Are We Now Ready To Fight Or To Die?

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Question: "What does the Bible say about killing in war? Is killing in war a sin?"

Answer:There are many wars mentioned in the Bible. Wars of conquest (Joshua 1:6), civil wars (2 Samuel 3:1), and even a war in heaven (Revelation 12:7). Of course, wars involve killing; there is no way around it. We know that murder is sin (Exodus 20:13). But what about the killing of an enemy combatant during wartime?

First, we know that notallkilling in wartime is a sin because there have been times when God Himself commanded battles to be fought. God told the ancient Israelites to possess the Promised Land; in fact, just before the conquest, the Lord appeared to Joshua as “commander of the army of the Lord”—a man of war (Joshua 5:14). God laid out the battle plans for the fight against Ai (Joshua 8:1–2). God told King Saul to “go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them” (1 Samuel 15:3). King David defeated the Philistines by following God’s strategy concerning the battle (2 Samuel 5:23–25). God never tells people to sin, so the Israelites who followed God’s commands to wage war were not sinning. Killing in war cannot be equated with murder.

This is not to say that killing in war has no effects. David wanted badly to build the temple in Jerusalem, but God did not let him. The Lord wanted a man of peace to build the temple, and David’s history had been anything but peaceful. God said to David, “You are not to build a house for my Name, because you are a warrior and have shed blood” (1 Chronicles 28:3).

There is no theocracy today. No nation has a command from God to wage war, and God is not handing out battle plans as He did to Joshua, Saul, and David. Yet wars continue to be fought. It is part a fallen world’s existence. The Bible never condemns the actions of a soldier following orders on a battlefield. In fact, the New Testament has examples of soldiers who had faith in God—Jesus commended a centurion’s faith inMatthew 8:10; and another centurion, Cornelius, was saved inActs 10. These men of war were not rebuked for performing the duties of a centurion, nor were they told they must change professions.

Most tellingly, some soldiers came to John the Baptist as he was baptizing in the Jordan River. The soldiers asked John, “What should we do?” This would have been the perfect opportunity for John to tell them to stop engaging in warfare, stop killing, or stop being soldiers. Instead, John replied, “Don’t extort money and don’t accuse people falsely—be content with your pay” (Luke 3:14). Being a soldier is not inherently sinful.

Paul uses the soldier life as an illustration of spiritual truth (see1 Corinthians 9:7and2 Timothy 2:3). Other references mention battles and warfare (see2 Corinthians 10:4and1 Timothy 1:18).Ephesians 6contains an extended comparison of the Christian life and warfare (verses 10–17). If being a soldier (and doing the things soldiers are required to do) were sinful, it is unlikely the Holy Spirit would have used soldiering as a metaphor for anything good.

Throughout the Bible, warfare is presented as a grim reality in a cursed world. There are forces of evil that must be stopped, and bloodshed is sometimes the result. Whether a Christian should serve in the military is a matter of one’s own conscience, but killing an armed combatant in the context of warfare is not sinful in itself. There is a time and season for everything, including war (Ecclesiastes 3:8).Recommended Resources:War: Four Christian Views by Robert G. ClouseandLogos Bible Software.

Read more:http://www.gotquestions.org/killing-in-war.html#ixzz3QwVk9Uqq

 

[LovethroughDove]

Bill - I feel like I have to tread lightly with you, but here I go.... I do think you have the Holy Spirit in your life. But, it seems like you speak from your flesh a lot.

And Jim - you have a sweet spirit. I appreciate your concern. I maybe shouldn't have threatened what I did, but I know that scripture doesn't have New Testament Christians killing...period. I won't speak like that again, with such dramatics!

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

And Jim - you have a sweet spirit. I appreciate your concern. I maybe shouldn't have threatened what I did, but I know that scripture doesn't have New Testament Christians killing...period. I won't speak like that again, with such dramatics!

Thank You for saying that Love through Dove...
I made the same mistake a very long time ago.....my life went from ok to hell on earth for a very long year....I just did not want you to make the same mistake...
P.S I posted another post that might clear up the two different views.....
Jim

 

[th1b.taylor]

To Everyone.......and Brother Bill please forgive me if I am out of line. We are talking about the written word of God and not simply words we can pick and choose to deploy for our defence..
again I am sorry for this post,,
Every single Born again believer is BORN of the Spirit....You can not change this !!
Hey ya know here is a concept for you, Stephen walked in LOVE and IN FORGIVNESS just as every single one of us IS CALLED TO DO !!

However can we please get back to the op or at least if Brother Bill will allow, can we for once and all, settle this and remember the Integrity of the Written Word please. We are all throwing scriptures around like they are fortune cookies claiming my thinking is better then yours. (( Forgive me Bill))

May I also ask of every one to at least spend some time reading the word and if you are going to post a scripture, please remember to bring along with it ther rest of the scriptures thast go hand in hand with it. Please.

COME ON People.......all the bickering and arguing over what this means or that means and this means this because I say so and all that. I mean THINK before you post.....we got one person saying I will renounce christ if it can be proven true and she claims she only said it because she knows it can not.... That is treading on foolish ground.
How can I with the Love of God in me share truth with you on this with your words laying there in this thread?
Or perhaps you dont truly understand the Written Word Of God as well as you think, AND have NO understanding of the power of words.....Before you say anything about the power of words, Study the written word.....The biggest problems Christians have these days come from thier own mouth.....

If you want to learn about this truth then we can start a new thread. I am NOT attacking a single person.
Please forgive me Brother Bill
Jim

Jim,
Do me one favor, please, stop asking for forgiveness and you are spot on. Even I got sucked in and all you're doing is putting the discussion back on track.

When I posted this I was wrong for a certain lack of framing of the question. This question is not theoretical, even if you prefer burying your head in the sand and not looking at truth, this question is what are you going to do when they show up on your lawn?

The Great Pretender is not going to mount a defense against them and if somebody does not beat them into submission, they will do as they have warned us.

 

[Gary]

I fail to see it as a ploy.

I know.

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[Gary]

The Great Pretender is not going to mount a defense against them and if somebody does not beat them into submission, they will do as they have warned us.

And you believe that's our job, as Christians? Beat the enemy into submission?

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[Fish Catcher Jim]

And you believe that's our job, as Christians? Beat the enemy into submission?

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Gary read the article I posted a few minutes ago about what the bible says about killing in war and is killing a sin.
I also posted an article earlier about the different words and meanings dealing with thou shal not kill and the word slay....Might find it to be interesting....

 

[Gary]

I think the way it addresses this issue is we are called to be prepared and we are called to protect that which is ours, be it property, people or children.
Luke 11:21
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are safe;

1 Timothy 5:8
But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

Luke 11:21
When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own palace, his goods are safe;

The Bible also allows for police officers and the military by this verse, some people do not even believe we should have police or military.

Romans 13:3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval,4 for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God,an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer.

There is also the issue of people who refuse to listen to God when He has plainly told us to protect that which is ours, which IS right in God's eyes, called righteousness. Not doing what God has called righteous - is self-righteous, people who justify themselves by doing nothing and then using God as their excuse.

Romans 10:3
For not knowing about God's righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.

I think we're pretty much on the same page here. I have no problem with coming to the rescue of someone in distress. What I have a problem with is the taking up of arms as a group. It's not biblical under the New Covenant.

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[Fish Catcher Jim]

Jim,
Do me one favor, please, stop asking for forgiveness and you are spot on. Even I got sucked in and all you're doing is putting the discussion back on track.

When I posted this I was wrong for a certain lack of framing of the question. This question is not theoretical, even if you prefer burying your head in the sand and not looking at truth, this question is what are you going to do when they show up on your lawn?

The Great Pretender is not going to mount a defense against them and if somebody does not beat them into submission, they will do as they have warned us.

Thanks Bill,
I will try to refrain from asking forgivness so much.
A righteous anger towards the Integrity of the Written word was burning in me. The word of God is more important then your house or your car or anything else for that matter. How we treat the word of God says a lot and the level of Integrity we have for the written word of God is going to direct how much we see God and His word moving on our behalf.

ALL Glory is to God
Jim

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

I think we're pretty much on the same page here. I have no problem with coming to the rescue of someone in distress. What I have a problem with is the taking up of arms as a group. It's not biblical under the New Covenant.

.

You might want to study this out a little more. As a group ? you mean like the military or vigalanties?

 

[Gary]

Gary read the article I posted a few minutes ago

No offense but I view gotquestions as an unreliable source for the truth.

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[th1b.taylor]

Bill - I feel like I have to tread lightly with you, but here I go.... I do think you have the Holy Spirit in your life. But, it seems like you speak from your flesh a lot.

And Jim - you have a sweet spirit. I appreciate your concern. I maybe shouldn't have threatened what I did, but I know that scripture doesn't have New Testament Christians killing...period. I won't speak like that again, with such dramatics!

Nobody need tread lightly with me, we, every one of us needs to stop ripping God's Word apart and to walk the talk. And I admit my concern for you because somebody has filled you with an skewered look at the scriptures and you are so in that teachings grip you are showing all the signs of the people that drank the Kool Aide from the hand of Jones.

Every time I have told you or anyone else that the New Testament is the Commentary from God on the scriptures I have, actually, offered you and them the opportunity to do what a number of Preachers have refused to try. My Pastor was here today and now he is also praying for you to stop refusing to read the scriptures through in submission to the leading of the Spirit of God. You must know that Jesus is God and everything He taught was based on the Jewish Bible, a.k..a. the Old testament. Brothers Paul and Peter taught from the same bible and the Bereans proved what Paul taught and there was not a New Testament then because the letters were being written.

The Bible does not teach us to be seated and witness out family's extinction as we pray. Jesus is the author of both testaments using about 40 scribes a.k.a secretaries.

 

[Gary]

You might want to study this out a little more. As a group ? you mean like the military or vigalanties?

Being in the military is not a sin. Going to war and killing someone while in the military is not a sin.

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[Fish Catcher Jim]

No offense but I view gotquestions as an unreliable source for the truth.

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Well brother that is your option, however read it and look it up in the word for your self. I wont post crap.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Being in the military is not a sin. Going to war and killing someone while in the military is not a sin.

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AMEN !!!!!!

 

[Gary]

Well brother that is your option, however read it and look it up in the word for your self. I wont post crap.

No.

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[Jesse]

I think we're pretty much on the same page here. I have no problem with coming to the rescue of someone in distress. What I have a problem with is the taking up of arms as a group. It's not biblical under the New Covenant.

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It seems to be important to protect our country from those who would like us all dead and this would involve a large group as in the military. The police are necessary, too.

There is a 2nd amendment for a reason, to stand against tyranny as a group. We are free here because a group of armed men stood up for their rights and beliefs.

 

[Gary]

It seems to be important to protect our country from those who would like us all dead and this would involve a large group as in the military. The police are necessary, too.

We have a military for that. There's no mandate in the scriptures that says we are to pick up arms in defense.

There is a 2nd amendment for a reason, to stand against tyranny as a group. We are free here because a group of armed men stood up for their rights and beliefs.

The constitution is a secular document.

Need I say more?

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[Jesse]

We have a military for that. There's no mandate in the scriptures that says we are to pick up arms in defense.




The constitution is a secular document.

Need I say more?

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We are still commanded to protect that which is ours, I already showed you the verses, and if it's a town we're to protect, then a group would be needed.
The media showed it for a split second, but in Ferguson there were armed citizens of that town on top of buildings protecting the town from those thugs. It was a good idea, chase them out of our towns by force! Why not? Why should they come into our towns and destroy everything all the while we sit back and let them do it?

 

[Gary]

We are still commanded to protect that which is ours, I already showed you the verses, and if it's a town we're to protect, then a group would be needed.
The media showed it for a split second, but in Ferguson there were armed citizens of that town on top of buildings protecting the town from those thugs. It was a good idea, chase them out of our towns by force! Why not? Why should they come into our towns and destroy everything all the while we sit back and let them do it?

The country we live in is secular in nature. The bible labels it as "the world" and states we are not to conform to that world. If we were to take up arms and side with the world, where does that leave Jesus?

Think about it.

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