Are these dangerous Christian mystics on the road to hell?

[Solo]

Nice post BB. It is sad to see that the ole enemy himself has destroyed so many people by keeping them blind as they continue a lifestyle in the darkness as opposed to walking in the light. Jesus cannot love anyone with being just as well. Jesus cannot love anyone without instructing them when they err.

Jesus will say to those that are not born of God, "Depart from me ye workers of iniquity, I NEVER knew you".

Jesus does not teach mysticism, He teaches truth full out. He does not have to hide his truth from mankind today, only the counterfeit Christ must hide the lies of deception.

 

[soma]

We should worry about our own sins. We can't judge others.

 

[bibleberean]

We should worry about our own sins. We can't judge others.

You seem to be worried about it... :D

Can you see how inconsistent your logic is?

Jesus told us to beware...

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Matthew 16:6 Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

Mark 12:38 And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,

Can't do that unless we judge righteously...

Paul told us to beware too.

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

If we love one another we will be concerned about each others sins.

 

[soma]

I am worried about the self righteous who kicked Jesus and other people when they are down. Jesus was cursed, whipped, kicked and punched. No need to put vinegar in the wounds of the people who are hurting.

Talk from your heart. We all read the Bible. To click cut in paste is easy. You are not a computor are your?

 

[bibleberean]

I am worried about the self righteous who kicked Jesus and other people when they are down. Jesus was cursed, whipped, kicked and punched. No need to put vinegar in the wounds of the people who are hurting.

Talk from your heart. We all read the Bible. To click cut in paste is easy. You are not a computor are your?

I don't blame you for being concerned about those sins.

It is easy to quote the word of God by cutting and pasting it.

I wish more people would use scripture to back up their points don't you?

Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

 

[Gods-Justice]

I am worried about the self righteous who kicked Jesus and other people when they are down. Jesus was cursed, whipped, kicked and punched. No need to put vinegar in the wounds of the people who are hurting.

Talk from your heart. We all read the Bible. To click cut in paste is easy. You are not a computor are your?

Jesus quoted scripture only to those that claimed to be righteous like the Pharisees and elect of the Jews. (Look it up) He did this to teach them a lesson. To expose their anger, pride, conceitedness through their contradictory use of God's Word.

In regards to the gentiles and common sinners who were not "educated" Jesus did not use scripture. He used parables.

You can talk from the heart using scripture like Jesus did. Or from judgement and anger like the Pharisees did and still do.

The Words dont change, just the intent.

The choice is yours.

Do you seek to be humble and meek like the Saviour, or pomp and conceited like the Pharisee?

Psalm 31:18 Let their lying lips be silenced, for with pride and contempt they speak arrogantly against the righteous.

 

[soma]

"My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed and in truth." 1 John 3:18

 

[Guest]

I read God's word and I believe. I walk by faith in God's word and in His truth.

You guys can take your experience. I don't trust you or your false Christ.

So you claim that God does not speak to men? That he is now absent from this world, and has left men to fend for themselves?

I begin to understand you. What a sad, bitter existence you must live.

 

[Judy]

I read God's word and I believe. I walk by faith in God's word and in His truth.

You guys can take your experience. I don't trust you or your false Christ.

So you claim that God does not speak to men? That he is now absent from this world, and has left men to fend for themselves?

I begin to understand you. What a sad, bitter existence you must live.

For someone who is new here you seem pretty familiar. But, we know you are not new here...huh Sal?

 

[Heidi]

Paul said that if someone comes to us and preaches a different Jesus or a different gospel than the ones he preached, they are false apostles who are deceitful workmen masquerading as angels of light. He also adds that since Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light, it is not surprising then that his servants will also. Then he says that their end will be what their actions deserve. I believe the bible. Others can believe a different gospel other than what Paul preached. But he makes it clear what their fate will be. People can disagree with Paul at their own peril.

 

[reznwerks]

saints

How could they be doomed to hell as they all believed the Holy Spirit dwelt in them as well as you do.

 

[Lyric's Dad]

People can disagree with Paul at their own peril.

And evangelicals accuse catholics of worshiping Mary. Sometimes I wonder if people forget the words of Jesus so they can focus on Paul. Remember, he was a man prone to mistakes and such. Christ was not. If the words of Paul do not line with Jesus's we need to see why not.

Kind of like the almost fanatical hatred of works by the church today. We have taken the reality that only faith saves and turned that into an excuse to never be accountable to good works. Jesus said to do as He said. Who will we follow?

 

[Gary]

Paul taught what Jesus taught

• An honest reading of the New Testament shows that Paul did not teach a new religion. The foundation stones for Christianity are patently taken from the Old Testament, Judaism generally, and the life of a historical figure named Jesus.
  
  A careful study of the Epistles and the Gospel reveals that the source of Paul’s teachings on salvation was the Old Testament and the teachings of Jesus. A simple comparison of both Jesus’ and Paul’s teachings will demonstrate the point:

1. Paul, similar to Jesus, taught that Christianity was a fulfillment of Judaism.

• Jesus declared: “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them†(Matthew 5:17). Jesus added, “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing his way into it. It is easier for heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the Law†(Luke 16:16-17).
  
  Paul’s teaching: The Christ of Paul and Jesus is utterly at home in Judaism. Paul wrote to the Romans: “Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes†(Romans 10:4). He added in Colossians, “Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ†(Colossians 2:16-17).

2. Both Paul and Jesus taught that human beings are sinners

• Jesus declared: “I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them†(Mark 3:28). He added in John, “I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am [the one I claim to be], you will indeed die in your sins†(John 8:24).
  
  Paul declared: All human beings are sinful, insisting that “all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God†(Romans 3:23). He added in Ephesians, “As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins†(Ephesians 2:1). Indeed, part of the very definition of the Gospel was that “Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures†(1 Corinthians 15:3).

3. Both Jesus and Paul insisted that the shed blood of Christ was necessary as an atonement for our sins

• Jesus proclaimed: “For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many†(Mark 10:45). He added at the Last Supper, “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins†(Matthew 26:28).
  
  Paul is just as emphatic: He affirmed that “In him [Christ] we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, in accordance with the riches of God’s grace†(Ephesians 1:7). In Romans he added, “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us†(Romans 5:8). Referring back to the Old Testament Passover, he said, “Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed†(1 Corinthians 5:7).

4. Jesus and Paul also taught that the death and burial of Jesus was completed by his bodily resurrection

• Jesus said: “He told them, ‘This is what is written: The Christ will suffer and rise from the dead on the third dayâ€Â’ (Luke 24:46). Jesus challenged, “Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.... But the temple he had spoken of was his body†(John 2:19, 21).
  After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the Scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken (John 2:22; John 20:25-29).
  
  Paul’s teaching: The apostle Paul also stressed the need of the resurrection for salvation. To the Romans he wrote: “He [Jesus] was delivered over to death for our sins and was raised to life for our justification†(Romans 4:25). Indeed, Paul insisted that belief in the resurrection was essential to salvation, writing, “That if you confess with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved†(Romans 10:9).

5. Jesus and Paul taught salvation is by grace through faith

• Jesus affirmed that every person needs God’s grace. Jesus’ disciples said to him, “Who then can be saved?†Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible†(Matthew 19:25-26). All through the Gospel of John Jesus presented only one way to obtain God’s gracious salvation: “Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life†(John 3:36; John 3:16; John 5:24; Mark 1:15).
  
  Paul taught salvation by grace through faith, affirming, “It is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast†(Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5-7). He added to the Romans, “To the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness (Romans 4:5).

Conclusion

A comparison of the teachings of Jesus and Paul on salvation reveals clearly that there is no basis for speculating on any source of Paul’s teachings other than that of Jesus. Christianity was rooted in Judaism. Indeed, Paul’s message of the gospel was both checked and approved by the original apostles (Galatians 1-2), demonstrating official recognition that his message was not opposed to that of Jesus.

http://www.geocities.com/gary_bee_za/pa ... djesus.htm

 

[Soma-Sight]

5. Jesus and Paul taught salvation is by grace through faith


Jesus affirmed that every person needs God’s grace. Jesus’ disciples said to him, “Who then can be saved?†Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible†(Matthew 19:25-26). All through the Gospel of John Jesus presented only one way to obtain God’s gracious salvation: “Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life†(John 3:36; John 3:16; John 5:24; Mark 1:15).

34Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

35For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

Faith???? Sounds like work to me!

Paul taught salvation by grace through faith, affirming, “It is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast†(Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5-7). He added to the Romans, “To the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness (Romans 4:5).

14What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? 15Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

Maybe James was hitting the bottle too much eh!

 

[bibleberean]

This thread needs to be shrunk back down to normal size.

I will have to delete the post that caused it otherwise. Thanks! :D

Robert

 

[Soma-Sight]

And evangelicals accuse catholics of worshiping Mary. Sometimes I wonder if people forget the words of Jesus so they can focus on Paul. Remember, he was a man prone to mistakes and such. Christ was not. If the words of Paul do not line with Jesus's we need to see why not.

Kind of like the almost fanatical hatred of works by the church today. We have taken the reality that only faith saves and turned that into an excuse to never be accountable to good works. Jesus said to do as He said. Who will we follow?

This is a good point....

Not to mention Paul and Peter disagreed about things as well....

Oh and also James..

 

[guibox]

Paul said that if someone comes to us and preaches a different Jesus or a different gospel than the ones he preached, they are false apostles who are deceitful workmen masquerading as angels of light. He also adds that since Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light, it is not surprising then that his servants will also. Then he says that their end will be what their actions deserve. I believe the bible. Others can believe a different gospel other than what Paul preached. But he makes it clear what their fate will be. People can disagree with Paul at their own peril.

More often than naught, certain teachings aren't judged as a 'different gospel' according to the truth but what to what version of the gospel we want to interpret as truth.

According to Heidi, Paul taught that there is no more Sabbath day (despite Paul's blatant example to the Jews) and that Jesus is our sabbath rest. She would also say that Paul preached eternal torment.

Hence, according to Heidi's reckoning, that would mean that I, in believing in annihilation and the seventh day Sabbath, would be preaching a 'different gospel' and therefore, I am on the road to hell.

Does that make her right?

Nope.

 

[Lonelyguide]

I wrote a post on page 1 of this thread. The post is still there, but "someone" deleted its contents.

1 Corinthians 2:14

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

I thought that this might make interesting reading for those who, like the individual who has deleted my words, have made spirituality into the enemy of Christianity.

 

[Soma-Sight]

Whats up Lonelyguide? Have not seen you in a while.

Good post.

 

[Lonelyguide]

Hi Soma-Sight Good to "see" you

I'm sorry, my friend, but much as this place can at times be an interesting environment, I don't always have the stomach for some of the things that I now and then read here :o From time to time I go back to my mountains. At that altitude there is always a fresh wind. One of the good things about that wind is that it keeps the poisonous flies away ........ if you get my drift :-D