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A call for good samaritans

TanNinety

Member
One day an expert in religious doctrine stood up to test a brother by asking him this question: "Brother, what must I do to receive eternal life?" The brother replied, "What does the law of Christ say? How do you read it?" The man answered, "`You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind.' And, `Love your neighbor as yourself.' ". "Right!" the brother told him. "Do this and you will live!" The man wanted to justify his actions, so he asked the brother, "And who is my neighbor?"
He replied with an illustration: "A buddhist man was traveling on a trip from Jerusalem to Jericho, and he was attacked by bandits. They stripped him of his clothes and money, beat him up, and left him half dead beside the road. "By chance a christian came along; but when he saw the man lying there, he crossed to the other side of the road and passed him by. A hindu walked over and looked at him lying there, but he also passed by on the other side. "Then a despised muslim came along, and when he saw the man, he felt deep pity. Kneeling beside him, the muslim soothed his wounds with medicine and bandaged them. Then he put the man on his own donkey and took him to an inn, where he took care of him. The next day he handed the innkeeper two pieces of silver and told him to take care of the man. `If his bill runs higher than that,' he said, `I'll pay the difference the next time I am here.' "Now which of these three would you say was a neighbor to the man who was attacked by bandits?" the brother asked. The expert in religious doctrine replied, "The one who showed him mercy." Then the brother said, "Yes, now go and do the same."
*******

I have seen some christians look and talk down to a fellow muslim based on the premise “you serve a different Godâ€Â. It is the same kind of contempt that the temple priest and a jew showed in the parable of good Samaritan according to Yashuah. It would come as a shock and a surprise that a Samaritan who “serves ‘another’ YHWH†would be considered a neighbor than a person who follows the true religion. This parable in my opinion is so ridiculously downplayed. By changing the names and cultural backgrounds of the persons in the parable you can see the truth of the parable more clearly. That a muslim who preaches another Jesus is more of a neighbor than a christian who shows contempt to his fellow humans.

The parable probably received the same reaction from the hearers of that day by a gasp of “what??? A Samaritan???†as it would if we replaced the Samaritan with something this culture can relate to, “what??? A mormon???â€Â, “what??? A word of faith believer???â€Â.

Christians need to realize they have the gift of having Christ in their lives and stop embarrassing Him. You don’t believe in the same doctrine as I do, so you are not born again, not saved, you are going to hell is less fundy and more mental.

If there is a burning building and people are stuck in it. How long will anyone want to get them out of there and save them? I bet it would be until the burning is complete and there were some whom we were able to save but some who died. But does this attempt to save them depend on the duration of the fire? Would we fight the fire for a day, two, or a week or a month and if the fire still blazes do we give up on the people?

How come we who call ourselves christians give up on people after trying a day or two and then leave people on the path to hell which according to some will last for eternity? Shouldn’t we preach repentance and obedience for a life time with humility and as a servant with less self righteousness when the results are based on eternity? Shouldn’t we be kind and passionate until the moment a person’s fate is finalized at their death? Others might never see the truth, but why should that be a license for christian arrogance and condemnation?

1 Peter 3:13 Now, who will want to harm you if you are eager to do good? 14 But even if you suffer for doing what is right, God will reward you for it. So don't be afraid and don't worry. 15 Instead, you must worship Christ as Lord of your life. And if you are asked about your Christian hope, always be ready to explain it. 16 But you must do this in a gentle and respectful way. Keep your conscience clear. Then if people speak evil against you, they will be ashamed when they see what a good life you live because you belong to Christ. 17 Remember, it is better to suffer for doing good, if that is what God wants, than to suffer for doing wrong!

Where does it say it’s ok to disrespect others because of their beliefs? Doesn’t it say they will be ashamed when they see what a good life we have in Christ? Then why do we need to make sure that we shame them with our words and haughtiness and self righteousness? If only we could follow the second commandment of love, then we christians would be more Christ like.

PS: No buddhists were harmed in the making of the parable.
 
Hey Tan, you forgot this one: 8-)

Luke 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
Luke 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
Luke 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
Luke 18:12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
Luke 18:13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
Luke 18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
 
I totally agree, and I get upset with people, of ANY religion, that refuse to help someone in need solely because they are not by the same belief set, or they refuse to convert.If someone is in need of help, and you can help, you should do it regardless of your religous beliefs.

I as an Atheist, have helped many a Christian, and I have been helped by several Christians when i really needed someone.
 
peace4all, I didn't realize you were an atheist. Is this from being fed up with how those of different beliefs interact with eachother?
 
For clarification...
It's one thing to help anyone regardless of belief in the real world and quite another when posting on forums.
Believe it or not but there are some of any belief who come here to put down the christian faith. <gasp>
If someone is in danger "out there" or in need of help then I can see Tan's post as being on the mark. But sitting behind one's keyboard expressing views and opinions (no matter who it is) is hardly what I call a life threating issue. Except of course if one is referring to the eternal life. ;-)

I can honestly say I've never turned my back on someone I've come across in dire need. That goes before I was saved also. But I will ardently refute someone's following/support for belief in another god, another jesus or another gospel on these forums.

Just making the distinction.
 
Veritas said:
peace4all, I didn't realize you were an atheist. Is this from being fed up with how those of different beliefs interact with eachother?

Umm. No. I am mainly an atheist because I cannot follow blind faith. I really am a person that likes to see how things work, and figure things out. If it doesn't make sense, I will work on it till I figure it out. I cannot find any plausible reason to believe in one religion over any other. So I just choose NOT to partake in any religion.

Now. I don't mind when people practice personal religion. i don't mind when people go to church or temple or mosque. However, I do mind when people try to force their religion on me, through laws, regulations, or just telling me I am going to hell because I don't believe, and that I better convert.

I usually see personal religion as a good thing, that helps people with difficult things, and gives people hope. However, when religion is mainstreamed and becomes large and organized, it seems to breed hate. All religions seem to do this (not every christian that is mainstream obviously) however, if everyone kept their faith to themselves, then I think there would be much less confrontation in the world, and much less hate overall.
 
peace4all said:
Umm. No. I am mainly an atheist because I cannot follow blind faith. I really am a person that likes to see how things work, and figure things out. If it doesn't make sense, I will work on it till I figure it out. I cannot find any plausible reason to believe in one religion over any other. So I just choose NOT to partake in any religion.

Now. I don't mind when people practice personal religion. i don't mind when people go to church or temple or mosque. However, I do mind when people try to force their religion on me, through laws, regulations, or just telling me I am going to hell because I don't believe, and that I better convert.

I usually see personal religion as a good thing, that helps people with difficult things, and gives people hope. However, when religion is mainstreamed and becomes large and organized, it seems to breed hate. All religions seem to do this (not every christian that is mainstream obviously) however, if everyone kept their faith to themselves, then I think there would be much less confrontation in the world, and much less hate overall.
Unfortunately, your position on Christianity is based on your human understanding of corporate religious institutions. The fact is that if you were the only person on this planet, Jesus Christ would have died on the cross for your sins. You would either accept this gift through faith, or you would reject this gift. When you pass from this life into judgment, you alone will answer for why you rejected the love of God. No excuse will be adequate. Your excuse of not being willing to seek God because of your distaste of religions will not stand when God asks you why you did not accept his word alone and ask Him for the truth in the quiet of your own home.
 
peace4all wrote:
I am mainly an atheist because I cannot follow blind faith.

Are you sure you don't already? I say this because most people are "reasonable". And, in fact, it takes a blind faith in the concept of Logic, to make any sense in the first place.

What do you think about that? I've talked with Quath about this so I'm guessing you've seen me say this before.
 
Thanks Veritas and destiny. Vic, great scripture.

Potluck said:
But I will ardently refute someone's following/support for belief in another god, another jesus or another gospel on these forums.

And that brings us to the matter that I have been mulling over in my heart.
You say you will refute someone who follows or supports another god. But do you think by Yashuah placing a Samaritan who follows another ‘YHWH’ as an example to inheriting eternal life as refuting or tolerating someone who belongs to another religion?

Frankly if Yashua was on earth today, He could have used a mormon or a jehovas witness or any other choice of religion that we consider a cult and give their good heart as an example to inherit eternal life and command us to “go do the sameâ€Â. Wouldn’t that surprise the mainstream Christianity that would say, “What is he talking about? We believe in all the true doctrines, we should be the example of how to inherit eternal lifeâ€Â.

Let’s cut to the future and give the parable some life. Say it is judgment day and Yashuah has just finished separating the sheep from the goats. On which side do you find the Samaritan? Numbered with the sheep or the goats? If you say he is a goat then how come Yashuah uses him for an example of how we should walk in our life? If he is a sheep then how come his religion didn’t matter when being separated from the goats?

I think the parable has more up its sleeve than meets the eye.

There is something very peculiar about some of this sheep. They ask Yashuah, “when have we done any good deeds unto you? When have we fed, gave drink, a place to rest, or visited when you were hungry, thirsty, homeless or were in prison?†If the sheep knew that Yashuah was the truth and there is no other way to the Father, how can they ask such a question? How can they not know their Shepherd and that everything that they did was offered up unto their good Shepherd?

What was Christ’s answer to the sheep’s question? “Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers and sisters of Mine, {even} the least {of them,} you did it to Me.â€Â

Who are Christ’s brothers and sisters? “For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is My brother, and sister, and mother.â€Â

Now tell me, the Samaritan who follows another YHWH, is He Christ’s brother according to the definition? If he wasn’t why would Christ set him up as an example of who did the will of the Father for the rest of us to follow?

1 John 2:23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.

Yashuah said HE IS the TRUTH. So lets substitute truth in the above scripture:
Whoever denies the truth does not have the Father; the one who confesses the truth has the Father also.

What is the truth of Yashuah? The message He brought to the world, the word of God. Every parable had the truth of the kingdom of God and eternal life in it. The Samaritan even though a follower of another ‘YHWH’ still had the truth in his heart when it came to actions. He followed the truth of Yashuah to love your neighbor as yourself without even knowing Yashuah. Just as he who hath the Son hath the Father, I believe he who hath the truth hath the Son also. This truth is not religious doctrine or fundamental tenets, but the truth of obedience to God which is written in the hearts of the jew and gentile alike.

This sheep that found themselves to belong to the fold of God are the sheep that even though not believing/knowing the true gospel stood without excuse in front of Him being obedient to the law written in their hearts.

And that is the beauty that I see in the parable of the good Samaritan. I do not know if all of this is sound, but I have to consider the evidence that God has brought me to and mull over it.
 
I agree with Veritas' last post peace4all. An atheist at the end of the day has to make a core statement of his belief/disbelief based on personal evidence or blind faith as you have put it. In this manner both theism and atheism are both belief systems based on personal faith on contradicting core statements.

I do not need this thread to be "on-topic" as such so you can answer Veritas' questions and I will chip in with my 2 cents.

Just so we are on the same page, I believe when you say you are an atheist that you are making a core statement of:

1. I believe there is no God.

Is that true?
 
Tan, please pardon me if I am not reading you correctly, but are you saying that Jesus Christ is not the only way?

I have a very good muslim friend, and I would say by the worlds standards he does a lot of good (by my standards he does a lot of good), though I honestly can not speak for his heart, but I fear he does these things mostly because he feels he must earn his way into Allah's good graces. This seems more like superstition and upbringing, rather than having the law written on his heart.

He is very dear to me, and I suffer over his unbelief because I want him to see God, but he does not believe in Yahweh at all, but Allah. I have talked with him on many occasions about grace through faith, but he rejects this. I understand your parable, but I see it as more of an example of God's love being in some of every nation, and that it will be evident by good works, and also that we will be justified by these works according to the law written on our hearts. I think that faith, or belief, is needed, though.

I love my friend, and eat kabobs with him about once a month...I love those things, but he does not believe in Yahweh, or Yeshua. The Lord bless you.
 
The samaritan parable has pretty much the same meaning as the Pharisee and the despised publican.

It wasn't the publicans humility that saved him, only Jesus can save; it was the publicans humility that caused God to favor him and reveal Himself to the man. Thats what saved him!
The religious proud man lost his reward, yet God chose to reveal Himself to another because of his humility.

It's dangerous to venture from what is plainly stated:

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door
into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way,
the same is a theif and a robber."
(John 10:1)

John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
 
yes, pretty much at the end of the day, I see no reason to begin to believe in A god(s). If, It could be proven to me, indesputably, I would obviously believe. However, people have tried, and failed, numerous times. I just can't sit there and accept these things that make no sense. Spots where the bible seems to contradict itself, and the whole "Magic" involved in the bible.

However, I find the odds of the universe being created through "the big bang" and other theories, to be much greater, than the odd that "God" did it.
I spent a few years trying to figure out what faith to choose, and I came to the conclusion that atheism, is more plausible than any other belief system.

It hasn't been until the last..4 years or so, that I have actually began to have a resentment for mainstream religion. I hadn't noticed some of the flaws and problems associated with these kind of things.
 
peace4all wrote:
yes, pretty much at the end of the day, I see no reason to begin to believe in A god(s). If, It could be proven to me, indesputably, I would obviously believe.

Yes, I'm afraid nobody can explicity prove that God exists to you in the way you want it. Jesus could even appear to you and say "Here I am", but you could still say.. "well, that was just my brain doing it, He couldn't possibly be real". Has to be a heart change. ;)

But I can tell you that the concept of God that we believe in is different than the concept of god's throughout other religions. The fact that we believe He is solely the cause for everything, sets Him apart from pretty much all but 2 other religions (Islam and Judaism) right away. The fact that we believe we can do nothing to save ourselves with works and that He loves us so much to become on of us and die for us sets us apart from Islam and Judaism.

peace4all wrote:
However, I find the odds of the universe being created through "the big bang" and other theories, to be much greater, than the odd that "God" did it.

How do you know that God isn't working through everything in nature as you see it and how some of our theories see it, including the big bang?

Here is something to consider. Pure atheism means "No God" it is basically a confirmation of a negative in the absolute. Which is, in fact, illogical. Does that makes sense to you how it is illogical?

Now, it is reasonable to be agnostic, that simply means "you don't know". But then... "you don't know" ;)
 
I agree with destiny’s post.

lovely, I am not saying Jesus is not the only way. But quite the contrary that He is the only way even though I am not able to convey it in a better manner.

Jesus is Truth. What I am saying is if someone for example our Samaritan even though he did not know Jesus by name, he knew Him implicitly by knowing the truth which is evident by him following the law of God that was written in his heart.

Jesus could have said the Samaritan had done good by earthly human standards but since he followed a religion that preached another God that he wasn’t a good example for eternal life. But Jesus quite clearly used the Samaritan as an example in the context of eternal life and not just good deeds.

We have now an advocate with God. There is one standing opposite to the accuser and justifying us. He has already overcome the death penalty and all authority has been subject under Him while He is subject under God. Now when our hypothetical Samaritan dies and finds himself at the gates of the kingdom of God, do you think our Savior will let him in? Will our Savior say you have done good according to earthly standards but you are a Samaritan who followed another YHWH, so I can’t justify you OR will He say if you have done good unto any of My brothers and sisters, it is as if you have done it unto me and he who does the will of my Father he is my brother and him shall my blood justify, so you shall be justified?

The kind merciful man being a neighbor and a brother did not depend on the religion of samaritanism but it depended on his actions and his obedience to the law of God written in his heart.

lovely said:
I understand your parable, but I see it as more of an example of God's love being in some of every nation, and that it will be evident by good works, and also that we will be justified by these works according to the law written on our hearts. I think that faith, or belief, is needed, though.
What I see in the parable is that if you follow the truth in your heart then you are following Jesus even if you don’t know it, because Jesus is Truth and Truth is Jesus. And He, the word was written in all our hearts. So no matter what religion you are brainwashed into because of parenting, circumstances, culture or other multitude of reasons, if you follow the truth in your heart then you are following Jesus who is the only way to the Father.

It boils down to one question. Is the good Samaritan who followed another YHWH be justified by Jesus’ blood and inherit eternal life? This is the question that I have been pondering and searching for answer over the parable.

To make my stance less ambiguous: I am NOT saying there is truth in every religion or that all religions are the same. I am saying God has written the Truth in all our hearts. He who listens to this Truth is following Christ even though they don’t know Him by His name because Christ said He is Truth.
 
Here is something to consider. Pure atheism means "No God" it is basically a confirmation of a negative in the absolute. Which is, in fact, illogical. Does that makes sense to you how it is illogical?
heh?

I am taking it as you saying that, God is an absolute, so, it is illogical to believe otherwise.

To not believe in santa-clause, is not illogical is it?

I am not positive if I completely understand the semantics your proposing.

and actually, basically, for me to believe in a God (any God) I (as well has multiple others, across the world) would have to at the same moment, see a "God" that says the exact same thing to them "hey, (insert name) I am real. so ya, believe in me" and then performs multiple miracles, that cannot just be giant orchestrated hoaxes.

Ya, I know, going out on a limb right?
I figure if Religion is really important, God would not try so hard to deceive people. (and don't give me the garbage about the devil doing it, because God is all powerful and all mighty, and could easily overcome the devil, if the bible is true)
 
peace4all said:
and actually, basically, for me to believe in a God (any God) I (as well has multiple others, across the world) would have to at the same moment, see a "God" that says the exact same thing to them "hey, (insert name) I am real. so ya, believe in me" and then performs multiple miracles, that cannot just be giant orchestrated hoaxes.

Ya, I know, going out on a limb right?
I figure if Religion is really important, God would not try so hard to deceive people. (and don't give me the garbage about the devil doing it, because God is all powerful and all mighty, and could easily overcome the devil, if the bible is true)

I could quote you scripture, but what is the point, right?

In all honesty you hit the nail on the head - it's all about taking that leap. Have I ever had a vision of God? No.
Have I ever had answered prayers? Yep, but you could/would easily write them off to chance / fate / it just happening.

I cannot offer you any true tangible proof. All I can offer you is this one bit of scripture and to say that I pray that your heart be sofened...

"Then Jesus told him, "Because you ahve seen me, you have believed: blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

I fail to see how God deceives people.
 
Veritas pretty much summed up what I was going to say peace4all.

You will fail as much to prove your core statement of belief that "There is no God" and will not be able to provide satisfactory evidence to bolster your position as would any theist would fail to satisfactorily show you evidence of a deity.

As for the scientific theories and facts, science acknowledges the ingredients that it can verify positively to establish these facts, but that doesn't mean there isn't an unseen ingredient(for lack of a better term) that is required and is always present to make a scientific setup or theory work. That unseen ingredient being a deity cannot be ruled out because science is not the right tool to verify the presence of a deity. Hence as an atheist it takes as much faith as it would a theist to believe in their core statements of faith. I have been an atheist most of my life, so I know.

If it was me, as Veritas pointed out, I would be agnostic. One at the end of the day being agnostic does not have to make any statement of 'faith' as you would have to being an atheist or a theist.
 
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