative.

Though the word gehenna is not found in the Book of Revelation, it is clear that the Book of Revelation continues the New Testament teaching about eternal, conscious punishment.

When one has a mindset that cannot determine the literal from the figurative or symbolic, cannot determine the difference between everlasting life and everlasting death, then this is the conclusion they will come to EVERY time. It's a circular argument and one that I'm tiring of.

The most comprehensive statement on eternal punishment is found in connection with the judgment of the Great White Throne. “The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. Then death and hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death†(20:13–14).

The second death is the 'kaput' or 'gone forever' death. This is when the earth will be burned, purified, and made new. There will be NO 'reserve' for the wicked who will be literally burning and tortured forever. There is NO SUCH PLACE AS HELL. The new earth will be Paradise. Please remove the blinders, jg.

Physical death separates an individual from his or her body; the second death separates the individual from the grace and mercy of God. The lake of fire will not annihilate the unsaved, for Revelation 20:10 states that the devil will be “thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.†Along with the fallen angels, they will suffer punishment forever. While people may dispute whether the Word of God is true, fulfillment of these prophecies will demonstrate that when God speaks He does so in complete accuracy and literalness.

God most definitely speaks with COMPLETE ACCURACY in a FIGURATIVE or SYMBOLIC manner, jg. Again, remove the blinders and use a little bit of nouse, my friend. You're too brainwashed with (Catholic) tradition.

The Bible clearly teaches that eternal punishment will be by fire. This was repeated so often from the lips of Jesus as well as by several New Testament writers that interpreters are not free to arbitrarily say it must mean something else. Since you have a problem with this, you can take it up with him when you meet him face to face........

Nice touch, jg. Such foolishness and lack of savvy, however, from such a nice guy.

The question as to whether eternal fire will annihilate those suffering in it is answered by the experience of the Beast, the False Prophet, and Satan, whose torment will last forever. Also the unsaved, from the moment of their death (which in some cases will be thousands of years before the Great White Throne judgment) will suffer, as described in Luke 16:19–31. However, the souls of believers who die are instantly transported into the presence of God.[/color]

Sure does need work, jg. It's the blinders that are the problem.

 

[jgredline]

Sput

I agree with you. Remove the blinders and you will see.


You gotta admit I am making you think ha? :wink:

 

[SputnikBoy]

Sput

I agree with you. Remove the blinders and you will see.


You gotta admit I am making you think ha? :wink:

Oh, I don't know about that, jg ... :wink:

 

[jgredline]

Oh, I don't know about that, jg ... :wink:

I am off to bed now. See ya tomarrow. Good night..

 

[John the Baptist]

Though Christ was the principal teacher of eternal punishment, Which many of you seem to ignore and that Jesus really did not mean what he said in Matt 25; this doctrine is also clearly taught in the Epistles. Sudden destruction is predicted for those whom the Day of the Lord will overtake (1 Thess. 5:3). They are said to be recipients of divine wrath (5:9), and “they will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power†(2 Thess. 1:9).

***
John here: Friend: There is a vast difference between Eternal Punishment & ETERNAL PUNISHING!! Think what you are teaching, all in hell will burn eternally along with some that just barely were lost along with satan??

And sudden destruction means ETERNALL TORMENT?? And to be punished means what, and with Everlasting DESTRUCTION??? Again, this is the same END seen in Obadiah 1:16.
***

You say: Hebrews 6:2 refers to “the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment,â€Â
Eternal judgment refers to the belief that everyone will be judged by the great Judge. The Scriptures indicate that there are two judgments: one for believers, in which Jesus determines every believer's reward (1 Cor. 3:12), and the other a judgment of condemnation on unbelievers (Rev. 20:11).

***
Me again: You are closer to the Truth than most it seems, :wink: but you need to get the RECORD BOOKS understanding. Just wondering, do you know that if you were on another thread, that you would be warned that you were going off thread every time you were seen to be really learning something? You know, eternal burning, resurection, reward & on & on?
***

You say: Hebrews 10:26–27 speaks of “a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.â€Â
With no hope of forgiveness (v. 26), all that one can expect is judgment, described here as a fiery indignation. Those who choose to disobey God become His adversaries (see James 4:4).

***
Me again: Very True. Good understanding. 'raging fire' ... 'CONSUME the enemies of God'. Again dozens of texts for this truth of what consume means! Nahum 1:9, Revelation 20:13-14 'second death', again Obadiah 1:16 is very easily understood by the youngest of students.
***

You say: Hell is a place of “blackest darkness†(2 Pet. 2:17).

The present judgment of angels who are confined after their original sin will end in judgment: “For...God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment†(2:4). The Book of Jude refers to the same concept, namely, that bound fallen angels, presently confined in darkness, are awaiting judgment (Jude 6).

In describing those who worship the Beast in the Great Tribulation, a word of warning is given by an angel: “If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the hand, he, too, will drink of the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name†(Rev. 14:9–11).

***
Me again: Here is where your post is going astray. 'conscious' punishment? Very true, see Luke 12:47-48, yet it does not say or teach without end, such as 'conscience punishing.
***

You say: Though the word gehenna is not found in the Book of Revelation, it is clear that the Book of Revelation continues the New Testament teaching about eternal, conscious punishment.
The most comprehensive statement on eternal punishment is found in connection with the judgment of the Great White Throne. “The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. Then death and hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death†(20:13–14).
Physical death separates an individual from his or her body; the second death separates the individual from the grace and mercy of God. The lake of fire will not annihilate the unsaved, for Revelation 20:10 states that the devil will be “thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.†Along with the fallen angels, they will suffer punishment forever. While people may dispute whether the Word of God is true, fulfillment of these prophecies will demonstrate that when God speaks He does so in complete accuracy and literalness.

The Bible clearly teaches that eternal punishment will be by fire. This was repeated so often from the lips of Jesus as well as by several New Testament writers that interpreters are not free to arbitrarily say it must mean something else. Since you have a problem with this, you can take it up with him when you meet him face to face........

The question as to whether eternal fire will annihilate those suffering in it is answered by the experience of the Beast, the False Prophet, and Satan, whose torment will last forever. Also the unsaved, from the moment of their death (which in some cases will be thousands of years before the Great White Throne judgment) will suffer, as described in Luke 16:19–31. However, the souls of believers who die are instantly transported into the presence of God.

***
Me again: Torment will last forever? You need to see the suggestion that your post makes above, 'whose torment last forever'? how about Sodom & Gomorrah in the K.J. of Jude 1:7. 'Eternal fire' means what? unless you think that they are still burning?? Again all sinners will be judged by the accurate RECORD BOOKS and will suffer accordingly to the Executional stage of Judgement. Yet they will be EXECUTED in a hot hell that will not go out until it finishes its work. Ecclesiastes 12:13-14. You best study Ezekiel 33:11-13. Matthew 10:28 along with Ezekiel 18:4 & Ezekiel 18:20 again.

 

[Oscar3]

JohntheBaptist

I have read your post over and over again and have come to the conclusion that you make no sense to me. You type in english but comes out in tongues.


I find it pretty cool that you are preaching to yourself here.
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, "Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

What I do know is you need to repent of your false SDA teachings.