What is a sin that doesn't lead to death?

[Serving Zion]

1 John 5:16-17 says this:

If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

It complicates the doctrine of Romans 6:23, which says "For the wages of sin is death". It doesn't seem to say that the wages of some sin is death, but that sin itself earns death.

So I am asking to find out what the difference is between the type of sin that leads to death and the type of sin that doesn't lead to death.

Why are we told to pray for the one type of sinning brother but not the other?

 

[tdidymas]

Sure.

Your wrote this......

"""""""He says of people who practice things like that "will not inherit the kingdom of God,""""""

= That verse is not talking about the born again.
And where the confusion can come in, and does, is when you see this world "PRACTICE", and a person thinks...."oh that means, a habitual lifestyle".
And it actually means "THOSE"......which is specific to a person who is not born again.

Many who are religious, and some are even saved, wrongly apply this verse to the born again to try to prove that if you are born again and sin, or practice sinning, then you wont "inherit the KOG".
And this shows that the person who teaches that, does not understand that the Born again are already a part of the eternal Inheritance, because they have ALREADY been born again into the Spirit of God, by the Spirit of God.
This is why all the born again are defined as this....>"ONE with GOD, In Christ".
Thats Spiritual union, with God, based on being BORN AGAIN.......not water baptized, but BORN AGAIN.

So, for the born again...., "sin" has been dealt with, when Jesus "became sin" on the Cross, so that the person who is born again, became "the righteousness of God, in Christ". 'Made righteous", based on receiving "the GIFT of Righteousness".

This means that those who are this verse.......John 3:36, the CHRiST REJECTORS, are those who "will not inherit", as they are not born again.

I was answering the OP question, and it isn't up for debate here. If you want to debate it, you'll need to pm me and agree to start a discussion,

 

[Bethel]

What is a sin that doesn't lead to death is a forgiven sin that we truly repent of.

What happens if you are walking down the hall to the bedroom, meaning to repent of that last sin, and you have a heart attack and die?
You didnt get to repent.
So, i guess you'll just have to trust that the blood of Jesus really is redemption for "all sin", and that Romans 4:8 and 2nd Corinthians 5:19 are true.

 

[for_his_glory]

What happens if you are walking down the hall to the bedroom, meaning to repent of that last sin, and you have a heart attack and die?
You didnt get to repent.
So, i guess you'll just have to trust that the blood of Jesus really is redemption for "all sin", and that Romans 4:8 and 2nd Corinthians 5:19 are true.

Only God knows our heart and the intents of it. There is no such thing of sinless perfection as even the Prophets and Apostles struggled with sin at times.

Genesis 9:20-21 Noah became drunk on the wine he made from the vineyard and exposed his nakedness

Genesis 12:10-20 Abraham lied about Sarah being his wife as he traded her for his own life as He was weak in the flesh even after the promises God gave him

Genesis 26:1-10 Isaac repeated the same sin of Abraham as he lied about Rebekah as he was also weak in the flesh as he feared for his own life even after the promises God gave him.

Numbers 20:1-12 Moses sinned against God in a moment of anger and a lapse of judgement that led him to not be able to bring the congregation into the land which God gave to all of them.

1 Kings 16:31; 21:25-26 Elijah became depressed and suicidal in a moment of human weakness when dealing with King Ahab and Jezebel as they did everything in their power to come threaten Elijah.

Genesis 25:19-34; 27:1-41 Jacob tricked his brother into giving him the birthright of the

1 Kings 11 Solomon turned away from God knowing God's commands, but ending up disobeying them

2 Samuel chapters 11, 12, 24 David called for a census, commits adultery with Bathsheba and has her husband killed.


Romans 7:13-25 Paul's struggle with sin in the flesh after his conversation.


Paul opposes Peter in Galatians 2:11-14 for not walking uprightly according to the truth of the Gospel.


Their sins were forgiven as they were still considered righteous and faithful after repenting of their sin of disobedience as all of us are who are in the Lord.

 

[Bethel]

Only God knows our heart and the intents of it. There is no such thing of sinless perfection

"sinless perfection" is a concept created by some religious nut who probably was not saved, who was trying to get to heaven by commandment keeping, self effort, and water baptism.
So, ignore this person.
Instead, just do what Paul told you to do, so that you can find continuing deliverance from "the world, the flesh, and the devil", as .....>"Christ ALWAYS gives me the Victory".

See that "always"? Thats not a myth.

 

[for_his_glory]

"sinless perfection" is a concept created by some religious nut who probably was not saved, who was trying to get to heaven by commandment keeping, self effort, and water baptism.
So, ignore this person.
Instead, just do what Paul told you to do, so that you can find continuing deliverance from "the world, the flesh, and the devil", as .....>"Christ ALWAYS gives me the Victory".

See that "always"? Thats not a myth.

You really need to take your time reading others post as I never said I believed in sinless perfection.

 

[Bethel]

Romans 7:13-25 Paul's struggle with sin in the flesh after his conversation.

Paul wrote Philippians 3 to describe his spiritual evolution from legalism to living like this....>"when i am weak then i am strong".
This is the application or the understanding of the application of Jesus telling you this. 'Apart from me, you can do nothing".

Now, Paul goes deep into his Legalism and describes it as a war within himself, as...."that which i would do i dont do, and that which i dont want to do, i do"..
He said......>"who shall deliver me from this body of death"..

A.) In steps Jesus.

And Jesus explained.....>"apart from me, YOU, (Paul , Me, everyone) can do NOTHING">

What was Paul's final reveal?
Where did Paul end up?
He ended up here....>"CHRIST always GIVES ME......the Victory".

See the "gives me" ????? That is Paul leaving Philippians 3, where He is all about the commandment keeping, and the self effort, that he comes to understand is "DUNG", when it comes to existing in this..= "Christ always gives me the Victory".

Now here is the problem. The problem is this....>"The Power of SIN......is the LAW".

See that? That means that when you try to be good and you try to resist sin, you are doing it in YOUR FLESH.
That is willpower, and striving., and that is YOUR FLESH.
And when you try to stop sinning with your FLESH, Jesus explains that you are : "Apart from me you can do nothing".
See that?
This is why 99.9% of believers are sinning and confessing.....Its because they are trying to stop sinning by FLESH.
Paul told you to "reckon your flesh DEAD", because its "crucified with Christ".
Yet, most believers are trying to use their FLESH to stop sinning.
Notice the issue? ????? And when you do that, .>"the power of sin, is the law", which enflames your flesh that empowers your flesh to want to sin MORE.

See, the law's power to cause you to sin, is activated when you try to resist your flesh that is empowered by the law.
That is the CURSE of the Law.
And the solution is......"Christ has redeemed us from the CURSE of the Law".

So, to stop sinning, you have to get out of the curse that is you trying to stop sinning by FLESH,= by will, by striving.
As when you do that you end up here......>"apart from Me you can do NOTHING".

Here is the revelation that a believer has to understand to begin to walk in the Grace of God as Real Faith.
Its this.
Salvation, is all of God, and in it is the power to empower you to live the Holy Life.
Its when a person is trying to do that in their flesh, that they find they have no power to do anything but sin and confess.
This is why Paul learned.....>"Christ Gives me the Victory"< .... vs Paul trying to stop sinning, and couldn't.
Paul discovered that when He was in the SELF EFFORT battle against sin, he was losing the battle because "Apart from me you can do nothing", Jesus said.

When Paul learned the revelation of the Grace of God, which is.....>"Christ GIVES GIVES GIVES GIVES, the victory" and not Paul trying to do it.......then He wrote.....>" I am crucified with Christ.....Nevertheless i live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me, and the life i live now in the flesh, i live by the faith of the Son of God"

Paul learned this lesson......"when i work, God rests"........"when i rest, God works".
See that?
When you struggle to be good, you will fail. But when you rest in God's Grace that has made you righteous, when you have that revelation and relax and let go of self effort.....then God lives HIS HOLY LIFE, through you, as "Christ always gives me the Victory".

 

[Bethel]

You really need to take your time reading others post as I never said I believed in sinless perfection.

You posted "sinless perfection" to try to reflect that on me, as you believe im teaching "sinless perfection".
Im not, and im not going to let you castigate me with that false narrative.
Im teaching 1 John 3:9, as "Christ always gives me the Victory" that is derived from Philippians 3 where Paul was learning how to stop being defeated by His flesh.

Its interesting to always keep discovering that when a Teacher teaches that God will give you the victory over sin and the flesh, that this is received by most believers as : "that is impossible". And for them, it is, until they are taught how to do it.
See, its just like all things with the Spirit of God......they come to you as revelation.
That's spiritual growth.
Most believers spiritual growth ended the second they believed they can lose their salvation, as at that precise moment is when they stopped trusting in Christ to keep them saved.
And once that becomes your broken faith, you are never going to be able have any more spiritual growth.
Spiritual growth is not related to being able to use a commentary or an online source to cut and paste someone else's theology that has tricked you.
Spiritual Growth, is "working out your salvation" so that you learn how to exist in the Kingdom of God, by real faith.

 

[Hopeful]

"sinless perfection" is a concept created by some religious nut who probably was not saved, who was trying to get to heaven by commandment keeping, self effort, and water baptism.
So, ignore this person.
Instead, just do what Paul told you to do, so that you can find continuing deliverance from "the world, the flesh, and the devil", as .....>"Christ ALWAYS gives me the Victory".

See that "always"? Thats not a myth.

I don't think Paul was a nut.
He wrote 1 Cor 15:34..."Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame."
I don't think Peter was a nut.
He wrote 1 Peter 4:1..."Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;"
John has plenty more to say on the subject.

 

[WIP]

[ACMP=warning]
I'm sorry but if we can't stick to the rules of this forum, I'm going to be forced to lock the discussion for offending members. Let's help the OP with answers to his questions and leave it at that.
[/ACMP]

 

[Bethel]

I don't think Paul was a nut.
He wrote 1 Cor 15:34..."Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame."
I don't think Peter was a nut.
He wrote 1 Peter 4:1..."Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;"
John has plenty more to say on the subject.

God would not save us with the Blood of Jesus, so that we can basically live the same lifestyle as an unbeliever, with the exception that they enjoy their sin, and the believer regrets theirs....

The reason a believer stays in the revolving door of....."here i am again to confess the same old sin" for 50 yrs, is because they were never taught that God's Salvation isn't... "Ok, the Cross got you started, now you take it from there". "best of luck". "try not to lose it".
So, as they were not taught that God's Grace is their entire Salvation, and not them trying to do it,.... they try to do it for themselves instead of exiting within what Jesus said from the Cross : is "finished".

Nearly every "christian" believes that "working out your salvation" means to try to keep yourself saved.
They are so deceived in this regard that if you point this out they will deny it, while they are doing it.

You can ask them.......>"how is it that you believe that what could not saved you before you were saved...(Lifestyle and self effort, and trying to be good).......You now try to do, to stay saved, and will argue till you lose eyesight in one eye that you have to do it, or you will lose your salvation.

Is it possible that works and commandment keeping that can't save you, before you TRUSTED CHRIST< now can keep you saved?
That is well beyond spiritual deception. That is intense spiritual ignorance.

Here is the Spiritual logic.....
If you can't wash away your own sin.....if you can't become God's righteousness by keeping commandments, if you can't SAVE YOURSELF, as proven by God having to come down here and die on the Cross to save you, then how can you live the righteous life, unless you pursue it exactly the very same way you received it as a GIFT?

A.) You can't.

All you can do, is live in that mind of the flesh, that has lost real faith.

 

[Bethel]

I'm sorry but if we can't stick to the rules of this forum, I'm going to be forced to lock the discussion for offending members. Let's help the OP with answers to his questions and leave it at that.

You didn't block the last post that was sent to me, so, i responded to it.

I'll leave this Thread now, so that the Original Topic might find its way back into the Thread.

 

[Hopeful]

God would not save us with the Blood of Jesus, so that we can basically live the same lifestyle as an unbeliever, with the exception that they enjoy their sin, and the believer regrets theirs....

The reason a believer stays in the revolving door of....."here i am again to confess the same old sin" for 50 yrs, is because they were never taught that God's Salvation isn't... "Ok, the Cross got you started, now you take it from there". "best of luck". "try not to lose it".
So, as they were not taught that God's Grace is their entire Salvation, and not them trying to do it,.... they try to do it for themselves instead of exiting within what Jesus said from the Cross : is "finished".

Nearly every "christian" believes that "working out your salvation" means to try to keep yourself saved.
They are so deceived in this regard that if you point this out they will deny it, while they are doing it.

You can ask them.......>"how is it that you believe that what could not saved you before you were saved...(Lifestyle and self effort, and trying to be good).......You now try to do, to stay saved, and will argue till you lose eyesight in one eye that you have to do it, or you will lose your salvation.

Is it possible that works and commandment keeping that can't save you, before you TRUSTED CHRIST< now can keep you saved?
That is well beyond spiritual deception. That is intense spiritual ignorance.

Here is the Spiritual logic.....
If you can't wash away your own sin.....if you can't become God's righteousness by keeping commandments, if you can't SAVE YOURSELF, as proven by God having to come down here and die on the Cross to save you, then how can you live the righteous life, unless you pursue it exactly the very same way you received it as a GIFT?

A.) You can't.

All you can do, is live in that mind of the flesh, that has lost real faith.

You don't include the miracle of rebirth from God's seed in your thesis.
Just as fig seeds cannot bear grapes, neither can God's seed bear liars and thieves.
We aren't working out our salvation alone, as we have the gift of the Holy Ghost/Comforter to help...not to mention many other tools from God.
This insures that the sins we have repented from don't re-occur.
Reoccurrence leads to death, as the repentance wasn't true.

 

[Bethel]

You don't include the miracle of rebirth from God's seed in your thesis.
Just as fig seeds cannot bear grapes, neither can God's seed bear liars and thieves.
We aren't working out our salvation alone, as we have the gift of the Holy Ghost/Comforter to help...not to mention many other tools from God.
This insures that the sins we have repented from don't re-occur.
Reoccurrence leads to death, as the repentance wasn't true.

Are you also getting the warnings about "off topic" discussion?
So, in case you are not, i dont want you to have to face that, which means, i'll now bid you farewell regarding this Thread.
If you want to continue to discuss the same topic, then you can find me on my Threads, or on a Thread where we are allowed to discuss what isn't necessarily related to the OP's Topic.

-B

 

[for_his_glory]

You posted "sinless perfection" to try to reflect that on me, as you believe im teaching "sinless perfection".
Im not, and im not going to let you castigate me with that false narrative.
Im teaching 1 John 3:9, as "Christ always gives me the Victory" that is derived from Philippians 3 where Paul was learning how to stop being defeated by His flesh.

Its interesting to always keep discovering that when a Teacher teaches that God will give you the victory over sin and the flesh, that this is received by most believers as : "that is impossible". And for them, it is, until they are taught how to do it.
See, its just like all things with the Spirit of God......they come to you as revelation.
That's spiritual growth.
Most believers spiritual growth ended the second they believed they can lose their salvation, as at that precise moment is when they stopped trusting in Christ to keep them saved.
And once that becomes your broken faith, you are never going to be able have any more spiritual growth.
Spiritual growth is not related to being able to use a commentary or an online source to cut and paste someone else's theology that has tricked you.
Spiritual Growth, is "working out your salvation" so that you learn how to exist in the Kingdom of God, by real faith.

Quit reading into things and putting words in others mouth. I never insinuated you are teaching sinless perfection.

 

[Serving Zion]

Bethel and Hopeful , in this part of the forum members aren't meant to be speaking to each other but only addressing the OP who is looking for an answer to a question. I am the OP in this thread and I have already marked one of the responses as the answer I had sought.

I appreciate your interest in the thread, but please do not take the topic away from the OP. You are welcome to begin a new thread and tag the other members if you want to keep discussing. Thank you.

 

[Bethel]

Bethel and Hopeful , in this part of the forum members aren't meant to be speaking to each other but only addressing the OP who is looking for an answer to a question. I am the OP in this thread and I have already marked one of the responses as the answer I had sought.

I appreciate your interest in the thread, but please do not take the topic away from the OP. You are welcome to begin a new thread and tag the other members if you want to keep discussing. Thank you.

Sin that leads to death.

IF you are in Florida or any state in the USA that has a death penalty, then the sin of murder will find you led to your death, if convicted.

Paul said that if you are born again, and you will not stop sinning......then you will die, eventually.

If you are a unbeliever, and you die, then you will face 2nd Death, that isn't going to end.

 

[Truthfrees]

Bethel and Hopeful , in this part of the forum members aren't meant to be speaking to each other but only addressing the OP who is looking for an answer to a question. I am the OP in this thread and I have already marked one of the responses as the answer I had sought.

I appreciate your interest in the thread, but please do not take the topic away from the OP. You are welcome to begin a new thread and tag the other members if you want to keep discussing. Thank you.

could you repost which post you thought was the answer?

thanks so much - great thread

 

[Serving Zion]

could you repost which post you thought was the answer?

thanks so much - great thread

Post #14 had everything I was looking for

 

[Shema]

Sin that doesn't lead to death is sex between lawfully married husband and wife. I believe most of the apostles did not marry because of their Faith and the example they see from Christ hence the reason for this celibacy is fetch from the fact that sex is a sin. However when the gospel is spreading all over, there is a need for some priests, pastors and leader of churches to marry. Apostle John the beloved is regarding to the word sex in a politically correct language that could is understandable by the elders of the church to avoid factions and disagreement between those who calls it sin and those who believe it is normal amongst the saints. Remember that there is always argument between the Jewish Christians and the Gentile Christians concerning marriage and other matters as to why apostle Paul addressed this in 1 Corinthians 7:8, 9, 19, 20

The matter of marriage caused heat in the church even Apostle Paul said "
Your husband or wife who isn't a follower is made holy by having you as a partner. This also makes your children holy and keeps them from being unclean in God's sight. 1 Corinthians 7:14

The husband or wife may not be a believer of Christ but when they have sex it will not be a sin that lead to death to the one who is a follower of Jesus Christ among the two because they are lawfully married.

 

[Hopeful]

Sin that doesn't lead to death is sex between lawfully married husband and wife.

A married couple having sex is not a sin.

I believe most of the apostles did not marry because of their Faith and the example they see from Christ hence the reason for this celibacy is fetch from the fact that sex is a sin. However when the gospel is spreading all over, there is a need for some priests, pastors and leader of churches to marry. Apostle John the beloved is regarding to the word sex in a politically correct language that could is understandable by the elders of the church to avoid factions and disagreement between those who calls it sin and those who believe it is normal amongst the saints. Remember that there is always argument between the Jewish Christians and the Gentile Christians concerning marriage and other matters as to why apostle Paul addressed this in 1 Corinthians 7:8, 9, 19, 20

The matter of marriage caused heat in the church even Apostle Paul said "
Your husband or wife who isn't a follower is made holy by having you as a partner. This also makes your children holy and keeps them from being unclean in God's sight. 1 Corinthians 7:14

The husband or wife may not be a believer of Christ but when they have sex it will not be a sin that lead to death to the one who is a follower of Jesus Christ among the two because they are lawfully married.