There is the WORD, then there is OPINION...do YOU know the difference???

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Wow, someone gets it about science!
It's true though, we are not scientists ourselves, so we listen and read them but in the end, we choose to put our faith into them and trust that what they are saying is true.

Good thread and good topic brother. Your OP makes perfect sense.

you might listen, and put your trust in them, but not if you read and trust the Bible. TEST TEST TEST everything, do not trust men. whoever trusts in the flesh is cursed. simple and true. (most scientists who tell the truth are silenced by the powers that be, including most other scientists, the government, the media, etc etc etc)

 

[Edward]

you might listen, and put your trust in them, but not if you read and trust the Bible. TEST TEST TEST everything, do not trust men. whoever trusts in the flesh is cursed. simple and true. (most scientists who tell the truth are silenced by the powers that be, including most other scientists, the government, the media, etc etc etc)

Absolutely brother!
I don't trust them, I trust the Word.

Just making the point that when people say science proved this or that...that they really do not know, they have merely chosen to have faith in them. Always better to have faith in our good Lord. He doesn't lie and is no respecter of persons.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Absolutely brother!
I don't trust them, I trust the Word.

Just making the point that when people say science proved this or that...that they really do not know, they have merely chosen to have faith in them. Always better to have faith in our good Lord. He doesn't lie and is no respecter of persons.

thank you for the quick clarification brother. too many trust in men or in mankind, and never learn the truth, even when someone comes back from the dead and says so ! (if they won't listen to Moses and the prophets, they won't listen to someone even if they come back from the dead. Jesus, N.T. Gospel. )

 

[BigSodaExposer]

in my 67 years science has adjusted it "facts" on so many fronts it takes faith in science to believe what they say..

i

Yep, it takes Faith to believe in either God or science

God is invisible.

And there were no dinosaurs in my lifetime. One is truth, one is lies. The old 50/50 argument. The atheist say a Christian is wasting his life on nonsense, the christians say the atheist will lose at death. And of course at death it will be too late to make a choice.

For those that believe no proof is necessary, for those that don't believe no proof is possible.

 

[BigSodaExposer]

It is the goal of science to be as accurate as possible, so it adapts and adjusts to new information. I see much more value and strength in that practice than if science were to dogmatically claim according to faith when the idea can be disproved. Science doesn't require faith. Your computer and the MRI machine down at the hospital will work just as well for some crazy cult follower who has zero belief in science as it does for a nuclear physicist. The power of science is its ability to cause measurable, predictable results.

With a laser, a pair of scissors, and a 3x5 notecard, you can prove wave-particle duality of sub-atomic particles. No such test exists for proving anything at all about any belief in gods or magic.

Wow, someone gets it about science!
It's true though, we are not scientists ourselves, so we listen and read them but in the end, we choose to put our faith into them and trust that what they are saying is true.

Good thread and good topic brother. Your OP makes perfect sense.

Thanks brother

 

[BigSodaExposer]

Science in many areas has lost credibility . Some of what science has done is wonderful .. Science bends as the 'facts' change.. as in my old text book. Believing science takes faith..

To me science is like "playpen physics".

Water freezes at 32 degrees, fire burns, metal conducts electricity. But THIS does not prove the sun is a billions of year old ball of gas, or that the Earth is billions of years old and once dinosaurs once inhabited it. One thing accounts for creation and 5000 years and the other goes against that. Faith in God VS Faith in science. Both things cannot be experienced by the 5 senses. So they both require faith to believe in.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

speaking of which, (the sun), recently a very smart genius, homeless, in arizone or naw mazico (sic) (sci) (sic)
was interviewed
and (oh, btw, he was once working in the so-called super science center out that way; i.e. 'official' super smart; fwiw),
said (proved?) that
the sun IS NOT A BIG BALL OF GAS. oooops --- secret's out now ! ----
he showed that it is ...................................should i even say it, dare i ?? (OF COURSE ) .......
...
.
h o l l o w .............................................................. and showed how it generates its tremendous energy also.......

now, he might not be right.
or, he might be right.
for sure we know one thing,
GOD is RIGHT, and the sun , if it was over a few hundred thousand years old, would not be where it is today ----- i.e. honest scientists have clearly shown via measurements of the suns rate of radiation, decay, etc etc etc, and dozens if not hundreds of other repeatable measurements,
well, if someone believes, they believe. if they don't , they don't.

no one was able to disprove him. (or at least no one did anyway).
so,
'wait and see' ....................................................................

 

[Edward]

BigSodaExposer:...For those that believe no proof is necessary, for those that don't believe no proof is possible.

As I progress in my learning and walk, i was given a huge truth. First... one chooses to put his faith (trust) into God...and then... God gives understanding to open our eyes. He also gives proof. But the funny thing about the proof is that is is not tangible, something that could be taken into a laboratory and tested and proven, but proof nonetheless. His Spirit bears witness with our spirit, and we come to "know" for fact, certain truths within our heart and spirit. He has also done certain miracles for me, that could not have been anything other than God Himself. I know this. I just can't prove according to worldly standards. This leaves room for faith which is what it is all about.


And as you say, for those who don't believe, no proof is possible. The lawyer syndrome, able to call into question anything. Which also includes the type who says that I have to be able to understand it, then i will believe it...I can actually wrap my mind around the thought process, all the way up until we realize the arrogance of such a statement. Ok, God, I'll believe it if you do it on my terms and prove yourself first. A scary way to talk to GOD. Wow.

 

[YosefHayim]

I'd be concerned about maintaining my Christian faith if I planned on reading the bible this literally. I'm not a Christian, but I would think one of the biggest challenges for believers is in deciding which scriptures are to be read as scientific, solid, no-doubt-about-it FACT, and which scriptures are not for one reason or another (allegory, parable, figurative language). Christians disagree on which scriptures should be read in which way, and there's no mechanism that can prove one determination over another. For example, when "the sun and moon stood still" for Joshua, did the sun and moon and the entire galaxy stop ALL of its motions as would have been necessary, or did the earth stop its rotation, or was it something else? There's either information missing, or the information provided isn't exactly correct, or some other explanation applies.

There are cultures on the opposing side with legends of long nights...

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Besides, Jesus said "My words are spirit, and they are life." so people can believe and have life, or refuse to believe and remain in darkness.
John 6:63
King James Version (KJV)
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

and again (why science cannot comprehend usually (apart from Revelation of God)

1 Corinthians 2:13-14
King James Version (KJV)
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (comprehended)

 

[BigSodaExposer]

As I progress in my learning and walk, i was given a huge truth. First... one chooses to put his faith (trust) into God...and then... God gives understanding to open our eyes. He also gives proof. But the funny thing about the proof is that is is not tangible, something that could be taken into a laboratory and tested and proven, but proof nonetheless. His Spirit bears witness with our spirit, and we come to "know" for fact, certain truths within our heart and spirit. He has also done certain miracles for me, that could not have been anything other than God Himself. I know this. I just can't prove according to worldly standards. This leaves room for faith which is what it is all about.


And as you say, for those who don't believe, no proof is possible. The lawyer syndrome, able to call into question anything. Which also includes the type who says that I have to be able to understand it, then i will believe it...I can actually wrap my mind around the thought process, all the way up until we realize the arrogance of such a statement. Ok, God, I'll believe it if you do it on my terms and prove yourself first. A scary way to talk to GOD. Wow.

Thats a really good way of explaining it. I will remember that.

 

[BigSodaExposer]

speaking of which, (the sun), recently a very smart genius, homeless, in arizone or naw mazico (sic) (sci) (sic)
was interviewed
and (oh, btw, he was once working in the so-called super science center out that way; i.e. 'official' super smart; fwiw),
said (proved?) that
the sun IS NOT A BIG BALL OF GAS. oooops --- secret's out now ! ----
he showed that it is ...................................should i even say it, dare i ?? (OF COURSE ) .......
...
.
h o l l o w .............................................................. and showed how it generates its tremendous energy also.......

now, he might not be right.
or, he might be right.
for sure we know one thing,
GOD is RIGHT, and the sun , if it was over a few hundred thousand years old, would not be where it is today ----- i.e. honest scientists have clearly shown via measurements of the suns rate of radiation, decay, etc etc etc, and dozens if not hundreds of other repeatable measurements,
well, if someone believes, they believe. if they don't , they don't.

no one was able to disprove him. (or at least no one did anyway).
so,
'wait and see' ....................................................................

See I just don't get that. How does one sitting here on the Earth truly know all that about the sun, that is however many billions or millions of miles away.? Yeah we get light and radiation and all that from it. But how does that make you believe its hollow? There are people on Earth right now that believe Earth is hollow. And there are two giant holes at each pole. I even saw someone on youtube say the light from the sun is merely a hole or portal and that is heavens light.

 

[BigSodaExposer]

Besides, Jesus said "My words are spirit, and they are life." so people can believe and have life, or refuse to believe and remain in darkness.
John 6:63
King James Version (KJV)
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

and again (why science cannot comprehend usually (apart from Revelation of God)

1 Corinthians 2:13-14
King James Version (KJV)
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (comprehended)

But what happens if you can comprehend and use science, and still believe in the word? That is my dilemma brother.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

men used to have a lot better functioning cerbral cortexes(or whatever) than they do today.
the bodies of some groups of people were very much more able to accomplish things 200 years and more ago
than most of who we're acquainted with living today.

they had beter understanding of the stars 4000 years ago, i reckon, than scientists today do, with very few if any exceptions.
indians, and native peoples in other countries, could run further, longer, easier --- without even trying hard.

But what happens if you can comprehend and use science, and still believe in the word? That is my dilemma brother.

there are apparently a lot of scientists and such, who are trained in modern day science, and fit in quite well with the world's system of science. however, when and if they start to discover the truth,
they come face to face with a choice - pursue the truth as God reveals it, or keep going with worldly science (in any field probably).
simple illustration ---- the rife microscope disappeared from the world almost entirely. it is forbidden to make one or be caught with one, because it better than anything else on earth visibly showed at the cellular level and smaller what was actually going on. modern science is built up with so many lies, they cannot permit it.

I don't have any idea what info on that is still available anywhere ---- most has been banned, confiscated, and destroyed r locked up.

 

[brother Paul]

The WORD is what I think it says. Opinion is what you think it says. (WFTH-I)

LOL! In my opinion...

 

[BigSodaExposer]

men used to have a lot better functioning cerbral cortexes(or whatever) than they do today.
the bodies of some groups of people were very much more able to accomplish things 200 years and more ago
than most of who we're acquainted with living today.

they had beter understanding of the stars 4000 years ago, i reckon, than scientists today do, with very few if any exceptions.
indians, and native peoples in other countries, could run further, longer, easier --- without even trying hard.



there are apparently a lot of scientists and such, who are trained in modern day science, and fit in quite well with the world's system of science. however, when and if they start to discover the truth,
they come face to face with a choice - pursue the truth as God reveals it, or keep going with worldly science (in any field probably).
simple illustration ---- the rife microscope disappeared from the world almost entirely. it is forbidden to make one or be caught with one, because it better than anything else on earth visibly showed at the cellular level and smaller what was actually going on. modern science is built up with so many lies, they cannot permit it.

I don't have any idea what info on that is still available anywhere ---- most has been banned, confiscated, and destroyed r locked up.

Thats interesting I had no idea about the rife microscope. Going to check it out now.

 

[Free]

Funny that with all this rhetoric about man's opinion regarding the Bible, there is now just man's opinion about science. No sources even given. Not that it matters at this point since it is all off-topic. Science discussions belong in the Science forum.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

help find this (I searched online several translations looking and can't re-locate it >> :: paul said something like >> what I say and do, and what you say and do doesn't matter(is not so important). what God says and what God does is what matters.(what's important)

it might have been a paraphrase around "one plants, another waters, but it is God who gives the growth" so all the glory and credit is God's -- we can't claim any credit for ourselves. all for Him.

i.e. man's opinion about ANYTHING doesn't matter. it woun't change God's Word, nor what God does.

 

[Free]

help find this (I searched online several translations looking and can't re-locate it >> :: paul said something like >> what I say and do, and what you say and do doesn't matter(is not so important). what God says and what God does is what matters.(what's important)

Paul doesn't say anything close to that.

it might have been a paraphrase around "one plants, another waters, but it is God who gives the growth" so all the glory and credit is God's -- we can't claim any credit for ourselves. all for Him.

1Co 3:4 For when one says, "I follow Paul," and another, "I follow Apollos," are you not being merely human?
1Co 3:5 What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each.
1Co 3:6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth.
1Co 3:7 So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth.
1Co 3:8 He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor.
1Co 3:9 For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building.
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it. (ESV)

i.e. man's opinion about ANYTHING doesn't matter. it woun't change God's Word, nor what God does.

No, that is not what that verse is saying.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

I'll keep looking. no worries.