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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Why did Jesus pray to God if he is God?
- Thread starter Riven
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- garden jesus christ prayer
4. If it is wondered by the OP, why Jesus is praying to the Father, how Jesus seems to be lesser than the Father, and doesn't seem to know when the time of the end is. ( Mark 13:32.)
That is a simple lack of understanding, by people. ( I can answer for us all.)
Just search and see when the end is ?
Christ comes to us at the end, first Christ puts down all rule and all authority and power. ( then comes the end.)
The reason then why it seems the Son does not know the hour, but the Father, is because the time is when the Father has put to restore the kingdom, in His own power. ( Acts 1:7.)
The Son knows the time by delivering the Kingdom to God, otherwise it would make no sense to mans mind that the Father and the Son are one. ( John 10:30.)
1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
That is a simple lack of understanding, by people. ( I can answer for us all.)
Just search and see when the end is ?
Christ comes to us at the end, first Christ puts down all rule and all authority and power. ( then comes the end.)
The reason then why it seems the Son does not know the hour, but the Father, is because the time is when the Father has put to restore the kingdom, in His own power. ( Acts 1:7.)
The Son knows the time by delivering the Kingdom to God, otherwise it would make no sense to mans mind that the Father and the Son are one. ( John 10:30.)
1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
I want to remind us all what the forum has named this place, as open and honest questioning.
If showing the scriptures gives an answer why things may seem confusing, they are, until we search for answer for ourselves.
Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
If showing the scriptures gives an answer why things may seem confusing, they are, until we search for answer for ourselves.
Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
I agree and in support, consider these scripture-only-in the book of Matthew. Scriptures of this nature are not inclusive. All of these scriptures suport your question.
“This is my Son…”-3:17
“…son of God…“ (4:3); “…Jehovah’s mouth…” (4:4); “…son of God…” (4:6); “Jehovah your God…” (4:7); “…Jehovah your God you must worship…”-4:10
“…your Father who is in the heavens.“ (5:16, 45) “…heavenly Father…”-5:48
“…Father who is in the heavens” (6:1); “..pay to your father…” (6:6); “…God your father…” (6:8); “Our father in the heavens…” (6:9); “…heavenly Father…”-6:14, 26, 32
“…your Father who is in the heavens…“-7:11, 21
“…Son of God…“-8:29
“…my Father who is in the heavens…“ (10:32, 33); “…sent me forth.”-10:40
“…Father…“-11:25-27
“…my Father who is in the heaven…“-12:50
“You are really God’s son.“-14:33
“…my heavenly father…“-15:13
“…son of the living God…” (16:16); “…my Father who is in the heavens…“ (16:17); “…come in the glory of his Father…“-16:27
“This is my Son…“-17:5
“…my Father who is in the heaven…“ (18:10, 14); “…my Father in heaven…”(18:19); “…my heavenly Father…”-16:35
"...my Father…“-20:23
“…your Father, the heavenly one…“ (23:9); “…your Leader…” (23:10); “…he that comes in Jehovah’s name!”-23:39
“…neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.”-24:36
“…blessed by my Father…“-25:34
“…in the kingdom of my Father.“ (26:29); “My Father…” (26:39, 42, 53); “By the living God…Christ the Son of God!” (26:63); “You yourself said it…”-26:64
“Certainly this was God’s Son.“-27:54
“All authority has been given me…“-28:18
Again, this is only a sampling of scriptures-taken from only one book-that clearly differentiates Jesus from God Almighty.
journeymanisnothing
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- Mar 12, 2022
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Hello Riven.
Our Father sent his Son to show us his love towards sinners who treated him shamefully.
How patient (longsuffering) would we be, if people accused us of crimes we didn't commit, mocked us, spit on us, beat us without mercy and then killed us? How much mercy would we show? Would we love people who despised us?
Our Savior took the form of flesh, which has feelings that can cause a man to think or act in a sinful way.
The Sons' prayers show his complete agreement with our Father, despite being tempted to act otherwise.
People who believe Jesus isn't God don't appreciate the fact that Jesus had every right as a sinlees man to condemn sinners without condemning himself.
He said,
But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be? Mt.26:54
Prophecy of how the Jewish Messiah would reveal God to the Jews and the gentilles wouldn't have happened, if he passed judgement on sinners in the 1st century.
journeymanisnothing
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- Mar 12, 2022
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Here's a story where it seems the certain man who has a vineyard is the Father and the dresser of his vinyard is the Son,
He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none. Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground? And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it: And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down. Lk.13:7-9
Is Jesus different from his Father? Does God want to cut that fruitless tree down but his Son is stopping him? Are the Father and Son really disagreeing with one another?
Our Lords' sole purpose for telling this parable was because people thought the horrible way some people died was because they were more sinful than others.
Lk.13:1-6 shows a call to repentance, no different from any other call to repentance by the prophets and apostles except for one thing,
The Bible says love is easily entreated, so our Father being easily entreated by his Son is fine. Gods' Son is easily entreated too.
And Jesus was so angry at money changers he threw their money all over the place. There's no reason that he wasn't just as angry being nailed to a cross. And it's just so normal for any loving father to understand the rage any good decent father would feel at the vicious way his innocent was treated, as God might.
He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none. Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground? And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it: And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down. Lk.13:7-9
Is Jesus different from his Father? Does God want to cut that fruitless tree down but his Son is stopping him? Are the Father and Son really disagreeing with one another?
Our Lords' sole purpose for telling this parable was because people thought the horrible way some people died was because they were more sinful than others.
Lk.13:1-6 shows a call to repentance, no different from any other call to repentance by the prophets and apostles except for one thing,
The Bible says love is easily entreated, so our Father being easily entreated by his Son is fine. Gods' Son is easily entreated too.
And Jesus was so angry at money changers he threw their money all over the place. There's no reason that he wasn't just as angry being nailed to a cross. And it's just so normal for any loving father to understand the rage any good decent father would feel at the vicious way his innocent was treated, as God might.
- Aug 22, 2018
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The term [God/Elohim/Theos] is multifunctional, but not omnifunctional, ie stretchable but not too far. Nowadays though it’s in the biblical shorthand data, I very much avoid the blunt expression, [Jesus is God], as too often it seems to imply, as in your Q, that a person, God, prayed to themself. That said, I sometimes discuss things with myself, ie I ponder in dialogue format—gollum!
That’s short of asking myself to help me, though. On that, at the easiest level, we may say that Jesus prayed to one who was in his society: God is three persons (the Eternal Society/Homoousios), who may talk to one another. Going deeper, unlike God the son noncarnate, Jesus was/is carnate, and begun at a set place and time. I speak of his deificity, and define him as the permanent temporal mode of the uncreated eternal second person of the tripersonal society.
I would always, BTW, avoid calling Jesus [God in the flesh], since [God] can often stand for the father—Jesus is not the father in the flesh, nor the spirit in the flesh. Thus I’d say, [God-the-son-in-the-flesh], or perhaps better, [God-the-son-as-a-human-being], God-the-son noncarnate being source/fullness, and Jesus being incarnate stream.
As for wrapping our heads around the trinity, I reckon the thing is for the trinity to be wrapped around our heads, but it’s good to be inside our heads as well.
- Feb 1, 2013
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Hello Riven, As I think about what you are saying, more and more of what Jesus says of Himself, and of His Father, especially when He said that GOD is a Spirit, means to me, my wife and I in prayer together about this issue according to the scriptures, but GOD was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself, there is much more to say about this.
Love, Walter And Debbie
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- Jul 13, 2012
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Because He became flesh; He became a little lower to the angels.
As a Man He prayed to God the Father.
JLB
Hey All,
Amen JLB! The simple answer stated beautifully. Jesus lowered Himself and became as we are, human. As such, He prayed.
As a man, Jesus also had to breathe, eat, drink, bathe, trim His nails, walk to where He wanted to go, and every other thing we humans do. (Number 1and number 2 as well. Sorry for the graphic image. But He was completely human.) Nobody seems to get hung up about those things.
May God bless,.Taz
Amen JLB! The simple answer stated beautifully. Jesus lowered Himself and became as we are, human. As such, He prayed.
As a man, Jesus also had to breathe, eat, drink, bathe, trim His nails, walk to where He wanted to go, and every other thing we humans do. (Number 1and number 2 as well. Sorry for the graphic image. But He was completely human.) Nobody seems to get hung up about those things.
May God bless,.Taz
Phoneman777
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- Jan 15, 2023
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Amen
"Oh Thou that hearest prayer, unto Thee shall come ALL FLESH come".
The reason Jesus prayed to the Father is because, although He was 100% God, He took on another nature - the nature of a flesh and blood man.
Exeter
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- Feb 15, 2022
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Hi Riven
The word RELATIONSHIP applies to your question. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are in RELATIONSHIP.
The word ROLE also applies to your question. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit have divinely assigned ROLES.
The word RELEVANCE is also applicable to your question. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are RELEVANT to our Christian duty, as this passage indicates.
Jud 1:20-23 But you, beloved, building yourselves up in your most holy faith and praying in the Holy Spirit, (21) keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ that leads to eternal life. (22) And have mercy on those who doubt; (23) save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.
- May 4, 2020
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Agreed. Also He pray aloud for our benefit on occasion ... keep us 'in the loop' so to speak.
Tenchi
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- Oct 10, 2022
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There's a law of logic dealing with the "Indiscernability of Identicals": Essentially, if two things are identical, there is no possible distinction that can be made between them. But this isn't the case with the Godhead. Many are the distinctions Scripture makes between Christ the Son, God the Father, and the Holy Spirit. They occupy different places, perform different actions, are distinguished in their relationship to one another, and so on. As a result, it isn't possible, logically, to say that the Persons of the Trinity are totally identical to one another, just "modes" of God, like a cup of water can be vapor, or ice or liquid but still be the same cup of water. Instead, the orthodox, biblical view of the Trinity is that the three Persons of the Godhead share an identical divine essence, or nature, but are distinct from one another as Persons. Thus, they are perfectly one in their deity, their divine essence, but separate and distinct in their form and function.
The best Trinity-analogy I know of is the equilateral triangle that has three equal sides to it, sides that are fundamentally identical to each other in nature, but together form the one triangle. Remove any of the three sides of the triangle, or collapse the lines into one another, and the triangle is no longer a triangle. The sides, though identical in nature, are still clearly distinguishable from one another within the form of the triangle (i.e. side "a," side "b," side "c") and must be in order to form the single equilateral triangle. Thus, the lines are both one in nature but distinguishable from each other at the same time. There is in this one-and-three state-of-affairs no logical contradiction, no ineffable mystery, just simple geometry.
Likewise, the three Persons of the Trinity are distinct but equal "sides" of the one "triangle" that is God. The three Persons are identical in their essential nature but stand in distinct relationship to one another in the "triangle" of the Godhead, in doing so, forming it. Remove any one of the "sides" of the Trinity "triangle," and the Trinitarian God of Scripture ceases to exist. In this biblical description of God there is no actual logical contradiction, though it is a highly unusual (actually, singular) state of conscious being in which to exist.
Was Jesus, then, praying to himself? No. Though he and his heavenly Father share an identical divine nature, they are separate, distinct Persons in the Godhead that interact with each other as such.
Carry_Your_Name
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- Oct 2, 2023
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He was praying to the incorporeal God of the universe who is NOT in the flesh. It's not about identity or ability, but attitude.
reddogs
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He came as a man like we are, and yet was still fully God...
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Aside: Sometimes Jesus prayed aloud for our benefit (John 11:42) I assume your question doesn't refer to this purpose.
Jesus is God in the flesh (Colossians 2:9 "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily") but God has chosen to create flesh (Jesus) and to inhabit a limited amount of His total essence in Jesus. As proof of this point we know that Jesus is not omnipresent, yet God (the trinity) is omnipresent. Also, Jesus did not know all things (Matthew 24:35-36) yet the trinity is all knowing. Also, God is Spirit and not material while Christ has material and spirit attributes.
So, considering Jesus is a subset of God in many respects (hypostatic union) it means that Jesus is dependent upon God for things that humans need like food and knowledge. So, answering your question one can assume that Jesus was inquiring to gain knowledge or fulfill some other human need.