Understanding the GodHead. The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

[Grailhunter]

Description of the Godhead called the Trinity

One God in the Old Testament and three Gods in the New Testament…
One God worshipped by the Jews in the Old Testament and three Gods worshipped by Christians in the New Testament. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Yahweh, Yeshua, and Holy Spirit.

As far as the preexisting Christ, I go with Einstein’s theorem of the relativity of time. When Yeshua was born He was aware of…the past, the present and the future. But that does not mean He created the world, but that He was aware of it.

The Trinity…what it is…Three Gods in a Godhead. A Divine unity exists between them, a unity that is not well defined in the scriptures and maybe because we cannot comprehend it.

The individual nature of the Godhead….
Individual Deities in that they could sit next to each other on three thrones.
Individual Deities with separate minds and individual thoughts in that one can know something that the other two do not.
Individual Deities in that they could have a discussion on a topic.
Individual Deities in that Yahweh can designate Himself as Father and Yeshua as Son and the third God as Holy Spirit.
Individual in that one can hover over the other and say He is well pleased with other.
Individual Deities where one can pray to another.
Yeshua as His Son….more than descriptive designations….God the Father impregnated Miriam and had a Son. Yahweh is a Father. Yeshua has a Father and Yeshua considers Him as a Father and His God. So there is a clear hierarchy. Christ said, The Father is greater than I and Fifty times Christ referred to Him as “My Father”

The Holy Spirit in detail is a mystery because of the lack of information in the scriptures. The name of the Holy Spirit was never disclosed in the scriptures, probably for a very good reason. But this has caused confusion about the Holy Spirit. Is the Holy Spirit a mere ghost or spirit? Is the Holy Spirit the Spirit of Yahweh, of Yeshua, of both….

The Holy Spirit is a full fledged God and member of the Trinity and they all have “Spirits” and they are all Holy. LOL Still a mystery. Which is ironic because of the three the Holy Spirit probably interacts with humanity the most. The Holy Spirit communicates with us, guides us, strengthens us, and educates us. Speaking in tongues is all about the Holy Spirit.

But still there is a oneness concept and Yeshua explained it. Speaking to God the Father (He was not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us. The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church. And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

No possibility of just one God….

1. Yahweh….God Almighty….Creator of Heaven and Earth.
2. Yeshua…..The Son of God….Savior…..Messiah.
3. Holy Spirit…..Third member of the Trinity and he guides us, strengthens us, and educates us. Speaking in tongues is all about the Holy Spirit.

 

[Free]

Description of the Godhead called the Trinity

One God in the Old Testament and three Gods in the New Testament…
One God worshipped by the Jews in the Old Testament and three Gods worshipped by Christians in the New Testament. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Yahweh, Yeshua, and Holy Spirit.


The Trinity…what it is…Three Gods in a Godhead. A Divine unity exists between them, a unity that is not well defined in the scriptures and maybe because we cannot comprehend it.

The individual nature of the Godhead….
Individual Deities in that they could sit next to each other on three thrones.
Individual Deities with separate minds and individual thoughts in that one can know something that the other two do not.
Individual Deities in that they could have a discussion on a topic.
Individual Deities in that Yahweh can designate Himself as Father and Yeshua as Son and the third God as Holy Spirit.
Individual in that one can hover over the other and say He is well pleased with other.
Individual Deities where one can pray to another.
Yeshua as His Son….more than descriptive designations….God the Father impregnated Miriam and had a Son. Yahweh is a Father. Yeshua has a Father and Yeshua considers Him as a Father and His God. So there is a clear hierarchy. Christ said, The Father is greater than I and Fifty times Christ referred to Him as “My Father”

The Holy Spirit in detail is a mystery because of the lack of information in the scriptures. The name of the Holy Spirit was never disclosed in the scriptures, probably for a very good reason. But this has caused confusion about the Holy Spirit. Is the Holy Spirit a mere ghost or spirit? Is the Holy Spirit the Spirit of Yahweh, of Yeshua, of both….

The Holy Spirit is a full fledged God and member of the Trinity and they all have “Spirits” and they are all Holy. LOL Still a mystery. Which is ironic because of the three the Holy Spirit probably interacts with humanity the most. The Holy Spirit communicates with us, guides us, strengthens us, and educates us. Speaking in tongues is all about the Holy Spirit.

But still there is a oneness concept and Yeshua explained it. Speaking to God the Father (He was not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us. The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church. And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

No possibility of just one God….

The main problem with this is that God himself repeatedly says he is the only one and there will never be another, as do his followers:

Deu 4:35 To you it was shown, that you might know that the LORD is God; there is no other besides him.
…
Deu 4:39 know therefore today, and lay it to your heart, that the LORD is God in heaven above and on the earth beneath; there is no other.

Deu 6:4 “Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.

Deu 32:39 "'See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god beside me; I kill and I make alive; I wound and I heal; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand.

1Sa 2:2 “There is none holy like the LORD: for there is none besides you; there is no rock like our God.

Isa 43:10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.
Isa 43:11 I, I am the LORD, and besides me there is no savior.

Isa 44:6 Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.
Isa 44:7 Who is like me? Let him proclaim it. Let him declare and set it before me, since I appointed an ancient people. Let them declare what is to come, and what will happen.
Isa 44:8 Fear not, nor be afraid; have I not told you from of old and declared it? And you are my witnesses! Is there a God besides me? There is no Rock; I know not any.”
…
Isa 44:24 Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by myself,

Isa 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is no other, besides me there is no God; I equip you, though you do not know me,
Isa 45:6 that people may know, from the rising of the sun and from the west, that there is none besides me; I am the LORD, and there is no other.
…
Isa 45:18 For thus says the LORD, who created the heavens (he is God!), who formed the earth and made it (he established it; he did not create it empty, he formed it to be inhabited!): "I am the LORD, and there is no other.
…
Isa 45:21 Declare and present your case; let them take counsel together! Who told this long ago? Who declared it of old? Was it not I, the LORD? And there is no other god besides me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none besides me.
Isa 45:22 "Turn to me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other.

Isa 46:9 remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me,

Mar 12:29 "The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.
...
Mar 12:32 And the scribe said to him, “You are right, Teacher. You have truly said that he is one, and there is no other besides him.
...
Mar 12:34 And when Jesus saw that he answered wisely, he said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” And after that no one dared to ask him any more questions.

1Co 8:4 Therefore, as to the eating of food offered to idols, we know that “an idol has no real existence,” and that “there is no God but one.”
1Co 8:5 For although there may be so-called gods in heaven or on earth—as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”—
1Co 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

Eph 4:4 There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call—
Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

1Ti 1:17 To the King of the ages, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

Jas 2:19 You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!

Jud 1:25 to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.

(All ESV)

The Trinity is not tritheism and tritheism is heresy.

 

[Grailhunter]

yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.

Get a calculator if you need to and add them up.
1. Yahweh
2. Yeshua
3. Holy Spirit
Now total it.
The sum is three

All of your Old Testament scriptures back up what I said, one God in the Old Testament and no one else like Him.

1Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.
The Apostles called Yahweh God and Yeshua Lord.

And again as I said, 50 times Yeshua says….My Father….not Myself in Heaven.
"I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God"
John 27:17
One God going to another to sit on the right hand of the Father.

The one God formula for the Trinity skews the meaning of over a hundred scriptures so that people can read them but not understand them. Does it sound like something that Satan would come up with. Bingo! Satan is all about confusion and he is a schemer.

 

[Free]

Get a calculator if you need to and add them up.
1. Yahweh
2. Yeshua
3. Holy Spirit
Now total it.
The sum is three

All of your Old Testament scriptures back up what I said, one God in the Old Testament and no one else like Him.

1Cor 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we exist.
The Apostles called Yahweh God and Yeshua Lord.

And again as I said, 50 times Yeshua says….My Father….not Myself in Heaven.
"I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God"
John 27:17
One God going to another to sit on the right hand of the Father.

I have never denied the threeness of God nor, unlike tritheists, the oneness of God. All the above can only be explained by the Trinity—three divine, coequal, coeternal persons within the one being that is God.

That there was and is only one true God is absolutely without question. It’s among the clearest teachings in the Bible, up there with the death and resurrection of Jesus.

The one God formula for the Trinity skews the meaning of over a hundred scriptures so that people can read them but not understand them. Does it sound like something that Satan would come up with. Bingo! Satan is all about confusion and he is a schemer.

Yes, he is, and that includes convincing people either that God lied when he said he is the only one and there would never be another, that he was clueless about the existence of two others (how many more could there actually be?), or that he created two other gods, which both means he lied and the other two are not his equals.

Those are your only three options.

At least the doctrine of the Trinity attempts to make sense of all God’s revelation of himself, rather than either ignoring the bits that don’t fit or reinterpreting them entirely.

 

[Grailhunter]

I have never denied the threeness of God nor, unlike tritheists, the oneness of God. All the above can only be explained by the Trinity—three divine, coequal, coeternal persons within the one being that is God.

Yes, he is, and that includes convincing people either that God lied when he said he is the only one and there would never be another, that he was clueless about the existence of two others (how many more could there actually be?), or that he created two other gods, which both means he lied and the other two are not his equals.

As we both agreed He said that in the Old Testament but if you notice He does not say that in the New Testament. In stead the scriptures said that God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son…..His Son is a God.

That there was and is only one true God is absolutely without question. It’s among the clearest teachings in the Bible, up there with the death and resurrection of Jesus.

That is the point, absolutely not a clear teaching and is in direct contradiction of over a hundred scriptures. It is a false teaching of man that has done a lot of harm to Christianity.

At least the doctrine of the Trinity attempts to make sense of all God’s revelation of himself, rather than either ignoring the bits that don’t fit or reinterpreting them entirely.

It is the Trinity that does not fit the over all theme of the New Testament. And skews the meaning of a Good part of the New Testament.

It almost like mind control, you can read about Yeshua talking to or praying to His Father but in your head it does not compute.
My Father, 50 times, but in your head....Myself. Ascending to the Father but in your head He is ascending to Himself to sit on the right hand of Himself….And when He says He is pleased with His Son, but in your head He was pleased with Himself…. “In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you….but in your head He should have said in My house….When Yeshua said the Father had given Him authority….did He give authority to Himself? I am curious, do you think they nailed God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit to the cross? How does feel to have your mind controlled by the Devil?

 

[Grailhunter]

At least the doctrine of the Trinity attempts to make sense of all God’s revelation of himself, rather than either ignoring the bits that don’t fit or reinterpreting them entirely.

Again that is the point, the one God, one person Trinity makes no sense. That is what is appealing to many….Believing if it makes no sense that is proof that it is of God. But God is not a God of non-sense, that is a characteristic of Satan.

 

[Free]

As we both agreed He said that in the Old Testament but if you notice He does not say that in the New Testament. In stead the scriptures said that God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son…..His Son is a God.

Yes, he does. Jesus said it himself and Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, said it as well. I quoted those passages.

That is the point, absolutely not a clear teaching and is in direct contradiction of over a hundred scriptures. It is a false teaching of man that has done a lot of harm to Christianity.

It is absolutely clear and I gave evidence of such. Monotheism is biblical and foundational to Christianity. If someone believes in more than one god they don’t believe in Christianity.

It is the Trinity that does not fit the over all theme of the New Testament. And skews the meaning of a Good part of the New Testament.

It makes the best sense, by a wide margin.

It almost like mind control, you can read about Yeshua talking to or praying to His Father but in your head it does not compute.
My Father, 50 times, but in your head....Myself. Ascending to the Father but in your head He is ascending to Himself to sit on the right hand of Himself….And when He says He is pleased with His Son, but in your head He was pleased with Himself…. “In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you….but in your head He should have said in My house….When Yeshua said the Father had given Him authority….did He give authority to Himself? I am curious, do you think they nailed God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit to the cross? How does feel to have your mind controlled by the Devil?

We’ve been over this before and you’re again showing that you, as with pretty much every other anti-Trinitarian currently in the forums, don’t seem to have really studied the doctrine of the Trinity. Your arguments here are addressing Modalism/Oneness, not the Trinity. I can only scratch my head as to why so many argue against the Trinity when they don’t even understand it.

 

[Free]

Again that is the point, the one God, one person Trinity makes no sense. That is what is appealing to many….Believing if it makes no sense that is proof that it is of God. But God is not a God of non-sense, that is a characteristic of Satan.

It makes the best sense. We clearly see three divine, coequal, coeternal persons, one of whom became flesh. We also clearly see that there was and ever will be only one true God. Those things are what we have to make sense of without denying the equality or divinity of any of the persons, or multiplying the number of gods.

 

[Grailhunter]

t is absolutely clear and I gave evidence of such. Monotheism is biblical and foundational to Christianity. If someone believes in more than one god they don’t believe in Christianity.

That is exactly what the Ecumenical Councils said!
This forum is dealing with the same dilemma as the Ecumenical Council of Nicaea had to deal with.
The Ecumenical Council had quite the dilemma on their hands. Members of Council could not agree on the characters of Yahweh and Yeshua and the perceived differences thereof. Some believed that Yahweh was the Creator God and some believed that Yeshua was the Creator God. Some believed that God the Father was senior to God the Son as Christ attested to Himself. Some believed that Yahweh had given all authority to Yeshua and had stepped down from being God Almighty and then Yeshua was God Almighty. Some had issues with what Yahweh had done in the Old Testament and some of the cruel and unfair elements of the Mosaic Law that seamed to focus on women. Back then there really wasn’t anyone that would defend women….Except the Gnostics that believed in the sacred feminine. Some very strong beliefs and no possibility of an agreement on these topics.

To make it worse the Gnostics had some of the same issues with Yahweh and they were a real challenge to “main stream” Christianity. They were certainly a lot more literarily prolific than the main stream Christians and because of that main stream Christians knew some of their beliefs and agreed with some of them. The Gnostics really did not have a good opinion of God the Father and believed that Yeshua was the Creator God and God Almighty. So this was seen as a threat.

But the Ecumenical Council could not come to an agreement. But Emperor Constantine insisted on agreement on this matter. The one belief, one faith thing would be a foundational theme for the Roman Catholic Church and they would kill for it and condemn any other belief, and even annihilate other groups. Even saying that if you did not believe in the Roman Catholic formula for the Trinity you were not a Christian and could not go to Heaven.

As it is the word Trinity was coined early on but the one God formula was strictly Roman Catholic and Protestants fell for it. The false Belief of the one God formula is a trophy on Satan's shelf. It definitely corrupts the understand and theme of the scriptures but the good thing is that I do not believe it affects salvation either way.

 

[Grailhunter]

It makes the best sense. We clearly see three divine, coequal, coeternal persons, one of whom became flesh. We also clearly see that there was and ever will be only one true God. Those things are what we have to make sense of without denying the equality or divinity of any of the persons, or multiplying the number of gods.

God the Father....Yahweh....God Almighty....Creator of Heaven and Earth
God the Son.....Savior.....Messiah
God the Holy Spirit

Which two are you kicking out?
Which two do you think are not true Gods?

 

[BB1956]

I have found no three person in a godhead formulation in the scriptures.
If there were three persons in a godhead, it should be clearly and consistently presented in the Bible, because the apostles affirmed, that the Bible is God’s revelation of himself to mankind. And since we need to know God to worship him acceptably, the Bible should be clear in telling us just who he is.

First-century believers accepted the Scriptures as the authentic revelation of God. It was the basis for their beliefs, the final authority. For example, when the apostle Paul preached to people in the city of Beroea, “they received the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the Scriptures daily as to whether these things were so.”(Acts 17:10, 11)

What did prominent men of God at that time use as their authority? Acts 17:2, 3 tells us: “According to Paul’s custom, he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, explaining and proving by references [from the Scriptures].”

Jesus himself set the example in using the Scriptures as the basis for his teaching, repeatedly saying: “It is written.” “He interpreted to them things pertaining to himself in all the Scriptures.”(Matthew 4:4, 7; Luke 24:27)

So Jesus, Paul, and first-century believers used the Scriptures as the foundation for their teaching. They knew that “all Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:16, 17; see also 1 Corinthians 4:6; 1 Thessalonians 2:13; 2 Peter 1:20, 21)

Since the Bible can ‘set things straight,’ it should clearly reveal information about a matter as fundamental as three persons in a godhead is claimed to be. Do theologians and historians themselves say that it is clearly a Bible teaching?

A PROTESTANT publication states: “The word Trinity is not found in the Bible . . . It did not find a place formally in the theology of the church till the 4th century.” (The Illustrated Bible Dictionary) And a Catholic authority says that the Trinity “is not . . . directly and immediately [the] word of God.”—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

The Catholic Encyclopedia also comments: “In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine Persons are denoted together. The word τρίας [triʹas] (of which the Latin trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch about A. D. 180. . . . Shortly afterwards it appears in its Latin form of trinitas in Tertullian.”

However, this is no proof in itself that Tertullian taught the Trinity. The Catholic work Trinitas—A Theological Encyclopedia of the Holy Trinity, for example, notes that some of Tertullian’s words were later used by others to describe the Trinity. Then it cautions: “But hasty conclusions cannot be drawn from usage, for he does not apply the words to Trinitarian theology.”

Now understand that these sources come from scholars and theologians that do believe in the trinity. They do believe in three persons in a godhead.

Is there at least the idea of the Trinity taught in the scriptures? What do the Hebrew Scriptures (“Old Testament”) reveal?

The Encyclopedia of Religion admits: “Theologians today are in agreement that the Hebrew Bible does not contain a doctrine of the Trinity.” And the New Catholic Encyclopedia also says: “The doctrine of the Holy Trinity is not taught in the O[ld] T[estament].”

Similarly, in his book The Triune God, Jesuit Edmund Fortman admits: “The Old Testament . . . tells us nothing explicitly or by necessary implication of a Triune God who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. . . . There is no evidence that any sacred writer even suspected the existence of a [Trinity] within the Godhead. . . . Even to see in [the “Old Testament”] suggestions or foreshadowings or ‘veiled signs’ of the trinity of persons, is to go beyond the words and intent of the sacred writers.”

An examination of the Hebrew Scriptures themselves will bear out these comments. So, there is no clear teaching of a Trinity in the first 39 books of the Bible that make up the true canon of the inspired Hebrew Scriptures.(old testament)

Do the Christian Greek Scriptures (“New Testament”) speak clearly of a Trinity?

The Encyclopedia of Religion says: “Theologians agree that the New Testament also does not contain an explicit doctrine of the Trinity.”

Jesuit Fortman states: “The New Testament writers . . . give us no formal or formulated doctrine of the Trinity, no explicit teaching that in one God there are three co-equal divine persons. . . . Nowhere do we find any trinitarian doctrine of three distinct subjects of divine life and activity in the same Godhead.”

The New Encyclopædia Britannica observes: “Neither the word Trinity nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament.”

Bernhard Lohse says in A Short History of Christian Doctrine: “As far as the New Testament is concerned, one does not find in it an actual doctrine of the Trinity.”

The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology similarly states: “The New Testament does not contain the developed doctrine of the Trinity. ‘The Bible lacks the express declaration that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are of equal essence’ said Protestant theologian Karl Barth.”

Yale University professor E. Washburn Hopkins affirmed: “To Jesus and Paul the doctrine of the trinity was apparently unknown; . . . they say nothing about it.”—Origin and Evolution of Religion.

Historian Arthur Weigall notes: “Jesus Christ never mentioned such a phenomenon, and nowhere in the New Testament does the word ‘Trinity’ appear. The idea was only adopted by the Church three hundred years after the death of our Lord.”—The Paganism in Our Christianity.

Thus, neither the 39 books of the Hebrew Scriptures(old testament) nor the canon of 27 inspired books of the Christian Greek Scriptures(New Testament) provide any clear teaching of three persons in a godhead.

Also note the following comments by historians and theologians concerning the early Christians:

“Primitive Christianity did not have an explicit doctrine of the Trinity such as was subsequently elaborated in the creeds.”—The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology.

“The early Christians, however, did not at first think of applying the Trinity idea to their own faith. They paid their devotions to God the Father and to Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and they recognised the . . . Holy Spirit; but there was no thought of these three being an actual Trinity, co-equal and united in One.”—The Paganism in Our Christianity.

“At first the Christian faith was not Trinitarian . . . It was not so in the apostolic and sub-apostolic ages, as reflected in the N[ew] T[estament] and other early Christian writings.”—Encyclopædia of Religion and Ethics.

“The formulation ‘one God in three Persons’ was not solidly established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith, prior to the end of the 4th century. . . . Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.”—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

So I don't believe those people who believe in the trinity, three persons in a godhead, are getting their information from the scriptures. The sources of information I have shown that admitted there was no scriptural evidence of a Trinity or three persons in a godhead, were from scholars and theologians who do believe in the trinity or three persons in a godhead.

 

[Free]

God the Father....Yahweh....God Almighty....Creator of Heaven and Earth
God the Son.....Savior.....Messiah
God the Holy Spirit

Which two are you kicking out?
Which two do you think are not true Gods?

None. They are all the true God; they are all Yahweh, yet always have and always be eternally distinct. Yahweh himself said many times that he was the only God and there never will be another. I choose to believe him on that point and not bring in two other separate gods and so commit to the heresy of tritheism. So, we have to make sense of the threeness of the one God.

 

[Grailhunter]

None. They are all the true God; they are all Yahweh, yet always have and always be eternally distinct. Yahweh himself said many times that he was the only God and there never will be another. I choose to believe him on that point and not bring in two other separate gods and so commit to the heresy of tritheism. So, we have to make sense of the threeness of the one God.

LOL

 

[Free]

So I don't believe those people who believe in the trinity, three persons in a godhead, are getting their information from the scriptures.

The doctrine of the Trinity is based directly on Scripture:

1. One God.
2. Three divine Persons.
3. The three Persons are coequal and coeternal.

The sources of information I have shown that admitted there was no scriptural evidence of a Trinity or three persons in a godhead, were from scholars and theologians who do believe in the trinity or three persons in a godhead.

That is going beyond what your sources are saying.

 

[Free]

LOL

Yup, I know. That must be why you continually ignore those passages which clearly show there is only one God. Just laugh the truth away, at your own peril.

 

[Grailhunter]

Yup, I know. That must be why you continually ignore those passages which clearly show there is only one God. Just laugh the truth away, at your own peril.

You need to read the Bible a little LOL

 

[Free]

You need to read the Bible a little LOL

I just did, and found this:

1Pe 5:5 Likewise, you who are younger, be subject to the elders. Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another, for “God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble.” (ESV)

 

[Grailhunter]

I just did, and found this:

1Pe 5:5 Likewise, you who are younger, be subject to the elders. Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another, for “God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble.” (ESV)

Nice and lets keep it nice.....go away.

 

[Free]

Nice and lets keep it nice.....go away.

Well, that’s one way of continuing to avoid addressing Scripture that doesn’t fit one’s position.

 

[Grailhunter]

Well, that’s one way of continuing to avoid addressing Scripture that doesn’t fit one’s position.

I could bury you in scriptures but that does not mean you would understand it.