What do you think?

[beehive2]

I am curious, what are your interpretations of what hell is like according to scripture?

Some believe hell is death and darkness.

Some believe you will be tortured and tormented by Satan for eternity.

Some believe you will be cast into a lake of fire.

I don't know what to believe! I feel it is hard to even fathom an almighty, loving and all-forgiving God would send his own children to an eternity of torturous death!

:roll:

 

[Fnerb]

I see it as eternal seperation from God's love. No ammount of pain you can experience on this earth will ever do it justice. Will it be fire? I don't know. I know the bible often mentions it as such.

In any case, living in eternity separated from God is nothing I ever wish to experience...not even for a moment.

 

[Solo]

Sheol is the Hebrew word equivalent of the Greek word Hades which is translated a number of ways in the various English translations.

Sheol is translated in the following English translations accordingly:

• KJV - Grave 30 times, Hell 30 times, Pit 3 times, lowest hell 1 time.[/*:m:28cbf]
• NKJV - Grave 25 times, Hell 18 times, Sheol 18 times, pit 2 times, lowest hell 1 time.[/*:m:28cbf]
• NIV - Grave 56 times, Death 6 times, Realm of death below 1 time, and depths 1 time.[/*:m:28cbf]
• NAS - Sheol 64 times.[/*:m:28cbf]
• RSV - Sheol 64 times.[/*:m:28cbf]

Sheol is the place where the righteous and unrighteous dead go prior to the resurrection at the return of Jesus Christ.

• Sheol exists of the grave, tomb, or sepulcre where the dead body is laid. [/*:m:28cbf]
• Sheol exists of the place of torment where the unrighteous souls dwell (Luke 16). [/*:m:28cbf]
• Sheol exists of the place where the righteous souls dwell called paradise prior to Jesus' ascension at which time paradise is raised to heaven (Luke 16 and Ephesians 4).[/*:m:28cbf]
• Sheol exists of the lowest depths of the earth, the pit, the place prepared for satan and his angels.[/*:m:28cbf]

Sheol/Hades will be cast into the lake of fire at the second death.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:14-15

Here are all of the Sheol texts in the Old Testament:

Genesis 37:35; Genesis 42:38; Genesis 44:29, Genesis 44:31; Numbers 16:30, Numbers 16:33; Deuteronomy 32:22; 1 Samuel 2:6; 2 Samuel 22:6; 1 Kings 2:6, 1 Kings 2:9; Job 7:9; Job 11:8; Job 14:13; Job 17:13, Job 17:16; Job 21:13; Job 24:19; Job 26:6; Psalm 6:5; Psalm 9:17; Psalm 16:10; Psalm 18:5; Psalm 30:3; Psalm 31:17; Psalm 49:14, Psalm 49:15; Psalm 55:15; Psalm 86:13; Psalm 88:3; Psalm 89:48; Psalm 116:3; Psalm 139:8; Psalm 141:7; Proverbs 1:12; Proverbs 5:5; Proverbs 7:27; Proverbs 9:18; Proverbs 15:11, Proverbs 15:24; Proverbs 23:14; Proverbs 27:20; Proverbs 30:16; Ecclesiastes 9:10; SongofSolomon 8:6; Isaiah 5:14; Isaiah 14:9, Isaiah 14:11, Isaiah 14:15; Isaiah 28:15, Isaiah 28:18; Isaiah 38:10, Isaiah 38:18; Isaiah 57:9; Ezekiel 31:15, Ezekiel 31:16, Ezekiel 31:17; Ezekiel 32:21, Ezekiel 32:27; Hosea 13:14 (two times); Amos 9:2; Jonah 2:2; Habakkuk 2:5

Those who are not born again are condemned already and will not gain access into the Kingdom of God; but those who are born again will gain eternal life.

 

[Veritas]

I feel it is hard to even fathom an almighty, loving and all-forgiving God would send his own children to an eternity of torturous death!

I think it absolutely breaks His heart. But if someone is saying NO, NO, NO always to God. I think God is going to respect that person and say, alright, have what you want, go on without out me.

Love is free. And people are free to reject.

 

[beehive2]

I am leaning towards believing that "hell" is everlasting death. It is believed only 144,000 make it to heaven at the end times adn this will be the new government. And those who are not worthy of heaven, (sinners,etc) are sentenced to everlasting death. Those who are repentent and have lived their lives accordingly (not perfectly) and believe Jesus is their saviour, will inherit the earth.

I do not believe hell is about torture, rape, and all of those horrible things that some people presume. I believe it is simply death. A permanant death.

I purchased a book from Mary K. Baxter, "The Divine Revelation of Hell". And although it would be enough to scare yourself silly into Religion, it just seems to be a bit far-fetched to me on what her "revelation" of hell is like. It is awful and I just cannot imagine our God sentencing people to that type of torture.

Has anyone read that book?

Thanks all!

 

[jgredline]

Zaks Darlene
Here is a part of a debate that took place I and another poster. These are just a few of the highlights. To read the entire thread click on the link.....

Matt 25:41 “Then he will say • to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
Matt 25:46 ‘’And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.â€Â
Note: Jay T …The Greek word for punishment is κόλασις (kolasis ) This is also translated ‘’Torment’’
John Uses the exact same word in 1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment ( κόλασις / kolasis ). But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.
Rev 14:9-11 Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.â€Â
Matt 10:28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Note: Jay T….The Greek word for destroy is ἀπόλλυμι (apollumi)…Lest you think it means annihilate this word in this context means ‘’ to declare that one must be put to death. IE metaph. to devote or give over to eternal misery in hell.’’ Strongs enhanced concordance…..
Luke 12:4 And I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do. 5 But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear Him who, after He has killed, has power to cast into hell; yes, I say to you, fear Him! ….Jay T…Like I said. AS Soon as one is born he has immortality. Its only a matter of where he will spend it…

Punishment….. Note: Jay T …The Greek word for punishment is κόλασις (kolasis ) This is also translated ‘’Torment’’ as is used in Matt 25:46
John Uses the exact same word in 1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment ( κόλασις / kolasis ). But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.
The word punishing is not used here, but if it were it would add even more credibility to what I am saying here…The actual Greek here uses the preposition εἰς (eis) followed by accusative noun κόλασις (kolasis)followed by the Adjective αἰώνιος (aionios) that describes how long in the case the punishment will be…It will be forever..In other words this mens Matt 25:46 And these will go away into everlasting torment, but the righteous into eternal life.â€Â

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=26893

 

[Drew]

I don't know what to believe! I feel it is hard to even fathom an almighty, loving and all-forgiving God would send his own children to an eternity of torturous death!

:roll:

I agree and fortunately the Scriptures do not teach eternal torment but rather, I believe, annihilation. Do most Christians believe in eternal torment? Yes they do, but numbers do not establish the correctness of a position. I used to accept the "traditional" doctrine of eternal torment, but I am now convinced that the Scriptures do indeed teach that the wages of sin is death, not eternal conscious suffering (how is that death?).

If I may quote another poster on the subject:

This is the bottom line folks, either accept it or reject the logic because all this bickering back and forth is getting everyone nowhere...Happy New Year to all, BTW

1) Nowhere do we see any clear teaching on eternal torment by Paul ANYWHERE in the didactic epistles. Nowhere do we see clear comparisons by Christ either (like using 'eternal torment' instead of 'death', 'perishing', 'destruction' and 'consuming'. Instead we see that the 'clearest' verses are Revelation 14 and 20 and Mark 9, all of which use highly metaphorical language and the same language used there is used in the OT to denote complete and utter destruction and annihilation

2) Nowhere in the scriptures are the wicked given eternal life in ANY form. Instead we see that immortality is a gift to the righteous and to those who accept Christ. Nowhere does it say that the wicked will receive immortal bodies to be burned or that merely their 'souls' are burned forever.

3) The Bible lays out clear teachings on the utter destruction of the wicked using 'fire and brimstone' (the two most clearest word examples of destruction to the Bible folk), to describe the fate of the wicked comparing them to 'chaff' 'branches' and other consumable material...thinjgs that 'consume' 'consume away into smoke', 'devour', 'burn up'. The language throughout the entire scriptures are absolutely crystal clear.

Just these three points alone demolish eternal torment, never mind the judicial, moral and cosmological arguments that create massive holes in the mindset of eternal torment.

I will leave you with a quote from R.F. Weymouth, director of Mill Hill School and translator of New Testament in Modern Speech as well as a translator of the Greek scriptures (and a NON-SDA, for all those who like to play the cult card when their arguments don't hold water). Hw was one of the premier scholars of his day as well as highly respected for his translations of the Greek.

Look at what he had to say and pray over his words and see the logic...

"My mind fails to conceive a grosser misrepresentation of language than when five or six of the strongest words which the Greek tongue possesses, signifying to destroy or destruction, are explained to mean `maintaining an everlasting but wretched existence.' To translate black as white is nothing to this."

[quote:22ebf]"The use in the N.T. of such words as `death', `destruction', `fire', `perish', to describe Future Retribution, point to the likelihood of fearful anguish, followed by extinction of being, as the doom which awaits those who by persistent rejection of the Saviour prove themselves utterly, and therefore irremediably bad."

Well said. Dr. Weymouth...[/quote:22ebf]
All this being said, if there is one thing I would want to humbly suggest: Please think for yourself - examine the scriptures with no prejudice against either viewpoint. See what the Scriptures say, rather than what "Christian culture" says. There will always be people willing to "tell you what to think" - on either side of this or other issues. Of course, one should indeed examine the arguments of proponents of either side.

 

[beehive2]

jgred, thank you for the link to the other post.

Could it be that the fire of hell is symbolic of all-consuming, or thorough, destruction? Separating fire from Hades, or hell, the Scriptures say: "Death and Hades were hurled into the lake of fire." "The lake" mentioned here is symbolic, since death and hell (Hades) that are thrown into it cannot literally be burned. "This [lake of fire] means the second death"â€â€death from which there is no hope of coming back to life.â€â€Revelation 20:14.


The lake of fire has a meaning similar to that of "the fiery Gehenna [hell fire, King James Version]" that Jesus spoke of. (Matthew 5:22; Mark 9:47, 48) Gehenna occurs 12 times in the Christian Greek Scriptures, and it refers to the valley of Hinnom, outside the walls of Jerusalem. When Jesus was on earth, this valley was used as a garbage dump, "where the dead bodies of criminals, and the carcasses of animals, and every other kind of filth was cast." (Smith's Dictionary of the Bible) The fires were kept burning by adding sulfur to burn up the refuse. Jesus used that valley as a proper symbol of everlasting destruction.

As does Gehenna, the lake of fire symbolizes eternal destruction. Death and Hades are "hurled into" it in that they will be done away with when mankind is freed from sin and the condemnation of death. Willful, unrepentant sinners will also have their "portion" in that lake. (Revelation 21:8) They too will be annihilated forever. On the other hand, those in God's memory who are in hellâ€â€the common grave of mankindâ€â€have a marvelous future.

Revelation 20:13 states: "The sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Hades gave up those dead in them." Yes, the Bible hell will be emptied. As Jesus promised, "the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear [Jesus'] voice and come out." (John 5:28, 29) Although no longer presently existing in any form, millions of dead ones who are in God's memory will be resurrected, or brought back to life, in a restored earthly paradise.â€â€Luke 23:43; Acts 24:15.

In the new world of God's making, resurrected humans who comply with his righteous laws will never need to die again. (Isaiah 25:8) God "will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore." In fact, "the former things [will] have passed away." (Revelation 21:4) What a blessing is in store for those in hellâ€â€"the memorial tombs"! This blessing indeed is reason enough for us to take in more knowledge of God and his Son, Jesus Christ.â€â€John 17:3.



* In the King James Version, the Greek word Hades is rendered "hell" in each of its ten occurrences in the Christian Greek Scriptures. The rendering at Luke 16:19-31 mentions torment, but the entire account is symbolic in meaning.

# The Hebrew word Sheol occurs 65 times in the Hebrew Scriptures and is rendered "hell," "grave," and "pit" in the King James Version.

I just do not believe hell or sheol, is torturous death. Either we choose to live our 70+ years here on earth as non-repentant sinners and receive everlasting death, or we choose to live out our lives as obedient as we can be to God and receive everlasting life as a gift.

 

[jgredline]

Drew
Did Jesus lie when he said

''Matt 25:41 “Then he will say • to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
Matt 25:46 ‘’And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.�????

By the way. Why would Paul teach on eternal torment, when Jesus was clear on the matter....The apostles Matthew and John both wrote about the eternal fires of hell....There is much that Paul did not teach on, because it was already taught by the other apostles.....

So did Jesus tell a lie?


Note:The Greek word for punishment is κόλασις (kolasis ) This is also translated ‘’Torment’’
John Uses the exact same word in 1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment ( κόλασις / kolasis ). But he who fears has not been made perfect in love. ''

 

[beehive2]

I believe "torment" means the eternal seperation from God. Not fire and brimstone.

 

[jgredline]

ZAC
I would encourage you to do a study on Luke 16....Notice that Jesus uses the names of real folk....Keep in mind that this is NOT a parable....While the bible does use ''some'' methaphores that are clearly metaphores, I believe the bible to be literal.....eternal torment is a reality that those who are not born again will face....It has been my experience that those who are not certain of their salvation tend to believe in the false doctrine of anniahlation....Now I am not saying you fall into this category, I am merely telling you what I have seen from my own experience...

 

[jgredline]

I believe "torment" means the eternal seperation from God. Not fire and brimstone.

''Torment'' means punishment. Put it in the context of Math 25 41-46 and it means eternal punishment in fire. Aa fire that never goes out and the soul is tormented forever....

3136 κόλασις (kolasis), εως (eōs), ἡ (hē): n.fem.; ≡ Str 2851; TDNT 3.816â€â€LN 38.2 punishment (Mt 25:46; 1Jn 4:18+; Mk 3:29 v.r.)

κόλασις [kolasis /kol·as·is/] n f. From 2849; TDNT 3:816; TDNTA 451; GK 3136; Two occurrences; AV translates as “punishment†once, and “torment†once. 1 correction, punishment, penalty.

 

[Solo]

The physical burns up in a fire, the soul/spirit does not.

 

[jgredline]

The physical burns up in a fire, the soul/spirit does not.

exactly right !!!!

 

[Drew]

:
The physical burns up in a fire, the soul/spirit does not.

exactly right !!!!

Leviticus 17:11 states that the soul (nephesh) is in the blood. I cannot imagine a more forceful way to underscore the belief that the soul is intimately and inextricably bound up with the physicality of the human person. If the soul really is "in the blood", it will cease to exist when the body is destroyed.

 

[Drew]

Drew
Did Jesus lie when he said
''Matt 25:41 “Then he will say • to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.'

Solo has posted claiming that some on this forum do not take "the whole counsel of God" into account. Let's heed that advice and take a look at other Scriptures that make reference to "eternal" fire and see what we can conclude about the Scriptural references to eternality and "foreverness" in specific relation to punishment by fire:

Isaiah 34:9-10
Edom's streams will be turned into pitch,
her dust into burning sulfur; her land will become blazing pitch!
It will not be quenched night and day;
its smoke will rise forever.
From generation to generation it will lie desolate;
no one will ever pass through it again.

Jude 7
In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Is smoke rising from Edom today?

Are Sodom and Gomorrah burning today?

So, of course, Jesus is not lying. He is just using the word "everlasting" in the same way that it is used in the rest of the Scriptures. To allow "Scripture to interpret Scripture" is part of what it means to heed the whole counsel of God.

Now I have a question for you: Did Paul lie when he wrote:

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[a] Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[beehive2]

ZAC
I would encourage you to do a study on Luke 16....Notice that Jesus uses the names of real folk....Keep in mind that this is NOT a parable....While the bible does use ''some'' methaphores that are clearly metaphores, I believe the bible to be literal.....eternal torment is a reality that those who are not born again will face....It has been my experience that those who are not certain of their salvation tend to believe in the false doctrine of anniahlation....Now I am not saying you fall into this category, I am merely telling you what I have seen from my own experience...

I'm sorry, I respect you jred - but I do not believe in fire and brimstone teachings. God is much too loving and I just cannot fathom him leaving his own children to be tortured in that manner. The book I had read from Mary K. Baxter teaches this fire and brimstone way of hell and it is just too much. I am left believing that the torture is eternal death and the torture is symbolic in the way of being separated from God for eternity.

I guess we will all find out in the end :

 

[Solo]

Leviticus 17:11 states that the soul (nephesh) is in the blood. I cannot imagine a more forceful way to underscore the belief that the soul is intimately and inextricably bound up with the physicality of the human person. If the soul really is "in the blood", it will cease to exist when the body is destroyed.

The soul and the body are two separate parts of mankind. Jesus says it well in Matthew 10:28:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Note that we are not to fear those who can kill the body, but we are to fear HIM which is able to destroy BOTH soul and body in hell (hades).

Notice in the following Scripture that Moses and Elias appeared with Jesus in front of the disciples, yet they were not in their bodies.

1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, 2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him. 4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. 5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. 6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid. 7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid. 8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only. 9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead. Matthew 17:1-9

Paul describes the makeup of a man perfectly in his letter to the Thessalonicans:

And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 1 Thessalonians 5:23

Also notice that the Word of God divides soul and spirit, joint and marrow, thoughts and intent. All of these things are similar but not the same. There is a difference between the joint and the marrow. There is a difference between thoughts and intent. There is a difference between the soul and the spirit.

For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Hebrews 4:12

How many sinners of the eighteenth century are still alive today? None.
What did the Holy Spirit mean when he inspired James to write that a converted sinner's soul will be saved from death?

Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. James 5:20

Why did the Holy Spirit speak through Peter that the flesh wars against the soul if the body and soul are the same?

11 Dearly beloved, I beseech you as strangers and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts, which war against the soul; 1 Peter 2:11

When the righteous die, their bodies enter the grave until the first resurrection when Jesus returns. Where are the souls of the righteous whose bodies are in the ground, in the tomb, or in the sepulcher? They are in heaven awaiting the resurrection of their NEW bodies and are resting under the altar of Jesus Christ.

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled. Revelation 6:9-11

Note that the souls are in Heaven under the altar, but the bodies cannot be there because flesh and blood will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 1 Corinthians 15:50

 

[Drew]

The soul and the body are two separate parts of mankind. Jesus says it well in Matthew 10:28:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

This text does not exclusively support Solo's take that man has separate parts. This text works perfectly well with a conceptualization man where the soul is not a separate part of man.

Here is how this works. Let's speculate that the term "soul" refers to the "blueprint" or the "specification" of a human person who is, in fact, indivisible into components. If man kills the body, God can still resurrect that person, because God "knows" who that person was (before they were killed) and can certainly reconstitute him at the time of the general resurrection using this "blueprint". The point - man can only kill the body, he cannot "erase" the information that God holds about that person. Is such a blueprint a separate "part" of a human person? Of course not.

God, on the other hand, can indeed utterly do away with a person, by electing to "erase" or "blot out" that person in his / her totality - by doing away with both body and "soul". On this view, the destruction of the soul is God's judgement that the wages of sin is indeed death (non-existence) as His word clearly teaches in Romans 6:23 and elsewhere. On the view that the "soul" is this blueprint for a human being, and God does away with that person by erasing the blueprint along with the body - the Matthew text works perfectly well with this.

The problem with Solo's conceptualization, on the other hand, is that it requires a dramatic re-interpretation of the meaning of the word "destroy". How does a "destroyed" soul continue on in conscious torment? This is overly awkward. On the other hand, the view that I have expressed does indeed honour the sense that we normally accord to the word "destroy".

The problem with the "traditional" view is this: certain assumptions are made about the meaning of words like "soul" and "spirit" are made and various texts are interpreted in light of such assumptions. Fair enough, but other assumptions are also possible, and I think these other assumptions work much better with the overall Scriptural picture. For example, those of us who do not believe in the exisitence of an immortal soul do not need to redefine "death" to mean "eternal conscious torment".

 

[Solo]

This text does not exclusively support Solo's take that man has separate parts. This text works perfectly well with a conceptualization man where the soul is not a separate part of man.

Here is how this works. Let's speculate that the term "soul" refers to the "blueprint" or the "specification" of a human person who is, in fact, indivisible into components. If man kills the body, God can still resurrect that person, because God "knows" who that person was (before they were killed) and can certainly reconstitute him at the time of the general resurrection using this "blueprint". The point - man can only kill the body, he cannot "erase" the information that God holds about that person. Is such a blueprint a separate "part" of a human person? Of course not.

God, on the other hand, can indeed utterly do away with a person, by electing to "erase" or "blot out" that person in his / her totality - by doing away with both body and "soul". On this view, the destruction of the soul is God's judgement that the wages of sin is indeed death (non-existence) as His word clearly teaches in Romans 6:23 and elsewhere. On the view that the "soul" is this blueprint for a human being, and God does away with that person by erasing the blueprint along with the body - the Matthew text works perfectly well with this.

The problem with Solo's conceptualization, on the other hand, is that it requires a dramatic re-interpretation of the meaning of the word "destroy". How does a "destroyed" soul continue on in conscious torment? This is overly awkward. On the other hand, the view that I have expressed does indeed honour the sense that we normally accord to the word "destroy".

The problem with the "traditional" view is this: certain assumptions are made about the meaning of words like "soul" and "spirit" are made and various texts are interpreted in light of such assumptions. Fair enough, but other assumptions are also possible, and I think these other assumptions work much better with the overall Scriptural picture. For example, those of us who do not believe in the exisitence of an immortal soul do not need to redefine "death" to mean "eternal conscious torment".

Drew's teachings do not align with the whole counsel of God's word, and only interpret the Scriptures according to a bias. The whole counsel of God's Word shows that the body and soul and spirit are distinct parts of the man, and the soul of the individual is that which goes to sheol awaiting the resurrection while the body decays in the ground, and the spirit returns to God from where it came. Simple. If it isn't simple it must be twisted.