Bible Study What is the human soul?

[Chopper]

I would appreciate it if this topic on nephesh went to an appropriate thread. This is about the soul and death. Thank you.

I actually meant giants.

 

[Chopper]

OK folks, I have been having a private conversation with my friend Tim. He has explained to me the difference between everlasting punishment and everlasting torture. Punishment is a Biblical Word. Torture is not. It's as simple as that!

Tim and I both believe in everlasting punishment. End of story. If you want to disagree with us, prove torture from Scripture please.

 

[TimothyW]

OK folks, I have been having a private conversation with my friend Tim. He has explained to me the difference between everlasting punishment and everlasting torture. Punishment is a Biblical Word. Torture is not. It's as simple as that!

Tim and I both believe in everlasting punishment. End of story. If you want to disagree with us, prove torture from Scripture please.

Exactly,
I believe that the lost go to everlasting punishment (Matthew 25:46)
I do not believe the lost are alive and conscious of torment, the punishment is death, which is eternal (Romans 6:23, John 3:16, Matthew 7:13, Luke 13:3, 2 Thess 1:9, Ezekiel 18:4, Jude 1:7, and many more)

 

[jasoncran]

that link didn't have anything for the words but he has a bias of soul sleep. he is correct that the Hebrews didn't separate that but forgets that sheol doesn't allow for that and ignores what jews today and the kaddish(which was done in Christ day for the rabbis only) had a prayer for them when they died and entered sheol.

 

[jasoncran]

it looks like a long talk with jeff on the Hebraic words. I simply after that link don't trust the greek words. I have had a problem with soul for some time going from 5 words for it to 4.are really are 3 pone, psuche, and pshyche and soma. a pone is similar to the word pone also means breathe.

that said to raise up only to simply kill them again for an everlasting judgement doesn't make sense. thus why I don't buy that idea Chopper.

 

[jasoncran]

what is the nature of the punishment?

if one is dead is already been meted at the grave.

 

[TimothyW]

what is the nature of the punishment?

if one is dead is already been meted at the grave.

The nature of the punishment is death. (Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death")
The death we are talking about is the permanent death which occurs as a result of the final judgment. The punishment for sin has not been meted out at the grave, because there is a resurrection following the grave, then the judgment. This is when the "sheep" are separated from the "goats". The sheep go off to eternal life, the goats go off to eternal punishment. This eternal punishment is death (no eternal life).

 

[jasoncran]

I want to clarify this, the greek language and culture think differently then the Hebrews and the languages often don't mix. that is what that link said. I have known that for several years. we being in the west think and act like greeks that we really don't understand Hebrew thought easily. I have gotten headeaches from reading Hebrew commentaries. the arguments and sermons from one word such as mikeitz(sp) is awesome. but its not for the biblically ignorant or those new to the bible to do what I do.

 

[Kathi]

Exactly,
I believe that the lost go to everlasting punishment (Matthew 25:46)
I do not believe the lost are alive and conscious of torment, the punishment is death, which is eternal (Romans 6:23, John 3:16, Matthew 7:13, Luke 13:3, 2 Thess 1:9, Ezekiel 18:4, Jude 1:7, and many more)

I do believe that the unbelievers are in hades right now and are very aware of their punishment and why they are there.I believe they are shrouded in darkness and they are experiencing unending regret.I think for them death is far worse than they ever imagined.

 

[TimothyW]

I do believe that the unbelievers are in hades right now and are very aware of their punishment and why they are there.I believe they are shrouded in darkness and they are experiencing unending regret.I think for them death is far worse than they ever imagined.

Thanks Kathi, I know that a lot of Christians share your view. I am also a Christian, but my view is a little different.

 

[Kathi]

Thanks Kathi, I know that a lot of Christians share your view. I am also a Christian, but my view is a little different.

I respect that...

 

[Chopper]

The nature of the punishment is death. (Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death")
The death we are talking about is the permanent death which occurs as a result of the final judgment. The punishment for sin has not been meted out at the grave, because there is a resurrection following the grave, then the judgment. This is when the "sheep" are separated from the "goats". The sheep go off to eternal life, the goats go off to eternal punishment. This eternal punishment is death (no eternal life).

I agree, no eternal life, eternal death right?

 

[Chopper]

I thought it would be interesting to see what John Calvin had to say about this subject.

"Moreover, as language cannot describe the severity of the divine vengeance on the reprobate, their pains and torments are figured to us by corporeal things, such as darkness, wailing and gnashing of teeth, inextinguishable fire, the ever-gnawing worm. (Matt 8:12; 22:13; Mark 9:43; Isa 66:24). It is certain that by such modes of expression the Holy Spirit designed to impress all our senses with dread, as when it is said, "Tophet is ordained of old; yea, for the king it is prepared: he has made it deep and large; the pile thereof is fire and much wood; the breath of the Lord, like a stream of brimstone, does kindle it" (Isa 30:33)."

 

[jasoncran]

I thought it would be interesting to see what John Calvin had to say about this subject.

"Moreover, as language cannot describe the severity of the divine vengeance on the reprobate, their pains and torments are figured to us by corporeal things, such as darkness, wailing and gnashing of teeth, inextinguishable fire, the ever-gnawing worm. (Matt 8:12; 22:13; Mark 9:43; Isa 66:24). It is certain that by such modes of expression the Holy Spirit designed to impress all our senses with dread, as when it is said, "Tophet is ordained of old; yea, for the king it is prepared: he has made it deep and large; the pile thereof is fire and much wood; the breath of the Lord, like a stream of brimstone, does kindle it" (Isa 30:33)."

I kinda said that to you already.

 

[Chopper]

I kinda said that to you already.

You're so smart. I guess we're on the same page.