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Are these dangerous Christian mystics on the road to hell?

Are these founding fathers of Christianity (mystics) on the "Highway to Hell"?

  • 1. Yes, the only Jesus to know is the one in the Good Book, these men although responsible for doctr

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  • 3. Whats a mystic?

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    4
S

Soma-Sight

Guest
As so aptly put obn the boards by some of our most outgoing members here.....

By the way, mysticism is of the occult.


So the question here is......

Are these founding fathers of Christianity...

these Mystics which are responsible for inerrant doctrine.....

on the way to eternal torment by Asmodeus and succubi in the lower realms of Sulfur and gastric acid?

Christian Mystics
ALBERTUS MAGNUS (1206-1280)
[The teacher of Thomas Aquinas. In the tradition of Pythagoras, emphasized the essential unity of science and mysticism.]

ANGELA of FOLIGNO (c.1248-1309)
[Mysticism is based on the facts of Christ's life and death. Works: The Book of Divine Consolations of the Blessed Angela of Foligno.]


ANONYMOUS (c.1349-c.1395)
[Author of The Cloud of Unknowing, The Book of Privy Council. Part of the "English school" of late mediaeval mysticism. The emphasis on "unknowing" God is part of Pseudo-Dionysius' apophatic theology. Influenced by (Pseudo-)Dionysius.]

ANONYMOUS (c.1350-1400)
[Author of Theologia Germanica or Theologia Deutsch. Important influence in the German mystical tradition. Luther rediscovered and popularized it. Influenced by Augustine, Eckhart, Tauler.]

ANTONY, Saint (c.251-356)
[Early hermit or solitary monk, and a model for later monasticism, particularly of his eremetical type. Works: The Letters of St. Antony the Great.]

ATHANASIUS, Saint (c.296-373)
[Bishop of Alexandria from 328 to 373, wrote a Life of Antony, and was an influence on later Eastern Orthodox mysticism. Other works: Against the Gentiles, Apology Against the Arians.]

AUGUSTINE, Saint (354-430)
[Important source for much mediaeval mysticism. Brings Platonism and Christianity together. He emphasizes the soul's search for God, made possible by the illumination of the mind of God. Works include: De Trinitate, Confessions.]

BASIL THE GREAT, Saint (c.330-379)
[One of the Cappadocians, early church fathers. He gave a mystical orientation to the monastic movement. Works: Longer Rules, Liturgy of St. Basil.]

BEATRICE of NAZARETH (1200-1268)
[Belgian Cistercian mystic. Associated with the Beguines. Works: The Seven Modes of Sacred Love.]

BERNARD of CLAIRVAUX (1091-1153)
[Cistercian mystic. Promoted a mystical vision of rhapsodic love, in which the Church is described in erotic terms as the bride of Christ. His love-mysticism had the tendency to be anti-intellectual, as in his disputes with Abelard. Works: Sermons, De diligendo Deo, On the Love of God.]

BONAVENTURE [John Fidanza] (1217-1274)
[Franciscan monk, and the architect of the philosophical, theological, and mystical side of Francis' thought. Mysticism in the Augustinian tradition. Works: The Mind's Road to God, The Tree of Life, The Life of St. Francis.]

BIRGITTA [Brigida] SUECICA of SWEDEN (1302-1373)
[Ascetic mystic. Heavily involved in political activity. Influenced by St. Francis of Assisi.]

CATHERINE of SIENA (1347-1380)
[Italian mystic and advisor to Pope Gregory XI. Influenced by Augustine. Works:Il Dialogo.]

DIONYSIUS [Pseudo-Dionysius] the Areopagite (writing c.500)
[Originates the distinction between kataphatic and apophatic theology. Works: Mystical Theology, The Divine Names.]

ECKHART, MEISTER (1260-1327/8)
[Dominican monk. One of the most important early German speculative mystics and the first of the so-called "Rhineland" mystics. His Sermons were in German, the academic works in Latin. Works: Sermons, Parisian Questions and Prologues. Selections in English are available. Influenced by Pseudo-Dionysius.]

ERIUGENA, John Scotus (c.810-c.877)
[Translated Pseudo-Dionysius from Greek into Latin. He holds that humans are a microcosm of the universe. That which is shared, the essence of all things, is God. Works: Periphyseon.]

FRANCIS of ASSISI [John Bernardone] (1182-1226)
[Founder of the Franciscan order, which emphasized self-renunciation and poverty. Francis approaches nature mysticism at times, particularly when he sees God in all living things. Works: Canticle of the Sun.]

GREGORY of NAZIANZUS (329-389)
[One of the Cappadocians, early church fathers. Works: Forty-five Sermons.]

GREGORY of NYSSA (c.335-c.398)
[Believed that the universe existed as a harmonious order emanating from God. One of the Cappadocians. Works: Dialogue with his Sister Macrina concerning the Resurrection.]

GREGORY PALAMAS (1296-1359)
[Eastern Orthodox mystic.]

HADEWIJCH [Adelwip] of Brabant/Antwerp (13th century)
[Belgian Beguine and one of the greatest exponents of love mysticism. Works: Letters, Poems in Stanzas, Visions, Poems in Couplets.]

HILDEGARD of BINGEN, Saint (1098-1179)
[Early German speculative mystic, reminiscent of Isaiah or Ezekiel at times. She was greatly respected in her time, both for her writings as well as for her music and art. Works: Scivias, The Book of Divine Works, Letters.]

HILTON, WALTER (d. 1395)
[English mystic. Works: The Scale (Ladder) of Perfection, Epistle to a Devout Man.]

HUGH of ST. VICTOR (c.1096-c.1142)
[He argues for a close tie between reason and mysticism.]

IGNATIUS of ANTIOCH (c. 35-c.107)
[Christocentric mystic. For him Christ's death and resurrection take on mystical significance.]

IRENAEUS (c.125-c.202)
[Irenaeus' work was directed against Gnosticism. He emphasized John's gospel, particularly the Logos, which became the voice of God that revealed itself to all people. Works: Revolution and Overthrow of False Knowledge (or Against Heresies).]

JOHN of the CROSS, Saint [Juan de Yepes] (1542-1591)
[Discalced Carmelite Spanish mystic. Along with Teresa of Avila, John's mysticism is union with God, attainable only in the denial of the self. Influenced by Teresa of Avila. Works: Dark Night of the Soul and Ascent of Mt. Carmel.]

JULIAN of NORWICH (1342-1413?)
[Julian was part of the "English school" of late mediaeval mysticism. Mystical experience that came at the point of death. The experience came with healing, and she devoted her life to understanding her vision. Influenced by Pseudo-Dionysius and perhaps Aquinas. Works: Showings or Revelations of Divine Love.]

JUSTIN MARTYR (c.105-c.165)
[Used Greek philosophy as the stepping-stone to Christian theology. The mystical conclusions that some Greeks arrived at, pointed to Christ. Works: First Apology.]

KEMPE, MARGERY (c.1413)
[Kempe is known primarily as the biographer of Julian of Norwich.]

LLULL, RAMON (c.1235-1315)
[Franciscan. Legend has it that he wrote 200 works, was an alchemist and a magician. He also worked on the logic of science. The "Great Art" is the scientific and mystical calculation of the interrelations of all things. Works: Great Art, The Book of the Lover and the Beloved.]

LUTHER, MARTIN (1483-1546)
[A well-known antipathy to mystics, but a foundation for mystical life in his theology of the heart, particularly in his early thought. Influences: Augustine, Theologica Germanica.

MECHTHILD of MAGDEBURG (1207-1282)
[Strongly feminine images in mysticism. Devotional mystic. Associated with the Beguines. Works: The Flowing Light of the Godhead.]

MERTON, THOMAS. (1915-1968)
[Prolific writer, Trappist monk given the name Father Louis. Spent many years at the Abbey of Gethsemani in Kentucky, USA. Died accidentally while in Southeast Asia to speak at a conference for contemplatives of many traditions.]

ORIGEN (c.185-254)
[Studied under Clement of Alexandria, and probably also Ammonius Saccus (Plotinus' teacher). He Christianized and theologized neo-Platonism. Each soul has individually fallen (emanation), and must find its way back to God (return) through the help of the Logos, Christ. Origen looks quite Gnostic at times. Works: On Principles, Against Celsus.]

PASCAL, BLAISE (1623-1662)
[French mathematician, scientist, and Jansenist. Influenced by Augustine.]

POLYCARP, Saint (c.69-c.155)
[Had a mystical vision which foretold his martyrdom by fire.]

PORETE, MARGUERITE (d. 1310)
[Works: The Mirror of Simple Souls.]

RICHARD of ST. VICTOR (d. 1173)
[Works: On Sacraments.]

ROLLE, RICHARD (1300-1349)
[Part of the "English school" of late mediaeval mysticism. Emphasizes the "physicality" of the mystical experience (feeling heat, seeing colours, etc.). Works: The Fire of Love.]

RUYSBROECK, JAN van (1293-1381)
[Flemish mystic, sometimes considered one of the Rhineland mystics, who outlined the stages of the mystical life. Works: The Adornment of the Spiritual Marriage (Spiritual Espousals), The Sparkling Stone, The Book of Supreme Truth.]

SUSO, HENRY (1295-1366)
[A Rhineland mystic. Works: The Little Book of Truth, The Little Book of Wisdom (Horologium Sapientiae).]

TAULER, JOHANNES (1300-1361)
[Rhineland mystic and Dominican. He emphasized the inner person rather than outer works, and because of this became popular in Protestant circles in the Reformation, and later Pietism and Romanticism. Was part of the same community that produced the Theologia Germanica. Works: Sermons.]
TERESA of AVILA (1515-1582)
[Spanish Carmelite nun. Formed the Discalced (Barefoot) Carmelites, with St. John of the Cross. Is very important for describing the stages of the mystical journey. Influenced by Augustine. Works: Life, by Herself; The Way of Perfection; The Interior Castle.]


TERTULLIAN (c.155-c.222)
[A faith that is a contradiction to reason. First to use trinitarian formulation for God. Works: To Martyrs, Apology, Against the Valentinians, Against Marcion, On the Soul.]

THOMAS AQUINAS, Saint (1224-1275)
[Dominican monk and the greatest Catholic theologian and philosopher. Late in life, he had a mystical experience which caused him to question his scholastic past. Works: Summa Theologica, De Anima, others.]

UNDERHILL, EVELYN (1875-1941)
[British Anglican contributor to a revival of interest in mysticism. Works: Mysticism, 12th edition. (New York: Meridian Books, 1955) which lists texts, translations, and studies for many different mystics.]

WILLIAM of ST.-THIERRY (c.1085-1148)
[A Cistercian contemporary of Bernard's who also emphasized love-mysticism, but with subtle differences from Bernard in his use of Augustine. Works: Golden Letter, On the Contemplation of God, On the Nature and Dignity of Love.]

 
If any of them accepted Christ's forgiveness on the cross and received the Holy Spirit, they are going to heaven regardless of what they did. Heaven is the Holy Spirit inside of us forever. And since the devil is not stronger than God, then no one can snatch those who've received the Holy Spirit out of God's hand.
 
None of those men founded the church...

Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

Ephesians 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

Each individual will give an account on what he taught or believed on the basis of God's word, the sacred scriptures.
 
If any of them accepted Christ's forgiveness on the cross and received the Holy Spirit, they are going to heaven regardless of what they did. Heaven is the Holy Spirit inside of us forever. And since the devil is not stronger than God, then no one can snatch those who've received the Holy Spirit out of God's hand.

Thats a great post Heidi!

That is a good response! Not full of hate and judgement!

BB,

The Point of this matter is that the people that formulated the CHRISTIAN doctrines and philosphies were in many cases MYSTICS who experienced the Holy Spirit just like Paul did on the road....

A mystic is not necesaarily an "occultic" withch boing brew in a cauldron in the woods or whatever it is that people have in thier minds on that matter....

It merely means one who has achieved a "consciouss Union with God".

In fact I bet YOU have even had experiences where you felt euphoric thinking about Heaven and the redemptive power of the Holy Spirit....

Or maybe you felt that way singing in Church or in the car to a good Gospel song?


That is what a Christian mystical experience is to me.... Not necessarily a mind blowing OBE or Angelic encounter.... just a soft tug on the heart of the believer by the Spirit letting you know you are safe in God's arms....[/b]
 
Soma-Sight said:
If any of them accepted Christ's forgiveness on the cross and received the Holy Spirit, they are going to heaven regardless of what they did. Heaven is the Holy Spirit inside of us forever. And since the devil is not stronger than God, then no one can snatch those who've received the Holy Spirit out of God's hand.

Thats a great post Heidi!

That is a good response! Not full of hate and judgement!

BB,

The Point of this matter is that the people that formulated the CHRISTIAN doctrines and philosphies were in many cases MYSTICS who experienced the Holy Spirit just like Paul did on the road....

A mystic is not necesaarily an "occultic" withch boing brew in a cauldron in the woods or whatever it is that people have in thier minds on that matter....

It merely means one who has achieved a "consciouss Union with God".

In fact I bet YOU have even had experiences where you felt euphoric thinking about Heaven and the redemptive power of the Holy Spirit....

Or maybe you felt that way singing in Church or in the car to a good Gospel song?


That is what a Christian mystical experience is to me.... Not necessarily a mind blowing OBE or Angelic encounter.... just a soft tug on the heart of the believer by the Spirit letting you know you are safe in God's arms....[/b]

I have never argued against being Spirit led or Spirit filled. The bible is the criterion by which we judge not mysticism....

The apostles saw to it that we had the written word not mystical experience to live by.

Peter wrote that although they had real experiences with the Lord and eyewitnesses that we have something better:

2 Peter 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

2 Peter 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

2 Peter 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

2 Peter 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

2 Peter 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

We have the entire bible and we do not need the occult experiences of modern day false teachers and prophets.
 
The New Age Movement (NAM) is both a religious and a social movement. In fact, Western culture is currently experiencing a phenomenal, spiritual, ideological, and sociological shift. It is a religious world view that is alien and hostile to Christianity. It's a multi-focused, multi-faceted synthesis, in varying degrees, of the Far Eastern, mystical religions, mainly Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism, and Western Occultism, adapted to and influenced by Western, materialistic culture. It sometimes appears in secularized forms.

Prominent expressions of the NAM were carried on into more modern times in Europe and America by Emanuel Swedenborg (1688-1772), transcendentalists like Thoreau, Emerson, and Wordsworth (early 1800s), and Theosophy introduced by Madame Helena Blavatsky (1831-1891) (The New Age Rage, pp. 22-24). The decade of the sixties witnessed a revival of Eastern mysticism as traditional values were being challenged. Zen, Carlos Castañada, the Beatles, Transcendental Meditation, and yoga all became popular.

The New Age Movement consists of an incredibly huge and well organized network consisting of thousands of groups, trusts, foundations, clubs, lodges, and religious groups whose goal and purpose is to prepare the world to enter the coming "Age Of Aquarius." A small sampling of only a few of the organizations involved would include: Amnesty International, Zero Population Growth, California New Age Caucus, New World Alliance, World Goodwill, The Church Universal and Triumphant, The Theosophical Society, the Forum, Planetary Initiative for the World We Choose, the Club of Rome, Church Universal & Triumphant, Christian Science, and the Unity School of Christianity. This list, by no means all inclusive, demonstrates the diversity of organizations operating in economic, political, and religious spheres of influence.

The New Age movement is not a unified, traditional cult system of beliefs and practices, even though its roots derive from Eastern religions and the occult. It has no official leader, headquarters, nor membership list, but instead is a network of groups working toward specific goals. One of its main goals is to bring to the forefront a one-world leader who is called "The Christ" or "Maitreya." Nevertheless, it is estimated that there are millions of worldwide followers of various New Age practices and/or holders of one or more of the major beliefs of the New Age.

Read the entire article at http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/newage.htm

The New Age Movement professes a broad-minded openness to all religions, but its basic underlying philosophy represents a carefully calculated undermining of Judeo-Christian beliefs with various combinations of gnosticism and occultism. [Gnosticism is an ancient world-view stating that Divine essence is the only true or highest reality, and that the unconscious Self of man is actually this essence. It is through intuitional discovery, "visionary experience or initiation into secret doctrine" (not the plenary revelation of propositional truth in the Bible), that man becomes conscious of this true Self (Encyclopedia Britannica, Vol. 10, 1968, p. 506; New Bible Dictionary, J.D. Douglas, ed., pp. 473-474).] It bears a remarkable resemblance to the apostate world religion that H.G. Wells claimed as his own and predicted would one day take over the world. It also fits the description of "The Plan" for establishing the new world government that is described in various psychic communications from alleged E.T.'s and ascended masters. There is one more connection: the New Age Movement fits the description of the Antichrist's religion -- a rejection of the Judeo-Christian God and the declaration that Self is God. (Source: The Seduction of Christianity.)

From http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/newage.htm

The New Age also encompasses a wide array of notions: spiritualism, astrology, bioenergy, Chi energy, chakras, nirvana, Christ-consciousness, Native American Spirituality, Prajna, out-of-body/near-death experiences, reincarnation, and the occult disciplines, as well as unorthodox psychotherapeutic techniques and pseudoscientific applications of the "healing powers" of crystals and pyramids. Some commonly used New Age terms are: guided imagery, reincarnation; positive thinking; human potential; holistic; holographic; synergistic; unity; oneness; transformation; awakening; networking; communal sharing; one-world/globalism/new world order (i.e., one language, one government, one currency, one religion); cosmic consciousness; etc. (See New Age Dictionary below.)

From http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/newage.htm

3. Jesus Christ. A major idea in New Age thinking is that of the "Christ Consciousness." In other words, Christ is an office rather than an individual, such as Jesus, whom Christians know to be THE CHRIST. This idea of "Christ Consciousness" asserts that Jesus was not the only Christ, but that He equipped Himself to receive the "Christ Consciousness" (i.e., He was a great "spiritual master" who attained Christ Consciousness), as supposedly also did Buddha, Krishna, and Mohammed. [This is an old occult Gnostic teaching which stems from the ancient Babylonian mystery religions. New Agers also reinvent the historical Jesus by claiming that he spent 18 years in India (during His "silent years") absorbing Hinduism and the teachings of Buddha.] New Agers believe that Jesus received the Christ Consciousness at His baptism, and that it left Him at His crucifixion.

From http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/newage.htm

Many of the occult practices and beliefs revived by the modern NAM were a part of very early pagan cultures. Many practices common to the NAM, such as witchcraft/sorcery, spiritism, divination, (clairvoyance; seeing the future), necromancy (consulting the dead), and astrology, are clearly and strongly condemned in Scripture (Deuteronomy 18: 9-17; Isaiah 47: 9-15). These and other occultic practices were spread through the ancient magic and mystery religions of the Chaldeans, Egyptians, and most notably, the Assyrian-Babylonian culture (Ancient Empires of the New Age, pp. 15-62). Noting the scope of its continuing presence, the Bible informs Christians of Babylon's eschatological implications. The lie of Genesis 3 is significantly developed in Babylon (Isaiah 47) and continues to its ultimate state of development, revealed as Satan's one-world system at the end of the age (Revelation 17-18).

From http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Cults/newage.htm
 
bibleberean said:
We have the entire bible and we do not need the occult experiences of modern day false teachers and prophets.

Many are called, but few are chosen ...

You may wish to express yourself "a tad" more carefully, BB. Some of these men, who you sweepingly refer to as false teachers, may well be holy men and amongst our Father's chosen ones.
 
Re: Are these dangerous Christian mystics on the road to hel

Soma-Sight said:
By the way, mysticism is of the occult.

Few words have been as abused and as misunderstood as the word "occult." Even some encyclopedias list the most nonsensical definitions.

To understand the word occult, we should go back to the days when what we nowadays refer to as France was devided into two areas; one of which was known as the Langue d'Oc (the Southern part) and the other ... the northern part ... which was known as the Langue d'Oil. Over the years the name Langue d'Oil has disappeared, but the name Languedoc (written without the apostrophe and as one word) still survives and is nowadays used to indicate part of southern France. Langued'Oil ... the north ... was the land of the written law and Langued'Oc ... the south ... was the land of the spoken law.

And this is where the Oc of Occult comes from. Occult therefore means nothing but "a cult which, rather than in writing, is passed on by word of mouth" .... from father to son, from mother to daughter, from druid to druid, from shaman to shaman and from priest to priest.

Since several of these "cults" found their origin in early Christian sources which predated the New Testament, they were demonized by Rome and hunted down. Simulteneously the meaning of the word occult gradually changed to the "darker" meaning which it has now; a meaning often associated with magic, etc.
 
Lonely Guide....

You are correct...

Occult means nothing more and nothing less than "Hidden".....

Jesus was in an "occultic" relationship with His disciples....

read on....

10And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

11He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

12For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

13Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.



He spoke to them in "private" and did other things which are "not written in this Book"......
 
This is what the word Occult meant in 1828

occult

OCCULT', a. L. occultus, occulo; ob and celo, to conceal.

Hidden from the eye or understanding; invisible; secret; unknown; undiscovered; undetected; as the occult qualities of matter.

The occult sciences are magic, necromancy, &c.

Occult lines, in geometry, are such as are drawn with the compasses or a pencil, and are scarcely visible


Jesus was not in an Occultic relationship with His disciples.

Matthew 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

Anyone who wants to know the truth can open their eyes.

Matthew 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Matthew 13:16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
 
bibleberean said:
This is what the word Occult meant in 1828

For me ....., BB, this discussion is not about wanting to be right and it is neither about what the meaning of the word "occult" had become by the early 1800s ... after the suffocating influence of some 1350 consecutive years of Catholicism. I have given you the original meaning; the meaning which it had during the earlier part of the first millennium.

bibleberean said:
Jesus was not in an Occultic relationship with His disciples.

Not that I find the subject particularly interesting or the point worth belabouring, but since you now bring this into the discussion ... as set forth in my previous post: occult is that which is passed on by word of mouth. Do we have anything which was written by Christ personally?

bibleberean said:
Anyone who wants to know the truth can open their eyes.

Yes, anyone can, but will he see the Truth right under his nose if he continues to hold on to ideas which obscure that Truth from his view? You see, BB, merely opening one's eyes is not enough. Christ Himself made that quite clear when pointing out that we must give up everything which is between our ears if we wish to commune with Him. You will find words to that effect in Luke 14:33 and in Matthew 13:15 (understand with their heart).

It is not that easy, BB ... one does not encounter Truth until one meets Its conditions. Surrender ... full surrender is the prerequisite. One has to give up the things of mind before one can understand the things of heart. Mind can perceive without love and is capable of perceiving an empty, imperfect shell rather than the perfect spirit inside of it. Even though mind is part of the realm of Spirit, the altar of the temple is the heart.

As for the verses which you frequently use and now and then interpret: in as far as what you allow between your ears will become your truth, perception is a wish fulfilled. Therefore be careful with what you perceive because it is the reality which you offer to yourself; a reality which may not coincide with the Reality which is our Father's Will. Perception changes, made to take the place of changeless knowledge. Yet is truth unchanged. It cannot be perceived, but only known. Truth needs no defense to make it true. What is perceived takes many forms, but none has true meaning. Brought to Truth, its senselessness is quite apparent. Kept apart from Truth, however, it seems to have a meaning and be real. Be careful with perceptions and do not mistake them for Knowledge.
 
Boring discussion. The next time we want to know what a word means we won't go to dictionaries or encylopedias to agree on terms we will all ask lonely guide to define the words for us. :roll:

Please, carry on without me. I have other topics I am involved in...

Enjoy your weekend.

Robert
 
Proverbs 23:9

bibleberean said:
Boring discussion

a definition of boring:
So lacking in interest as to cause mental weariness.

Like I said ...... mind :wink:

And the things of mind are precisely what needs to be relinquished, BB.

bibleberean said:
Anyone who wants to know the truth can open their eyes.

Yes, but some wouldn't recognise Truth if It hit them on the head. Truth may not be quite where you expect to find It, BB. Why sometimes Truth can even be found in ... for instance ... a lowly shrub appearing to be on fire ... a burning bush if you like.

Would some of our contemporaries treat such a bush as a demon or would they listen to it? What do you think?
 
a definition of boring:
So lacking in interest as to cause mental weariness.

Like I said ...... mind

And the things of mind are precisely what needs to be relinquished, BB.

lol....

Your a good writer and echo the Truths I believe quite well in your posts.....

Yes, but some wouldn't recognise Truth if It hit them on the head. Truth may not be quite where you expect to find It, BB. Why sometimes Truth can even be found in ... for instance ... a lowly shrub appearing to be on fire ... a burning bush if you like.

Would some of our contemporaries treat such a bush as a demon or would they listen to it? What do you think?

lol!!!!

Excellent point!!!

Christians fail to realize that the "Prophets" that wrote the "Word" were in there own day and time....

talking to bushes...
talking to entities materializing above rivers....
talking to talking dokeys!!!!!

(these people would be labeled insane in our own time)
 
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