What is your purpose?

[jasoncran]

In the Millennium, there will be many survivors of the Tribulation which will still be mortal. They will make up the nations of the earth which after the 1000 years will be stirred to rebellion by Satan when he is released from the pit.

i know but that verse that he posted is after the destruction of satan.

 

[Bazz1040]

speculation, i dont speculate. its possible but that isnt really supported,
for all we know it could the weaker less active christian we reign over.

You just did the very thing that you said you don't do and is acusing me of doing......why the hyporacy and double standard?


The Bible does tell us that the saints will rule over the Earth with Jesus. The saints are not going to rule over an empty Earth......people are going to be on it who were not believers. But they will during the Millennium.


Revelation 11:15 (NKJV)
15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!"

The saints will judge the world

1 Corinthians 6:2 (ASV)
2 Or know ye not that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world is judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

One of the role of a king or a ruler is to judge. God is called in the Bible a judge, so since we will be like God, we too will be judges of the Earth. The Saints will also judge angles.


1 Corinthians 6:3 (ASV)
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more, things that pertain to this life?

The problem is that many false teachings have permeated and dominated the Church that the truth becomes a strange thing. Too many Christians do not study the Bible and even when some do, it is filtered through the errors that are taught from the pulpit.

Most Christians believe that Jesus is coming back to take them to Heaven, yet the Bible tells us that Jesus is coming to rule on the Earth. It is no wonder that Jesus said that many false prophets (those claming to speak under divine insparation) would decieve many.

The saints will rule over them (other human beings) until they are glorified. After that, they will be kings themselves and rule with us over everything.

<O:p</O:p

BESIDES, that is what the cult LDS says. we become Gods and rule a planet!

So if a cult says eating apples is good for you, then according to your logic that is a reason not to eat apples. What if I were to show you a scripture in the Bible that says the saints will be worshiped, would you believe it?

 

[Alabaster]

i know but that verse that he posted is after the destruction of satan.

After the destruction of death and sin and Satan with his angels, we will continue in our roles over the universe and in whatever plans God has in store in the eons that will come, that the Bible stops short of telling us.

 

[jasoncran]

I see that you have been stuck in a box for a long time. Let me answer that question by asking you a few questions. What do you think is the reason why God created the universe with uncountable numbers of galaxies? Do you think God created it just for the sake of having it? Don't you think that God intends for us to create life on them and rule? Don't you understand the parable that Jesus told?

so how can we do only what God does and can do? doesnt the lord say that he wont share his glory with another? i think its clear that he wont. only God gets the glory. if we can create life then how can we have an almighty God?if we are making life and having beings that worship us?



wow saints to be worshiped really

woah, so i can worship the st.mary and revere her above GOD.

not buying that one

 

[Alabaster]

Only God is Creator.

 

[jasoncran]

After the destruction of death and sin and Satan with his angels, we will continue in our roles over the universe and in whatever plans God has in store in the eons that will come, that the Bible stops short of telling us.

i agree and we dont know, i'm merely saying rather emphatically that we cant be worshipped or create as god. see my response.

God doesnt share his glory, if new life is created it would have to worship him as he is the utilimate creator.and he alone has that glory.

 

[Bazz1040]

I see that you have been stuck in a box for a long time. Let me answer that question by asking you a few questions. What do you think is the reason why God created the universe with uncountable numbers of galaxies? Do you think God created it just for the sake of having it? Don't you think that God intends for us to create life on them and rule? Don't you understand the parable that Jesus told?

so how can we do only what God does and can do? doesnt the lord say that he wont share his glory with another? i think its clear that he wont. only God gets the glory. if we can create life then how can we have an almighty God?if we are making life and having beings that worship us?

The question is who and what is God talking to? Look at what God is saying very carefully. He is talking about carved images....God will not use carved images to represent him and cause people to praise that image.<O:p</O:p
<O:p</O:p

Isaiah 42:8 (KJV)
<SUP>8 </SUP>I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
<O:p</O:p
You say that only God will get glory. Does not the Bible tells us that we will see Jesus as He is because we will be like Him? And does not the Bible tell us that Jesus will come with great power and glory? So how can you say that only God will get glory when the Bible says we will be like Jesus, whom is God?
<O:p</O:p
1 John 3:2 (BBE)
<SUP>2 </SUP>My loved ones, now we are children of God, and at present it is not clear what we are to be. We are certain that at his revelation we will be like him; for we will see him as he is.


Mark 13:26 (ASV)
<SUP>26 </SUP>And then shall they see the Son of man coming in clouds with great power and glory.
<O:p</O:p

wow saints to be worshiped really

woah, so i can worship the st.mary and revere her above GOD.

not buying that one

Do you want me to show you the scripture or you just want to be silly?
Is your mind made up without even seen the scripture? Is that how you come to conclusions?

<O:p
<O:pYou could learn from these people example.</O:p
<O:p
Acts 17:10-12 (NKJV)
<SUP>10 </SUP>Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews.
<SUP>11 </SUP>These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.
<SUP>12 </SUP>Therefore many of them believed, and also not a few of the Greeks, prominent women as well as men.

<!--EndFragment--></O:p

 

[jasoncran]

the why does each instance of angellic appearance does the angel say that dont worship me for i am thy fellow serveant?

surely that they never sinned and hold that power over men in the judments(they do carry out judgments)see the death of herod by the angel

so if we have a zillion gods that all have the same power and likeness of christ then that makes GOD NOTHING as he has made us all like him.

angels are like him spirits.

does it not show that the four and twenty elders in revalation casting their crowns in worship to the father?
and they are just like us.

so if they yeild to father then HE must be greater then US and remain so.

we cant become that much like him.

it also says that we ought to worship angels. if we are that much like christ or the trinity then we too are a spirit!

 

[Bazz1040]

Only God is Creator.

Not everyone can handle the truth.....Jesus even told His disciples that their were things He wanted to tell them but they could not recieve it.<O:p</O:p

 

[jasoncran]

no, i dont go off into odd doctrines and where the bible isnt specefic and claim that. we dont know as that is a mystery.


it doesnt say we become demi-gods at all. its says we reign with him. if the humans that are alive after the final battle are perfected as they passed the final test of the devil.
so we dont know what happens after that.

i dont see any verse that says he gives up his throne and makes us his equals.

on earth a queen reigns with her husband but isnt equal to his authority. in fact most queens werent in control of the affiars of the state.

i see something similar we reign with him but always under him.

never having his glory. only he gets that.

besides,moses and also elijah were angels when they appeared , surely they didnt get worshipped.

 

[Alabaster]

Not everyone can handle the truth.....Jesus even told His disciples that their were things He wanted to tell them but they could not recieve it.<o>:p</o>:p

Like what? Why do you extrapolate anything from that?

 

[Bazz1040]

the why does each instance of angellic appearance does the angel say that dont worship me for i am thy fellow serveant?

Angles are servants of God and man.

surely that they never sinned and hold that power over men in the judments(they do carry out judgments)see the death of herod by the angel

Angels only hold power over man temporarily......man's destiny is greater than any angel.<O:p</O:p

so if we have a zillion gods that all have the same power and likeness of christ then that makes GOD NOTHING as he has made us all like him.

I said anything about zillions of gods. And if God brings us to His level how does that make God nothing? If that would make God nothing then we too would be nothing.<O:p</O:p

angels are like him spirits.

But angels were not made in God's image.....only human beings.....our potential is greater.<O:p</O:p

does it not show that the four and twenty elders in revalation casting their crowns in worship to the father?
and they are just like us.

Those elders symbolically represents the Church. Only the Church/the members have been crowned kings. <O:p</O:p

so if they yeild to father then HE must be greater then US and remain so.

we cant become that much like him.

it also says that we ought to worship angels. if we are that much like christ or the trinity then we too are a spirit!

I have no idea what you are trying to say, but what I do know is that most Christians are sadly ignorant of what the Bible says......they know more about what their Church believe than what is actually in the Bible.<O:p</O:p

 

[Bazz1040]

Like what? Why do you extrapolate anything from that?

Because I made a statement that the Bible says that the saints will be worshiped and so far no one even ask me to show it to them. But instead are arguing with me and even saying things that I did not say. It’s as if they either fear the truth or already have their mind made up and therefore do not have to ask.<O:p</O:p

 

[jasoncran]

Angles are servants of God and man.



Angels only hold power over man temporarily......man's destiny is greater than any angel.<O:p</O:p



I said anything about zillions of gods. And if God brings us to His level how does that make God nothing? If that would make God nothing then we too would be nothing.<O:p</O:p



But angels were not made in God's image.....only human beings.....our potential is greater.<O:p</O:p



Those elders symbolically represents the Church. Only the Church/the members have been crowned kings. <O:p</O:p




I have no idea what you are trying to say, but what I do know is that most Christians are sadly ignorant of what the Bible says......they know more about what their Church believe than what is actually in the Bible.<O:p</O:p

really? the same ones listed by tribes? we have christian tribes and males only?

and uh basic logic. basic, basic logic

we cant have God still be all powerful, all knowing, and all presence, when I or you have the same attributes.

its not logical at all. odd that after all these yrs only you know this. what church do you attend?

if am all powerful and you are at the same how can you have the same traits as me? that means if i do something and you dont want it, you cant stop it as i have the same power.

so God cant be all powerful then if he yeilds to us his nature fully.or all present and the other ominscience.

as when you create on planet x then i have to be there in spirit and knowing about it.

and so would the father and the original trinity but they cant since we all have the same traits.

 

[Bazz1040]

no, i dont go off into odd doctrines and where the bible isnt specefic and claim that. we dont know as that is a mystery.


it doesnt say we become demi-gods at all. its says we reign with him. if the humans that are alive after the final battle are perfected as they passed the final test of the devil.
so we dont know what happens after that.

i dont see any verse that says he gives up his throne and makes us his equals.

on earth a queen reigns with her husband but isnt equal to his authority. in fact most queens werent in control of the affiars of the state.

i see something similar we reign with him but always under him.

never having his glory. only he gets that.

besides,moses and also elijah were angels when they appeared , surely they didnt get worshipped.

Where did I say anything about demi-god? And where does the Bible says Moses and Elijah were angels? <O:p</O:p

 

[Bazz1040]

really? the same ones listed by tribes? we have christian tribes and males only?

and uh basic logic. basic, basic logic

we cant have God still be all powerful, all knowing, and all presence, when I or you have the same attributes.

its not logical at all. odd that after all these yrs only you know this. what church do you attend?

if am all powerful and you are at the same how can you have the same traits as me? that means if i do something and you dont want it, you cant stop it as i have the same power.

so God cant be all powerful then if he yeilds to us his nature fully.or all present and the other ominscience.

as when you create on planet x then i have to be there in spirit and knowing about it.

and so would the father and the original trinity but they cant since we all have the same traits.

If Jesus told the disciples that all things were possible for those who believe, then how much more so when one has been glorified?<O:p</O:p

 

[jasoncran]

Because I made a statement that the Bible says that the saints will be worshiped and so far no one even ask me to show it to them. But instead are arguing with me and even saying things that I did not say. It’s as if they either fear the truth or already have their mind made up and therefore do not have to ask.<O:p</O:p

you mean this verse? i already know the verse. its in revalation 3:9

New International Version (©1984)
I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you

hmm that one translates that as something else other then the kjv version that says this;

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


interesting when look to other translations that say this.

the word and medival use of worship is the same as bowing in respect and humily not as to place in that level of the lords alone worship.

its like me bowing to the king and saying what Daniels after the king cyrus asked daniel if he was alive.
what did daniel say

yes i am here,o king Live forever.

so he what, worshipped him and said that, meaning Long live the king!

 

[jasoncran]

If Jesus told the disciples that all things were possible for those who believe, then how much more so when one has been glorified?<O:p</O:p

logic, logic.

did God make the math we use?!or the languages we use to a degree? yes

so god can make a rock so big that he cant lift it?

do you see the sillyness of your thoughts

 

[jasoncran]

Where did I say anything about demi-god? And where does the Bible says Moses and Elijah were angels? <O:p</O:p

you claimed that we create, only God can create.


ARE these not your words?
Don't you think that God intends for us to create life on them and rule? Don't you understand the parable that Jesus told?

the transifiguration in the gospels.

peters sees the the men elijah and also moses and says lord let us make tabernacles for moses, elijah, and you.

and those men appeared talking to the lord.

now how does the dead talk to the lord if they arent dead?

 

[Bazz1040]

you mean this verse? i already know the verse. its in revalation 3:9

New International Version (©1984)
I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you

hmm that one translates that as something else other then the kjv version that says this;

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


interesting when look to other translations that say this.

the word and medival use of worship is the same as bowing in respect and humily not as to place in that level of the lords alone worship.

its like me bowing to the king and saying what Daniels after the king cyrus asked daniel if he was alive.
what did daniel say

yes i am here,o king Live forever.

so he what, worshipped him and said that, meaning Long live the king!

That does not look like a translating that looks more like a comment on what it means.

Notice how the two verses are similar to each other. One is about God and the other is about the saints. Notice how similar the meaning of the word worship in both verse.

Psalms 86:9 (KJV)
9 All nations whom thou hast made shall come and worship before thee, O Lord; and shall glorify thy name.

Hebrew Strong's Number: 7812
Hebrew Word: ‏שָׁחָה‎
Transliteration: shāḥâ
Phonetic Pronunciation: shaw-khaw'
Root: a primitive root
Cross Reference: TWOT - 2360
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Worship (To)



a primitive root; to depress, i.e. prostrate (especially reflexive in homage to royalty or God) :- bow (self) down, crouch, fall down (flat), humbly beseech, do (make) obeisance, do reverence, make to stoop, worship.
— Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary

Revelation 3:9 (KJV)
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Jesus used the same word proskyneō in regards to God as He did for the saints.


Matthew 4:10 (KJV)
<SUP>10 </SUP>Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.



<!--EndFragment-->Greek Strong's Number: 4352
Greek Word: προσκυνέω
Transliteration: proskyneō
Phonetic Pronunciation Pros-koo-neh'-o
Root: from <G4314>and a probable derivative of <G2965>(meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand)
Cross Reference: TDNT - 6:758,948
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Worship, Worshiping


from <G4314>(pros) and a probably derivative of <G2965>(kuon) (meaning to kiss, like a dog licking his master's hand); to fawn or crouch to, i.e. (literal or figurative) prostrate oneself in homage (do reverence to, adore) :- worship.
— Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary

Two different languages both saying the same thing one to God and the other to His people, in glory. To deny what the scriptures are saying and say that they are saying different things is deny what would be plain for any fair minded person can see.



As God is worshiped so will the world do for the saints.