Believe in God, you will be saved

[GodsGrace]

Thanks for your response. Yes, I know what folks mean by the term. I reject it out of hand.

Was Jesus blood and breath (life) cheap? That's what it cost for him to promise that thief (on the right side, as you say) a place in paradise. We don't know if he felt some love or some fear- the text doesn't say. The accounts in Matthew and Mark tell us that both of the thieves were among those (along with the Scribes and Priests, soldiers and passersby) hurling insults at him, mocking him. Only in the account from Luke does it indicate that at some point one of the thieves felt some remorse or regret, or a sense acknowledging that they were getting what they deserved while Jesus was being unjustly punished. -That's all it says.

The text doesn't even say--- "and the thief believed" when Jesus told him that " “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”

All it says concerning this thief is that he asked-- “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!”

It was a plea. It wasn't a special prayer. It wasn't belief plus anything. But it sure as hell wasn't cheap. Here was the price paid>>

And Jesus, crying out with a loud voice, said, “Father, INTO YOUR HANDS I COMMIT MY SPIRIT.” Having said this, He breathed His last.

Whoever calls out to God will be heard.
I don't think I mentioned a special prayer and I don't think one is necessary.

Jesus taught us how to pray...
Our Father who art in Heaven
Hallowed by Thy name


That's about all we need if we mean it truly.

And let's understand, it's not God's sacrifice that is cheap, no one could possibly believe that.
It's His grace that some cheapen by responding to it in a cheap manner not worthy of the sacrifice.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It occurred to me all the Muslims believe in God. Are they therefore saved? If not, why post “Believe in God and you will be saved?”

 

[Randy]

It occurred to me all the Muslims believe in God. Are they therefore saved? If not, why post “Believe in God and you will be saved?”

Did you read her post not just the title of the thread?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Did you read her post not just the title of the thread?

Atheists might only read the title and think they just need to believe there’s a God of some kind. Muslims might agree with her. If the title is untrue, the inside won’t rescue it. Quoting scripture would have been much better.

I know you all care about her feelings. I care about those who read the title and think they’ll be fine. No worries as they believe there’s a God.

 

[stovebolts]

Easy believism? Is that a thing?

Simply put, it's when one knows better but does it anyway because they think they get a free pass on sin because they know the big guy. In reality, they don't really know Jesus, they simply know distorted bits of Jesus.

Can you explain the concept to these three?

One of the criminals who were hanged there was hurling abuse at Him, saying, “Are You not the Christ? Save Yourself and us!” But the other answered, and rebuking him said, “Do you not even fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? “And we indeed are suffering justly, for we are receiving what we deserve for our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong.” And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!” And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.” (Luke 23)

I don't consider that passage 'easy believism'.

 

[Mister E]

Simply put, it's when one knows better but does it anyway because they think they get a free pass on sin because they know the big guy. In reality, they don't really know Jesus, they simply know distorted bits of Jesus.

I don't consider that passage 'easy believism'.

I'm not so sure that everyone uses the same definition. Not only of 'easy believism' - which I've yet to see a single example of, but of the term "believe" itself. There are many I think, that to simply "believe" is not enough. They insist always that it must be "believe and...."

It might be believe and obey, or believe and ask for forgiveness, or believe and ask Jesus into your heart, or believe and get baptized, or believe and follow, or believe and study, or believe and something else. I'm curious though-- what could be easier that the example I provided of that thief on the cross who was promised paradise?

The only sign of his regeneration was that at one moment he was cursing Jesus, then he stopped. The extent of his belief was--- 'What if' this guy is the real deal. I'm dying because I was found guilty for my crimes, he's being killed not for anything he did wrong, but for who he claimed to be.... what if it's true?

But when he speaks to Jesus he doesn't say -if- he says -when- That's the conversion moment.

When the bystanders and soldiers and the chief priests and the thieves were mocking him it was- "If You are the Son of God, come down from the cross.” “If You are the King of the Jews, save Yourself!”

But when the thief reconsidered the circumstances it became- “Jesus, remember me when you come in your kingdom!”

And that's it! That's the whole extent of his belief. No and's. No if's, and's, or but's. What could be easier?

If that example isn't the easiest easy-- then please, give me a better example.

 

[stovebolts]

And that's it! That's the whole extent of his belief. No and's. No if's, and's, or but's. What could be easier?

If that example isn't the easiest easy-- then please, give me a better example.

I understand your point of view.
I would say this in response. Every situation calls for discernment.

As far as the thief on the cross, we don’t know his situation other than he admits that his actions merited his punishment. However, he knew enough about Jesus situation to also understand that Jesus was unjustly put on the cross.

To me, this indicates that the thief must have been a follower of Christ and Jesus has mercy on him just as he shows us mercy when we ask (1John 1:9).

When I speak of east believism or cheap grace, personally, I am talking specifically about those who abuse Gods grace as a license to continue in their sin unabated. They talk the talk, but don’t walk the walk. They know right from wrong, and willfully choose wrong. Their hearts become calloused and hard.

 

[Mister E]

I understand your point of view.
I would say this in response. Every situation calls for discernment.

As far as the thief on the cross, we don’t know his situation other than he admits that his actions merited his punishment. However, he knew enough about Jesus situation to also understand that Jesus was unjustly put on the cross.

To me, this indicates that the thief must have been a follower of Christ and Jesus has mercy on him just as he shows us mercy when we ask (1John 1:9).

When I speak of east believism or cheap grace, personally, I am talking specifically about those who abuse Gods grace as a license to continue in their sin unabated. They talk the talk, but don’t walk the walk. They know right from wrong, and willfully choose wrong. Their hearts become calloused and hard.

Thank you, and now I understand yours. I wouldn't call it 'easy believism' rather something like 'presumed grace' or as you say- a calloused heart. As far as the thief having been a follower of Jesus- that's pure speculation. And there's no need for it to have been the case as if that was some sort of condition for mercy. While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

 

[GodsGrace]

I'm not so sure that everyone uses the same definition. Not only of 'easy believism' - which I've yet to see a single example of, but of the term "believe" itself. There are many I think, that to simply "believe" is not enough. They insist always that it must be "believe and...."

It might be believe and obey, or believe and ask for forgiveness, or believe and ask Jesus into your heart, or believe and get baptized, or believe and follow, or believe and study, or believe and something else. I'm curious though-- what could be easier that the example I provided of that thief on the cross who was promised paradise?

The only sign of his regeneration was that at one moment he was cursing Jesus, then he stopped. The extent of his belief was--- 'What if' this guy is the real deal. I'm dying because I was found guilty for my crimes, he's being killed not for anything he did wrong, but for who he claimed to be.... what if it's true?

But when he speaks to Jesus he doesn't say -if- he says -when- That's the conversion moment.

When the bystanders and soldiers and the chief priests and the thieves were mocking him it was- "If You are the Son of God, come down from the cross.” “If You are the King of the Jews, save Yourself!”

But when the thief reconsidered the circumstances it became- “Jesus, remember me when you come in your kingdom!”

And that's it! That's the whole extent of his belief. No and's. No if's, and's, or but's. What could be easier?

If that example isn't the easiest easy-- then please, give me a better example.

You aren't hanging on a cross dying.

God expects you to do what Jesus taught us to do.
And that's not NOTHING.

We are to do SOMETHING.
Faith without works is a dead faith.

What do you make of Matthew 25?
Does Jesus give us any instruction there?
Does Jesus give us any instruction in Matthew 5?

What exactly would get you to ACT on your belief in God?

It IS believe AND...
believe and obey.

 

[GodsGrace]

Thank you, and now I understand yours. I wouldn't call it 'easy believism' rather something like 'presumed grace' or as you say- a calloused heart. As far as the thief having been a follower of Jesus- that's pure speculation. And there's no need for it to have been the case as if that was some sort of condition for mercy. While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

Mister E
You cannot make up your own definition of words.
How would we ever be able to communicate?
Easy believism means what it means, even though you may not agree with the definition.

Jesus' yoke is easy...
but He does have a yoke...
we are to do His work.

 

[Mister E]

You aren't hanging on a cross dying.

God expects you to do what Jesus taught us to do.
And that's not NOTHING.

We are to do SOMETHING.
Faith without works is a dead faith.

What do you make of Matthew 25?
Does Jesus give us any instruction there?
Does Jesus give us any instruction in Matthew 5?

What exactly would get you to ACT on your belief in God?

It IS believe AND...
believe and obey.

ahhhhh..... there it is.

Was Jesus just kidding? -when he spoke to that one who was hanging on a cross. Where was his "and" fulfilled?

 

[Mister E]

Mister E
You cannot make up your own definition of words.
How would we ever be able to communicate?
Easy believism means what it means, even though you may not agree with the definition.

Jesus' yoke is easy...
but He does have a yoke...
we are to do His work.

Sorry-- the yoke's on you. I have freedom in Christ.

Who is making up definitions? Can you find "easy believism" in any dictionary? Does it float through your spellcheck?

I'm using common language for a universal understanding of "believe."

 

[GodsGrace]

ahhhhh..... there it is.

Was Jesus just kidding? -when he spoke to that one who was hanging on a cross. Where was his "and" fulfilled?

Are you serious?

How could there be an AND for a man hanging on a cross?
His faith was sufficient.

Is your faith sufficient?
Or does Jesus expect more from you?

 

[GodsGrace]

Sorry-- the yoke's on you. I have freedom in Christ.

Who is making up definitions? Can you find "easy believism" in any dictionary? Does it float through your spellcheck?

I'm using common language for a universal understanding of "believe."

I'm not sure you know what BELIEVE means.
Do you care to explain it?

And easy b elievism is part of Christian language.
Cheap Grace or Free Grace mean the same.

You could check out the following:

Free grace theology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Easy believism Wikipedia - Google Search

www.google.com

 

[Mister E]

I'm not sure you know what BELIEVE means.
Do you care to explain it?

And easy b elievism is part of Christian language.
Cheap Grace or Free Grace mean the same.

You could check out the following:

Free grace theology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Easy believism Wikipedia - Google Search

www.google.com

I’ve said at least twice I’m familiar with the usage of the term. That still doesn’t make ‘believism’ a word. I simply reject it as a concept.

I’m satisfied with the dictionary definitions. Can you offer one?

‘Cheap Grace’ to me is a complete misnomer. It was never cheap. It cost him his life.

It can never be made cheap. But it can be offered for free by the one who paid the price.

Free, not cheap.

 

[GodsGrace]

Sorry-- the yoke's on you. I have freedom in Christ.

Who is making up definitions? Can you find "easy believism" in any dictionary? Does it float through your spellcheck?

I'm using common language for a universal understanding of "believe."

You have freedom in Christ.
Freedom to do what?

 

[GodsGrace]

I’ve said at least twice I’m familiar with the usage of the term. That still doesn’t make ‘believism’ a word. I simply reject it as a concept.

I’m satisfied with the dictionary definitions. Can you offer one?

‘Cheap Grace’ to me is a complete misnomer. It was never cheap. It cost him his life.

It can never be made cheap. But it can be offered for free by the one who paid the price.

Free, not cheap.

OK Mister E
You're familiar with the term but do not accept it.
I'm just happy that everyone on this board knows what it means...
That must mean something.

However, you cannot reject it as a concept...the concept stands.
And as a dictionary definition...we Christians use words that are not in most dictionaries.
I did offer you Wikipedia and a whole page of the concept of easy believism.

I think I explained why it's called cheap grace.
I don't wish to debate the usage of a word, so I'll sign off on this now.

BTW, ain't ain't a word...but we did make rules as to how to spell it !
And it's even in some dictionaries.
Maybe it just takes time...

 

[Randy]

Atheists might only read the title and think they just need to believe there’s a God of some kind. Muslims might agree with her. If the title is untrue, the inside won’t rescue it. Quoting scripture would have been much better.

I know you all care about her feelings. I care about those who read the title and think they’ll be fine. No worries as they believe there’s a God.

Atheists don't believe in God and for the most part are well versed in regard to Christianity. If they were interested in salvation reason would state their not atheists and would dig deeper than a title of a single thread on this board. My Muslim friends are aware of the need of Jesus in regard to Christianity beliefs and reason would state if they were interested in Christianity and leaving behind their faith and what they believe to be true it wouldn't be the title of a single thread on this board. Further you apparently set aside the feelings of another on this board and claim you motive is love. Frankly I don't believe you.

 

[Runner]

This may help. My mind was jogged by something I learned about the tense of Greek verbs in my very first year as a Christian newbie with Campus Crusade. This links to a discussion specifically about "believes" in John 3:16: http://www.jba.gr/The-present-tense-in-Greek-A-demonstration-using-John-3-16.htm.

The point is that the present tense in Greek is unusual. Unless there is some clue that a verb is being used in a different way, the present tense denotes an action that happens now and continues to happen. So "believes" would mean something closer to "believes and continues to believe" - which is the correct theology in my opinion. (The link translates it as "goes on believing," but the point is the same.)

 

[jerry63935]

Atheists might only read the title and think they just need to believe there’s a God of some kind. Muslims might agree with her. If the title is untrue, the inside won’t rescue it. Quoting scripture would have been much better.

I know you all care about her feelings. I care about those who read the title and think they’ll be fine. No worries as they believe there’s a God.

do you have any idea what your posting?

John 14:1​

“Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.” i am not concerned about feeling im concerned over your post reading over this has me standing on my head. trying to figure you out.... john 10: 27My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30I and my Father are one. 31Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. 32Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 33The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.