Allah is not the God of Abraham

[JudaicChristian]

Christians should not use the name Allah for God because that name belongs to a Pagan god. Allah is the short form of Alilah: Al / il / ah, means [The god ascends.] Alilah was a Pagan sun god. Alilah is the phase of the morning sun. Because Mohammad was not a prophet, he did not know the name of the God of Abraham. Gods personal name is written on an ancient piece of stone found in Arabia. There was a time when the Arabs knew God’s name as Yahwah. But that was before God’s name was cursed by the Arabs, and not to ever again be spoken. The Arabs began worshiping other gods when Yahwah would not curse the Jews for them.

 

[Joe67]

mdo757,

Here is a prophetic testimony to guide our thoughts.

Jer 32:27
27 Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh: is there any thing too hard for me? KJV

Joe

 

[JudaicChristian]

mdo757,

Here is a prophetic testimony to guide our thoughts.

Jer 32:27
27 Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh: is there any thing too hard for me? KJV

Joe

If God's personal name had not been removed from scriptures you would see that "The Lord" is Yahwah.

 

[seekandlisten]

If God's personal name had not been removed from scriptures you would see that "The Lord" is Yahwah.

Just a couple of questions for you. Where is it 'evidenced' that 'God' had a 'personal name?' Where is it 'evidenced' that 'God' is a 'person'? Where is the 'evidence' that 'God' can even be fully comprehended in our 'worldly' terms? From what I can see the only 'image' or 'shadow' we have is the 'fullness of God' in Jesus. Doesn't all descriptions of 'God' come from 'man' making them? So really nothing more than our 'perception' of 'God'.

You said,

"Because Mohammad was not a prophet, he did not know the name of the God of Abraham."

Do you also realize that the Qur'an was assembled and written after Muhammed's death making it subject to the translators 'interpretations'? What 'evidence' makes you think Muhammed is not a prophet?

 

[JudaicChristian]

Just a couple of questions for you. Where is it 'evidenced' that 'God' had a 'personal name?' Where is it 'evidenced' that 'God' is a 'person'? Where is the 'evidence' that 'God' can even be fully comprehended in our 'worldly' terms? From what I can see the only 'image' or 'shadow' we have is the 'fullness of God' in Jesus. Doesn't all descriptions of 'God' come from 'man' making them? So really nothing more than our 'perception' of 'God'.

You said,

"Because Mohammad was not a prophet, he did not know the name of the God of Abraham."

Do you also realize that the Qur'an was assembled and written after Muhammed's death making it subject to the translators 'interpretations'? What 'evidence' makes you think Muhammed is not a prophet?

If Mohammad was a prophet of the God of Abraham, he would not have used the name of a Pagan god. Besides that, what did Mohammad ever prophesy? In our bible scriptures, God's personal name has been removed from thousands of places by the scholars. Scripture even stated by God Himself that Yahwah is His personal name.
Exodus 6
2. Elohiym said to Moses, "I’m Yahwah. 3. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as God Almighty, but by my name Yahwah I did not make known to them.
Yahwah reveals His name to Moses
Exodus 3:13-15.
13 And Moses said to Elohiym, “Suppose I go to the siblings of the Israelites and say to them, 'The Elohiym of your forefathers has sent me to you,' and they ask me, 'What is His name?' What shall I say to them?†(Elohiym means, “God of The Living.â€) It can also be translated as “god-s of the living†or “god-s of life;†for those who have life immortal.
14 And Elohiym said to Moses, “The Living that Lives. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'The Living has sent me to you.†(HaYah) in the ancient Semitic language means: The Living, or The Life.)
15 And Elohiym also said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites, 'Yahwah, the Elohiym of your forefathers; the Elohiym of Abraham, the Elohiym of Isaac and the Elohiym of Jacob has sent me to you.' That’s my name forever, the name by which I’m to be remembered, from generation to generation.€

 

[Ottawan61350]

Allah is just another name for the wrong god.

 

[JudaicChristian]

Allah is just another name for the wrong god.

It is more then that. It is proof that Mohammad was not a prophet of God, and that he mislead his own people the Arabs.

 

[Tubalcain]

A small boy said God's name was "Andy" because in the hymn "In the Garden" it goes "Andy walks with me, Andy talks with me..."

 

[D4Christ]

'The Elohiym of your forefathers has sent me to you,' and they ask me, 'What is His name?' What shall I say to them?†(Elohiym means, “God of The Living.â€) It can also be translated as “god-s of the living†or “god-s of life;†for those who have life immortal.
14 And Elohiym said to Moses, “The Living that Lives. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'The Living has sent me to you.†(HaYah) in the ancient Semitic language means: The Living, or The Life.)
15 And Elohiym also said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites, 'Yahwah, the Elohiym of your forefathers; the Elohiym of Abraham, the Elohiym of Isaac and the Elohiym of Jacob has sent me to you.' That’s my name forever, the name by which I’m to be remembered, from generation to generation.â€[/size]

:amen

Truth be told...the only thing Muhammed got right is that he thought his visions came from demons. Apparently people thought he was possessed as a child. His visions also made him suicidal. A genuine experience with God's messengers should not make one want to throw oneself off of a cliff.

 

[JudaicChristian]

Chemosh was the god of war and the national god of the Moabites. He is equivalent to the Babylonian Shamash.
Chemosh, an ancient West Semitic deity, revered by the Moabites as their supreme god.
Others view Chemosh as the god of the neitherworld on the basis of an Akkadian god-list which identified him with the god Nergal. Support for this identification may be found in Ugaritic texts. Encyclopedia Judiaca Vol. 5, Col. 390.
THE MOABITE STONE
King Mesha, 930 BC.

Moabite Stone
I am Mesha, son of Chemosh melek, the king of Moab, the Dibonite. My father was king over Moab for thirty years, and I became king after my father.

And I made this high place for Chemosh in Qarhar . . . because of the deliverance of Mesha, and because he has saved me from all the kings and because he caused me to see [my desire] upon all who hated me. Omri, king of Israel -- he oppressed Moab many days, because Chemosh was angry with his land.

And his son succeeded him, and he also said I will oppress Moab. In my day he spoke according to this word, but I saw my desire upon him and upon his house, and Israel utterly perished forever.

Now Omri had possessed all the land of Medeba and dwelt in it his days and half the days of his son, forty years, but Chemosh restored it in my day. And I built Baal-meon and I made in it the reservoir and I built Kiryathaim. And the men of Gad had dwelt in the land of Ataroth from of old and the king of Israel had built for himself Ataroth. And I foutht against the city and took it, and I slew all the people of the city, a sight pleasing to Chemosh and to Moab.

And I brought back from there the altar-hearth of Duda and I dragged it before Chemosh in Kiryoth. And I caused to dwell in it the men of Sharon and the men of Meharoth (?).

And Chemosh said to me: "Go take Nebo against Israel"; and I went by night and fought against it from break of dawn till noon, and I took it and slew all, seven thousand men and boys, women and girls, and I devoted it to Ashtar-Chemosh.

And I took from there the altar-hearths of Yahwah, and I dragged them before Chemosh. And the king of Israel built Jabaz and dwelt in it while he fought with me and Chemosh drove him out from before me. And I took from Moab two hundred men, all its chiefs, and I led them against Jahaz and took it to add unto Dibon.

And I built Qarhar, the wall of the forests and the wall of the hill; and I built its gates and I built its towers, and I built the kings house, and I made the sluices for the reservoir of water in the midst of the city.

And there was no cistern in the midst of the city, in Qarhar; and I said to all the people: "Make you each a cistern in his house;" and I cut the cuttings for Qarhar with the help of the prisoners of Israel. I built Aroer and I made the highway by the Arnon. And I built Beth-bamoth, for it had been destroyed. And I built Bezer, for it was in ruins....(Chi) of Dibon wer fifty, for all Dibon was obedient. And I ruled. And I ruled a hundred....in the cities which I had added to the land. And I built [Mede]ba dnd Beth-diblathan. And [as for] Beth-baal-meon, there I placed sheep-raisers....sheep of the land... And [as for] Horonaim there dwelt in it....and.....Chemosh said unto me: "Go down, fight against Horonaim," and I went down and....Chemosh in my day, and from there.....and I.......

Chemosh was the god of war and the national god of the Moabites. He is equivalent to the Babylonian Shamash.
Chemosh was the national deity of the Moabites (Numbers 21:29; Jeremiah 47:7,13,46). In Judges 11:24 he was also the god of the Ammonites. Solomon introduced Chemosh but later Josiah abolished the worship of Chemosh at Jerusalem (1 Kings 11:7; 2 Kings 23:13).

Chemosh, was the ancient West Semitic deity, revered by the Moabites as their supreme god. The famous Moabite Stone, written by Mesha, a 9th-century-bc king of Moab, Chemosh received prominent mention as the deity who brought victory to the Moabites in their battle against the Israelites. In those days the Arabs knew the name of God as Yahwah, but because Yahwah would not curse the Jews for the Arab people, His name was not to be ever spoken. And so the name of God was a cursed and never to be spoken. And that is why Mohammad did not know the name of the God of Abraham. That proves that Mohammad was not a prophet of God.

 

[seekandlisten]

Well, I've come to realize these threads are a lost cause and useless. Love our enemies and forgive those who do wrongs against us is the teaching, not bring down and discredit those who oppose our 'personal' beliefs. All I will say here is if you want 'legit' information you must go to source that is in opposition to your beliefs and weigh the information against what you know. Simply getting your information from a 'christian' bias will do nothing to better understand another religion. I do not 'believe' in Islam but in the same way that I do not 'believe' in 'Christianity' and that is in regards to the influence of 'man' on both religions. They both do, however, contain 'truth' beneficial to understanding 'God's great mystery.'

In regards to a point made about Muhammed leading the Arabs astray, he actually attempted to reform his people from their idolatry. Look into the Hunafa. Muahammed and his followers were also persecuted for their beliefs. Another point, Muhammed could neither read nor write so his rendition of the bible was of the oral tradition.

Just a point I would like to make before I leave this thread.

Isaiah 42:11 (One of the OT passages held to be prophetic to Islam)

"Let the wilderness and the cities thereof lift up their voice, the villages that Kedar doth inhabit; let the inhabitants of the rock sing, let them shout from the top of the mountains."

Kedar was the son of Ishmael. The Muslim interpretation that this passage speaks of the coming Word of God to Ishmael's descendants through Muhammed.

 

[JudaicChristian]

Just a point I would like to make before I leave this thread.

Isaiah 42:11 (One of the OT passages held to be prophetic to Islam)

"Let the wilderness and the cities thereof lift up their voice, the villages that Kedar doth inhabit; let the inhabitants of the rock sing, let them shout from the top of the mountains."

Kedar was the son of Ishmael. The Muslim interpretation that this passage speaks of the coming Word of God to Ishmael's descendants through Muhammed.

The word of God does come to the Arabs, through Christ in the New Covenant.

 

[Tabasco Breath]

I had the pleasure of spending some time in Dubai not too long ago. There are middle eastern Christians in Dubai as well as a few Christian churches. When they praise Jesus by referring to him as the Son of God, they use the Arabic equivalent to say "Jesus is the Son of"....then they use the word "Allah"

Allah is in it's denotation is just the Arabic word for God and that is it.

Unless I am wrong I still think Jesus is viewed as the God of Abraham in Christianity.

 

[JudaicChristian]

I had the pleasure of spending some time in Dubai not too long ago. There are middle eastern Christians in Dubai as well as a few Christian churches. When they praise Jesus by referring to him as the Son of God, they use the Arabic equivalent to say "Jesus is the Son of"....then they use the word "Allah"

Allah is in it's denotation is just the Arabic word for God and that is it.

Unless I am wrong I still think Jesus is viewed as the God of Abraham in Christianity.

The word for God in Aramaic is IL, as in Israil. Modern Hebrew is EL, as in Israel. Ancient Hebrew was also IL. You know if lies are told for a long enough time, people will build doctrines around them. For certain Allah has nothing to do with the God of Abraham. Allah is a blasphemy of God's true name. Allah is the contracted form of Alilah.

 

[JudaicChristian]

• According to Arab tradition, it was Abraham and Ishmael that built the Kaaba as a house for Yahwah, but as time went on other gods were introduced and placed in the Kaaba. Now when Yahwah was in the Kaaba pantheon, there came the King of Moab called Balak; and it was Balak who wanted the prophet Balaam to ask Yahwah to curse the Jews, but Yahwah refused to curse the Jews. (For more info see Numbers 22 through 24:25 in the bible) At some point in time afterward, Yahwah, the God of Abraham was cast out of the Kaaba by the Arabic people, and His name was cursed and not to be ever spoken.
  
  During that time Chemosh was made the head of the Pantheon in the Kaaba. Chemosh means Highest Power, and is also a phase of the sun at midday; it is Allah who becomes Chemosh at midday. And so Mohammed did not know the name of the God of Abraham, and that is why he said, "you already believe that Allah is a god, why not believe that he is the only God."

• Exodus 6
  1. Then Yahwah said to Moses, "Now you will see what I will do to Pharaoh: Because of my mighty hand he will let them go; because of my mighty hand he will drive them out of his land."
  2. Elohiym said to Moses, "I’m Yahwah. 3. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as IL/God Almighty, but by my name Yahwah I did not make known to them.

 

[Tabasco Breath]

I had the pleasure of spending some time in Dubai not too long ago. There are middle eastern Christians in Dubai as well as a few Christian churches. When they praise Jesus by referring to him as the Son of God, they use the Arabic equivalent to say "Jesus is the Son of"....then they use the word "Allah"

Allah is in it's denotation is just the Arabic word for God and that is it.

Unless I am wrong I still think Jesus is viewed as the God of Abraham in Christianity.

The word for God in Aramaic is IL, as in Israil. Modern Hebrew is EL, as in Israel. Ancient Hebrew was also IL. You know if lies are told for a long enough time, people will build doctrines around them. For certain Allah has nothing to do with the God of Abraham. Allah is a blasphemy of God's true name. Allah is the contracted form of Alilah.

Not to sure what you had in mind with regard to lies, but you have it backwords. "El" in semetic languages with Hebrew being a derivative of that language means God. Just like Yahweh is a name for God, so is "Allah" the Arabic term for God that is it's pure denotation. What people change through denotation is another thing and from a perspective of religions, no one is guilt free.

 

[goodfriday]

Well if people are going to get stuck on the "personal" name of God, then remember that "God" is neither His name, and therefore "God" could be considered a false god too. If we accept that the word Allah comes from Al-Ilah, thus rendering it The Diety, The God, then it is no more or less a title than the word God.

Allah isnt a sun god or a moon god, and those who make such claims have done very poor research on the subject. Even idolaters seem to have worshipped Allah, what they saw as the Supreme Being, the Creator. But they worshipped him through means of Idols, believing that one could not or was not able or allowed to approach him directly. I have done years of studies on the subject and just because one believes something to be false doesnt mean that one has the right to spread falsehood and lies regarding it.

Christ Jesus didnt lie about people to make them look bad. If you stand by the truth, be truthful and you should have nothing to fear!

 

[jasoncran]

i guess malak and malach the arabic word for angel and the hebrew word angel . The later must mean something holy and the former must mean demon.

arabic is just a language, thats it. we use some arabic/persian words commonly
bazaar
algrebra
chemistry
hocus pocus

esther is the persian word for what star. Persian/farsi is used by many muslims, WE better change that name of that book. It might meant demon.

 

[JudaicChristian]

Well if people are going to get stuck on the "personal" name of God, then remember that "God" is neither His name, and therefore "God" could be considered a false god too. If we accept that the word Allah comes from Al-Ilah, thus rendering it The Diety, The God, then it is no more or less a title than the word God.

Allah isnt a sun god or a moon god, and those who make such claims have done very poor research on the subject. Even idolaters seem to have worshipped Allah, what they saw as the Supreme Being, the Creator. But they worshipped him through means of Idols, believing that one could not or was not able or allowed to approach him directly. I have done years of studies on the subject and just because one believes something to be false doesnt mean that one has the right to spread falsehood and lies regarding it.

Christ Jesus didnt lie about people to make them look bad. If you stand by the truth, be truthful and you should have nothing to fear!

• I'm sorry, but you do not know what you are talking about. Yahwah has many name titles, but He only has one personal name that He has made known to us. Allah was worshipped as a pagan god long before Mohammad lived. That is why Mohammad said: "You already believe that Allah is a god, why not believe he is the only god."

• Exodus 6
  
  2. Elohiym said to Moses, "I’m Yahwah. 3. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as IL/God Almighty, but by my name Yahwah I did not make known to them.

 

[goodfriday]

• I'm sorry, but you do not know what you are talking about. Yahwah has many name titles, but He only has one personal name that He has made known to us. Allah was worshipped as a pagan god long before Mohammad lived. That is why Mohammad said: "You already believe that Allah is a god, why not believe he is the only god."

• Exodus 6
  
  2. Elohiym said to Moses, "I’m Yahwah. 3. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as IL/God Almighty, but by my name Yahwah I did not make known to them.

I don't know what I am talking about?
I'm not sure what your qualifications are when it comes to knowledge of Islam, but I have spent 4 years of intensive studies under Islamic scholars around the world. So i would believe im in a better position than your average joe who read an article or two about the subject.

Yes, God has many titles. Let me ask you, is God one of them? Or is God a foreign word used to explain Elohim? Yes, Abraham didnt, nor did Moses, King David, Solomon, or even Christ Jesus use the word God! Yet, since we are speaking english, so that is the title used when referring to Him. And the same goes for other languages, Greek, Latin, Italian, Spanish etc.. and yes, this also includes Arabic.

While the word Allah was used by the pagans, to refer to the Creator, meaning thee God, as in the highest God. What Muhammad did was not to just abolish the other gods, rather he taught them the "true" nature of the God, and rectified their beliefs. And the title remained the same.

Just as you would with an English speaking person who worships something false, you will teach him about the true God, not whine about him using the word God. Or are all Arab Christians calling upon a false God every day?