Who was Jesus addressing the Sermon on the Mount to?

[JLB]

hello JLB, dirtfarmer here

To be part of the "Church" you have to be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit, so, when did the Spirit begin to indwell and "born" people into the body of Christ?

It seems you have been taught Replacement Theology at one point in your walk with the Lord.


Please post the scripture that says “To be part of the "Church" you have to be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit”.


[edited] It sounds like you find this to go against what you believe, it’s better for us to come to a common understanding through expressing what the scriptures say.


Ecclesia is the Greek word used to define the Church, the called out ones, the holy nation of God, the holy congregation of the Lord.


This began with Abraham.

We are grafted into that covenant, in Christ, and have become partakers of the household of God that Abraham was a part of, through faith in Christ Jesus.


This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

1. a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
   1. an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
   2. the assembly of the Israelites
   3. any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
   4. in a Christian sense
      1. an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
      2. a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
      3. those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
      4. the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
      5. the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

JLB

 

[JLB]

Amen. I believe the Lord expects each of us to be an Abraham to Him, that is walk in faith and obedience.

Yes sir. Abraham left a wonderful legacy for us, as an example of those who walk in faith with our Lord.


JLB

 

[JLB]

I'm doing an Abraham right now, lol. He said Edward move to land of Ohio...and nothing else so here I am waiting on Him I guess, lol.

No promises, no nothing just go He said. So now I'm here, like, da da da what now?

There’s good deer hunting there.


I don’t know about pigs though.

 

[dirtfarmer]

It seems you have been taught Replacement Theology at one point in your walk with the Lord.


Please post the scripture that says “To be part of the "Church" you have to be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit”.


I have given you many scriptures and you don’t seem to be discussing them with me. Since you find this to go against what you believe, it’s better for us to come to a common understanding through expressing what the scriptures say.


Ecclesia is the Greek word used to define the Church, the called out ones, the holy nation of God, the holy congregation of the Lord.


This began with Abraham.

We are grafted into that covenant, in Christ, and have become partakers of the household of God that Abraham was a part of, through faith in Christ Jesus.


This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

1. a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
   1. an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
   2. the assembly of the Israelites
   3. any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
   4. in a Christian sense
      1. an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
      2. a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
      3. those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
      4. the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
      5. the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

JLB

hello JLB, dirtfarmer here

I have never believed in "the replacement theology".

As to being indwelt by the Spirit Romans 8:9 the last phrase states: " Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

 

[ezra]

It seems you have been taught Replacement Theology at one point in your walk with the Lord.


Please post the scripture that says “To be part of the "Church" you have to be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit”.

hang on there first of all who is the Church? > Christians make up the Body of Christ . to be a Christian one MUST be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit”. not sure what Replacement Theology is but dirt farmer is correct in his latter statement

 

[ezra]

hello JLB, dirtfarmer here

Was animal sacrifice necessary for the old testament Jews? The answer is yes. As a new testament believer are we to offer animal sacrifices? The answer is no. The only sacrifice that is New Testament is that of Christ on the cross.

this is true but as Paul wrote we are to present our bodies a living sacrifice Holy and acceptable . it takes lots of spiritual sacrifice being crucified with Christ . while we may not live word by word of the O.T .BUT IT DOES HAVE GOOD EVERY DAY PRINCIPALS we can apply to our walk . we all have different ways of seeing scripture ( i call it wired differently lol } in the Goal of our walk we all try to keep our eye on the prize..Jesus and run the race and cross the finished line

 

[JLB]

hello JLB, dirtfarmer here

I have never believed in "the replacement theology".

As to being indwelt by the Spirit Romans 8:9 the last phrase states: " Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

Again, I addressed this with scripture.

From post # 24

• The Spirit of Christ dwelled within Abraham.

The Spirit of Christ dwelled within Abraham, being in covenant with the Lord, and being a prophet, who obeyed the Lord.

Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.
1 Peter 1:10-11

Abraham was a prophet.

The Spirit of Christ dwelt within the Old Testament prophets of whom, Abraham was one of them.

Now therefore, restore the man’s wife; for he is a prophet, and he will pray for you and you shall live. But if you do not restore her, know that you shall surely die, you and all who are yours. Genesis 20:7


Brother, please use scripture to make your points.



JLB

 

[JLB]

hang on there first of all who is the Church? > Christians make up the Body of Christ . to be a Christian one MUST be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit”. not sure what Replacement Theology is but dirt farmer is correct in his latter statement

I just got through posting this in post # 41 -


Please read this scripture.

• This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers:

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

1. a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
   1. an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
   2. the assembly of the Israelites
   3. any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
   4. in a Christian sense
      1. an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
      2. a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
      3. those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
      4. the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
      5. the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

Please show me the scripture that says -

• to be a Christian one MUST be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit

Abraham was indwelt by the Spirit of Christ, being a prophet.

• Here is what the scriptures says about being born again -

Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:5-6

No mention of Christian or Church here, but rather Jesus emphasizes entering the kingdom of God.


Abraham is part of God's Kingdom just like you and I.




JLB

 

[ezra]

I just got through posting this in post # 41 -


Please read this scripture.

• This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers:

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

1. a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
   1. an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
   2. the assembly of the Israelites
   3. any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
   4. in a Christian sense
      1. an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
      2. a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
      3. those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
      4. the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
      5. the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

Please show me the scripture that says -

• to be a Christian one MUST be born of the Spirit and Indwelt by the Spirit

Abraham was indwelt by the Spirit of Christ, being a prophet.

• Here is what the scriptures says about being born again -

Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:5-6

No mention of Christian or Church here, but rather Jesus emphasizes entering the kingdom of God.


Abraham is part of God's Kingdom just like you and I.




JLB

gnat straining the church is the body of Christ which has many members ! to enter in to the kingdom one must be born again --which gives them the Title CHRISTIAN

Abraham was indwelt by the Spirit of Christ, being a prophet.

and? nobody said different

 

[WIP]

It sounds like what is needed is a distinction between Christ's Church and the Kingdom of God. Sounds like some are equating the two while others are not. Maybe that will help clarify this question?

 

[ezra]

It sounds like what is needed is a distinction between Christ's Church and the Kingdom of God. Sounds like some are equating the two while others are not. Maybe that will help clarify this question?

perhaps but to be in part of/partakers the Kingdom of God one has to be in Christ Church .to me its like having flour gravy and no biscuits for breakfast.. so maybe someone can explain how to be part of one and not the other . i ddi quick google search come up with this from got questions the kingdom of God is a spiritual rule over the hearts and lives of those who willingly submit to God’s authority. Those who defy God’s authority and refuse to submit to Him are not part of the kingdom of God; in contrast, those who acknowledge the lordship of Christ and gladly surrender to God’s rule in their hearts are part of the kingdom of God and i agree with it https://www.gotquestions.org/kingdom-of-God.html
and this search Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Church_(Disciples_of_Christ)

The Christian Church (Disciples of Christ)[note 1] is a mainline Protestant Christian denomination in the United States in the Reformed tradition with close ties to the Restoration Movement.[2]

It is often referred to as The Christian Church, The Disciples of Christ, or as The Disciples. The Christian Church was a charter participant in the formation of the World Council of Churches (WCC) and of the Federal Council of Churches (now the National Council of Churches), and it continues to be engaged in ecumenical conversations.

The Disciples' local churches are congregationally governed. In 2008 there were 679,563 members in 3,714 congregations in North America.[3]By 2015, this number had declined to a baptized membership of 497,423 in 3,267 congregations, of whom about 306,905 were active members, while roughly 177,141 people attended Sunday services each week.[4]

 

[JLB]

gnat straining the church is the body of Christ which has many members ! to enter in to the kingdom one must be born again --which gives them the Title CHRISTIAN and? nobody said different

perhaps but to be in part of/partakers the Kingdom of God one has to be in Christ Church .to me its like having flour gravy and no biscuits for breakfast.. so maybe someone can explain how to be part of one and not the other .

You don’t which is why I gave you scripture that shows the Church, the Ecclesia, began with Abraham, in which Moses was a part.

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

• a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
• an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
• the assembly of the Israelites
• any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
• in a Christian sense
• an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
• a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
• those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
• the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
• the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

JLB

 

[ezra]

You don’t which is why I gave you scripture that shows the Church, the Ecclesia, began with Abraham, in which Moses was a part.

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
Acts 7:37-38 KJV


Key Passage:

This is he, that was in the church (ecclesia) in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina


Strong's G1577 - ekklēsia

• a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly
• an assembly of the people convened at the public place of the council for the purpose of deliberating
• the assembly of the Israelites
• any gathering or throng of men assembled by chance, tumultuously
• in a Christian sense
• an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting
• a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake
• those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body
• the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth
• the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven

JLB

so let me guess you want to be right

 

[JLB]

It sounds like what is needed is a distinction between Christ's Church and the Kingdom of God. Sounds like some are equating the two while others are not. Maybe that will help clarify this question?

Here is what will occur on the Day of Judgement when we all will stand before His throne to be judged according to our deeds.


34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: Matthew 25:34

• inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

 

[JLB]

so let me guess you want to be right

Yes I want to be right with the Lord, when I discuss doctrine.


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
2 John 9



JLB

 

[WIP]

so let me guess you want to be right

Don't you? The question that has come to my mind in this discussion is if one must be in Christ's Church then how do we reconcile the Scripture that was presented regarding Abraham since Christ wasn't known until much later? I'd like to understand this.

 

[JLB]

Don't you? The question that has come to my mind in this discussion is if one must be in Christ's Church then how do we reconcile the Scripture that was presented regarding Abraham since Christ wasn't known until much later? I'd like to understand this.

Abraham was in Covenat with the Lord, the same Lord that became flesh and died for our sins.

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. 2 And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” 3 Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: 4 “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. Genesis 17:1-4

• the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God;

This same Lord appeared to Moses as well as Saul of Tarsus.

These men all believed and obeyed Him, walking in the righteousness which is according to faith.


JLB

 

[ezra]

Don't you? The question that has come to my mind in this discussion is if one must be in Christ's Church then how do we reconcile the Scripture that was presented regarding Abraham since Christ wasn't known until much later? I'd like to understand this.

do i want to be right?----------------> NO ! Abraham looked to Christ coming by faith.look i dont have all the answers when it comes to the o.t let alone the n.t i dont even understand all the o.t saints was saved but they was.. the 4th man in the fire may along with me believes it was Christ incarnate . John 8: 57 Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and You have seen Abraham?” 58“Truly,truly, I tell you, Jesus declared, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59At this, they picked up stones to throw at Him. But Jesus was hidden and went out of the temple area.… i can only go by the scripture.. so by reading what Jesus had to say in john 8 Jesus said he was around before Abraham clarke commentary reads like this first paragraph Before Abraham was, I am - The following is a literal translation of Calmet's note on this passage: - "I am from all eternity. I have existed before all ages. You consider in me only the person who speaks to you, and who has appeared to you within a particular time. But besides this human nature, which ye think ye know, there is in me a Divine and eternal nature. Both, united, subsist together in my person. Abraham knew how to distinguish them. He adored me as his God; and desired me as his Savior. He has seen me in my eternity, and he predicted my coming into the world."
i am only a h.s graduate i have had no other training other than reading and studying and it is of my opinion to be part of the kingdom one must be part of the Body of Christ born again and have the Holy Spirit . i stand by that its a discussion and in discussions there are agreement and disagreements.. that makes neither party wholly correct or wholly wrong it is also imo many things we can only ponder but will not till we get to heaven.

 

[ezra]

Abraham was in Covenat with the Lord, the same Lord that became flesh and died for our sins.

bingo so even though the words the Body of CHRIST which has many members was never used in the o.t the body of Christ was still there

 

[WIP]

Now I'm more confused. What is the dispute between you? I'm not getting it I guess.