Bible Study 👀

[Rookie]

What is it about Matthew 23:37 and Luke 19:41-44 that you did not catch? Voddie didn't even bring them up! You know why? Because it nibbles away at his misguided theological rant about a supposedly sissified Jesus, even though those passages about a longing Jesus are right in the context of the strong Jesus who will judge the nations.

Just because someone doesn't someone doesn't mention something you want them to mention at the time you want them to mention it doesn't mean they don't recognize it. The Spirit leads people to different verses at different times, you are free to find a sermon and preacher that suits what you want. :D

 

[Rookie]

Typical Christian thinking: Just because I see the so-called 'sissified' Jesus Voddie rails against in scripture I must not acknowledge that Jesus is also the judge of the world, right? Typical black and white thinking of Christians. Just because I see Jesus the Lamb in scripture doesn't mean I don't also see Jesus the Lion.

You need to understand why Voddie is railing as he is in the video. He's serving a very selfish reformed agenda.

Not typical Christian thinking quite rare actually. And it is black and white, why? Because Jesus said so in Revelation 3 about being hot and cold.

And all these names like Reformed and calvinist, all i care about is it being biblical. Not all the extra. And it's your personal opinion once again not backed by Scripture that asserts it being a selfish agenda,

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Yes he is

Which Voddie called 'sissified'.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Actually no, or else the prosperity gospel and the feel-good and erroneous Jesus that is preached he's referring to wouldn't exist.

Voddie did not mention the prosperity gospel any where in the clip.

Christians who believe and continue to believe will never suffer the wrath of God - 1 Thessalonians 1:10.

As painful as it may be, believers are chastised as children of God, not subject to his wrath as enemies of God - Hebrews 12:5-7, Hebrews 10:26-27.

Voddie's sermon is a milk knowledge, juvenile sermon about the judgment of God for baby Christians learning about the faith (who aren't even subject to the wrath of God, as long as they keep believing) and unbelievers: Hebrews 5:13-14 - Hebrews 6:1-2

What's interesting is, no where in his sermon did he talk about the compassionate redeemer who ransoms sinners from the task master of sin that they have sold themselves to. No where. That's too sissified for him, apparently. And, of course, as a reformed preacher, it's not even on his radar. It's a juvenile hellfire and brimstone sermon for unbelievers because Christians won't be on the receiving end of the wrath of God. They are chastised in this age for the very reason they are children of God, not the enemies of God.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Do you realize the actual false teachers that exist and your complaining that Voddie is too direct?

Hmmm....don't recall saying Voddie was too direct, lol.
Misguided is what I'd say he is.

He didn't use his personal opinion he used Scripture that you don't like so much.

You would think as a trained teacher and preacher, Luke 13:34 and Luke 19:41 would be ringing in his ears as he rants about a sissified Jesus who weeps over and longs for people here at 2:31:

He must have forgotten about that Jesus in scripture, or never knew he was there. I think he's the one who's using his personal opinion and doesn't know scripture as well as he should, or doesn't like that part of scripture, whichever is true.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I do know Jesus

I suspect you only know him as a harsh judge, not a compassionate redeemer. Most new believers start out this way.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I do know Jesus, I just didn't feel led to post the side of the gospel you like at the time you wanted it. And you clearly ignored how Voddie speaks about his grace.

And that was where in the clip?
This is a hell and damnation sermon, not a sermon about God's grace.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Just because someone doesn't someone doesn't mention something you want them to mention at the time you want them to mention it doesn't mean they don't recognize it.

What you're not getting is he is a reformed preacher. Which means you're probably not going to get much more than fire and brimstone and the wrath of God out of him. I can tell just from this one clip you're not going to learn from him about a Jesus who knows and cares that sinners are captive to sin and that Jesus longs to redeem them and have an intimate 'knowing' relationship with them. I know that because he calls that 'sissified'. I mean, if he wants to be a fire and brimstone evangelist, fine. But that's a message for unbelievers, not Christians who have passed from death to life and will not come into judgement - John 5:24.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

you are free to find a sermon and preacher that suits what you want. :biggrin

Yes, I'm waaaay past the fire and brimstone stuff. That's milk knowledge (Hebrews 6:1-2). I need sermons on how to be more and more like Jesus according to the righteous fruit of the Spirit (Hebrews 5:14). I eat meat now. I have for years.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Not typical Christian thinking quite rare actually. And it is black and white, why? Because Jesus said so in Revelation 3 about being hot and cold.

So Revelation 3:15 means you can automatically think in black and white that I must only know about Jesus as compassionate redeemer and not judge of all mankind, and not both? That's not an accurate or fair use of scripture.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

And all these names like Reformed and calvinist, all i care about is it being biblical. Not all the extra.

I hate labels too. But they are useful in identifying how a person is likely to be bent, doctrinally speaking. What you have to understand is, generally speaking, reformists are all about the hellfire and brimstone Penal Substitution model of salvation, while non-reformists are all about the Ransom model of salvation. That's why Voddie is ranting about sin, hellfire, and the judgement of God, and didn't say anything about the compassionate Jesus who longs for his creation, with tears even, other than to say that was 'sissified'.

And it's your personal opinion once again not backed by Scripture that asserts it being a selfish agenda,

I showed you the passages in Matthew and Luke a few times now about Voddie's sissified, longing Jesus and you still insist I'm not backing what I say with scripture?

 

[Rookie]

Voddie did not mention the prosperity gospel any where in the clip.

Christians who believe and continue to believe will never suffer the wrath of God - 1 Thessalonians 1:10.

As painful as it may be, believers are chastised as children of God, not subject to his wrath as enemies of God - Hebrews 12:5-7, Hebrews 10:26-27.

Voddie's sermon is a milk knowledge, juvenile sermon about the judgment of God for baby Christians learning about the faith (who aren't even subject to the wrath of God, as long as they keep believing) and unbelievers: Hebrews 5:13-14 - Hebrews 6:1-2

What's interesting is, no where in his sermon did he talk about the compassionate redeemer who ransoms sinners from the task master of sin that they have sold themselves to. No where. That's too sissified for him, apparently. And, of course, as a reformed preacher, it's not even on his radar. It's a juvenile hellfire and brimstone sermon for unbelievers because Christians won't be on the receiving end of the wrath of God. They are chastised in this age for the very reason they are children of God, not the enemies of God.

You are persistent I'll give you that. The numbers represent each paragraph I address.

1. It's a 5 minute clip of an 1hr and 40 min sermon, and he did indirectly mention it when he said "it is preached all over the United States". And he was hoping you would do your due dilegence and your own discernment to automatically know those type of messages, so he wouldn't have to ruffle any feathers by calling names as no one likes that right? Many other sermons of Voddie do call it out by name.

2. That contradicts nothing Voddie said, he was speaking of the event on the cross that actually backs up what he said because God poured his wrath on His son so that we could be spared.

3. True, however like Hebrews 10 does say, if we deliberately keep on sinning, there remains no more sacrifice for sins, and a couple verses down it talks about how God will not let unpunished those who abuse the Spirit of Grace (open unbelievers don't quite even appeal or have accepted that grace). He's talking to psuedo-Christians.

4. And Santa Claus is meat I suppose. Again using your personal opinions and sprinkling a little Jesus on them to make them look Scriptoral. You remind me of Craig Groeschel, seems to only recognize grace and love and even to the expense of being holy and righteous, but even he at least to some extent recognizes that sin provokes God's wrath, and we need his grace to save us.

5. Once again, 5 minute clip out of a 1hr 40min sermon. And once again, he didn't mention your ideology when you wanted him to mention at the extent you deemed acceptable. Not every sermon is supposed to be what you want it to be, if you don't like his preaching, then just find another pastor simple as that. Apparently you have zero regard for God's holiness and want to use grace as a banner, beware because sooner or later satan can cause you to abuse grace.

 

[Rookie]

Hmmm....don't recall saying Voddie was too direct, lol.
Misguided is what I'd say he is.


You would think as a trained teacher and preacher, Luke 13:34 and Luke 19:41 would be ringing in his ears as he rants about a sissified Jesus who weeps over and longs for people here at 2:31:

He must have forgotten about that Jesus in scripture, or never knew he was there. I think he's the one who's using his personal opinion and doesn't know scripture as well as he should, or doesn't like that part of scripture, whichever is true.

1. I did, and misguided according to Jethro Bodines theology I would presume yes. Just face it, there are some who care about holiness, who care for righteousness, and who refuse to use grace as a banner to excuse themselves. And who refuse to make up a Jesus that's like a teddy bear that you can snuggle and cuddle up to and who doesn't challenge you at all to overcome.

2. Again, how many sermons does Voddie have? Many. How long was this clip, 5 min. How long was his entire sermon? 1hr 40. I can say the same with preachers like Joel Osteen, TD Jakes, Steven Furtick, Joyce Meyer, Kenneth Copeland who don't have Matthew 3:5, Hebrews 10:26-30, Revelation 3:5, Matthew 6:24 in their minds when they preach. But of course, like always, the ones who are pursuing holiness in Christ and have a disdain for sin will always be mocked by those who have their hearts set otherwise.

3. Key word, "I think....". That automatically destroys your validity. You have rejected the Holy One (Isaiah 43:15), the Righteous Judge (2 Timothy 4:8), and disgarded what doesn't fit your agenda. And the reason you can't stop commenting on Voddie is because it seems irks you. Your non-stop straw mans against Voddie are apparent and you continously ignore what isn't pleasing in your eyes. As Ray Comfort says, "You've created a god in which you can snuggle up and cuddle with who doesn't call you out on your sin or on your need to repent" (because believers sin too). Now if believers don't sin, your theology and logic would be perfectly applicable, but since there are perhaps millions claiming Christ but who's hearts are far from him (even Revelation chapters 1-3 support this because the seven churches represent the whole church and 5 were reproached only 2 were praised showing less than 30% of Christianity).

You know what's juvenile? The feel-good, ear-tickling gospel you seem to believe.

 

[Rookie]

I suspect you only know him as a harsh judge, not a compassionate redeemer. Most new believers start out this way.

Well you've got the wrong man then good sir. If you stop straw manning me and take my comments for what they are (because if you did you couldn't make the arguments your making) then you would see both sides of God I accept, the whole God and complete God. I posted a 5 minute clip about the side you didn't like and your on a judging spree, out of all the other 200+ comments and posts and threads I did.

 

[Rookie]

And that was where in the clip?
This is a hell and damnation sermon, not a sermon about God's grace.

Hell and damnation because he said we deserved Gods wrath but it was poured out on Jesus instead, and Jesus isn't a teddy bear genie you can't cuddle up to.

If someone doesn't preached what you want them to I guess they are condemned in your eyes. I guess holiness and the seriousness of sin is repulsive to your theology and thus Voddie is condemned, although funny thing is what your condeming God never condemned.

I guess it's a sin in your worldview and atrocious if you talk about anything but grace grace grace (and therefore abuse). You ignore the concept of mercy, which was this 5 minutes was talking about. The whole concept of mercy is that we rebelled against God for no reason, and like a court of law, is justified in pressing charges, but because of mercy he doesn't, (and his motivation isn't because of him being a puppy-dog, but because he is love, and love keeps no records of wrongs)

 

[Rookie]

What you're not getting is he is a reformed preacher. Which means you're probably not going to get much more than fire and brimstone and the wrath of God out of him. I can tell just from this one clip you're not going to learn from him about a Jesus who knows and cares that sinners are captive to sin and that Jesus longs to redeem them and have an intimate 'knowing' relationship with them. I know that because he calls that 'sissified'. I mean, if he wants to be a fire and brimstone evangelist, fine. But that's a message for unbelievers, not Christians who have passed from death to life and will not come into judgement - John 5:24.

I know he's a reformed preacher, what your not getting is that not ever pastor revolves around your biblical preferences. It's like that 11th commandment "Thou shalt not preach anything but grace". How dare someone condemn something God doesn't condemn. "I can just tell" you just told wrong.

If you listen to him open-mindedly and not close-mindedly, you can see that he doesn't directly defined what sissified means. But what you won't accept is like he said, the culture thinks Jesus neeeeeeeds us, when by definition he is self-sufficient. The culture thinks Jesus entire world revolves around us when although he is attentative we don't have the Almighty El Shaddai at the tips of our fingers, that is the sissified one since they can't have the real one. And if you look at the context and the tone of what he was saying, he wasn't condemning having a relationship with Jesus, or that he wants us to be his children, he was condemning the use of God's desire for us as a pride pedestal to pump up our chests and make Jesus look as if we got him on the tips of our fingers.

God has wrath for all sin committed, difference is his children won't have to worry about hell if they repent and seek forgiveness, while the unsaved won't. And you've said it's for unbelievers, ok? Can I not post what I wish? You can write it off as only for unbelievers for your own discretion but last time I check 2 Timothy 3:16-17 says otherwise.

So if I can sugar-ify it, Christ loves us but not because he's a puppy dog who doesn't have a life outside of us, but because he's a compassionate Judge, the Righteous One who always forgives our sins, the Holy One who cleanses us of unrighteousness. Not because he needs you, but because he wants you. He could've slain you and been perfectly justifiable in doing so, as David said in Psalm 51, but by his grace, we live to see another day. I found a video that shows it

Just watch from 12:31-12:46 the rest of the video is irrelevant.


He mentioned grace, is he uncodemned now?

 

[Rookie]

So Revelation 3:15 means you can automatically think in black and white that I must only know about Jesus as compassionate redeemer and not judge of all mankind, and not both? That's not an accurate or fair use of scripture.

Your the one who's making the assertion of your own preferences. I know your basing your understanding off of the story of Ruth, which is biblical. All I am saying is that that's not all God is. So you backtracking your own statements because remember, you came on here condemning Voddie as misguided because he doesn't preach what you want him to preach when you want him to preach it at the frequency you want him to. God's calling on preachers lives are different, one may be called to speak of mainly encouragement and grace (doesn't mean he can diminish the whole gospel just anything from his main calling won't be mentioned as much). We have a serious shortage of people who are willing to speak the painful truth without apology, mainly because of fellow Christians condemning them for not being "nice" enough or for it not tickling their ears.

Yes, I'm waaaay past the fire and brimstone stuff. That's milk knowledge (Hebrews 6:1-2). I need sermons on how to be more and more like Jesus according to the righteous fruit of the Spirit (Hebrews 5:14). I eat meat now. I have for years.

That's nice, good for you. Assuming that's true, and I'm not questioning you however 2 things about your statement.

1. You are putting Hebrews 6:1-2 out of context because it says about people who are not acquainted with the teachings of righteousness (ring a bell?). Nothing to do with what you said so you just inserted what you wanted to insert.

2. You've said you eat meat, but carnality and meat of the Spirit cannot mix brother. What do I mean? Because one of the fruits of the flesh is discord (Galatians 5:20). And a synonym to that is quarreling which is not becoming of Christians (1 Corinthians 3:1-3). So meat by biblical definition is the deep things of God, the infinite and unknown depths of the Spirit. Mysteries of things unknown. The book of Revelation and its symbolic meanings, the discernment of the Spirit to see behind someones actions, visions, etc that's meat. How to act like Jesus is basic Christianity 101.

3. And a bonus, I would reconsider your statement because in a relationship, particularly marriage, when you marry someone you don't marry them because they are everything you like, you marry them because despite what you do and don't like, your love for them empowers you through that marriage even though at times it won't always be comfortable. You have fallen in love with the "romantic" (as you call it) side of Jesus and have rejected the Holy and Zero-Tolerance-For-Sin, side of Jesus. When you accept Christ into your life, you accept everything. When you live according to Scripture, you live by all of it, when you pursue God you pursue all of Him, and when the Holy Spirit guides, you, He wants and calls you to listen to everything he said. Not just the parts you like. So since you've rejected a part of Gods character, you've rejected all of Him just like if you violate one part of Scripture, you are guilty of violating all of it (James 2:10). In other words, you still are at base 0 with accepting Christ for who he is, not who you want Him to be.

Of course you can and I'm pretty sure you will refute this, but consider before you straw man me and actually take it for what I'm saying instead of what you want me to say in a close-minded conscience. Take what Voddie is saying for what he is saying not what you're straw manning him to say.

And I guess a bonus bonus, if you're waaaaaay past milk, why does this milk affect and offend you so deeply? What don't apply let it fly good sir.

 

[Rookie]

I hate labels too. But they are useful in identifying how a person is likely to be bent, doctrinally speaking. What you have to understand is, generally speaking, reformists are all about the hellfire and brimstone Penal Substitution model of salvation, while non-reformists are all about the Ransom model of salvation. That's why Voddie is ranting about sin, hellfire, and the judgement of God, and didn't say anything about the compassionate Jesus who longs for his creation, with tears even, other than to say that was 'sissified'.


I showed you the passages in Matthew and Luke a few times now about Voddie's sissified, longing Jesus and you still insist I'm not backing what I say with scripture?

1. What you have to understand is, every section of the 3 thousand or so denominations and growing Christianity has rebelled against what was prior to do their own thing. From the apostles to now the church has been rebelling and creating it's own thing. Whether your baptist, protestant, Calvinist, church of God in Christ, Pentecostal, Reformed, whatever, you have a duty to preach the whole truth. Now some may be called to one specific topic a little more than the other. One may be called to preach mainly the Gospel, another may be called to teach how to live like Christ, another may preach about sin so others may be aware of it, another may teach about the deep things of God, but none can neglect the heart of the Gospel, which Voddie brought up.

The heart of the Gospel is that God made everything perfect, then in our rebellion we sinned, and committed adultery with out spiritual husband and harlotted with sin, the world, and the devil. This provoked God in two ways, since he is a Jealous God, His wrath against sin and the universal demand for the atonement of sin demanded our punishment, but also he is a loving God who took the Wrath that we deserved, our blasphemous rebellion, our idolatrous witchcraft, our repulsive abominations, He took the Wrath that was coming for us. He paid the debt we couldn't pay, and since on the cross, which he was held up high, the Wrath of God was then satisfied, since the wrath of God was satisfied and the power sin was done away with, we can now experience the full blown love of God, because of what Jesus Christ had done. We deserved death, everlasting torment, we deserved Gehenna, we deserved to perish, but for His grace.......we live and move and have our being.

Now many will see the love of God and take that for granted or think/try to abuse it. And if we can't understand what we've been saved from, or how dangerous our previous state was, we can never truly appreciate the love of God. If we don't know the (as it's called) sinfulness of sin, we can't know the true magnitude of God's love.

That's what Voddie's mission is. I don't know about all "reformed" people, but for Voddie that's his mission and that should be our mission. We don't have to fear the wrath if we are saved, but we need to know what wrath He could've poured on us so we can encapsulate the vast magnitude of God's grace. If we think God just made humans and then just decided to die for them for not much reason and is willing to give us our hearts desires, humans will never appreciate that, they will see God as a thing to control, not a Creator to reverence. But if we see that we were in a state were the earth itself cried out for our judgement, where our advisary demanded our death, where our sin plummetted us into a deep trench that no human strength could overcome, and if we see that our sin was so vile to God and to creation that just one of it can condemn someone to eternal torment for eternity and a blazing all-consuming Wrath that will scourge us forever, and all our lusts that will torture the soul because they never go fulfilled, if we see that THAT is what Christ endured on the cross, and took away from us to give us eternal life, joy, peace, a eternity without pain, sorrow, sin or death. What an enormous amount of gratefulness and brokenness can explain a penitent child of God.

A broken and contrite heart....

Psalm 51:16-17
16 You do not delight in sacrifice, or I would bring it; you do not take pleasure in burnt offerings. 17 My sacrifice, O God, is a broken spirit; a broken and contrite heart you, God, will not despise.

 

[Rookie]

God tells us a lot of things in the Bible . Did God say that he was omniscient in his own words ? It is a serious question , not an assertion that he is not omniscient .

Before God told Moses what He was going to do to the calf worshipers God knew Moses would plead for the wayward Israelites . Maybe it was a test from God for Moses . What do you think ? This makes way more sense than God putting on an act with Moses .

Yes ! Moses is a Christ figure .

- Did you not get my entire breakdown of the original language for Psalm 147:5 "Our Lord is great, vast in power; his understanding is infinite." And understand in the original language meaning knowledge.
- Of course it was a test, that's what I meant, doesn't mean your original point as Moses changed God's mind as God cannot change (Hebrews 13:8, Malachi 3:6, Numbers 23:19, Isaiah 40:8).

 

[Rookie]

I salute you Soldiers, you definitely went above and beyond sir, and did a fine job. One thing that puzzles me however, not once did you reveal His name, may I ask why? That would have been one of the first things I mentioned. You came very close to it, one of the verses you posted was an answer to Moses question to Him about what is His name, and you posted a partial reply. What did God tell Moses His name was, and would be His name forever?

Sorry I never saw this post. God has many names, but the one He told Moses, and the one I did mention was I AM THAT I AM (or I WILL BE WHAT I WILL BE)