Addiction is a disease

[th1b.taylor]

Cigarette smokers took Big Tobacco to court because Big Tobacco spent tons of money spreading lies and ruining peoples' lives, for filthy lucre's sake. Given how much money the tax payers have had to pay to clean up after Big Tobacco's mess, it seems only fair that BT should have to pay at least some people a ton of money.

Being a Christian, I will always hold the position taught in scripture, that is what Bond Servants of the LORD do when they have been exposed to the Gospel and the Bible. I was responsible for my cigarette addiction, I was responsible for my sexual addictions, I was responsible for my alcohol additions and I was the perp that run the rails of Coke, smoked the dope, poped the pills and stuck the needles into my body. Others did help me along with all my additions for their pleasure but no one held a gun to my head for any of it.

We live in a sin sick society and this attempt to convince God' s Called that the addict is not responsible is old Sly Slewfoot pulling the strings once more.

 

[jeff77]

What about the solution to the problem of addiction? I believe recognizing whether it is a disease or not is important, but maybe not THE most important thing. Since there is not a surgical procedure, treatment like chemo, medication or something of that nature it seems that the solution could be similar in some ways, especially from the Christian perspective. I have a few ideas but not all the answers of course, I am just trying to stay on the positive side of things.

 

[stovebolts]

Gary and Malachi

Neither of you are engaging in the spirit of this thread.

Nobody is saying the addict isn't responsible for their actions. Nobody is using the fact that the disease of addiction is an excuse for bad behavior.

Honestly, I'm getting angry with both of you.

 

[stovebolts]

Gary,
North American culture has instilled into everyone for the last 100 years that no one is responsible for there own actions -- blame parents, blame schools, blame society, blame God, but don't blame yourself. So now addiction has be be classified as a "disease", which relieves you of all responsibility. Smokers took cigarette manufacturers to court and believe it or not -- they won! Blame the tobacco companies, but don't blame yourself.

I disagree... And I don't appreciate the stigma.

 

[stovebolts]

No, but as adults they're responsible for their own actions.
.

I agree. But understanding why somebody does the things they do helps in their recovery.
Most addicts have pain. They need grace and encouragement. Not discarded and thrown away.

 

[jasonc]

I agree. But understanding why somebody does the things they do helps in their recovery.
Most addicts have pain. They need grace and encouragement. Not discarded and thrown away.

the pain that drove them to the substance that they crave.

 

[jasonc]

Cigarette smokers took Big Tobacco to court because Big Tobacco spent tons of money spreading lies and ruining peoples' lives, for filthy lucre's sake. Given how much money the tax payers have had to pay to clean up after Big Tobacco's mess, it seems only fair that BT should have to pay at least some people a ton of money.

well they do make more addictive, thus why I am against legalization of pot and other drugs. they also did target teens. while they aren't the only to blame the fact is they were and its documented that they stalled the honest research and presentation of that nicotine is a hazard to ones health. I wonder If I can find a way old ad saying that nicotine was good for the health.

 

[stovebolts]

Cigarette smokers took Big Tobacco to court because Big Tobacco spent tons of money spreading lies and ruining peoples' lives, for filthy lucre's sake. Given how much money the tax payers have had to pay to clean up after Big Tobacco's mess, it seems only fair that BT should have to pay at least some people a ton of money.

Oh yeah, I remember the Marlboro man and all the sexy gals with a cigarette. There were no surgeon generals warning. Smoking was sold as sexy, masculin and hip. I even remember butts on the floor of the super market.
When science said it was dangerous, big tobacco hired their own scientist to say it wasn't dangerous.

People don't mind sueing for asbestos, but how dare you sue for smoking at a time big tobacco said it was safe. Pffft.

Anyone who smokes now can't sue because of the scientific studies.

One day, stigma over addiction will be won and people will accept the science just like they do for mental illness.

 

[Malachi]

Cigarette smokers took Big Tobacco to court because Big Tobacco spent tons of money spreading lies and ruining peoples' lives, for filthy lucre's sake. Given how much money the tax payers have had to pay to clean up after Big Tobacco's mess, it seems only fair that BT should have to pay at least some people a ton of money.

StoveBolts,
I do apologize sincerely if you are upset with what I've said. There was nothing personal whatsoever. This is a very general observation and I believe it is true.

Back to CE,
If we just step back a little regarding tobacco and be objective we will find:
1. If BT lied, then numerous doctors and pharmaceutical companies also lied about certain drugs. So the "health" industry (also a "wealth" industry) has also been lying to the public for ages.

2. Just because BT made big bucks does not mean that smoking addicts must go after those big bucks. The capitalist system is based on supply and demand, and there is nothing illegal about tobacco. No one is forced to buy anything.

3. While BT was lying, there were numerous studies which confirmed that tobacco was (a) addictive and (b) harmful to health. Smokers could have, and should have, given heed. But because they were "hooked" they refused to do so.

4. No one has ever held a gun to a smoker's head to force them to smoke. It is purely voluntary in each and every case.

5. In view of all this, smokers have no moral or legal right to blame BT for their woes. This would apply to all addicts in general.

6. This is similar to taking McDonald's to court because their coffee was hot and someone was injured. No one forced anyone to go to McDonald's and buy hot coffee, and coffee is always served hot. Why won't people take responsibility for their own actions? Goes back to Adam and Eve. Find a scapegoat.

 

[th1b.taylor]

What about the solution to the problem of addiction? I believe recognizing whether it is a disease or not is important, but maybe not THE most important thing. Since there is not a surgical procedure, treatment like chemo, medication or something of that nature it seems that the solution could be similar in some ways, especially from the Christian perspective. I have a few ideas but not all the answers of course, I am just trying to stay on the positive side of things.

The solution is extremely complicated to work through a but when it is worked through the answer is then, very simple. Up front, I would still be pouring alcohol and snorting Coke, Tea, popping what ever form of Speed was available and bedding the next conquest except for Jesus.

The trouble with this issue is just the same as every other issue the world faces today. We, the people of the Church, are just as guilty as the Lost Man in looking to God last. I sought after the LORD in Vietnam, at the age of twenty-one, and finding Him I turned and would not surrender to His control until, just before, my 45th birthday.

People in the Church, in bulk form, all hold this or that one thing in reserve and most are only willing to surrender this or that specific area or day or part of one day of the week to the Master. That night in Porky's when the Holy Spirit over came me I surrendered every fiber of my body and every area of my life and I, as much as I loved forty year old Turkey, I have not had a single shot since that day.

And therein lies the answer, right on the middle of the truth.

 

[Gary]

Gary and Malachi

Neither of you are engaging in the spirit of this thread.

Nobody is saying the addict isn't responsible for their actions. Nobody is using the fact that the disease of addiction is an excuse for bad behavior.

Honestly, I'm getting angry with both of you.

You're saying addiction is a disease and it's not.

It's a state of mind.
.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Oh yeah, I remember the Marlboro man and all the sexy gals with a cigarette. There were no surgeon generals warning. Smoking was sold as sexy, masculin and hip. I even remember butts on the floor of the super market.
When science said it was dangerous, big tobacco hired their own scientist to say it wasn't dangerous.

People don't mind sueing for asbestos, but how dare you sue for smoking at a time big tobacco said it was safe. Pffft.

Anyone who smokes now can't sue because of the scientific studies.

One day, stigma over addiction will be won and people will accept the science just like they do for mental illness.

I do pray they never fall into that trap, even though they are doing that right now.

 

[Gary]

I agree. But understanding why somebody does the things they do helps in their recovery.
Most addicts have pain. They need grace and encouragement. Not discarded and thrown away.

I don't disagree with this. But someone going through withdrawals doesn't equate to them having a disease.

 

[jasonc]

.

You're saying addiction is a disease and it's not.

It's a state of mind.
.

so is nicotine and weight loss. easy as pie to stop and go from 300 pounds to proper weight. gluttony is that not a sin?

 

[Gary]

the pain that drove them to the substance that they crave.

How did they come to have this craving for this substance? Did they just wake up one day to discover they were addicted to Heroin or tobacco or whatever and there was nothing they could do about it? They just became addicts through no fault of their own?

Is that how addiction works?
.

 

[jasonc]

How did they come to have this craving for this substance? Did they just wake up one day to discover they were addicted to Heroin or tobacco or whatever and there was nothing they could do about it? They just became addicts through no fault of their own?

Is that how addiction works?
.

yes, in part the desire is there, they don't know that. they are still in responsible. I hate beer, it has no power over me. I can drink and I wouldn't be addicted. porn on the other hand. yet I know men who are able to resist that. rare but I have met them.

why is it that with food and weight the church doesn't address that? its not an addiction at times. the gmos and mcds don't make them foods addictive and also try to stopping cokes, and go to diet coke and see what the body does. I did that on the fake sugar and it made me crave sugar all the more. thus why I said food and diet, its not just a state of mind.
jeff is saying that we should stop the stigma of oh they are a drunk and have the will power to stop. they don't.nicotine is addictive and I know you smoke it. why do YOU have to have it? what does it do for you? have you tried to stop that? I know people that have and have gone back several times. some have quit and its been a hard battle for most that I know to stop.

with habits one must find a replacement for the habit that is positive to fill the void or you will go back.

have you ever heard of codependency? that drives a lot of this. all addicts have it. I do. and I have never done any drugs. smoke pot? no, get drunk? nope, high, nope.

 

[Gary]

.


so is nicotine and weight loss. easy as pie to stop and go from 300 pounds to proper weight. gluttony is that not a sin?

If you're addicted to cigarettes, that's your choice. You're the one choosing to smoke, no one is forcing you and you didn't just wake up one day with 2 pack a day habit. You are totally responsible for your own nicotine addiction.

The same with weight issues. Nobody's forcing you to do these things to your body. You do them because you choose to.
.

 

[jasonc]

If you're addicted to cigarettes, that's your choice. You're the one choosing to smoke, no one is forcing you and you didn't just wake up one day with 2 pack a day habit. You are totally responsible for your own nicotine addiction.

The same with weight issues. Nobody's forcing you to do these things to your body. You do them because you choose to.
.

so don't preach that anti-gmo stuff to me then. do you think that doesn't have an affect on us and our desires. you aren't made to eat them? okay so can YOU afford the higher organic food budget? have you tried to loose weight? probably not.

again im not saying YOU aren't responsible but gmo and companies aren't doing this to make us eat their products?

http://www.naturalnews.com/045514_food_addictions_chemical_ingredients_obesity.html#

im not a fan of that site but I don't deny they do that either. quit smoking and try it.if its that easy. one day should end that craving. again why is it hard to see that some have a disposition to sin in one area and others don't. pot has no pull or draw to me. I don't need a drug to make myself look like and idiot or feel accepted. I can do that without drugs. some have a desire to be accepted and are lied to by the devil and suckered into drugs to fill that void of loneliness.

 

[Gary]

nicotine is addictive and I know you smoke it. why do YOU have to have it? what does it do for you? have you tried to stop that? I know people that have and have gone back several times. some have quit and its been a hard battle for most that I know to stop.

I smoke because I choose to, not because I have to. It's a personal choice.
.

 

[jasonc]

I smoke because I choose to, not because I have to. It's a personal choice.
.

then why do you think YOU have that power to stop. do you want emphesma , lung cancer which often is painful and quick death. or other cancers. the smokers lungs. yeah you like that nicotine that much that you prefer that? how long have you smoked? one year or over a decade? my brother did and quit cold turkey, he said it was hard but he made it and doesn't miss it. he said many cant do that . he just was blessed. ten years plus he quit. now he runs. I have asthma the smokers coughing fits. I get them from asthma. no thanks. I wouldn't want to take any substance If I know that cause that stuff. I know that it is hard to quit. real hard.

caffeine will take a toll on my kidneys. I may visit cessation of that. that would eliminate tea and coffee and sodas for me, and the sugar as well.