Already Gone - Teens Abandoning Faith

[Mike]

As a father of three (10, 12, and 15), this is something I'm in prayer about for my own children constantly. More than happiness, fulfillment in life, education or anything else, my hope for my children is that they embrace their faith and take it into their adulthood. My kids think I'm obsessed with this, and they're probably right.

I'm in the middle of a book called, "Already Gone (Why your kids will quit church and what you can do to stop it)".

http://www.amazon.co m/Already-Gone-your-kids-church/dp/0890515298/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1302402675&sr=1-1

(I broke up the link in case it doesn't work - cut/paste into address bar)

This is a book that has researched the matter of young adults who have fallen away, interviewing 1000 people in their 20's. The premise of the book is that many parents are concerned about the college-age years, when they should really be looking at the mid-teen years with concern.

Here's an interesting stat they found. Of the respondents who said they no longer believe the Bible is true:
39.8% began doubting in middle school
43.7% began doubting in high school
10.6% began doubting in college

Thus the title, "Already Gone". Parents who are intervening after high school are intervening too late. Most have already begun to walk away. There are alarming statistics that set the stage. Churches are struggling, and many have shut their doors. Why? What are we doing wrong? What are we not addressing that we should be. This shouldn't only be the concern of parents. It should be the concern for everyone in the Body of Christ.

I'm only about a quarter of the way through the book, and I'll likely have additional thoughts as I countinue, but this matter is too important for me to wait until I'm done. It is on the topic of Sunday School at this point, and the responses of those who regularly attended Sunday School compared to those who didn't blow my mind. Of the 1000 people in their 20's asked, far more who did answer a series of questions directly opposed to what we'd think.
Do you believe in evolution?
Do you believe premarital sex is wrong?
Do you believe good people don't need to go to church?
Do you believe the Bible is irrelevant?
Do you believe you have become "anti-church" through the years?

All of these were significantly higher among those who did attend Sunday School.

Do you share the concerns of this book? If you do, what do you think we are doing wrong with our youth, and what do you think we need to do differently?

Prayer? Yes! Instruction and faith discussions at home? Absolutely! But what about at church. How can we minister to the future of our church more effectively?

 

[Igor]

I'm ordering that book right now. It sounds really interesting.

I've been preaching to deaf ears for many years about the importance of quality youth ministry for the Jr High and High schoolers. Very few ever listen. The little ones are usually pretty well taken care of, but when they get to Jr High and start to have more inteligent questions and needs, so many of us just start ignoring them. I think many parents only start to really care about their spiritual health again when they go to college because the reality that they can no longer physically control them sets in. That's when they panic and start to fear that the years of neglect in Jr and Sr high are going to result in their kids leaving the church now that they can exercise their own free will as adults. With good reason too.

 

[Igor]

...Churches are struggling, and many have shut their doors. Why? What are we doing wrong? What are we not addressing that we should be. This shouldn't only be the concern of parents. It should be the concern for everyone in the Body of Christ.

"When a church loses it's youth, it dies." John MacAurther

 

[pjt]

"It is on the topic of Sunday School at this point, and the responses of those who regularly attended Sunday School compared to those who didn't blow my mind. Of the 1000 people in their 20's asked, far more who did answer a series of questions directly opposed to what we'd think. "

Do you mean more of those who attended Sunday School regularly were more likely to believe in evolution, fornication, etc?

My feelings on this topic have changed in recent years. The topic of this book sounds like it focuses on "why your children quit church and how to stop it". I would say until recent years this would have been a primary concern for me too, but now I think this concern may be part of the problem. If we just feel a sense of satisfied security if our children go to church, we may be deceiving ourselves. I think more than being concerned if children quit church, we should be focusing on do they quit God. Perhaps parents and churches have created a little bit of this problem. We are so concerned about children quitting church that we create all sorts of gimics, parties, and entertainment to entice them to come rather than just giving them real substance for them to feed on and hold on to for life.

For those who are just coming for the entertainment, they probably will not stick around in the long run. For those who are coming for substance, but only get a watered down message because we have to entertain and entice, they leave empty. Why don`t we focus on the true seekers and feed them generously. And of course, at home we have to make God a part of our family life. The family influence is probably more important than the church experience, but ideally they should be working together, reinforcing one another.

Back to the topic of church though, when we feel security in seeing our children go to church it is similar to sending our children to a Christian school, it can be a false sense of security. I knew kids that went to what many Christians would consider a very good Christian school, yet there was drugs, fornication, and all the same stuff you find in other regular public schools. The school, of course, taught the Bible but we all know just listening to a lecture on morals does not always penetrate the heart. I think we just have to be praying for our children that God`s Word will penetrate the heart, and we have to be feeding them His Word and living as examples to our children. I think we also have to be pointing out God every day in daily life. For example, my daughter got a very good teacher this year and I pointed out to her God`s goodness in this for her to see. Basically we have to make God a natural part of our conversation and thinking so God is not a Bible lecture/lesson time, but a part of life. After that, we just have to leave it in the hands of God. Church and Sunday School alone aren`t going to save our children and this is very important for parents to realize, I think.

 

[Mike]

Do you mean more of those who attended Sunday School regularly were more likely to believe in evolution, fornication, etc?

Unfortunately, this is exactly what I mean:
(in the numbers below, the first is those who grew up in Sunday School, the second is who did not)
Evolution - 27.2% / 18.8%
Premarital sex is wrong - 47.7% / 40.8%
Good people don't need church - 39.3% / 28.9%
Bible/church is not relevant - 46.4% / 39.6%
Become anti-church - 39.1% / 26.9%

Igor, I'm sure you'll appreciate the book, and you know by now, it's not an expensive one. I look forward to your thoughts.

Pjt, I might have your same response if I hadn't begun reading it. But the co-authors don't have "filling the pews" as their end goal. They are looking deep into the heart of the matter of them becoming spiritually disconnected and empty inside. From what I've read thus far, I'm convinced the advice they will give is NOT to change the experience for them with lights, loud music and multi-media. I expect that it will be the exact opposite; reverse this trend in the church as it seems to have a hand in it. Focus on a deeper understanding of scripture and a defense of the faith. All the "show" of modern churches CAN have the affect of creating a shallow, visceral experience that is fleeting; there when at church, gone by the time they're driving home.

As I said, and I inferred the same from you, the home is most important. But the local church is important too. Hebrews 10 speaks to that. There has always been a significant roll for the church in a community from the very beginning. So the questions at hand are "How does a church do its part to spiritually grow its youth? How can we better address the very real questions about the Word and their faith WHEN and WHERE they begin to create inner-conflict within the hearts if our youth?"

 

[Johnny916]

I understand where the author the thread is coming from. I'm not a parent but I'm religious. Times change and it goes by the person how they view what would be a better life for them. Many people enjoy living a secular lifestyle. Others maybe religious or traditional. If I had children what I would do is create the best image of my faith. Keep it influential and something that well benefit them all the time.

 

[pjt]

Unfortunately, this is exactly what I mean:
(in the numbers below, the first is those who grew up in Sunday School, the second is who did not)

So the questions at hand are "How does a church do its part to spiritually grow its youth? How can we better address the very real questions about the Word and their faith WHEN and WHERE they begin to create inner-conflict within the hearts if our youth?"

Mike, those statistics are alarming aren`t they, and really shine a light on the fact that the church is doing something significantly wrong.

I wonder though what sort of churches these kids interviewed were from. That could make a difference. If they were from rather liberal churches then we could indeed expect more worldly answers, but if they were from more Biblically sound/conservative churches we really have a problem on our hands.

So to answer your questions, perhaps one way is for church leadership to start reflecting Biblical truths. If we say divorce is wrong but our leaders are divorcees what sort of message does it give to our youth? We need to go back to the Bible and choose leaders and teachers based on Bible standards. If we just let anyone volunteer to teach and lead, then maybe we are doing our youth a disservice. Maybe our youth need the MOST qualified leaders to teach and be examples. I hate to say it but sometimes the children/youth services are more like a babysitting service than a place for spiritual training.

Another thing we can do is to act more like a community or family. We need to invest in each other`s lives and really support parents because parenting is not only a tough job but also one of the most meaningful spiritual jobs we have. Church should not be 1-2 hours once a week. Church should be every day. We should be as a body of believers supporting and interacting with each other throughout the week so we are not merely fair weathered friends. We should know each other and spend time with each other, and let our families interact with each other. When do this we become a community that cares for each other and the children feel that and our community feels like home. Going to church just to hear a moral lecture or to be entertained is not how God designed the church. And I think many churches are failing in this area. People go to church and have no idea where the person next to them lives so there is no investment in each others lives. Our children need investment not just moral lectures. They need a community to love them, care for them, nurture them, and encourage them in their walk with Christ. If we function as a family of God with each other, children will respond to that and will be drawn to it. But if children see us being critical of each other, a bunch of strangers just coming together once a week, and us pushing moral doctrines on them that we don`t even live ourselves, they`ll eventually be put off by it. Living the faith is more than just living a moral life, it is living as a family of God that should reflect His love to each other. Children and teens are drawn to love.

 

[Cheyenne K]

This disturbs me, because I get to see the reflection of these statistics in school five days a week.

But another factor: how many parents of these children have given their children an example of a relationship with Christ in comparison to just the ritualistic appeasement or motions of religion?

 

[Igor]

...Focus on a deeper understanding of scripture and a defense of the faith.

This is exactly what I meant when I used the term "quality youth ministry " in my post above. This is the type of youth ministry I ran years ago. Many of the kids that were involved in that ministry have kept in touch with me over the years (they are old now!), and they have for the most part stayed with their faith, a few working in full time ministry positions, almost all still in church and raising their own kids in the church. A few of these people even came from non-Christian homes. A far cry from the statistics posted above!

Sure, we had fun and games. But the focus was on solid Biblical teaching and Biblical based effective Christian counseling. The kids were never told this of course, but everything, including the fun and games, was designed to focus the youth toward Christ and to teach practical Christian living. Many times this wasn't obvious, even to the parents or other church members but, as the youth pastor, I knew that everything, even just a fun game somehow helped focus toward Christ. It worked. The majority of these kids (now middle aged) are still strong Christians today.

But today, I don't see this happening in any churches I have been involved in. (Actually, I have seen it in one, but after some time they seemed to lose interest and just let it fall apart. Now they don't seem to even care, and their youth group has been lost.) It is a problem in conservative and liberal churches alike (I've looked at quite a few). Rather than put an effort into youth ministry, they take the cheap and easy way out, sticking an overworked volunteer in the position of "youth director" just because they have a warm body that is willing to "fill the position", rather than look for a truly qualified person. Than the head pastor and board members can sit back and say "It's been taken care of." Out of site, out of mind.

One pastor I was quite close to for a time found himself in the postion of having a good start to a youth ministry which seemed ready to really take off. I spoke to him a lot (hoping that I would be given the chance to make this happen). I pointed out the potential in his church, which he did see once it was pointed out to him. What was his response? He said it scared him to have so many teenagers around, then he took active steps to discourage the whole idea of a growing youth ministry. (Of course, he would never admit to this, but I watched him do it from the sidelines. It was pretty obvious to anyone that knew what to look for as well as pretty obvious to the kids invovled.) The result? Today his church is empty of youth and adults as well. He keeps the doors open by working a secular job to cover the cost of the utility and insurance bills just so he can still say he is the pastor of a church.

Sadly, I've been trying to point this out to others lately, but no one that is in a position to make a difference will listen. In addition to new insights, maybe the book will give me some better ammunition and make me look more credible. Maybe someday, one person in a position to make a difference will listen. Although I'm beginning to think it won't be in my lifetime.

 

[Sparkey]

This disturbs me, because I get to see the reflection of these statistics in school five days a week.

But another factor: how many parents of these children have given their children an example of a relationship with Christ in comparison to just the ritualistic appeasement or motions of religion?

Cheyenne, I like your thought: how many children have seen by example a real relationship with our Father God? Have children seen their parents fall on their face before God as together they struggle to overcome challenges greater than themselves?

(Psalm 135:13 KJV)
"Thy name, O LORD, [endureth] for ever; [and] thy memorial, O LORD, throughout all generations."

 

[Mike]

Mike, those statistics are alarming aren`t they, and really shine a light on the fact that the church is doing something significantly wrong.

I wonder though what sort of churches these kids interviewed were from. That could make a difference. If they were from rather liberal churches then we could indeed expect more worldly answers, but if they were from more Biblically sound/conservative churches we really have a problem on our hands.

Igor, when you get this book, you'll see on page 44, it is made clear that this data wasn't bent by liberal churches. In their Bible Study classes it was taught in 9 of 10 that the Bible is true and accurate, in 9 of 10 that Darwinian evolution could not be believed, in 75% the earth was not millions of years old, in 80% the days of Creation were literal, and in only 1 in 16 that Genesis could be taken as legend/not real history. They taught these points, but gave little informed defense of them.

To your post that followed this one after Cheyenne, I pray this book does help lend validity to your argument. Ironically, I was in a Bible study this morning made up of pretty serious thinkers, there was significant opposition to me when I brought this up. They said it was asking too much of the pastors and leadership! Really?!! This isn't just the book that has me fired up. It confirms what I've been concerned with, myself.

The book makes the argument that Bible study teachers should be chosen, not by whoever volunteers, but by who can and will address the tough issues. The ultimate core of the problem, they surmise, is that teens get all their sciences explained by the public schools and media while their churches don't provide a biblical world view defense. They too often compromise by merging old earth with Creation. "The days might not have been literal days." That's when they do address it, but way too many don't. The kids are forced to reconcile what they're learning from the world with silence from their church. So they begin to question the very foundations of their faith, and no one is there to offset it; certainly not their Sunday school teachers.

I really wish I had the control to wait until I was done with the book, but I was so convicted to talk about it. As it is, I'm about 1/2 way through with more info to come. The "how" is yet to come, but that "what and why" is there. Now, this is just one book's answers, but they resonate with me. We need solid, firm answers coming from the pastors and Sunday school teachers to meet these teens where and when they are experiencing doubt or conflict. We don't need feel-good stories and pats on the back.

This disturbs me, because I get to see the reflection of these statistics in school five days a week.

But another factor: how many parents of these children have given their children an example of a relationship with Christ in comparison to just the ritualistic appeasement or motions of religion?

Cheyenne, this is true, but I believe there is too much seeking going on from the pulpit and not enough challenging of their own to dig deeper. The parents are not being challenged and informed either. The church needs to empower kids and adults with more information and answers, but I agree that adult Christians need to be more proactive themselves.

 

[jasoncran]

This disturbs me, because I get to see the reflection of these statistics in school five days a week.

But another factor: how many parents of these children have given their children an example of a relationship with Christ in comparison to just the ritualistic appeasement or motions of religion?

sadly at one time i thought my views of lets see what the bible says on creation wasnt welcomed. i was wrong. i can defend alot of what i see as this forum helped.i'm willing to share this with my church if so called.

i'm willing to tackle all any difficult issue. my pastors daughter and boyfriend who just got saved today were talking to him on gay rights and being born gay. the pastor learned of my testimony on porn and being bi.i hope that in the future he will come to me if he needs to understand how god healed and heals me.i know i'm not alone there in that, just probably the first he knows off.

 

[pjt]

"The book makes the argument that Bible study teachers should be chosen, not by whoever volunteers, but by who can and will address the tough issues"

I completely agree that a person who leads needs to be Biblically qualified. My husband is a part of Men`s Bible Study Fellowship, and the leaders in that group are chosen and carefully screened. I guess I can say I am proud that my husband was chosen to be a leader, but he was told that the standards for being a leader is higher than what is expected of most missionaries. And once you get to be a leader (volunteer not paid), you are expected to do your job. The leaders all get together every Saturday morning at 5AM and carefully go over all the scriptures and Bible study material before having the actual Bible study on Monday evening. So they are prepared for potential questions and they are expected to know the material. They can`t just wing it through. They have to come Saturday morning prepared with all their Bible study questions answered. It is a discipline and committment to be a leader. It is not just a casual voluntary act of service. And the leaders are kept accountable. But you can see the fruit. I have heard several men say this men`s Bible study is the deepest Bible study they have ever been in in their lives and there is really a sense of brotherhood and fellowship among the men. But to have a fellowship like this, it takes work and cultivation.

 

[Pebbles]

So Mike you feel it's a bad thing to believe in evolution?

 

[Sam21]

So Mike you feel it's a bad thing to believe in evolution?

Bad to the bone. If evolution was what it is presented as,just a group of honest men and women seeking truth from this physical world, then it would be alright,however evolution is far from honest and truth is only used if it benefits evolution.

 

[tim-from-pa]

The thing we have to consider is that the kids abandoned the faith because there is no substance in our worship and for years perhaps been following traditions of Babylon. Even the ancient Babylonians were very religious, but not saved.

We talk about bringing kids back into the church (even I have another thread out about our dying Sunday school class) but bring them back to what? Traditions of men having the form of godliness but denying the power thereof?

I'm not so sure that the masses before this generation were any more saved --- they were more religious, but not saved.

God calls those whom He will save --- some now, some later in His time, and our job is merely to preach the gospel of the Kingdom so that people know and let God do the rest. We are responsible in choosing God, but he does the birthing.

 

[tim-from-pa]

So Mike you feel it's a bad thing to believe in evolution?

I'm not Mike, but I'm tempted to put in my word.

In spite of the intellectual academia pressure to believe in evolution as something reasonable, all one has to do is look at medical science (which takes this stance) and behinds the scenes and we can see how truly messed up it is. The medical philosophy is more stupid than the believers are deemed to be.

If I want good health, I listen to them, and then turn the advice around 180º and then I'm fine. So next time one fumes that a preacher asks for a modest contribution to help the work of the Lord, just remember Big Pharma who lines their pockets with gold and yet nobody complains about that as they dish out their hard-earned money and may even consider that "reasonable".

If the same minds and mindset proposed the theory of and believe in evolution, that's enough for me to reject it right then and there. Just a racket.

 

[Elijah674]

As a father of three (10, 12, and 15), this is something I'm in prayer about for my own children constantly. More than happiness, fulfillment in life, education or anything else, my hope for my children is that they embrace their faith and take it into their adulthood. My kids think I'm obsessed with this, and they're probably right.

I'm in the middle of a book called, "Already Gone (Why your kids will quit church and what you can do to stop it)".

http://www.amazon.co m/Already-Gone-your-kids-church/dp/0890515298/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1302402675&sr=1-1

(I broke up the link in case it doesn't work - cut/paste into address bar)

This is a book that has researched the matter of young adults who have fallen away, interviewing 1000 people in their 20's. The premise of the book is that many parents are concerned about the college-age years, when they should really be looking at the mid-teen years with concern.

Here's an interesting stat they found. Of the respondents who said they no longer believe the Bible is true:
39.8% began doubting in middle school
43.7% began doubting in high school
10.6% began doubting in college

Thus the title, "Already Gone". Parents who are intervening after high school are intervening too late. Most have already begun to walk away. There are alarming statistics that set the stage. Churches are struggling, and many have shut their doors. Why? What are we doing wrong? What are we not addressing that we should be. This shouldn't only be the concern of parents. It should be the concern for everyone in the Body of Christ.

I'm only about a quarter of the way through the book, and I'll likely have additional thoughts as I countinue, but this matter is too important for me to wait until I'm done. It is on the topic of Sunday School at this point, and the responses of those who regularly attended Sunday School compared to those who didn't blow my mind. Of the 1000 people in their 20's asked, far more who did answer a series of questions directly opposed to what we'd think.
Do you believe in evolution?
Do you believe premarital sex is wrong?
Do you believe good people don't need to go to church?
Do you believe the Bible is irrelevant?
Do you believe you have become "anti-church" through the years?

All of these were significantly higher among those who did attend Sunday School.

Do you share the concerns of this book? If you do, what do you think we are doing wrong with our youth, and what do you think we need to do differently?

Prayer? Yes! Instruction and faith discussions at home? Absolutely! But what about at church. How can we minister to the future of our church more effectively?

Good Post! We need to remember though in Christ's day, That He refered to a couple (James & John) as the 'Sons Of Thunder' (past tense of course!) But the point is that we of the forum do not ever want to write these 'guys' off! We do know that Christ could not use any of the leadership of His day to start up His Act's Church!

Yet, 'i' will never believe that these one who were documented with your posts required of us, with good 'seed' sown in their youth, that many will not be the ones who will 'come back' & FINISH the Master Work for Him! Those who have sinned most, Christ say LOVE THE MOST! huh?;)

 

[handy]

Ironically, I was in a Bible study this morning made up of pretty serious thinkers, there was significant opposition to me when I brought this up. They said it was asking too much of the pastors and leadership! Really?!!

Yikes, Mike! That is really concerning.

Here's a question to ponder: We all want to see the kids in Sunday School and at church.

Why?

 

[Christ_empowered]

I think that we're blaming the church for a lot of problems that are social in nature. People aren't as involved in their communities as they once were. They work too much or they "cocoon" into cozy suburban houses or they move for work or there's divorce involved..."the ties that bind" on both the family and the social level have weakened considerably.

Plus, its easier to choose self+society over Christianity, anyway. The secular world has become so sophisticated, it even has ways to find some semblance of spirituality/enlightenment (various forms of psychotherapy and self-help, yoga, New Age movements, etc.).

I'm not saying the church can't or shouldn't do more to answer young people's questions and keep them in the fold, but I am saying that we're entering (in many places, have entered) a post-Christian phase, and its not entirely the Church's fault that there's a growing indifference (sometimes antipathy) to all things Christian in the world.