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Charismatic Bible Studies - 1 Peter 1:22 - 2:3

Hidden In Him

Charismatic
Staff member
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Growing The End-Time Army, Through The Pure Milk Of The Word

10-Surprising-Benefits-of-Breastfeeding-by-Mama-Natural-1.jpg

The Holy Spirit is sent of God to be our Teacher, and the One who feeds us the word of God as newborn babes, leading us into all truth. This is what Jesus taught the disciples in John's Gospel:

12 “I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak, and He will tell you of things to come. (John 16:12-13)

Peter now urged his readers to grow spiritually by the same means; taking in the word of God as newborn babes, by receiving "the pure milk of the word," which through the agency of the Holy Spirit leads to true spiritual growth and love for the brethren.

22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 24 because “All flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of the grass. The grass withers, and its flower falls away, 25 But the word of the Lord endures forever.” Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you. Therefore, laying aside all malice, all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and all evil speaking, 2 as newborn babes, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby, 3 if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is gracious. (1 Peter 1:22-2:3)

How was the Holy Spirit feeding them "the pure milk of the word" in New Testament times? Some within Cessationist circles do not like to admit it, but the Holy Spirit was often doing so supernaturally, through prophecy, dreams and visions.

Before the gospel was ever preached to the Gentiles, Peter himself received a vision of a curtain being lowered down to the earth with all sorts of unclean foods on it. The message the Lord was sending him was essentially, "Whatsoever is set before you, take and eat," and by extension, "No longer fear to eat with the Gentiles, for they are now about to be admitted into the household of God."

10 Then [Peter] became very hungry and wanted to eat. But while they made ready, he fell into a trance 11 and he saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth. 12 In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air. 13 And a voice came to him, saying “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.” 14 But Peter said, “Not so, Lord! For I have never eaten anything common or unclean.” 15 And a voice spoke to him again the second time, “What God has cleansed you must not call common.” 16 This was done three times. And the object was taken up into heaven again. (Acts 10:10-16)

The Roman Centurion Cornelius also received visions from God, and these two men eventually met because the supernatural power of the Holy Spirit was working in both their lives to direct them to one another, at which time Cornelius and his family heard the gospel, believed it and received the outpouring of the Holy Spirit.

In other words, these visions are what led to the gospel first being preached to the Gentiles. It also opened the door for the entire church to begin receiving revelation from God concerning how He planned all along for this to happen, based on several Old Testament verses.

So the supernatural was playing a part in the pure word being ministered. Even Pentecost itself, where the Holy Spirit was poured out in great measure, ran a parallel with Mount Sinai, where the supernatural power of God was preset to give the Israelites the word. And on Pentecost, the apostle Peter declared that Joel 2 was now starting to be fulfilled, and that dreams and visions would be granted to the church to cause her to grow in the knowledge of God.

14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, raised his voice and said to them, “Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and heed my words. 15 For these are not drunk, as you suppose, since it is only the third hour of the day. 16 But this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel: 17 ‘And it shall come to pass in the last days,' says God, 'that I will pour out of My Spirit upon all flesh. Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your young men shall see visions, your old men shall dream dreams. 18 And upon My menservants and My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days, and they shall prophesy.19 I will show wonders in heaven above and signs in the earth beneath. Blood and fire and vapor of smoke. 20 The sun shall be turned into darkness and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord. 21 And it shall come to pass that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.’" (Acts 2:13-21)

If only this had remained the way the church operated in the things of God.


Ceasing To Receive As Children

One must become as a child to move in the prophetic. You don't know if what you are saying is actually true or of God or not, but you are being called to speak things forth, risking looking foolish. Tongues is no different. The disciples had to endure others thinking they were drunk, and Paul admitted in another place that visitors who saw that gift in operation would declare they had gone mad. But this is part of why the Lord commands us become as "little children." When we speak and act as the Spirit gives us utterance, the Holy Spirit is the One causing us as a body to "grow in the pure word of God" rather than the mere words of men.

Supernatural utterance continued to be attested by the early church well into the next two centuries. Justin Martyr wrote in the second century that "the prophetical gifts remain with us, even to the present time." Irenaeus added "We also hear many brethren in the church who possess prophetic gifts, and who through the Spirit speak all kinds of languages, and bring to light, for the general benefit, the hidden things of men and declare the mysteries of God... some do certainly and truly drive out devils, so that those who have thus been cleansed from evil spirits frequently both believe [in Christ], and join themselves to the Church. Others have foreknowledge of things to come. They see visions, and utter prophetic expressions. Others still, heal the sick by laying their hands upon them, and they are made whole. Yea, moreover, as I have said, the dead even have been raised up, and remained among us for many years." And Origen as late as the mid 3rd Century was still professing to have been an eye-witness to many instances of exorcism, healing, and prophecy. Yet by the 5th century men like Augustine and Chrysostom were attesting that the gifts were now largely gone.

The Lord wanted the church to remain as children who continued receiving instruction through the Holy Spirit, yet the enemy crept in and began telling them they were "adults" instead, and didn't need the gifts. They had spiritually "grown up" now and could handle it themselves. The name "Chrysostom" meant "golden mouthed," and by the time such men were assuming leadership over the church, it was becoming a religious institution run and led by professional orators and rhetoricians rather than Spirit-led, common men like the Lord first chose. Now the church was being led by the very kind of men Paul said he was nothing like when he told the Corinthians:

1 Brethren, when I came to you, I did not come with excellence of speech or of wisdom declaring unto you the testimony of God.... my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, 5 that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in the power of God. (1 Corinthians 2:1, 4-5)

The supernatural gifts continued to survive in what some early church writers referred to as "vestiges" of their former selves until the time of the Reformation, when the worst possible scenario unfolded. While wanting to defend themselves against Catholic excesses and abuses, instead of seeking God for a restoration of the gifts in their New Testament manifestations, the Reformed Movement completely threw the baby out with the bathwater and declared all supernatural gifts were not of God.
 
Cessationism is, generally speaking, a doctrine of Reformed Christianity. Prior to the Protestant Reformation, there was no such explicit doctrine... there were sporadic mentions of some gifts, such as speaking in tongues, and more frequently, but still unusually, of healings and miracles. It was when these miracles in the Catholic Church were used as a polemic against the post-Reformation Protestant churches that John Calvin began to develop a doctrine of cessationism, and it was primarily in the Calvinist tradition that this doctrine was developed. The argument was that as the gifts of the Spirit must have necessarily ceased at the end of the Apostolic Age, it followed that the claims of miracles and healings should be met with skepticism and could not be used by believers to determine God's favor. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessationism_versus_continuationism)


The Fulfillment Of Joel's Vision

So where are we now, and what must be done to grow the end-time army of God through the pure and sincere word of God, especially through Spirit-filled visions and dreams, and through divine utterance? The Book of Joel gives the answer. We must now turn our hearts back to God with fasting and prayer, and cry out to Him to restore unto us the years that the caterpillar, the cankerworm, the palmerworm and the locust (or in other words demonic spirits) have stolen away:

12 “Now, therefore,” says the Lord, “Turn to Me with all your heart, with fasting, with weeping, and with mourning." 13 So rend your heart, and not your garments. Return to the Lord your God, for He is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and He relents from doing harm... 23 Rejoice then and be glad, ye children of Sion, in the Lord your God, for He has given you food fully, and He will rain on you the early and the latter rain, as before. 24 And the floors shall be filled with corn, and the presses shall overflow with wine and oil. 25 And I will recompense you for the years which the locust, and the caterpillar, and the palmerworm, and the cankerworm have eaten, and restore my great army, which I sent among you. 26 And you shall eat abundantly, and be satisfied, and shall praise the name of the Lord your God which he has wrought wonderfully with you (Joel 2:12-13, 34-36)

When the true church devotes herself to fasting and prayer, the Lord's great army will restore true spirtual food to His people through supernatural gifts, as it was in the beginning. The phrase "great army" could also be translated "great power" in the Greek Old Testament, in which case it refers more specifically to the Holy Spirit being poured out during what Joel refers to as the "latter rain." Either way, the church will eat abundantly once again, for through dreams, visions and prophecy the Holy Spirit will minister true spiritual food to those who have ears to hear once again.

28 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your old men shall dream dreams, and your young men shall see visions. 29 And on my servants and on handmaids in those days will I pour out of my Spirit. 30 And I will shew wonders in heaven, and upon the earth, blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke. 31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and glorious day of the Lord come. 32 And it shall come to pass whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved (Joel 2:28-32)

So what is He telling us then? It will not just happen as a result of fasting and prayer, but when we truly rend our hearts before Him, and the importance of this cannot be understated. It says, "Turn to Me with all your heart, with fasting, weeping and mourning." The Holy Spirit is a Person, and desires to be wanted. If we weep like innocent infants crying out for the sincere and pure milk of the word again, it will surely be given, but we must cry out to Him letting Him know how truly we need Him, and what only He can provide.

I will close with a poignant quote from a sister I read on one of the forums recently, and it goes like this:

The Holy Spirit is a person and not just a power or force that we seek to improve our Christian ministry. Too often, we seek the gifts of the Holy Spirit and do not seek to develop a relationship with the Holy Spirit. We need to see the Holy Spirit as a person and cultivate a relationship with Him, like we did with the Father and Jesus. We need to remember that we ought to talk to the Holy Spirit and love Him, and not just want the gifts that He can give to us. Do not seek only after the Holy Spirit's gifts. Rather, be a friend of the Holy Spirit. - His Handmaiden

This is the message the Lord was trying to get across to us in Joel 2:12-31. When the end-time church finally longs for her God and desires Him with all her heart, He will respond, and nurture her with the pure and living word once again.


Questions And Applications

1. How do you feel about prophetic dreams and visions. Are they something you desire to receive knowledge of from God (whether they come through you or from others), or do you still view them with suspicion and uncertainty?

2. Many teach that visions and dreams are not to be placed on the same level as the written word of God, and I personally agree. But how important should we view them, and on what level should we be placing them? If any have been especially important to your walk with the Lord describe them.

3. What would you say to Cessationists who still believe the gifts are not for today, and that we must trust only in the written word?
 
Don't mean to be a negative nelly, but I always have to say what I think. My thought is that although I'm very happy that the Christian Gospel engulfed Europe and rendered its citizens "Christian," resulting in state churches, I think that the mix of true Christians and nominal Christians has tended to dilute the Gospel and reduce "miracles." I think that where unbelief mixes in too much, the supernatural tends to be reduced in effect.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not against either the high churches or the low churches, whether Catholic, Orthodox, Lutheran, Reformed, Baptist, Pentecostal--whatever. It's just that historically, the bigger the Christian organization, the more diminished the spiritual manifestation.

Catholics have long had their "miracle phenomena," but it may have been relegated more to the monks and nuns, or great saints of lore. I think, however, that as Christianity became less "popular" in our day, those who persist in worshping Christ have found a more solid bunch to interract with, and Charismatic phenomena has been more forthcoming.

I hope this is the direction we're going in! I really want to see more of God's manifest presence, above us and through us.
 
Growing The End-Time Army, Through The Pure Milk Of The Word

10-Surprising-Benefits-of-Breastfeeding-by-Mama-Natural-1.jpg
So...right with this title and picture i had a recollection that is kind of interesting maybe.

El-shaddai, if i look in any of my Bibles (maybe i need a better selection?) The footnote always translates that title as "God Almighty" or something along those lines, right.

So apparently back in Moses' day the sign of strength and masculinity was not a muscle-bound dude, the sign of strength was how much something could be provided. So the actual translation of El-shaddai is "the big-breasted God." Although that is a feminine attribute, that was a sign of power in that day, how much He provides for His people. So as bizarre as this may seem....kind of interesting.

Not to side-track, just something i learned along the way, will get to the rest of the study eventually :)
 
Don't get me wrong. I'm not against either the high churches or the low churches, whether Catholic, Orthodox, Lutheran, Reformed, Baptist, Pentecostal--whatever. It's just that historically, the bigger the Christian organization, the more diminished the spiritual manifestation.

That's sort of the natural consequence of time that Christian denominations become watered down over the years - including Pentecostalism - and the reason is simple. They have children, and those children grow up in the same denominations to carry on the work and beliefs of their parents, only they don't come to it as much by freewill as by emulation and peer pressure. This alone begins to diminish the genuine moves of God, because their zeal for the Lord is not as strong. Neither will the leadership be so strong. People simply become set in their traditions, and set in their ways rather than seek God for things that might "rock the boat" as they say.

This is why the Reformation was necessary, despite the mistakes they made along the way. Christ has to be free to move, and "sing a new song" as it were in each succeeding generation until His return. He will not be bound by peer pressure or tradition or church boards or elders. He will seek out those who are listening to the Holy Spirit and will obey HIM, and no one else. There are those who decry so many denominations and even the Reformation itself, but they serve a good purpose, because the Lord Jesus Christ will no longer be bound. Those days are over.
 
So apparently back in Moses' day the sign of strength and masculinity was not a muscle-bound dude, the sign of strength was how much something could be provided. So the actual translation of El-shaddai is "the big-breasted God." Although that is a feminine attribute, that was a sign of power in that day, how much He provides for His people. So as bizarre as this may seem....kind of interesting.

Wow Brandon... At first I thought you might be a little off your cracker this time, but I looked it up and there is actually support for this position. Shaddai also carried the meaning "teat" in the Hebrew. From a Jewish article on it:

In the previous chapter we have discussed the meaning of the word אל (el), as found in אל שדי (el shaddai), and will now focus on the word שדי (shaddai). Most Bible translations translate this word as “Almighty.” Many times a translator will not translate a Hebrew word literally because the literal meaning would mean nothing to the Western mind and in some cases would actually be offensive to the Western reader. Such is the case with the word שדי (shaddai). The use of the word “Almighty” by the translator is his attempt at translating the text in a manner that will both make sense to the Western reader as well as retain some of the meaning of the original Hebrew word.

The parent root for this word is שד (shad). The original pictograph for this word is
heb-anc-sm-dalet.jpg
heb-anc-sm-shin.jpg
. The
heb-anc-sm-shin.jpg
(sh) is a picture of the two front teeth and has the meaning of “sharp,” “press” (as from chewing) as well as “two.” The
heb-anc-sm-dalet.jpg
(d) is a picture of a tent door with a meaning of “hang” or “dangle” as the door is hung or dangles down from the top of the tent.

The combined meanings of the
heb-anc-sm-shin.jpg
and
heb-anc-sm-dalet.jpg
would be “two danglers.” The goat was a very common animal within the herds of the Hebrews. It produces milk within the udder and is extracted by the goat kid by squeezing and sucking on the two teats dangling below the udder. The function of these teats is to provide all the necessary nourishment for the kids, as they would die without it. The Hebrew word שדי (shaddai) also has the meaning of a “teat.” Just as the goat provides nourishment to its kids through the milk, God nourishes his children through his milk and provides all the necessities of life. This imagery can be seen in the following passage:

“And I will come down to snatch them [Israel] from the hand of the Egyptians and to bring them up from that land to a good and wide land to a land flowing with milk and honey.” Exodus 3:8

The word שדי (teat) is often coupled with the word אל (mighty, strong) creating the phrase אל שדי (el shaddai) literally meaning the “mighty teat,” hence we can see the translator's reluctance to literally translate this phrase in this manner and instead using the more sanitized “God Almighty.”

The idea of God being characterized as having teats does not sit well in our Western culture. We are familiar with identifying with God as a father, but not as a mother.... But God promised the nation of Israel that he would bring them into a “land flowing with milk and honey.” God as the אל שדי (el shaddai), the mighty teat, will supply his children with his life sustaining milk. (The Meaning of El-Shaddai. Ancient Hebrew Research Center)

Is that not incredible or what... I'm astonished. It's obviously a metaphor because God ultimately has no sex and therefore has no gender. But He compared Himself to animals on occasion (a Lion, and an Eagle), so why would He not compare Himself to the Ultimate Provider as a nursing mother as well?

There's also an article in Christianity.com that acknowledges the root etymology as well, which is why it could also be translated as The "All-Sufficient" God:

The term is a compound of two words: "El," which is a generic term for God in Hebrew, and "Shaddai," which is derived from the root word meaning "breast" or "mountain."

There's more on this actually as well now that I'm looking at it. Maybe I can do a little research and post on it more tomorrow. :thumbsup2 :thumbsup2 :thumbsup2
 
There's more on this actually as well, now that I'm looking. Maybe I can do a little research and post on it more tomorrow. :thumbsup2 :thumbsup2 :thumbsup2

The Scofield Bible used to acknowledge it as well (not sure if it still does):

(1) The etymological signification of Almighty God (El Shaddai ) is both interesting and touching. God (El ) signifies the “Strong One” (Gen. 1.1, note). The qualifying word Shaddai is formed from the Hebrew word “shad” the breast, invariably used in Scripture for a woman’s breast; e.g. Genesis 49: 25; Job 3: 12; Psalms 22: 9; Song 1:13; 4:5, 7: 3, 7-8; 8:1, 8, 10; Isa. 28: 9; Ezekiel 16: 7. Shaddai therefore primarily means “the breasted one.”

There's this from Isaiah 60:16: “You will drink the milk of nations and be nursed at royal breasts. Then you will know that I, Yahweh, am your Savior, your Redeemer, the [Shaddai] of Jacob.”

The New Agers and Gnostics would likely go bonkers with a discussion like this, and it should never be taken out of context that He is depicted in scripture as masculine far more than as feminine. But taken in the right contexts, there is evidence He used the "All-Sufficient" imagery to present Himself as the ultimate Provider as well.
 
1. How do you feel about prophetic dreams and visions. Are they something you desire to receive knowledge of from God (whether they come through you or from others), or do you still view them with suspicion and uncertainty?

2. Many teach that visions and dreams are not to be placed on the same level as the written word of God, and I personally agree. But how important should we view them, and on what level should we be placing them? If any have been especially important to your walk with the Lord describe them.

3. What would you say to Cessationists who still believe the gifts are not for today, and that we must trust only in the written word?

1.) Personally, I'm still not sure... they could be something that God gives us so that we receive knowledge, or they could be fake, and just our subconscious trying to process what we've been through over the day, or over the week... I believe they're possible, I just don't think that they are as commonplace as some individuals may tend to believe. The last time I went to church, I listened to a Q&A from Conrad Vine, He made a remark saying that those who want to hear from other people who have dreams and visions of Jesus, he encouraged those to get Involved with outbound ministries. Experience, he has talked to many Muslims who have had dreams and visions of Jesus, and have described how He looks as He is described in Revelation 19

2.) I lean on the side of caution, simply because in my experience, I have heard more about dreams and visions from individuals who claim their vision or dream is real, get when they describe the vision or dream, it doesn't add up with scripture... I see more of that than act people actually having dreams that can be interpreted with scripture. Of course, again, I'm not saying that dreams and visions can't happen, I do believe they can and do happen, I've had a few in my life, I just am very cautious, because within the Christian community, dreams and visions become very sensational, and for some it becomes so sensational, it replaces the scriptures... and I don't like that at all.

3.) Even as I err on the side of caution, I am not a cessationist, I would challenge them to interact and have a conversation with those who do have bona fide dreams and visions that God has given to them. It's easy for us as Christians to sit in a pew, with a mental box, saying "oh, it's only this, that, and the other", when the truth is, at least on this particular topic, I do believe that God can work outside that box... if the Lord is willing to give Muslims the visions of Jesus Christ returning in a white robe as is mentioned in Revelation 19, then I would definitely say there's something going on, and it deserves to be looked at more closely, especially where we are when it concerns end times and biblical prophecy
 
So...right with this title and picture i had a recollection that is kind of interesting maybe.

El-shaddai, if i look in any of my Bibles (maybe i need a better selection?) The footnote always translates that title as "God Almighty" or something along those lines, right.

So apparently back in Moses' day the sign of strength and masculinity was not a muscle-bound dude, the sign of strength was how much something could be provided. So the actual translation of El-shaddai is "the big-breasted God." Although that is a feminine attribute, that was a sign of power in that day, how much He provides for His people. So as bizarre as this may seem....kind of interesting.

Not to side-track, just something i learned along the way, will get to the rest of the study eventually :)
Our darker side, as human beings, tends to elevate physical strength and military attributes. A lot of guys enjoy firing off guns or fireworks--they like to break glass, or blow things up..

But in international relations, and even in marriages, aggression can be very bad. Forcing our own way puts us up against One so very much bigger than ourselves, namely God.

But I wouldn't want to say that everything we do morally is a contest of nerves, over how much we want to irritate the God who can stomp us to death in a heartbeat. I think He wants us to believe that strength of character is much more important, and the strength to persevere in grace is better than winning the Olympics.

Back on the topic of charismatic gifts and spiritual manifestations, we know we can't force God to do our will or to do tricks for us, as King Herod tried to get Jesus to do. But it may be a matter of showing God our willingness to submit to His kindness that allows Him to entrust to us spiritual gifts and spiritual phenomena? Why would He show us important things if we're just going to use it to show ourselves superior to others?
 
So apparently back in Moses' day the sign of strength and masculinity was not a muscle-bound dude, the sign of strength was how much something could be provided. So the actual translation of El-shaddai is "the big-breasted God." Although that is a feminine attribute, that was a sign of power in that day, how much He provides for His people. So as bizarre as this may seem....kind of interesting.

Here's more. From an article by the Jerusalem Prayer Team:

If you check carefully the first three references to El Shaddai in the Bible you’ll be more than surprised. These are the three cases when God speaks in first person. Each verse is about fertility and the name Shaddai is stressed. Here is how El Shaddai is connected with fruitfulness:

‘May God Almighty [El Shaddai] bless you and make you fruitful and increase your numbers…’ (Genesis 28:3)

‘I am God Almighty [El Shaddai]: be fruitful and increase in number’ (Genesis 35:11)

‘By the Almighty [El Shaddai] who will bless you with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lies beneath, blessings of the breasts [shadayim] and of the womb [racham]’ (Genesis 49:25)

 
SuperKal. Sorry for the late answers. Couldn't get back to this until now.
1.) Personally, I'm still not sure... they could be something that God gives us so that we receive knowledge, or they could be fake, and just our subconscious trying to process what we've been through over the day, or over the week... I believe they're possible, I just don't think that they are as commonplace as some individuals may tend to believe.

You know, it's a truly curious question about how much He tries speaking even to the common man through dreams but we just don't get it. Scripture says Pilate's wife had a dream the night before the crucifixion and even warned him about it, and she obviously wasn't Christian yet...

I have had dreams my whole life, ever since I was a child, but I couldn't interpret until the Lord opened that up to me much later in life. But then no one mentioned to me that they could have meaning. Maybe if they had I might have sought the Lord earlier in life? I don't know. But I do think He speaks even to unsaved people to protect them from harm, and even if we may not get things consciously, we can still pick up on things subconsciously, and make the right moves to protect ourselves from stuff happening. My wife's sister will get premonition dreams pretty frequently, and she's not really Christian - very nominal at best - yet I think He still speaks to her nonetheless.

It's an interesting question.
The last time I went to church, I listened to a Q&A from Conrad Vine, He made a remark saying that those who want to hear from other people who have dreams and visions of Jesus, he encouraged those to get Involved with outbound ministries. Experience, he has talked to many Muslims who have had dreams and visions of Jesus, and have described how He looks as He is described in Revelation 19

Oh absolutely. I have a thread on this that I could post later. It's amazing the things He has been doing among the Muslims, but He has to, in part because we are not reaching them very well through apologetics or evangelism.
 
2.) I lean on the side of caution, simply because in my experience, I have heard more about dreams and visions from individuals who claim their vision or dream is real, get when they describe the vision or dream, it doesn't add up with scripture... I see more of that than act people actually having dreams that can be interpreted with scripture. Of course, again, I'm not saying that dreams and visions can't happen, I do believe they can and do happen, I've had a few in my life, I just am very cautious, because within the Christian community, dreams and visions become very sensational, and for some it becomes so sensational, it replaces the scriptures... and I don't like that at all.

Thanks for your honesty. And I'll tell you what I think is going on there. The problem isn't with the dreams, it's with the interpretation. Many Christians I think unfortunately don't know the word all that well, and they can only apply what they know to their interpretation of dreams. So if they assume scripture teaches that the rapture could happen two days from now, if they receive a dream that resembles the rapture, they can just run with it and start telling everyone, "Thus saith the Lord, The Rapture is Coming!!" when that's not what the dream actually meant at all.

I've seen men with large, very well established ministries makes this mistake, and I've even seen genuine prophets make it. Their dream is real, and it's from God, but the way they were interpreting it was screwed up. But interpretation can be hard for me as well, so I certainly don't judge anyone over it. But the problem is almost invariably on the interpretation end, not on the dreamer's end.
 
3.) Even as I err on the side of caution, I am not a cessationist, I would challenge them to interact and have a conversation with those who do have bona fide dreams and visions that God has given to them. It's easy for us as Christians to sit in a pew, with a mental box, saying "oh, it's only this, that, and the other", when the truth is, at least on this particular topic, I do believe that God can work outside that box... if the Lord is willing to give Muslims the visions of Jesus Christ returning in a white robe as is mentioned in Revelation 19, then I would definitely say there's something going on, and it deserves to be looked at more closely, especially where we are when it concerns end times and biblical prophecy

Absolutely. I'll try and find that thread, post it, and then send you a link here when I'm finished. It's really kind of amazing. :thumbsup2
 
if the Lord is willing to give Muslims the visions of Jesus Christ returning in a white robe as is mentioned in Revelation 19, then I would definitely say there's something going on, and it deserves to be looked at more closely, especially where we are when it concerns end times and biblical prophecy

Here's the thread I was referring to, Kal. I posted it back in April at my place, but it came to mind when you were sharing about how He speaks to them through visions and dreams.

 
Out of all the studies, i feel this one in particular has been a great overview of the forest. The broad picture and goal of your ministry. Very clear and concise. I love it and it seems like a good one to meditate on. The basic steps for calling on the Lord. Fasting, prayer and mourning. 3 very important things. And as for the mourning...
12 “Now, therefore,” says the Lord, “Turn to Me with all your heart, with fasting, with weeping, and with mourning." 13 So rend your heart, and not your garments.
This verse here is really wonderful. Rend your heart and not your garments. I think its what God has been calling for from the beginning and all He's ever wanted from His people, not just in the context of this study, but in relation to the atonement law for the jews back then and our relationship with God in general. It really speaks to me.

The instructions couldnt be any clearer. Praise God 🙏😁😆
 
Don't get me wrong. I'm not against either the high churches or the low churches, whether Catholic, Orthodox, Lutheran, Reformed, Baptist, Pentecostal--whatever. It's just that historically, the bigger the Christian organization, the more diminished the spiritual manifestation.
That's sort of the natural consequence of time that Christian denominations become watered down over the years - including Pentecostalism - and the reason is simple. They have children, and those children grow up in the same denominations to carry on the work and beliefs of their parents, only they don't come to it as much by freewill as by emulation and peer pressure.

The diminished spiritual manifestation or watering down for Christians seems like its in congruence with people repeatedly falling away from God throughout the old testament. It seems like we might be repeating history to this very day and at the same time, some may find it easy to scoff at everyone in the OT while being cut from the exact same cloth.
 
Our darker side, as human beings, tends to elevate physical strength and military attributes. A lot of guys enjoy firing off guns or fireworks--they like to break glass, or blow things up..

But in international relations, and even in marriages, aggression can be very bad. Forcing our own way puts us up against One so very much bigger than ourselves, namely God.

But I wouldn't want to say that everything we do morally is a contest of nerves, over how much we want to irritate the God who can stomp us to death in a heartbeat. I think He wants us to believe that strength of character is much more important, and the strength to persevere in grace is better than winning the Olympics.

Back on the topic of charismatic gifts and spiritual manifestations, we know we can't force God to do our will or to do tricks for us, as King Herod tried to get Jesus to do. But it may be a matter of showing God our willingness to submit to His kindness that allows Him to entrust to us spiritual gifts and spiritual phenomena? Why would He show us important things if we're just going to use it to show ourselves superior to others?
Your insight is always flavorful Randy :) i like what your saying !!
 
The diminished spiritual manifestation or watering down for Christians seems like its in congruence with people repeatedly falling away from God throughout the old testament. It seems like we might be repeating history to this very day and and at the same time, some may find it easy to scoff at everyone in the OT while being cut from the exact same cloth.
Absolutely, I agree. We tend to think that somehow we, in our own culture, have arrived at some superior position, when all around us we see the very same fallenness or proneness to self-destruction.

Judges 2.8 Joshua son of Nun, the servant of the Lord, died at the age of a hundred and ten. 9 And they buried him in the land of his inheritance, at Timnath Heres in the hill country of Ephraim, north of Mount Gaash.
10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel. 11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. 12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger 13 because they forsook him and served Baal and the Ashtoreths. 14 In his anger against Israel the Lord gave them into the hands of raiders who plundered them. He sold them into the hands of their enemies all around, whom they were no longer able to resist.
 
1. How do you feel about prophetic dreams and visions. Are they something you desire to receive knowledge of from God (whether they come through you or from others), or do you still view them with suspicion and uncertainty?
Love 'em !!
2. Many teach that visions and dreams are not to be placed on the same level as the written word of God, and I personally agree. But how important should we view them, and on what level should we be placing them? If any have been especially important to your walk with the Lord describe them.
Dont let the dreams and visions, miracles, healings, what have you, over shadow the relationship we have with God Himself. The final quote in your study from His Handmaiden was a sober reminder to keep things in perspective, and it rounded off the study beautifully.
3. What would you say to Cessationists who still believe the gifts are not for today, and that we must trust only in the written word?
Off the top of my head. They are restricting God to a box that He doesnt fit in.
 
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Here's more. From an article by the Jerusalem Prayer Team:

If you check carefully the first three references to El Shaddai in the Bible you’ll be more than surprised. These are the three cases when God speaks in first person. Each verse is about fertility and the name Shaddai is stressed. Here is how El Shaddai is connected with fruitfulness:

‘May God Almighty [El Shaddai] bless you and make you fruitful and increase your numbers…’ (Genesis 28:3)

‘I am God Almighty [El Shaddai]: be fruitful and increase in number’ (Genesis 35:11)

‘By the Almighty [El Shaddai] who will bless you with blessings of heaven above, blessings of the deep that lies beneath, blessings of the breasts [shadayim] and of the womb [racham]’ (Genesis 49:25)

Reading these scriptures with that perspective sure do add an elegance to that title :)
 
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