Catholics' Fruit of Christianity

[NRoof]

StoveBolts

:smt038

I was getting ready to post something very simular.

I still may start another thread because I have a lot to get off my chest on this matter.

God bless,
Norm

 

[stovebolts]

Hi Norm! It is so good to see you! I was afraid that you were ran off.

I hope that the Lord has been good to you and your family.

Thank you my friend, you always seem to be bring a smile to my face!

 

[gingercat]

Look every one,


I am here to voice my convictions. We will be judged accoring to what we do or don't do.

I have been saying this over and over.

The Bible tells us to expose the evil deeds of darkness. I am doing the most of the churches are not doing because of the reasons you have been saying. I don't have to do the same thing as everyone else.

Most of the churchegoers are the majority. I will not be one of the majority. I will not let majority intimedate me. I will keep on speaking up for the Lord. The Fruit Jesus is giving my family is supporting us. That's how I discern by my family's fruit for the Lord.

Either majority of my opinions of me or I am wrong. We both cannot be right.

We will be judged by Him and not anyone else. I hope you respect my responsibility and privileges for the Lord.

I am very aware of what I am doing. Am I just being judgemental, self-righteous or just simply obeying the Lord, we will find out soon enough :wink:

It seems that you have the need of defend yourselves becasue you feel guilty of your Christianity? You did plenty to defend yourseves in other of my threads and now you are shooting at it again?

Again, you never know who we are fighting for; God or satan.

We cannot be in between.

 

[fatboyluis]

man i dont get it,

i know with all my being that the Catholic Church is the Church istituted by Jesus himself,

now im living in 2006 and ur digging up dirt from past acts of ppl ive never met or even know or heard of,
so in the end what are u saying?
ur trying to expose the "bad fruits of the Catholic Church" right?
so ok some ppl claiming they were Catholic did what they did, now so what r u getting at?
now does that make me "one of them"?
and note im not defending these "Catholics" that commited such and such a sin,

so i still dont get what ur trying to say, OOOO u have exposed some secret sin that had never been heard of, ooo and gues what he/she was a Catholic! what pagans!

dude they did what they did, let God judge them, now all i want to do is try and make sure none of that stuff happens again,

anyways God Bless, please be clear in what we're actually talking about, just get it off ur chest, cos i cant be bothered to "work it out"

Again, you never know who we are fighting for; God or satan.

lol i hope and pray its for God, from the fruits that r in my life and r being ripeened it sure seems like im fighting for God

 

[gingercat]

now im living in 2006 and ur digging up dirt from past acts of ppl ive never met or even know or heard of,

It is not just past, evil is still going on. If you don't do anything about it you are one of them.

If you keep make exuse for them you are helping satan whether you realize or not.

 

[Heidi]

Christ said that a 'good tree does not yield bad fruit nor a bad tree yield good fruit' or something similar to that. Someone can point a finger at a 'Christian' and say, "Look! You did something wrong. Therefore Christianity is evil and wrong!" Or they could point the finger at the Person and say, "You did something wrong. You must not be a Christian or you must not be living up to Christian morals."

The main difference is not blaming a group of individuals for wrong done by one individual claiming to be in that group, but is blaming the group for wrong that it endorses. You cannot hold a case against Christianity unless you can hold a case against Christ. The same goes for Catholicism. If Catholics endorse evil deeds, then blame them. If they don't, then you can do nothing but blame the individual claiming to be Catholic. This will merely show that the person claiming to be Catholic is 1. not Catholic if they are acting contrary to the doctrines in Catholicism or 2. has failed miserably and soon will not be Catholic due to circumstances brought on by their failure.

I personally don't know what sort of teachings Catholics uphold other than a mass of liturgy I really don't care for. I've never been interested in it, but I'm just saying judge a group based on what its teachings are - not by one individual screwing up who says that they are from this group. There are plenty of imposters in different societies.

"For by your words you will be acquitted and by your words you will be condemned."

Anyone who endorses calling any human being "Our Holy Father" is accountable to God.

Any human being who endorses making up a new gospel adding that Mary was born sinless is accountable to God. It's that simple. Your reasoning is what the Nazi's used; "I was just following orders."

 

[belovedwolfofgod]

gingercat, you make me sick.

heidi, you make me sick.

neither of you are anything close to christian. the ignorance in this thread hurts a great deal.

just wow.

 

[belovedwolfofgod]

To anyone that is Catholic or even a sympathizer,

Lets drop this thread like a bad habit. This mudslinging contest is shameful. Lets let them say what they want and revel in their ignorance. I, for one, wash my hands of this thread.

 

[gingercat]

Those evil deeds you are protecting so hard make me sick to my stomach too.

 

[ArtGuy]

Any human being who endorses making up a new gospel adding that Mary was born sinless is accountable to God. It's that simple. Your reasoning is what the Nazi's used; "I was just following orders."

Comparing people to nazis is pretty abhorrent. Only the very lowest form of intellect would have to resort to such allusions in lieu of actually constructing an argument.

 

[gingercat]

To anyone that is Catholic or even a sympathizer,

Lets drop this thread like a bad habit. This mudslinging contest is shameful. Lets let them say what they want and revel in their ignorance. I, for one, wash my hands of this thread.

You keep saying the whole truth of the reality is mudslinging. Of course it is ugly. Reality of the catholic is ugly.

 

[Imagican]

Stove, fatboyluis, belovedwolfofgod,

Let me First restate what I already offered in my first post: I DO NOT blame the present Catholics for the horrors perpetuated upon God's children in the past, PERIOD. I wonder what would encourage one to follow the teachings of these, but that is between YOU and YOUR GOD.

Stove, I want to apologize to you personally for directing my entire post towards you. I AM sorry. Forgive me. After reviewing your posts, with your reply firmly in mind, I certainly see your point better now. YES, you are right about the love and forgiveness, but I still feel an obligation to warn others about false doctrine and following false gods and such.

If you and the rest of those present noted the FACTS that I offered in my first post, I am confused as to which ANYONE has a problem with. I have also noticed that all ANYONE had to say in reference to everything offered by me and others so far on this thread, is that NO ONE should be criticizing this religion.

I have yet to see any kind of reasonable rebuttal to the points offered. No one doing anything other than saying, 'these things were in the past'. OK, sure, they were. But HOW is it possible that ANY true followers and teachers of the principles of Christ, ANY who truly believed and understood GOD, have not only allowed such horrendous treatment of their fellow man, but CREATE this EVIL? By following that taught to us by Christ Himself?

This is what I would like to hear. An explanation of HOW one could truly be following the WILL of God and create such an evil establishment? Past, yes, but the teachings are the SAME now as they were then. So, am I to believe that the hearts that formed this 'beast', were 'wrong' then, but different and 'right' now?

And, when one begins to understand the history of the RC, one is left, literally shaking their heads, wondering; and people STILL choose to follow these? I refer NOT ONLY to their acts of the past, but their doctrine that STILL insist that there are those on this planet more worthy to be worshiped than any other.

I mean, my understanding of Christianity leaves ONLY ONE GOD, and HIS SON, Jesus Christ. And Christ stated Himself that WE ARE ALL SINNERS. That, 'there is NOT one that is perfect, NO, not one.

Yet, the Catholics doctrine demands that I COMPLETELY ignore this and accept their leader as a 'Christ-like' intermediary of sorts, that is actually capable of denying my Salvation. HUH?

They teach MANY things that are CONTRADICTORY to the Word. I guess a thousand years ago when they were capable of denying the written Word to the 'few' that could even read, they were capable of forcing their beliefs upon the masses. But these conditions exist NO MORE. I simply hope to offer an understanding to those, (not yet brain-washed by this ????), in the hopes that before even considering following their teachings, they may read the Word in order to discern the difference between it and their teachings.

I REALLY do NOT intend to offend ANY. But, hey, if I got on here and spoke about the negativity that stealing would bring into the life of a Christian, and some took offense, I can only say that it would be the thieves that would complain the loudest.

And NOT just the Catholic, But, BEWARE of ALL FALSE DOCTRINE. Let NO ONE Cheat you out of the prize my friends. Read, READ, READ, THEN decide what faith you will follow. Impossible for most, to even see the truth once they have been indoctrinated and brainwashed into a cult or false form of Christianity.

 

[Heidi]

gingercat, you make me sick.

heidi, you make me sick.

neither of you are anything close to christian. the ignorance in this thread hurts a great deal.

just wow.

Actually, it's your unbelief of the bible that has caused the problmes on this thread. If you believed Jesus when he said not to call anyone on earth 'father' or when he said that among those born of women, no one is greater than John the Baptist, then we wouldn't have to stand up for Jesus against you. But as long as you persist in not believing Jesus but instead, the pope, true followers of Christ will stand up against you. And I'm not ashamed to stand up for Christ one bit. :angel:

 

[CatholicXian]

Imagician,

One thing it may be helpful to think about is that the crusades, the molestation of children by evil priests, and any other evil deed done a priest or in the name of Catholicism has NEVER been part of the doctrine of the Catholic Church. Never.

It has been bad people, and yes even bad popes who perpetuated evil and abuse using the Church (though they never changed the Church's doctrine on Christ-- too concerned with their sins, I suppose).

Nonetheless, you must separate the sinners from the doctrine. All these evil deeds being described in this thread (from both sides of the coin, Protestant, Catholic, etc.) are done by sinful people "in the name of ______". But they do/did so outside of the doctrines/teachings of their own faith (whether that be Protestant or Catholic). The Catholic Church does not condone, preach, or teach murder and molestation, etc.


Other than that, this thread is not edifying to the Body of Christ and so I shall refrain from further participation. I have said my piece.

 

[gingercat]

Bad reputation is bad fruit; You know by their fruit if they are of God or not.

You can say anything, lip-servicing is cheap.

 

[Imagican]

Imagician,

One thing it may be helpful to think about is that the crusades, the molestation of children by evil priests, and any other evil deed done a priest or in the name of Catholicism has NEVER been part of the doctrine of the Catholic Church. Never.

It has been bad people, and yes even bad popes who perpetuated evil and abuse using the Church (though they never changed the Church's doctrine on Christ-- too concerned with their sins, I suppose).

Nonetheless, you must separate the sinners from the doctrine. All these evil deeds being described in this thread (from both sides of the coin, Protestant, Catholic, etc.) are done by sinful people "in the name of ______". But they do/did so outside of the doctrines/teachings of their own faith (whether that be Protestant or Catholic). The Catholic Church does not condone, preach, or teach murder and molestation, etc.


Other than that, this thread is not edifying to the Body of Christ and so I shall refrain from further participation. I have said my piece.

You obviously didn't really understand what I stated in my previous posts. Let me explain it in more simple terms and 'outright'. Yes, I speak of the past, BUT, I MUST speak of the past in order to refer to Catholicism PERIOD. It is NOT a 'new' religion. So, what I offered was a matter of; would these 'bad' people that you yourself referred to, have been able to 'create' a 'good' religion? I mean, the apostles taught one thing, and they chose to alter that into something else.

I personally believe that the 'bad' people came from 'bad' doctrine. If they had been 'following' Christ throughout the 'true' teachings of the apostles, there would have been no where near the 'bad' leaders to which we have BOTH referred.

So, when a religious doctrine that 'claims' to be Christian does NOT conform to the teachings of Christ or His apostles, I MUST question where the discrepancies came from. If not from God, Christ, Holy Spirit or apostles, then I say, IMO, that this is NOT any form of 'true' Christianity. Understand what I just said folks, IN MY OPINION.

Forbid NOT to wed. Ever read that anywhere before? Perhaps if this religion didn't teach AGAINST this very offering of 'truth', (the Word), the priests of this religion may not be out there molesting children. Heidi mentioned a number of false teachings in her posts. Isn't it obvious to ANYONE that has read the Word how divergent this Catholic religion is? I mean, the more I learn of it, the more deviant it becomes.

I condemn NO ONE for their beliefs so long as their beliefs harm no others. As I blame NO MUSLIM for being a muslim, so long as their religion doesn't require them to hurt others simply FOR their religious beliefs, I blame NO Catholic either. But I certainly have the history to back up my opinions concerning the Catholic Church. And my problem is NOT with 'bad' people involved with the religion over the centuries, what I have the 'problem' with is in accepting that God would have chosen these to offer Christianity to with His granting them unlimited power to change or alter it at will.

I don't believe that it was "just" the bad people, but the religion itself that 'leant' to creating of 'bad' people. And I mean this in NO way to disrespect ANY existing Catholic.

 

[CatholicXian]

Imagician,

It was because they were not following doctrine that the fell into sin.

The Church does not forbid marriage. It is a discipline in the Latin (/Roman) rite of the Church, but priests know what they are getting into. Furthermore, certain converts are permitted to become priests and they are already married. I know several married Latin rite priests. (All the Eastern rites of the Church permit marriage, so long as they were married before they became a priest). FYI.

Hope that helps.

 

[Free]

This thread is done. I wish I had noticed it earlier. If anyone actually wants to engage in intellectual debate about some of the points in this thread, copy and paste into a new thread.