Daniel's Seventy Weeks

[Marilyn C]

The question was: When would the temple be tore down. The answer was that He did not know. Today we know that this took place in 70 AD. He gave them instructions on what they should do when they see these things happen.

2“Do you see all these things?” He replied. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

3While Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your coming and of the end of the age?”

Oh, ok. I thought you were asking about the rapture.

 

[RandyK]

The seven year great tribulation, which is not found anywhere in scripture, was derived by mans misinterpretation of Daniel 9:24-27.

I will reiterate what I believe on Daniel's 70th Week. I've probably shared on this a number of times, but it's my only answer to this difficult passage, which I've struggled with for many years. I don't struggle so much now because after going from school to school and from position to position I finally have an assortment that at least makes sense as a whole. Not saying I'm right....

Daniel is concerned about the restoration of the temple worship after the Babylonian Captivity ends. And an angel shows him that the temple will be restored, but will be destroyed yet again in the time of Messiah. It is the prince of the 4th Kingdom, I believe, whose people, a Roman army, will destroy Jerusalem and the temple.

This army is identified as an "abomination that causes desolation." This begins a period of trouble for Israel identified as the "great tribulation." Jesus later indicated this destruction of Jerusalem and the temple would lead to an age-long exile of the Jewish People, now called the "Jewish Diaspora."

Luke describes a "Jewish Punishment" that comes upon Israel for persecuting Christ and his Disciples, that causes Israel to lose their homeland and their Covenant with God. But it also causes suffering for Christians who like Christ are persecuted by Jews and Gentiles alike.

This is the actual "Great Tribulation"--not the one we hear about all the time in connection with the Antichrist. That is yet another Great Tribulation of sorts, but which actually is just a continuation of the same Great Tribulation we've had for the Jews and for fallen Christians nations for centuries.

From the time of Artaxerxes' decree in 457 BC to 26 AD is 483 years, or "69 Weeks," leaving the 70th Week remaining. I believe that instead of the 70th Week being a full Week, it actually ended in a Half-Week when Christ was put to death.

That is when the Roman ruler, by putting Christ to death, terminated the usefulness of animal sacrifices and offerings under the Law. The temple veil had been rent, signifying that the covenant of Law had been broken.

So the 70 Weeks Prophecy was fulfilled in history, with the exception that the prophecy indicated the 70 Week period would be followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple by the same ruler who put Jesus to death. It was the same Roman ruler who indirectly causes sacrifices and offerings to cease under the Law by removing the one to whom they had been offered.

Anybody curious about my position, this is it.

 

[Elijah7777]

h, ok. I thought you were asking about the rapture.

If you are 77 than you and me may go at about the same time. Everyone gets raptured when it is their time to go onto their reward. Most of the people I knew who believed in a rapture have already gone to be with the Lord. I do not think people are qualified to be an elder in the Church until they have been a Christian for 40 years. So why would God want to take people before their time and before they have lived out their life to the fullest? So I guess I am asking about the rapture.

 

[Elijah7777]

The temple veil had been rent, signifying that the covenant of Law had been broken.

There were many people resurrected when the Veil was torn. This showed their was no longer a veil to separate people from the Holy of Holies. Because of the Blood Sacrifice of Jesus.

When Jesus died, the veil in the temple was torn in two from top to bottom (Matthew 27:51), symbolizing the removal of the barrier between God and humanity. His blood sacrifice made direct access to God possible, fulfilling the purpose of the temple and its rituals.

At the same time, many dead believers were resurrected (Matthew 27:52-53), showing the power of His victory over death and foreshadowing the future resurrection of all who believe in Him. This moment was a divine confirmation of the new covenant, demonstrating that Jesus' sacrifice had opened the way to eternal life.

 

[for_his_glory]

I will reiterate what I believe on Daniel's 70th Week. I've probably shared on this a number of times, but it's my only answer to this difficult passage, which I've struggled with for many years. I don't struggle so much now because after going from school to school and from position to position I finally have an assortment that at least makes sense as a whole. Not saying I'm right....

Daniel is concerned about the restoration of the temple worship after the Babylonian Captivity ends. And an angel shows him that the temple will be restored, but will be destroyed yet again in the time of Messiah. It is the prince of the 4th Kingdom, I believe, whose people, a Roman army, will destroy Jerusalem and the temple.

This army is identified as an "abomination that causes desolation." This begins a period of trouble for Israel identified as the "great tribulation." Jesus later indicated this destruction of Jerusalem and the temple would lead to an age-long exile of the Jewish People, now called the "Jewish Diaspora."

Luke describes a "Jewish Punishment" that comes upon Israel for persecuting Christ and his Disciples, that causes Israel to lose their homeland and their Covenant with God. But it also causes suffering for Christians who like Christ are persecuted by Jews and Gentiles alike.

This is the actual "Great Tribulation"--not the one we hear about all the time in connection with the Antichrist. That is yet another Great Tribulation of sorts, but which actually is just a continuation of the same Great Tribulation we've had for the Jews and for fallen Christians nations for centuries.

From the time of Artaxerxes' decree in 457 BC to 26 AD is 483 years, or "69 Weeks," leaving the 70th Week remaining. I believe that instead of the 70th Week being a full Week, it actually ended in a Half-Week when Christ was put to death.

That is when the Roman ruler, by putting Christ to death, terminated the usefulness of animal sacrifices and offerings under the Law. The temple veil had been rent, signifying that the covenant of Law had been broken.

So the 70 Weeks Prophecy was fulfilled in history, with the exception that the prophecy indicated the 70 Week period would be followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple by the same ruler who put Jesus to death. It was the same Roman ruler who indirectly causes sacrifices and offerings to cease under the Law by removing the one to whom they had been offered.

Anybody curious about my position, this is it.

I can't agree with this, but it is your opinion.

 

[for_his_glory]

There were many people resurrected when the Veil was torn. This showed their was no longer a veil to separate people from the Holy of Holies. Because of the Blood Sacrifice of Jesus.

When Jesus died, the veil in the temple was torn in two from top to bottom (Matthew 27:51), symbolizing the removal of the barrier between God and humanity. His blood sacrifice made direct access to God possible, fulfilling the purpose of the temple and its rituals.

At the same time, many dead believers were resurrected (Matthew 27:52-53), showing the power of His victory over death and foreshadowing the future resurrection of all who believe in Him. This moment was a divine confirmation of the new covenant, demonstrating that Jesus' sacrifice had opened the way to eternal life.

What you are speaking about that happened over 2000 years ago was that many, not all, were raised from the grave when the earth quaked and Jesus yielded up the Ghost. They were brought back to life and entered into the city, not heaven, so others would know Jesus as in "I am Lord" as only Jesus has power to raise anyone from the dead. This is what caused the centurion and many that were with him to believe this was the Son of God that hung on the cross.

Matthew 27:50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. 51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. 54 Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.

 

[for_his_glory]

If you are 77 than you and me may go at about the same time. Everyone gets raptured when it is their time to go onto their reward. Most of the people I knew who believed in a rapture have already gone to be with the Lord. I do not think people are qualified to be an elder in the Church until they have been a Christian for 40 years. So why would God want to take people before their time and before they have lived out their life to the fullest? So I guess I am asking about the rapture.

How do you explain these scriptures in light of what you have said.

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

[Johann!@#]

What you are speaking about that happened over 2000 years ago was that many, not all, were raised from the grave when the earth quaked and Jesus yielded up the Ghost. They were brought back to life and entered into the city, not heaven, so others would know Jesus as in "I am Lord" as only Jesus has power to raise anyone from the dead. This is what caused the centurion and many that were with him to believe this was the Son of God that hung on the cross.

for_his_glory what do you make of this?

Enoch - Genesis 5:24
"And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him."
  — Genesis 5:24 (cf. Hebrews 11:5)

Hebrew: וַיִּתְהַלֵּךְ חֲנוֹךְ אֶת־הָאֱלֹהִים וְאֵינֶנּוּ כִּי לָקַח אֹתוֹ אֱלֹהִים
  — “...for God took him” (lāqaḥ, to take, seize, receive)

The term "took" is interpreted in both Jewish and Christian tradition as implying translation into God's presence without death.

New Testament confirmation:
  “By faith Enoch was taken up so that he would not see death; and he was not found because God took him up...” -- Hebrews 11:5
  – Greek: μετετέθη (metetethē) = transferred, translated

2. Elijah – 2 Kings 2:11
“And it came about, as they were going along and talking, that behold, a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared, and they separated the two of them. Then Elijah went up by a whirlwind to heaven.”
  2 Kings 2:11

Hebrew: וְאֵלִיָּהוּ עָלָה בְּסַעֲרָה הַשָּׁמָיִם
  - “And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven”

Elijah is visibly taken in a supernatural manner, confirming ascent into the visible heavens, and traditionally interpreted as translation without death.

Jewish tradition: Elijah’s return is anticipated (cf. Malachi 4:5), and he is seen as eternally alive (see Sirach 48:9).


Summary--
Person Taken Alive? Reference Notes
Enoch Yes Genesis 5:24; Hebrews 11:5 Walked with God, then “was not”; translated so he would not see death
Elijah Yes 2 Kings 2:11 Taken up bodily by a whirlwind into heaven
Moses No Deuteronomy 34:5–6; Jude 1:9; Luke 9:30 Died and was buried, but later seen in glory; not taken alive

Johann.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi FHG,

When the Father sends Jesus to gather His Body it will be when He has brought us to the -

`unity of the Faith, and the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ.` (Eph. 4: 13)

`...exhorting (encouraging and warning) one another and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.` (Heb. 10: 25)

So glad you are also looking for the Lord`s coming.

There are many different interpretations, but our common bond is that we are Spiritually born again from above and indwelled with the Holy Spirit as we have become Christ's own.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi FHG,

When Jesus was manifest as a man on earth he did not know the day when He would come again to deliver Israel and bring vengeance upon the rebellious nations. However, now that the Lord is seated at the right hand of the Father in glory, He does know for He is not limited by an earthly body.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Jesus does not come back for just Israel, but all that are His own.

Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

This happens at the end of the seventy weeks.

Dan9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

 

[Elijah7777]

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

This takes place at the end of the Kingdom age in 1,000 years.

 

[Elijah7777]

They were brought back to life and entered into the city, not heaven

Then what happened to them after they entered into the city?

 

[for_his_glory]

Then what happened to them after they entered into the city?

Scripture is silent on that, but I would think they would have testified of Jesus bringing them back to life.

 

[for_his_glory]

This takes place at the end of the Kingdom age in 1,000 years.

This is my understanding.

Revelation 20:1-8 is the only passage in the entire scriptures that the premillennialists have as the basis for the 1000 year reign. Rev 20:4 doesn't speak about a 1000 year reign of Christ it says by the vision John received "and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years." It's not Christ that reigns 1000 years, but those who were killed for God's sake that reign with Christ a 1000 years as 1000 being a figurative number, not a literal number as in Deuteronomy 7:9; 1Chronicles 16:15; Psalms 50:10; 90:4; 105:8 Ecc 6:6; 7:28; Daniel 5:1; 2 Peter 3:8.

 

[Elijah7777]

it says by the vision John received "and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years."

I say the same thing now. We live and reign with Jesus for 1,000 years. As a general rule they say we are raptured out before the tribulation, we go to the marriage feast and then we return with Jesus to the earth at the end of the seven years. Only I tend to thing we will be in Heaven with Jesus and return to the Earth at the end of the 1,000 years. For me Kingdom means Government. The idea that "the government will rest on His shoulders" comes from Isaiah 9:6, a prophecy about the coming Messiah:

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."

This verse is often interpreted to mean that Christ will rule with divine authority, establishing a kingdom that surpasses earthly governments

 

[for_his_glory]

I say the same thing now. We live and reign with Jesus for 1,000 years. As a general rule they say we are raptured out before the tribulation, we go to the marriage feast and then we return with Jesus to the earth at the end of the seven years. Only I tend to thing we will be in Heaven with Jesus and return to the Earth at the end of the 1,000 years. For me Kingdom means Government. The idea that "the government will rest on His shoulders" comes from Isaiah 9:6, a prophecy about the coming Messiah:

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."

This verse is often interpreted to mean that Christ will rule with divine authority, establishing a kingdom that surpasses earthly governments

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This happens after all have taken the mark of the beast during the 3 1/2 year reign of the son of perdition/last antichrist/ false prophet, Rev 13; 2Thessalonians 2:1-12, when Christ returns after that of the seven vial/bowel judgements, Rev 16-19. We know that the kingdom of God is within those who are Christ own, Luke 17:20-21, as after the final judgements of God when the sheep will be separated from the goats, Matthew 25:31-46, we will be with God and His Son Christ Jesus in the New Jerusalem that will be ushered down from Heaven after the elements of this world will be burned and all things made new again, 2Peter 3:10; Rev 19-20;

 

[Elijah7777]

when Christ returns after that

When do you think that will be? The angels talk about this in Acts. We know his feet will touch the ground and then we are told there will be a big earthquake. The New Jerusalem will come down from Heaven. 1500 by 1500 by 1500 miles. This gives them mineral right and airspace. All of the Arab continental plate. There is a huge amount of science behind what we read in the Bible.

Zechariah 14:4:

"On that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half the mountain moving to the north and half to the south."
In Acts 1:11, after Jesus ascended into heaven, two angels appeared to His disciples and said:

"Men of Galilee," they said, "why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen Him go into heaven."

You talk about 5 different things in one paragraph but this is the main point. The return of Jesus. Not just where we are caught up in the air to be with Him

 

[Marilyn C]

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Jesus does not come back for just Israel, but all that are His own.

Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

This happens at the end of the seventy weeks.

Dan9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

So FHG, are you saying that the glorified Jesus at the Father`s right hand is not in the Godhead, knowing all things?

Also, Abraham`s Seed is Christ. That is who we are of, not Abraham.

 

[Elijah7777]

Also, Abraham`s Seed is Christ. That is who we are of, not Abraham.

Gentiles are grafted in. We are not natural branches. Romans 11:17–24 I have beening working on my family genealogy. Even my grandmother wrote a book going back at least 3 generations to my great, great, great-grandfather. I have found two people that I share a common ancestor with. One of them grew up in the same house that our common ancestor was born in.

I can imagine how difficult it was to trace the genealogy from Mary back 4,000 years to Adam and Eve. Even there are a lot of interesting stories like Hagar the "slave" and Rehab the "prostitute". Where we get the scarlet thread term we use for the Blood line of Jesus through the generations.

Paul said there were a lot of arguments and he tended to stay away from it. Titus 3:9 I have studied the DNA on this and it is complicated. But still very exact and precise. Studies suggest that many Kohanim share haplogroup J1 (J-P58) or haplogroup J2a (J-M410), indicating a common ancestral lineage. Found at high frequencies among Arab populations, Jewish groups (especially Kohanim), and some Caucasus ethnicities.

 

[Marilyn C]

Gentiles are grafted in. We are not natural branches. Romans 11:17–24 I have beening working on my family genealogy. Even my grandmother wrote a book going back at least 3 generations to my great, great, great-grandfather. I have found two people that I share a common ancestor with. One of them grew up in the same house that our common ancestor was born in.

I can imagine how difficult it was to trace the genealogy from Mary back 4,000 years to Adam and Eve. Even there are a lot of interesting stories like Hagar the "slave" and Rehab the "prostitute". Where we get the scarlet thread term we use for the Blood line of Jesus through the generations.

Paul said there were a lot of arguments and he tended to stay away from it. Titus 3:9 I have studied the DNA on this and it is complicated. But still very exact and precise. Studies suggest that many Kohanim share haplogroup J1 (J-P58) or haplogroup J2a (J-M410), indicating a common ancestral lineage. Found at high frequencies among Arab populations, Jewish groups (especially Kohanim), and some Caucasus ethnicities.

Hi Elijah,

Now that would be very interesting about your family genealogy.
However, we need to look at more closely at Rom. 11 especially verses 16 & 17.

`For if the first-fruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them become partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree.` (Rom. 11: 16 & 17)

Only Jesus is holy and supports and nourishes us NOT Israel. We are grafted into Christ, NOT Abraham or Israel.