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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join Hidden in Him and For His Glory for discussions on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/become-a-vessel-of-honor-part-2.112306/
Thoughts on Acts 6 ; 11 and 13
- Thread starter Humblepie
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Greetings Humblepie,
I am not sure what your problem is here. The whole of Stephen's defense in Acts 7 must be considered, but it is evident that Stephen was teaching the destruction of the Temple and the superseding of the Law of Moses and its environment by the Way of Life in Christ.
Kind regards
Trevor
Acts 6:11–13 (KJV): 11 Then they suborned men, which said, We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses, and against God. 12 And they stirred up the people, and the elders, and the scribes, and came upon him, and caught him, and brought him to the council, 13 And set up false witnesses, which said, This man ceaseth not to speak blasphemous words against this holy place, and the law:
I am not sure what your problem is here. The whole of Stephen's defense in Acts 7 must be considered, but it is evident that Stephen was teaching the destruction of the Temple and the superseding of the Law of Moses and its environment by the Way of Life in Christ.
Kind regards
Trevor
Humblepie
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How is it evident when the scripture contradicts your statement.
Can you show me old testament scripture that backs your claim?
Deuteronomy 13 is the reason he was stoned.
So you believe christ teached the superseding of the law? If he did he wouldn't have been perfect.
If there is no law, there is no sin. The law defines what sin is, and if there is no law anymore then you don't need to be saved because without the law, there is no sin.
There was sin before the Torah was given.
Death is the price of sin - regardless of Law or No Law.
Most everyone dies for their own sin.
Humblepie
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Are you saying The Torah wasn't given to Adam? If so then why did able make a sacrifice to God?
Before Moses it was verbally passed down, but it was there. He made the end known from the beginning.
If you have not entered the faith, God judges you by the law and you have the second death, if you're saved you are no longer under "the law of (sin and death)" but the law is still there.
The law will never save anyone, it's there to show how sinful we truly are, but you follow the law because you are saved and nowhere in the bible does it say the law is not applicable.
As a Christian you are not judged by the law because we have grace, but as a Christian we still follow his law, that's what sets us apart.
Early apostles and Paul NEVER taught that Christ death bypassed the law,
The word fulfill in Greek can be translated as
Fully teach, preach, fulfill, never end, abolish, get rid of.
The law is still here, and if it isn't, where in God's old testament did he tell us that his law is not everlasting?
Not till heaven and earth pass away......
Many confuse the "new covenant" with the ending of his law.....the new covenant does no such thing.
Why could early Christians convert jews? Not just any jews either, priest and teachers as well. Paul was converted, he didn't believe that God ended the law that's why he persecuted them, he believed the Liars in Acts 6.
After Jesus told him what was really being taught he believed.
journeymanisnothing
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Hello Humblepie.
The mercy our Lord showed negated condemnation of the law,
For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. Jas.2:13 KJV
The law is still in effect on the unrepentant,
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. Jn.5:45 KJV
"New Living Translation
When Adam sinned, sin entered the world. Adam’s sin brought death, so death spread to everyone, for everyone sinned.
English Standard Version
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—
12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was passed on to all men, because all sinned. 13
For sin was in the world before the law was given;"
When Adam sinned, sin entered the world. Adam’s sin brought death, so death spread to everyone, for everyone sinned.
English Standard Version
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—
12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was passed on to all men, because all sinned. 13
For sin was in the world before the law was given;"
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Acts 6:8-14
8 And Stephen, full of grace and power, was performing great wonders and signs among the people.
9 But some men from what was called the Synagogue of the Freedmen, including both Cyrenians and Alexandrians, and some from Cilicia and Asia, rose up and argued with Stephen.
10 But they were unable to cope with the wisdom and the Spirit with which he was speaking.
11 Then they secretly induced men to say, "We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses and against God."
12 And they stirred up the people, the elders and the scribes, and they came up to him and dragged him away and brought him before the Council.
13 They put forward false witnesses who said, "This man incessantly speaks against this holy place and the Law;
14 for we have heard him say that this Nazarene, Jesus, will destroy this place and alter the customs which Moses handed down to us."
It's always important to read and understand any particular verse, or verses, within their immediate context.
It seems an obvious mistake to try to imagine what Stephen actually said in his discussions with the members of the Synagogue of the Freedmen by way of their antagonistic misconstructions of his words. They wanted to cast Stephen in a bad light and incite in others their own feelings of antagonism toward him. And so, they "put forward false witnesses" who made claims about Stephen's speech that were not true. What was it that Stephen actually had said to the members of the Synagogue of the Freedmen? We aren't told. However, we do have a record of Stephen's preaching in Acts 7. If you want to get some sense of what Stephen might have said to the members of the Synagogue of the Freedmen, chapter 7 would be the best place to look. Does Stephen go on about the Mosaic Law in chapter 7? Not really, no. He gives a summary recounting of the history of the Israelites from Abraham to Solomon and then finishes with this statement:
Acts 7:51-53
51 "You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.
52 "Which one of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? They killed those who had previously announced the coming of the Righteous One, whose betrayers and murderers you have now become;
53 you who received the law as ordained by angels, and yet did not keep it."
There's not much to conclude about what Stephen thought and taught about the Mosaic Law in all of this, it seems to me.
Humblepie
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- #9
You claim it is evident that Stephen was teaching the destruction of the Temple and the superseding of the Law of Moses and its environment by the Way of Life in Christ.
It's quite the opposite according to the word.
If that's what early Christians taught then Saul would have never became Paul.
Everything the old testament teaches is still valid, if it isn't then the old testament is lie. The old testament and the new testament do not contradict each other, only your interpretation is a contradiction.
How many times is it said in the old testament that his law is forever, or that the law is good, or perfect, or a light?
The early Christians converted many priest, scribes, pharisies, and Israelites to christ including Paul. This never would have happened if what they taught didn't line up exactly with the Torah and the prophets.
The ONLY change is that those in the faith are not judged by the law because of grace. We are no longer slaves to the law of sin and death.
Works will never get you to heaven on their own, only being born again will, but if you produce no fruit as a believer, will be cut off the vine and burned with fire.
James 2: 17-18.
Works is law based.
So it takes both faith, and obedience to the law. Obedience to the law alone accomplishes nothing. Faith alone accomplishes nothing.
Remember, Christians or the Church is graphed into the nation of Israel.
When you become saved you are no longer a Gentile you are part of the nation of Israel.
If the law is gone, why does Christ enforce the law when he returns including sacrifice?
How many times did Paul defend himself against these false allegations?
So either Paul is a Liar or your interpretation is false. I don't think Paul is a liar.
If you don't read and apply all the old testament (including all the times God proclaims the law to be for all generations) when you read the new testament, then you will misinterpret what the new testament is actually teaching.
Acts 15
The question is this
The circumcision party believed one had to be circumcised to be saved.
The apostles believed that you didn't need to be circumcised to be saved.
So what did Peter decide?
He said basically that when one enters the faith they absolutely need to abstain from idols, things strangled, and blood, they must do this first, then as verse 21 states the rest they will learn on the sabbath. They didn't abolish the Law, they said it wasn't required to be saved.
Just like today. A new believer comes to church that never stepped foot in a church before isn't told they have to quit smoking, drinking, swearing, FIRST before God will save them. They enter the faith as a baby and grow and learn.
Acts 15 isn't about to follow or not to follow the law, it's about, following the law first to be saved, or getting saved first then learning the law as your faith matures.
Greetings again Humblepie,
Kind regards
Trevor
I reaffirm the above. Gentile believers are not now compelled to be circumcised.
Kind regards
Trevor
Humblepie
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You claim it is evident that Stephen was teaching the destruction of the Temple and the superseding of the Law of Moses and its environment by the Way of Life in Christ.
It's quite the opposite according to the word.
If that's what early Christians taught then Saul would have never became Paul.
Everything the old testament teaches is still valid, if it isn't then the old testament is lie. The old testament and the new testament do not contradict each other, only your interpretation is a contradiction.
How many times is it said in the old testament that his law is forever, or that the law is good, or perfect, or a light?
The early Christians converted many priest, scribes, pharisies, and Israelites to christ including Paul. This never would have happened if what they taught didn't line up exactly with the Torah and the prophets.
The ONLY change is that those in the faith are not judged by the law because of grace. We are no longer slaves to the law of sin and death.
Works will never get you to heaven on their own, only being born again will, but if you produce no fruit as a believer, will be cut off the vine and burned with fire.
James 2: 17-18.
Works is law based.
So it takes both faith, and obedience to the law. Obedience to the law alone accomplishes nothing. Faith alone accomplishes nothing.
Remember, Christians or the Church is graphed into the nation of Israel.
When you become saved you are no longer a Gentile you are part of the nation of Israel.
If the law is gone, why does Christ enforce the law when he returns including sacrifice?
How many times did Paul defend himself against these false allegations?
So either Paul is a Liar or your interpretation is false. I don't think Paul is a liar.
If you don't read and apply all the old testament (including all the times God proclaims the law to be for all generations) when you read the new testament, then you will misinterpret what the new testament is actually teaching.
Acts 15
The question is this
The circumcision party believed one had to be circumcised to be saved.
The apostles believed that you didn't need to be circumcised to be saved.
So what did Peter decide?
He said basically that when one enters the faith they absolutely need to abstain from idols, things strangled, and blood, they must do this first, then as verse 21 states the rest they will learn on the sabbath. They didn't abolish the Law, they said it wasn't required to be saved.
Just like today. A new believer comes to church that never stepped foot in a church before isn't told they have to quit smoking, drinking, swearing, FIRST before God will save them. They enter the faith as a baby and grow and learn.
Acts 15 isn't about to follow or not to follow the law, it's about, following the law first to be saved, or getting saved first then learning the law as your faith matures.
Acts 16:3 Paul has Timothy circumcised. Why if he taught it wasn't necessary for a believer to follow the law? Do you have Scripture to back your claim? I have Scripture to back my belief.
Enlighten me.
Scripture?
Greetings again Humblepie,
Acts 15:1–2,5 (KJV): 1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. 2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question. 5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
Acts 15:22–24,28-29 (KJV): 22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren: 23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia: 24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; 29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Acts 16:3 (KJV): Him (Timothy) would Paul have to go forth with him; and took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters: for they knew all that his father was a Greek.
1 Corinthians 7:18–19 (KJV): 18 Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised. 19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
Galatians 2:3–5 (KJV): 3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised: 4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage: 5 To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
Galatians 5:2–11 (KJV): 2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. 3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. 4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love. 7 Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth? 8 This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you. 9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. 10 I have confidence in you through the Lord, that ye will be none otherwise minded: but he that troubleth you shall bear his judgment, whosoever he be. 11 And I, brethren, if I yet preach circumcision, why do I yet suffer persecution? then is the offence of the cross ceased.
Seems to be a comprehensive list.
Kind regards
Trevor
There is a lot of Scriptures about this subject:
Acts 15:1–2,5 (KJV): 1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. 2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question. 5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
Acts 15:22–24,28-29 (KJV): 22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren: 23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia: 24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things; 29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Acts 16:3 (KJV): Him (Timothy) would Paul have to go forth with him; and took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters: for they knew all that his father was a Greek.
1 Corinthians 7:18–19 (KJV): 18 Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised. 19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
Galatians 2:3–5 (KJV): 3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised: 4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage: 5 To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
Galatians 5:2–11 (KJV): 2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. 3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. 4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love. 7 Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth? 8 This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you. 9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. 10 I have confidence in you through the Lord, that ye will be none otherwise minded: but he that troubleth you shall bear his judgment, whosoever he be. 11 And I, brethren, if I yet preach circumcision, why do I yet suffer persecution? then is the offence of the cross ceased.
Seems to be a comprehensive list.
Kind regards
Trevor
Humblepie
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I am saying the exact same thing Paul is saying, the law can't save you, all it does is condemn you.
It shows how imperfect we are. Circumcision does not save you and that is the point Titus was making. Only God's grace can save you but that doesn't mean the law isn't applicable today. Paul and all the apostles followed the law to the letter, and they taught us to as well.
Where in the OLD testament do the prophets foretell the abolishing of the law?
Amos 3:7 states God always warns us first through the prophets.
If it's not told in the old testament first, it's not in the new testament.
They cannot contradict. What you believe is a contradiction
It shows how imperfect we are. Circumcision does not save you and that is the point Titus was making. Only God's grace can save you but that doesn't mean the law isn't applicable today. Paul and all the apostles followed the law to the letter, and they taught us to as well.
Where in the OLD testament do the prophets foretell the abolishing of the law?
Amos 3:7 states God always warns us first through the prophets.
If it's not told in the old testament first, it's not in the new testament.
They cannot contradict. What you believe is a contradiction
Greetings again Humblepie,
Acts 15:24 (KJV): Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
Kind regards
Trevor
So you are saying that it is necessary that Gentile believers must be circumcised and keep the law:
Acts 15:24 (KJV): Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
Kind regards
Trevor
Humblepie
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((((((So you are saying that it is necessary that Gentile believers must be circumcised and keep the law
))))))))Negative.....that's NOT what I am saying. I'm saying only the blood of JESUS can save you grace through faith just as the apostles preached, I am also saying that just because there is grace doesn't mean the law has been pushed aside. It is still relevant. As a believer you always have grace, and as a believer we follow GODS law because we want to be obedient to his will.
You think it's either one or the other, well according to scripture it is both.
We as Christians are not judged according to the law like unbelievers, because our sins are forgiven, but that doesn't give us a free pass to sin ( sin is the breaking of GODS law) that would be an insult to grace.
Once you become a believer you are no longer considered Gentile because we've been graphed into the nation of Israel.
You still haven't shown me in the old testament scripture, the same scripture Paul used to convert Jews to the faith, where the prophets proclaim that the law will no longer be applicable to us.
If God didn't say it in the old testament, he sure didn't say it in the new testament.
I eagerly wait for your reply.
In Brotherhood.
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So many false statements in this comparatively short quotation!
There is an Old Covenant under which the OT Jew lived and the New Covenant under which the NT born-again believer lived (and you and I, too). What's the difference?
Romans 7:4-6
4 Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.
5 For while we were in the flesh, the sinful passions, which were aroused by the Law, were at work in the members of our body to bear fruit for death.
6 But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.
Galatians 3:1-3
1 You foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified?
2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?
Galatians 3:23-26
23 But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed.
24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith.
25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Hebrews 10:19-22
19 Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus,
20 by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh,
21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God,
22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
Galatians 5:4-6
4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.
5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.
6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love.
@ Humblepie wrote:
"Works will never get you to heaven on their own, only being born again will, but if you produce no fruit as a believer, will be cut off the vine and burned with fire.
James 2: 17-18.
Works is law based.
So it takes both faith, and obedience to the law."
This is so self-contradictory it almost beggars belief!
There is only one Savior. Just one. He ALONE saves, fully and permanently (John 14:6; Acts 4:12; 1 Timothy 2:5; Hebrews 9-10:22; 1 John 5:11-13).
The moment anyone asserts that they retain or maintain their salvation by way of their works, they make themselves a co-Savior with Jesus (which is a deeply blasphemous thing to do). The thinking of the works-salvation crowd is that Jesus merely starts their salvation, he "gets the ball rolling," so to speak, but the saved person must retain the "ball" and keep it rolling. But this means that the saved man is essentially saving himself; he's the one whose good work, whose obedience to God, makes Jesus's salvation "stick." In other words, Jesus needs the good works of those he saves in order to really save them. Again, this is blasphemous, elevating the wretched, weak sinner to the level of their perfect, all-powerful Savior.
Imagine a man drowning in the ocean. He's about to go down for the third - and last - time. As he sinks beneath the waves, strong hands grip him, lifting him from the water and into a boat. The drowning man is saved! Yay! He lays for several minutes in the boat shivering and gasping for air, recovering himself from his almost-death. Finally, he looks up at his rescuer and says, "Thank you! You saved my life."
"Not entirely," the rescuer replies. He then lifts the man from the bottom of the boat and throws him back into the ocean, calling out to him, "I've saved you from drowning but now you've got to keep yourself saved! It's up to you to make the most of what I did for you! Good luck!" And then, the man in the boat sails away.
Moments later, as the dark waters of the ocean swallow the drowning man, he thinks to himself: What a great savior that man in the boat was! If only I'd been able to save myself...
No one in their right mind would think, imagining this situation, that the man in the boat had really saved the drowning man in any meaningful, or useful way; the man in the boat had only briefly forestalled the drowning man's death. What the man in the boat did, actually, was quite monstrous, giving the drowning man an entirely false sense of hope and relief. In fact, the man in the boat is a cruel murderer, fully aware the drowning man could not save himself, able to save the drowning man completely, but unwilling to do so. This, though, is essentially what works-salvation folk want to say is the sort of "salvation" Jesus has accomplished for the lost person. His "salvation" is only partial, imperfect, and is as temporary as the ability of the sinner to keep himself saved.
The sinner needs saving, he needs a Savior, precisely because he is "without strength" (Romans 5:6-8), "dead in trespasses and sins," bound under the power of the World, Flesh and the devil (Ephesians 2:1-3), and desperately unable to save himself. His heart is naturally bent toward evil, fleshly, carnal, and incorrigibly rebellious toward God.
Romans 8:5-8
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit.
6 For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace.
7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law; indeed, it cannot.
8 Those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
No one in this state - which is the state in which all unsaved person exist - is able to please God. In fact, they are hostile toward God, worshiping and serving themselves as their own god. All unsaved people are "drowning in sin," and cannot do anything to change this condition for themselves. They need someone else to save them from themselves.
How, then, the works-salvation folk think they can do anything to contribute to their salvation is a mystery to me. They were too weak to save themselves and they are, then, too weak to retain and maintain their salvation.
Titus 3:5-7
5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
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This is just a facile deflection from all that I pointed out.
Read the verses/passages I offered in my last post. Just read Hebrews 9-10:22. The Old Testament does not serve as the structure for, or pattern of, post-Calvary, New Covenant life in Christ. There is, then, no reason at all to anchor the things I pointed out from the New Testament in the Old Covenant of the Old Testament.
Humblepie
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Many like to point out the differences between the old and new covenants, but are those differences biblical or invented by traditions of men to suit their own doctrine and theology? We are told to test everything which includes testing our faith, and ourselves.
1 Thessalonians 5:21 Test everything; hold fast to what is good
2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, to see whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Or do you not realize this about yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you fail to meet the test!
Amos 3:7 reads Surely the Lord GOD (YHWH) does nothing, unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.
If Amos is correct, then everything that the New Covenant was to become should be detailed in the prophets. Otherwise, according to Amos, God would not, nor did not, do anything. So, if we were smart, we should examine what the prophets said about the New Covenant.
Here is what we would discover.
The Spirit of God would be given to His people, and then they would then keep the whole law of God. We find this in
Ezekiel 36:26-27
And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.
This is consistent with what Christ taught that the spirit would do in John 14:26 and John 16:12, saying that the Spirit would lead us into truth, and according to the Bible, the truth is the Law of God, the Torah.
Psalm 119:142 Your righteousness is forever, and your law (Torah) is true.
We also learn that the prophets said that the new covenant will be different than the old covenant in the sense that the fathers broke the old covenant.
Jeremiah 31:32
Not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares (Yahweh) the Lord. Thus, consistent with what we already reviewed in Ezekiel 36; the Lord says what the solution will be.
We are told in the very next verse in Jeremiah that the New Covenant would consist of the law of God being written on our heart.
Jeremiah 31:33 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules. This, of course, is saying the exact same thing as the prophet Ezekiel was already noted to say. The spirit leads us to want to do (from our heart), the law of God because the Lord removes our stony heart that is against the law of God and gives us a new heart that is after the law of God. And as we already noted, that is the purpose of the spirit according to Yeshua as well. Lastly, the only other change noted in the New Covenant is that we shall not have to teach our brothers anymore. That everyone will already fully know the Lord, which of course, is saying the same thing as one knows the Word of God.
Jeremiah 31:34
And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know (Yahweh) the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares (Yahweh) the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
We still have to teach today, but someday when everyone knows the Word of God perfectly, then we will no longer have to teach them. This of course, has not yet been fully realized in the covenant just yet, and will not be fully realized until the first resurrection, in which we will be in our glorified bodies (see Daniel 12, 1 Corinthians 15).
To summarize, here is what the new covenant is according to the prophets:
1) We have the spirit to want to obey, from our heart, the Law of God, the truth.
2) Someday, we will not have to teach any longer because all will know the whole Word of God.
Do you see anything in the prophets about the law of God changing at all or being abolished?
Let me ask that again. Do you see anything in the prophets about the commandments being abolished, or removed?
Keep looking, and you might be looking for a long time, because it is simply nowhere to be found.
Now remember what Amos said.
Amos 3:7
If the prophets did not say that God was going to do it, then God didn’t do it, nor is he going to do it. So, if you believe some commandments were abolished in the new covenant, but you cannot find any mention of it beforehand in the prophets, well then you sort of have a problem.
1 Thessalonians 5:21 Test everything; hold fast to what is good
2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, to see whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Or do you not realize this about yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you fail to meet the test!
Amos 3:7 reads Surely the Lord GOD (YHWH) does nothing, unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.
If Amos is correct, then everything that the New Covenant was to become should be detailed in the prophets. Otherwise, according to Amos, God would not, nor did not, do anything. So, if we were smart, we should examine what the prophets said about the New Covenant.
Here is what we would discover.
The Spirit of God would be given to His people, and then they would then keep the whole law of God. We find this in
Ezekiel 36:26-27
And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.
This is consistent with what Christ taught that the spirit would do in John 14:26 and John 16:12, saying that the Spirit would lead us into truth, and according to the Bible, the truth is the Law of God, the Torah.
Psalm 119:142 Your righteousness is forever, and your law (Torah) is true.
We also learn that the prophets said that the new covenant will be different than the old covenant in the sense that the fathers broke the old covenant.
Jeremiah 31:32
Not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares (Yahweh) the Lord. Thus, consistent with what we already reviewed in Ezekiel 36; the Lord says what the solution will be.
We are told in the very next verse in Jeremiah that the New Covenant would consist of the law of God being written on our heart.
Jeremiah 31:33 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules. This, of course, is saying the exact same thing as the prophet Ezekiel was already noted to say. The spirit leads us to want to do (from our heart), the law of God because the Lord removes our stony heart that is against the law of God and gives us a new heart that is after the law of God. And as we already noted, that is the purpose of the spirit according to Yeshua as well. Lastly, the only other change noted in the New Covenant is that we shall not have to teach our brothers anymore. That everyone will already fully know the Lord, which of course, is saying the same thing as one knows the Word of God.
Jeremiah 31:34
And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know (Yahweh) the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares (Yahweh) the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
We still have to teach today, but someday when everyone knows the Word of God perfectly, then we will no longer have to teach them. This of course, has not yet been fully realized in the covenant just yet, and will not be fully realized until the first resurrection, in which we will be in our glorified bodies (see Daniel 12, 1 Corinthians 15).
To summarize, here is what the new covenant is according to the prophets:
1) We have the spirit to want to obey, from our heart, the Law of God, the truth.
2) Someday, we will not have to teach any longer because all will know the whole Word of God.
Do you see anything in the prophets about the law of God changing at all or being abolished?
Let me ask that again. Do you see anything in the prophets about the commandments being abolished, or removed?
Keep looking, and you might be looking for a long time, because it is simply nowhere to be found.
Now remember what Amos said.
Amos 3:7
If the prophets did not say that God was going to do it, then God didn’t do it, nor is he going to do it. So, if you believe some commandments were abolished in the new covenant, but you cannot find any mention of it beforehand in the prophets, well then you sort of have a problem.
