joethemechanic
Member
I'm pretty sure she has a soul. And I don't think she sins, well unless licking the butter is a sin.
Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
-
Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
-
-
Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
-
-
How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
-
Will My Kitty Go to Heaven?
- Thread starter joethemechanic
- Start date
I'm pretty sure she has a soul. And I don't think she sins, well unless licking the butter is a sin.
handy
Member
It's one of the things that the bible isn't crystal clear about...
but in my own heart, I've studied quite a few biblical principles and passages and checked out some Hebrew and have come to the conclusion that our beloved pets will most certainly be sharing eternity with us.
:yes
(She's adorable by the way... and I don't believe a word about the butter. Not a word! Why you can see it in her eyes that she would never do such a thing.)
but in my own heart, I've studied quite a few biblical principles and passages and checked out some Hebrew and have come to the conclusion that our beloved pets will most certainly be sharing eternity with us.
:yes
(She's adorable by the way... and I don't believe a word about the butter. Not a word! Why you can see it in her eyes that she would never do such a thing.)
AirDancer
Member
Of course your kitty will go to heaven, Joe. She'll be waiting for you ... playing with toys, licking butter, lapping up cream.
One of my pets, a cat who died in 1998, is waiting for me... he's eating Oreo double stuffs & grilled cheese sandwiches while he awaits our reunion, of this I have no doubt.
One of my pets, a cat who died in 1998, is waiting for me... he's eating Oreo double stuffs & grilled cheese sandwiches while he awaits our reunion, of this I have no doubt.
joethemechanic
Member
I think she's had a rough life. Half her tail is missing and she is a bit crooked. She runs kinda sideways too.
Jethro Bodine
Member
The real sin is not telling anybody else she licked the butter.
Jethro Bodine
Member
Jethro Bodine
Member
Don't get me started thinking about my bunnies who dropped dead from fright when 2 big dogs came into the yard and scared them to death. I learned all about the 'rainbow bridge' that day.Of course your kitty will go to heaven, Joe. She'll be waiting for you ... playing with toys, licking butter, lapping up cream.
One of my pets, a cat who died in 1998, is waiting for me... he's eating Oreo double stuffs & grilled cheese sandwiches while he awaits our reunion, of this I have no doubt.
joethemechanic
Member
Her tongue leaves these swirl marks in the butter. I'm always checking for them lol.
Lewis
Member
Over the years here I have talked about this 3 times, so I am going to paste something on this here again.
Will We See Our Pets in Heaven?
One of life’s greatest joys is having a pet. They bring so much happiness, companionship and enjoyment that we can’t imagine life without them. Many Christians wonder, "Do animals have souls? Will I see my pet in heaven?"
Answer: In the past few decades, scientists have proven beyond any doubt that some species of animals possess intelligence. Porpoises and whales can communicate with other members of their species through audible language. Dogs can be trained to do relatively complex tasks. Gorillas have even been taught to form simple sentences using sign language.
Animal rights activists point to this intelligence to claim that all creatures have equal rights to life and to certain treatment. Some activists even bristle when someone says they own a pet. They prefer the term "caretaker."
But does animal intelligence constitute a soul? Does a pet’s emotions and ability to relate to human beings mean that animals possess an immortal spirit that will survive after death?
Theologians say no. They point out that man was created superior to animals and that animals can’t be equal with him.
Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground." (Genesis 1:26, NIV)
Most interpreters of the Bible assume that man’s likeness to God and animals’ subservience to man implies that animals may have the "breath of life," nephesh in Hebrew, but not an immortal soul in the same sense as man’s.
Later in Genesis we read that by God’s command, Adam and Eve were vegetarians. There is no mention that they ate animal flesh:
And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden, but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die." (Genesis 2:16-17, NIV)
After the flood, God gave Noah and his sons permission to kill and eat animals:
"Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything." (Genesis 9:3, NIV)
In Leviticus, God instructs Moses on animals that are suitable for sacrifice:
"Speak to the Israelites and say to them: 'When any of you brings an offering to the LORD, bring as your offering an animal from either the herd or the flock.'" (Leviticus 1:2, NIV)
Later in that chapter God includes birds as acceptable offerings and adds grains as well. Except for the consecration of all firstborn animals in Exodus 13, we do not see the sacrifice of dogs, cats, horses, mules or donkeys in the Bible. Dogs are mentioned many times in Scripture but cats are not. Perhaps that’s because they were favorite pets in Egypt and were associated with pagan religion.
God prohibited the killing of man ("You shall not murder," Exodus 20:13) but he placed no such restriction on the killing of animals. Man is made in God’s image, so man must not kill one of his own kind. Animals, it would seem, are different from man. If they do have a "soul" that survives death, it is different from man’s.
It does not need redemption. Christ died to save the souls of human beings, not animals.
Even so, the prophet Isaiah says God will include animals in the new heavens and new earth:
"The wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox, but dust will be the serpent’s food. They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, says the LORD." (Isaiah 65: 25, NIV)
In the last book of the Bible, Revelation, the Apostle John’s vision of heaven also included animals, showing Christ and the armies of heaven "riding on white horses." (Revelation 19:14, NIV)
Most of us can't picture a paradise of unspeakable beauty without flowers, trees, and animals. Would it be heaven for an avid birdwatcher if there are no birds? Would a fisherman want to spend eternity with no fish? And would it be heaven for a cowboy without horses?
While theologians may be stubborn in classifying animals' "souls" as inferior to those of humans, those learned scholars must admit that descriptions of heaven in the Bible are sketchy at best. The Bible does not give a definitive answer on the question of whether we will see our pets in heaven, but it does say, "... with God, all things are possible." (Matthew 19:26, NIV)
My Cairn Terrier, Charlie, is an important part of my life and I often feel he is a gift God has given me. You probably feel the same way about your pet.
That’s why I like the story about the elderly widow whose beloved little dog died after fifteen faithful years. Distraught, she went to her pastor.
"Parson," she said, tears streaming down her cheeks, "the vicar said animals have no souls. My darling little dog Fluffy has died. Does that mean I won’t see her again in heaven?"
"Madam," said the old priest, "God, in his great love and wisdom has created heaven to be a place of perfect happiness. I am sure that if you need your little dog to complete your happiness, you will find her there."
Jack Zavada, a career writer and guest contributor for About.com, is host to a Christian website for singles. Never married, Jack feels that the hard-won lessons he has learned may help other Christian singles make sense of their lives.
His articles and ebooks offer great hope and encouragement. To contact him or for more information, visit Jack's Bio Page.
More About Animals in the Bible
Will We See Our Pets in Heaven?
One of life’s greatest joys is having a pet. They bring so much happiness, companionship and enjoyment that we can’t imagine life without them. Many Christians wonder, "Do animals have souls? Will I see my pet in heaven?"
Answer: In the past few decades, scientists have proven beyond any doubt that some species of animals possess intelligence. Porpoises and whales can communicate with other members of their species through audible language. Dogs can be trained to do relatively complex tasks. Gorillas have even been taught to form simple sentences using sign language.
Animal rights activists point to this intelligence to claim that all creatures have equal rights to life and to certain treatment. Some activists even bristle when someone says they own a pet. They prefer the term "caretaker."
But does animal intelligence constitute a soul? Does a pet’s emotions and ability to relate to human beings mean that animals possess an immortal spirit that will survive after death?
Theologians say no. They point out that man was created superior to animals and that animals can’t be equal with him.
Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground." (Genesis 1:26, NIV)
Most interpreters of the Bible assume that man’s likeness to God and animals’ subservience to man implies that animals may have the "breath of life," nephesh in Hebrew, but not an immortal soul in the same sense as man’s.
Later in Genesis we read that by God’s command, Adam and Eve were vegetarians. There is no mention that they ate animal flesh:
And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden, but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die." (Genesis 2:16-17, NIV)
After the flood, God gave Noah and his sons permission to kill and eat animals:
"Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything." (Genesis 9:3, NIV)
In Leviticus, God instructs Moses on animals that are suitable for sacrifice:
"Speak to the Israelites and say to them: 'When any of you brings an offering to the LORD, bring as your offering an animal from either the herd or the flock.'" (Leviticus 1:2, NIV)
Later in that chapter God includes birds as acceptable offerings and adds grains as well. Except for the consecration of all firstborn animals in Exodus 13, we do not see the sacrifice of dogs, cats, horses, mules or donkeys in the Bible. Dogs are mentioned many times in Scripture but cats are not. Perhaps that’s because they were favorite pets in Egypt and were associated with pagan religion.
God prohibited the killing of man ("You shall not murder," Exodus 20:13) but he placed no such restriction on the killing of animals. Man is made in God’s image, so man must not kill one of his own kind. Animals, it would seem, are different from man. If they do have a "soul" that survives death, it is different from man’s.
It does not need redemption. Christ died to save the souls of human beings, not animals.
Even so, the prophet Isaiah says God will include animals in the new heavens and new earth:
"The wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox, but dust will be the serpent’s food. They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, says the LORD." (Isaiah 65: 25, NIV)
In the last book of the Bible, Revelation, the Apostle John’s vision of heaven also included animals, showing Christ and the armies of heaven "riding on white horses." (Revelation 19:14, NIV)
Most of us can't picture a paradise of unspeakable beauty without flowers, trees, and animals. Would it be heaven for an avid birdwatcher if there are no birds? Would a fisherman want to spend eternity with no fish? And would it be heaven for a cowboy without horses?
While theologians may be stubborn in classifying animals' "souls" as inferior to those of humans, those learned scholars must admit that descriptions of heaven in the Bible are sketchy at best. The Bible does not give a definitive answer on the question of whether we will see our pets in heaven, but it does say, "... with God, all things are possible." (Matthew 19:26, NIV)
My Cairn Terrier, Charlie, is an important part of my life and I often feel he is a gift God has given me. You probably feel the same way about your pet.
That’s why I like the story about the elderly widow whose beloved little dog died after fifteen faithful years. Distraught, she went to her pastor.
"Parson," she said, tears streaming down her cheeks, "the vicar said animals have no souls. My darling little dog Fluffy has died. Does that mean I won’t see her again in heaven?"
"Madam," said the old priest, "God, in his great love and wisdom has created heaven to be a place of perfect happiness. I am sure that if you need your little dog to complete your happiness, you will find her there."
Jack Zavada, a career writer and guest contributor for About.com, is host to a Christian website for singles. Never married, Jack feels that the hard-won lessons he has learned may help other Christian singles make sense of their lives.
His articles and ebooks offer great hope and encouragement. To contact him or for more information, visit Jack's Bio Page.
More About Animals in the Bible
Personally I don't see why animals wouldn't go to heaven.
Last edited by a moderator:
handy
Member
From Strong's Concordance
nephesh
1) soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion
a) that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man
b) living being
c) living being (with life in the blood)
d) the man himself, self, person or individual
e) seat of the appetites
f) seat of emotions and passions
g) activity of mind
1) dubious
h) activity of the will
1) dubious
i) activity of the character
1) dubious
Then the Lord God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being (nephesh). Genesis 2:7
Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature (nephesh), that was its name. Genesis 2:19
The animals...all of them, including the human ones, are souls...
Just part of the evidence that I believe adds up to Miranda and Cleo and Duchess and Rajah and Kitty Kitty all enjoying the new earth with us. After all, if God redeems us, who brought sin into the world and caused death... why not redeem the animals who have no sin? If their innocent death remains... how is that a victory over death?
nephesh
1) soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion
a) that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man
b) living being
c) living being (with life in the blood)
d) the man himself, self, person or individual
e) seat of the appetites
f) seat of emotions and passions
g) activity of mind
1) dubious
h) activity of the will
1) dubious
i) activity of the character
1) dubious
Then the Lord God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being (nephesh). Genesis 2:7
Out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature (nephesh), that was its name. Genesis 2:19
The animals...all of them, including the human ones, are souls...
Just part of the evidence that I believe adds up to Miranda and Cleo and Duchess and Rajah and Kitty Kitty all enjoying the new earth with us. After all, if God redeems us, who brought sin into the world and caused death... why not redeem the animals who have no sin? If their innocent death remains... how is that a victory over death?
That's my reasoning as well. If God is willing to redeem us filthy humans, why not the animals? It's not like any of them have done anything really immoral--they don't have a sense of right and wrong.
tim-from-pa
Member
I think the bible has answers to the "afterlife" of animals and all creation. It's found here:
<sup>19</sup>For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. <sup>20</sup>For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, <sup>21</sup>Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
The millennium is a great time, but after the Great White Throne judgement (I call that a mini-millennium post-dating the Millennium), we see according to Peter that the earth and heavens will melt with fervent heat (the lake of fire) and once the lake of fire burns out and is no more, a new heavens and new earth will be made. There will be no more death and dying, and I believe even past animals were resurrected for this new earth. How do I know?
Nothing in scripture, beyond what I shown above (to my knowledge anyway) states that directly, but it can be inferred with the above passage, and the idea of resurrection. Sleeping and waking is a biblical euphemism for dying and resurrection--- and is the physical "type" to show something that will take place. I have this personal belief that any animal that sleeps and wakes again will have this part. That's the point of it (I even have answers to the reason we expel our waste and what it denotes, but that's another subject :toofunny). Disgusting animals such as maggots and flies will not be because they were created for the purpose of destruction and that's their lot. Some insects, although not sleeping strictly speaking, such as a butterfly, will be resurrected because of the "sleep" in the cocoon and "awakening" in its butterfly form.
Keep in mind not all resurrection (including humans) is spiritual. Some will be raised physical for the purpose of the white throne judgement and to be destroyed in the eternal lake of fire. And I suppose resurrected or recreated animals may be the same, as Paul speaks of different bodies as well used as an illustration. But I would hesitate to say that God cannot make a physical, or physical-like body capable of immortality.
<sup>19</sup>For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. <sup>20</sup>For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, <sup>21</sup>Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
The millennium is a great time, but after the Great White Throne judgement (I call that a mini-millennium post-dating the Millennium), we see according to Peter that the earth and heavens will melt with fervent heat (the lake of fire) and once the lake of fire burns out and is no more, a new heavens and new earth will be made. There will be no more death and dying, and I believe even past animals were resurrected for this new earth. How do I know?
Nothing in scripture, beyond what I shown above (to my knowledge anyway) states that directly, but it can be inferred with the above passage, and the idea of resurrection. Sleeping and waking is a biblical euphemism for dying and resurrection--- and is the physical "type" to show something that will take place. I have this personal belief that any animal that sleeps and wakes again will have this part. That's the point of it (I even have answers to the reason we expel our waste and what it denotes, but that's another subject :toofunny). Disgusting animals such as maggots and flies will not be because they were created for the purpose of destruction and that's their lot. Some insects, although not sleeping strictly speaking, such as a butterfly, will be resurrected because of the "sleep" in the cocoon and "awakening" in its butterfly form.
Keep in mind not all resurrection (including humans) is spiritual. Some will be raised physical for the purpose of the white throne judgement and to be destroyed in the eternal lake of fire. And I suppose resurrected or recreated animals may be the same, as Paul speaks of different bodies as well used as an illustration. But I would hesitate to say that God cannot make a physical, or physical-like body capable of immortality.
joethemechanic
Member
Here is the thought that really bothers me
What about animals we as humans don't like, such as rats and cockroaches
If cats and dogs get into heaven, do all animals get in?
Do only animals that are loved by humans get in? If so what about animals such as feral cats? They just are not fortunate enough to have a human's love. That isn't their fault.
Sorry Tim I didn't see your post before I posted, but you address some of the same things that I am thinking about
What about animals we as humans don't like, such as rats and cockroaches
If cats and dogs get into heaven, do all animals get in?
Do only animals that are loved by humans get in? If so what about animals such as feral cats? They just are not fortunate enough to have a human's love. That isn't their fault.
Sorry Tim I didn't see your post before I posted, but you address some of the same things that I am thinking about
Last edited by a moderator:
handy
Member
One of the realities of the new earth will be that animals will no longer have the fear they now have of humans and will no longer be carnivores... They weren't created to be so and they will cease to be so when the new earth is created. So, the issues we see with "unwanted pets" and feral animals won't exist.
I HOPE roaches won't go to heaven!:toofunny Sometimes I'd like to brutally torture and slowly kill those things...they're so annoying. (Kidding. Partly. And I have a infestation of those idiots in my house that just won't away, so...yeah.)
But, no. I guess if they did go to heaven they wouldn't be annoying like they are now.
....what purpose does a roach serve anyway? Destruction?
To teach us patience and anger management?
But, no. I guess if they did go to heaven they wouldn't be annoying like they are now.
....what purpose does a roach serve anyway? Destruction?
To teach us patience and anger management?
I can't read it. =/You'll have to enlarge it but its worth it
Drew
Member
I do not think this is Biblical.
In Romans 8, Paul refers to all creation waiting to experience the promised redemption.
Elsewhere, we are instructed to "preach the gospel to all creation". Now it may not be clear as to what it means to address the gospel to creatures / things other than human beings, I think the safe route is to assume that the writer meant what he wrote, and that there is some sense in which all creation is affected by the resurrection and lordship of Jesus.
Beware the tendency to think "its all about us". I see no Biblical case for this whatsoever. True, God has placed mankind in a position of stewardship over all creation. But I believe the scriptures teach the redemption of all creation, not just us humans.
Remember also: our ultimate future is not in a disembodied state in heaven - it is here on a redeemed and restored earth. And what would a restored earth be without animals?
Jethro Bodine
Member
Well, if your cat gets to go to heaven, then so does mine:
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
My daughter named him Bebo.
I call him Mayhem.
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
My daughter named him Bebo.
I call him Mayhem.