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Cturtle, thank you for your thoughts. I have a lot to say about this but I want to think about it more so I will provide a longer answer later and a short answer now. One thing I never understood about Jesus' sacrifice is how it could be considered a sacrifice. Did God really "give" his Son...

Thank you Bluegirl, that was a very thoughtful response and I appreciate you taking my concerns seriously. I think you are saying I should put my faith in Jesus and not get caught up in the details. I understand this to a certain degree and it makes sense. The thing is, I've prayed to Jesus...

Of course Cturtle, I think we are all here to share and learn so all subjects are open to discuss. I am enjoying all the conversations as well.

If it's the devils fault how can you blame man? We have our imperfect human nature to contend with and on top of that the devil is working against us? How can man be faulted given all the outside influence he must overcome?

Yes, I can tell he's passionate. I just wonder how many non-believers have been turned off to the faith by his brash arrogance.

Jesse, you keep proving my point.

I'm sorry Jesse, I guess your the only one that is teaching the right gospel. By the way, I guess I was right, I looked your age and your a young buck. You will mellow out in the years to come but try not to scare away too many non-believers in the mean time. I may not be a Christian, but I...

You must be really young or a new Christian because your tone smacks of immaturity.

Well, you see, that's the problem. Contradictory passages. Calvinists will find a way to explain away John 3:16 just like others will interpret Ephesians 1:4-5 in light of their previously held beliefs. That's why there are 33,000 Christian denominations.

Agreed

Jesse, in the passage I just posted Jesus doesn't say anything about "if you love me". He simply says follow the commandments and follows it up by saying if you want to be perfect, sell everything and follow him. Your certitude of the accuracy of your interpretation of the Bible is only...

I guess it depends upon how you interpret the passage. Some of your Calvinist friends on this forum may disagree with you though.

Well, Jesse seems to think it is. But Calvinism goes a little further than what you've described. Basically, they believe that we have no ability to choose to be saved because we are totally depraved. Since you are totally depraved from birth you're natural inclination is to hate what is good...

Jesse, how can you read Matthew 25:31- and Matthew 19 below and say that Jesus didn't teach works is required for salvation? Matthew 19: 16Just then a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?” 17“Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus...

What false doctrine are you referring to? Calvinism?

How I your statement about faith without works being dead incompatible with what I said about works being required? If no works render your faith dead, doesn't that mean works are required? Do you accuse everyone that disagrees with your biblical interpretation of twisting the text?

Ha ha, OK, I'll take that as a challenge. Well, as you have seen from some of the other debate topics on the forum, there are some passages that support the concept of the election. But as you've pointed out, there are passages that support the idea of grace. Here is a passage a Calvinist...

I guess at this point we aren't getting anywhere but I don't want to leave your last statements unanswered. The way I interpreted the text was to say that Jesus did teach that "works" are required for salvation. This is what you call "twisting"? There are more "works" passages from Jesus in...

So sorry to hear that Cturtle. I think that there are very few situations that are impossible to reconcile between family, I've seen amazing things happen in my own family when it seemed hopeless. I hope you never give up hope Cturtle.

Where is the animosity coming from exactly Jesse? Did I say something offensive or disrespectful to you? I surely don't think your blinded even though I don't share your views, but you seem to think I am. I think we simply have different opinions and I enjoy discussing those differences as...