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Thoughts on Joel Osteen

Marriage IMO falls in a different catagory.. it TO ME is spitting at the relationship of Christ and His bride
 
smaller said:
All sin is a "moral issue." Yet, none are sinless. Where does that leave the equations? You'll take homosexuals as friends, but not attend their wedding? What kind of a friend would you really be? Obviously a phony self righteous one.
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ouch... we dont disagree very often but we do here. :)
 
I suppose the teetotalers among us would consider the wedding for which Jesus made more than 908 bottles of wine to be a drunken brawl. Then why did He attend?
 
Lets all go to 4th & T streets in Sacramento and play with the hookers.....

forgive the short pop up posts ..not used to this traveling lap top
 
reba said:
Lets all go to 4th & T streets in Sacramento and play with the hookers.....

forgive the short pop up posts ..not used to this traveling lap top
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I, and many in my church actually do. Every Sunday, we go to "the" local hang-out for hookers and druggies and homosexuals, and spend several hours with them. And we often have them to parties at our building.
 
2 Corinthians 6:14 (NASB)
14 Do not be bound together with unbelievers; for what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship has light with darkness?
 
reba said:
ouch... we dont disagree very often but we do here. :)
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That's probably because I have LG friends and relatives, and you, mabe not? I also take their money in business. I'm sure you would join in that effort would you not? As a christian I had to work very hard to love these people. I had to "get over myself" in order to do so. Do you know how much they appreciate a "christian" who can actually love them? It is an invaluable experience, to love people regardless of their sin. In my more "self righteous" days I am ashamed to say that I had "strong believing friends" who were the type that would go to a funeral of a suicide victim, tell the grieving family their loved one is in hell, and then tell the family it was not too late for them to repent and accept Jesus before it was too late for them.

I no longer hang around with these types of religious manipulators. They actually make me sick.

I'm not much on hypocrisy. Just because I attend a gay wedding it doesn't mean I agree with any sin. Whatever civil ceremony there was, or whatever ill headed church held up and celebrated that sin, I can disagree with and still attend.

The obligation for me to love my neighbors as myself is the over riding factor in "all things." There really is no other choice to make. That is the best that I can do. Expressing self righteous hypocrisy is just not on my list. I wish no one was a sinner, but all are.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
This makes me wonder, have you ever tuned him in and listened to a sermon by him?
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Based on the numerous things I've heard about him, I have no interest in tuning into him. I would rather listen those whom I know teach the gospel and teach the entirety of Scripture.
 
Willie T said:
Please open your quoted post. I believe you will find that Jesus always demonstrated His love and acceptance of the person (not their acts) BEFORE He ever told them to first straighten up in order for Him to approach them.
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And that in no way addresses my points.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
This insult of my integrity deserves no answer.
And imagine, it coming from a moderator.
Not exactly setting a good example to the rest of us, is it?
Not to mention that you get away with it.
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There was absolutely no insult intended. They are serious questions.
 
Free said:
Based on the numerous things I've heard about him, I have no interest in tuning into him. I would rather listen those whom I know teach the gospel and teach the entirety of Scripture.
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Is that not a big issue Free? Making a judgement about someone based on what someone else says? When folks come to warn me, or talk about about someone I shut them down. I don't base my opinion on someone, based on what someone said, I don't consider someone based on past crimes, sins or mistakes.

Now I don't have time to incorporate everyone's favourite bible teacher. There are not enough hours in the day, and it really depends on who's telling me to go listen to this or that. There is a whole lot out there to listen to. We don't have to paint someone in a bad light though based on what other say.

Mike.
 
smaller said:
All sin is a "moral issue." Yet, none are sinless.
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This shows me that you are not reading what I am actually writing. I was very clearly addressing the acts of associating with sinners, not the sin. Of course all sin is a moral issue and none are sinless. That is not at all what I am addressing.

Eating with sinners and having them as friends, etc., are not moral issues. Celebrating their sin is a moral issue. Not once did Jesus ever celebrate sin.

smaller said:
Where does that leave the equations? You'll take homosexuals as friends, but not attend their wedding? What kind of a friend would you really be? Obviously a phony self righteous one.
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You need to tone it down a notch or ten. Being friends with homosexuals and not attending their wedding is consistent with Scripture. There is absolutely no phoniness or self-righteousness in that. The fact that the friendship exists proves your point wrong. If they were true friends, they would know ahead of time that I disagree with gay marriage and would be understanding with my not attending. If they would break a friendship over that, then it would show that they don't respect my beliefs. This has everything to do with pleasing God.

smaller said:
Attending any event does not mean we concede to any sin or celebrate any sin.
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Marriage is not just any event. As I stated, the sole purpose of a marriage is to celebrate the union of two people and by attending, it is implied that one is accepting of that marriage and joining in the celebration.

smaller said:
Every attendant at every and any event is in fact a sinner, regardless. Yes, it is entirely possible to love sinners and hate sin. Isn't that what "we" expect from Jesus ourselves? His Love, regardless of "our sin?"
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Again, most this has nothing to do with the issue, but there is one thing to address. You say that "it is entirely possible to love sinners and hate sin," with which I whole heartedly agree. However, what one does by attending a gay wedding is love the sin.

smaller said:
I'd suggest that there is a bit of circular logic in the above. Not much different than Peter eating with the Gentiles when the Jews weren't around, but pretending to be kosher when they were. Wouldn't want any of my believing "christian" buddies to catch me at a gay wedding. Oh, that just wouldn't do. Even though the gay people are my friends, come to my house, eat, share, etc etc.

Maybe a cave somewhere where we can express our non-celebration of moral turpitude by personal isolationism, and we can sit there and contemplate our personal righteousness in complete solitude, not tainted by all the other "immoral" sinners. Yes, that should express our moral disdain for sin quite thoroughly.
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None of that has any bearing on this issue and it certainly isn't circular.
 
Brother Mike said:
Is that not a big issue Free? Making a judgement about someone based on what someone else says? When folks come to warn me, or talk about about someone I shut them down. I don't base my opinion on someone, based on what someone said, I don't consider someone based on past crimes, sins or mistakes.

Now I don't have time to incorporate everyone's favourite bible teacher. There are not enough hours in the day, and it really depends on who's telling me to go listen to this or that. There is a whole lot out there to listen to. We don't have to paint someone in a bad light though based on what other say.

Mike.
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As you said, there are not enough hours in the day. I don't have the time to sit here and go through all he has said or written. I've seen enough and heard enough from numerous people and websites that there is good reason to believe he doesn't preach the whole gospel and I simply have no desire to listen to him.
 
smaller Willie T LovethroughDove

Please answer these simple questions:

Would you go to the marriage of a father and daughter? How about a brother and sister? What about a marriage between two adulterers, each currently married to someone else?
 
Willie T said:
I'm sorry. I firmly believe we are wrong to run people down because we take other people's word for what they are saying.
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Willie, the stories, proved true and factual, over and over are not disputable. At some point we must fall into obedience or question ourselves, "Do we serve the Risen Saviour?" Jesus told us that if we love Him, we will obey His Commands. (John 14:23) For this reason my first rule of Hermeneutics stands because should we fail to read all of scripture and to consider all of scripture when we seek God's understanding of any scripture.

Scripture, like God is one complete package, to use popular vernacular. And scripture, parted out, is not the Word of God, the Old Testament and the, seeming, changes in God between the Old and the New Testaments that, as per Mal 3:6, are not changes at all but are man made misconceptions.
 
smaller said:
I'm not much on hypocrisy. Just because I attend a gay wedding it doesn't mean I agree with any sin. Whatever civil ceremony there was, or whatever ill headed church held up and celebrated that sin, I can disagree with and still attend.
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So you think that churches that perform gay marriages aren't Christian and you acknowledge that a gay marriage is a celebration of sin, but you don't think it is hypocritical to attend, joining in that celebration?

smaller said:
The obligation for me to love my neighbors as myself is the over riding factor in "all things." There really is no other choice to make. That is the best that I can do.
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Where does loving God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength fall into the picture then, the first and greatest commandment, according to Jesus?

Mar 12:28 And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him, "Which commandment is the most important of all?"
Mar 12:29 Jesus answered, "The most important is, 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.
Mar 12:30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'
Mar 12:31 The second is this: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these." (ESV)

It really looks like you've put the second one first.
 
LovethroughDove said:
I don't think I'll ever have to address the first 2 questions. And the last question, it has probably already taken place.
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It is irrelevant if you think you'll ever have to, the question is would you knowingly and willingly attend such weddings?
 
Free said:
It is irrelevant if you think you'll ever have to, the question is would you knowingly and willingly attend such weddings?
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I think it does matter. I have really had to ponder attending a wedding between my cousin who is one of my dearest friends, and his partner of 8 years. If they were to take it to that level (which hasn't been discussed ever) But.

I can't give you an honest answer to questions that aren't on the radar (at all).
 
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