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Christians & secular music

empathologicalism said:
Christian music is like Christian movies, though the music has more variety hence more quality, the movies are an affront to Christians
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By and large I agree. There are some I've seen that like with some music, aren't labeled specifically as Christian, but that have the Christian message in them, that are quite good. Often not the highest quality acting, but definitely miles ahead of the horribly stilted and stiff stuff present in anything from Sherwood Pictures.
 
chaz345 said:
Exactly. With the idea that songs must mention God or Jesus explicitly a certain number of times in order to called christian, It's no wonder that many Christian artists don't what to be specifically known as Christian artists. The point about reaching a wider audience is a good one too. If one is known as a Christian music artist, then it's pretty much guaranteed that the only people who will hear you are people who are already Christians. OTOH, an artist who is Christian, but who chooses to be known as a musician/artist and who still has the Christian message an meanings in their music although perhaps a little more subtly, will have that message reach a much larger audience. And hearing such things are often the seeds needed for someone to become a Christian. Listening to primarily country music, with the largely positive moral messages, and sometimes even direct references to God/Jesus played a huge part in getting my heart/mind into the proper place for accept Jesus. But at the time, I can guarantee that hearing more specifically "Christian" music I would have tuned it out.

And I disagree that Rap as a music forum is necessarily repulsive or un-Christian. Ever hear of Toby Mac or Kirk Franklin? Or the clearly Christian rap in the movie The Fighting Temptations?
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chaz345:

Interesting.

So what are your favorite groups?

Blessings.
 
farouk said:
chaz345:

Interesting.

So what are your favorite groups?

Blessings.
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Casting Crowns, The Afters and Tenth Avenue North currently top the list.

I've got nothing against Christian music at all. My issue is with the idea that's seemingly been implied in this thread, and outright stated other places I've seen, that music must explicitly mention God/Jesus in order to be Christian. Maybe an example will illustrate a bit where I'm comming from.

Are these lyrics "Christian"?
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/petergabriel/inyoureyes.html

It's a song written and performed in the early 80's I beleive, but Peter Gabriel, a decidedly non-Christian artist. If not then did it suddenly become Christian when it was re-recorded by Nichole Nordeman and played on KLOVE?

In my opinion ANY music that causes the listener to turn their heart/mind toward God is christian. The point of view or intent of the author/performer is largely irrelevant. And music from an artist who is a Christian, but who chooses not tbe be specifically known as a Christian artist is no less Christian than music from an artist signed on a Christian label and only played on Christian radio. The "ah ha" moment when pointing out the Christian meaning in a song by the Fray, or Switchfoot to someone who had never noticed it before is very powerful in evangelizing.
 
BobE said:
Something that I've been very interested in, is the growing number of Christian artists that have been signed by "secular" labels. This term itself can be misleading, however, since some of those working for these labels are also believers.

In other words, many Christians--musically--are embracing a new model: be in the world, but not of the world.
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I heard an interview with a Christian artist several years ago, I completely forget who, who was struggling with the idea of signing with a label that wasn't specifically Christian. Someone from the label, obviously a Christian, said to her, "You've got a bucket of water, what's going to do more good, dumping it into the ocean, or bringing it to the desert?"

Like I said before, signing with a Christian label and specifically identifying one's self as a Christian artist pretty much guarantees that the only people what will hear you are already Christians. And there's nothing wrong with that, people who are already Christians need the music and message too. But there's also nothing wrong with being a little more subtle with your Christian message, and expressing it in a way that non-believers will listen too. To put it another way, Switchfoot, or The Fray are no less Christian than Casting Crowns or Mathew West.
 
chaz345 said:
Casting Crowns, The Afters and Tenth Avenue North currently top the list.

I've got nothing against Christian music at all. My issue is with the idea that's seemingly been implied in this thread, and outright stated other places I've seen, that music must explicitly mention God/Jesus in order to be Christian. Maybe an example will illustrate a bit where I'm comming from.

Are these lyrics "Christian"?
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/petergabriel/inyoureyes.html

It's a song written and performed in the early 80's I beleive, but Peter Gabriel, a decidedly non-Christian artist. If not then did it suddenly become Christian when it was re-recorded by Nichole Nordeman and played on KLOVE?

In my opinion ANY music that causes the listener to turn their heart/mind toward God is christian. The point of view or intent of the author/performer is largely irrelevant. And music from an artist who is a Christian, but who chooses not tbe be specifically known as a Christian artist is no less Christian than music from an artist signed on a Christian label and only played on Christian radio. The "ah ha" moment when pointing out the Christian meaning in a song by the Fray, or Switchfoot to someone who had never noticed it before is very powerful in evangelizing.
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chaz345:

Oh yes, Casting Crowns. I like their East/West song.

Ty for your reply.

Blessings.
 
farouk said:
Crusader:

I see you like Demon Hunter; not for the faint-hearted, is it? (Some of their stuff played on the piano is quite tuneful, though.)

Blessings.
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Not really, even though they really aren't that heavy; there are worse bands for the faint-hearted than Demon Hunter. Although, it seems that their newer music has gotten a bit heavier.
 
Crusader7000 said:
Not really, even though they really aren't that heavy; there are worse bands for the faint-hearted than Demon Hunter. Although, it seems that their newer music has gotten a bit heavier.
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Crusader7000:

Yes, well like I said, especially when played on the piano, some of the Demon Hunter stuff can actually be quite tuneful. Seems that with other of the music, where there is a whole lot of accompaniment, the Demon Hunter vocalists seem really to like to sing with a high pitched rasping voice, don't they? (Maybe you like that, of course.)

Blessings.
 
farouk said:
Crusader7000:

Yes, well like I said, especially when played on the piano, some of the Demon Hunter stuff can actually be quite tuneful. Seems that with other of the music, where there is a whole lot of accompaniment, the Demon Hunter vocalists seem really to like to sing with a high pitched rasping voice, don't they? (Maybe you like that, of course.)

Blessings.
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Perhaps. Still, there's heavier music than Demon Hunter, but I understand that some people can't handle any metal.
 
Crusader7000 said:
Perhaps. Still, there's heavier music than Demon Hunter, but I understand that some people can't handle any metal.
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Crusader7000: Yes well, if you really like the rasping, high pitched voices and the loud percussion and so on, you'll really be into metal, I guess. (And also several of the Demon Hunter vocalists have gotten themselves appropriate arm tattoos as guys who will be pretty visible performers, haven't they.)
 
farouk said:
Crusader7000: Yes well, if you really like the rasping, high pitched voices and the loud percussion and so on, you'll really be into metal, I guess. (And also several of the Demon Hunter vocalists have gotten themselves appropriate arm tattoos as guys who will be pretty visible performers, haven't they.)
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Most of the bands I like don't have high pitched raspy voices, though some (the power metal bands I like) have just high pitches.

[video=youtube;f8S3DPc8x3U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8S3DPc8x3U[/video]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8S3DPc8x3U
 
Crusader7000 said:
Most of the bands I like don't have high pitched raspy voices, though some (the power metal bands I like) have just high pitches.

[video=youtube;f8S3DPc8x3U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8S3DPc8x3U[/video]
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Crusader7000:

Yes, well I 'hear you'.

I can see you really like this kind of sound, anyway.
 
farouk said:
I love Philippians 4.8.

It sets a wholesome perspective.
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:amen brother. Worship music is great as is Contemporary or Southern Gospel Christian Music, but we are NOT limited to it only. More people should actually read Phil 4:8
I do wonder though if those that don't think it is proper to listen to secular music, carry that to secular TV or Movies?
 
Stuggling with this right now Ive been reading a lot & watching a lot of different views on Secular music its origins, messages (open & Hidden) Even so called " Christian Approved" music I have a problem with because its still formed (in my opinion) after music that is ungodly/anti christ. I dont see how it is okay to still dressed like the world (too tight/loose clothing, gaudy jewelry, make up galore, fake hair, piercings & tattoo's etc) and say you also follow Christ that just does not seem right to me....Im also guilty of piercings & tattoo's.... Im not saying everyone does this but where do you draw the line?? Its all confusing to me where to stand on this issue. Im someone who loves music in general its hard for me to break away but thru prayer I know the chains will be broken. Really tough topic for me....and then that leads into other issues like Tv/ movies/ practically everything if you really think about it. Guess that's why we have the Holy Ghost to lead & guide us into ALL truth.
 
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Stan53 said:
:amen brother. Worship music is great as is Contemporary or Southern Gospel Christian Music, but we are NOT limited to it only. More people should actually read Phil 4:8
I do wonder though if those that don't think it is proper to listen to secular music, carry that to secular TV or Movies?
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Stan53:

Yes, and you know if you think about it, all those wholesome and good things mentioned in Phil. 4.8 are exemplified by the Lord Jesus, if you follow through those ideas from what the Bible says about Him.

And I think that a background of wholesome music is a good thing and can be calming to people. (A lot of media stuff isn't!)

Blessings.
 
ReesesPieces said:
Stuggling with this right now Ive been reading a lot & watching a lot of different views on Secular music its origins, messages (open & Hidden) Even so called " Christian Approved" music I have a problem with because its still formed (in my opinion) after music that is ungodly/anti christ. I dont see how it is okay to still dressed like the world (too tight/loose clothing, gaudy jewelry, make up galore, fake hair, piercings & tattoo's etc) and say you also follow Christ that just does not seem right to me....Im also guilty of piercings & tattoo's.... Im not saying everyone does this but where do you draw the line?? Its all confusing to me where to stand on this issue. Im someone who loves music in general its hard for me to break away but thru prayer I know the chains will be broken. Really tough topic for me....and then that leads into other issues like Tv/ movies/ practically everything if you really think about it. Guess that's why we have the Holy Ghost to lead & guide us into ALL truth.
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ReesesPieces:

Hi. My suggestion is that some good Christian hymns and songs, if you play them quietly in the background, especially if you know the words and they are God honoring, can have a very wholesome and soothing effect. Even music that is not specifically Christian but which is tuneful and warm can help people to keep calm: after all, it was God Who created harmony and love: He IS love.

I know some people can go 'over the top', as it were.

But remember there is also the other extreme that the Lord Jesus attacked strongly: for people to have such a "correct and religious" and well dressed exterior like the Pharisees and Sadducees, but inwardly they were like wolves; He called the proud and strictly religious and self-righteous people "whited sepulchres", so in avoiding going 'over the top' in the way we behave, dress, etc. in one direction, it's good to avoid the other extreme, too.

Re. piercings and tattoos, hair color, etc.: you must know what you like and are comfortable with. If we concentrate on the inward and spiritual, it doesn't mean that a moderate amount of doing things to keep ourselves nice and presentable can't be nice, too, but it's not the main thing.

Above all, a daily Bible reading and prayer habit is essential, as is also meeting regularly with and enjoying the company of other Christians.

Blessings.
 
farouk said:
ReesesPieces:

Hi. My suggestion is that some good Christian hymns and songs, if you play them quietly in the background, especially if you know the words and they are God honoring, can have a very wholesome and soothing effect. Even music that is not specifically Christian but which is tuneful and warm can help people to keep calm: after all, it was God Who created harmony and love: He IS love.

I know some people can go 'over the top', as it were.

But remember there is also the other extreme that the Lord Jesus attacked strongly: for people to have such a "correct and religious" and well dressed exterior like the Pharisees and Sadducees, but inwardly they were like wolves; He called the proud and strictly religious and self-righteous people "whited sepulchres", so in avoiding going 'over the top' in the way we behave, dress, etc. in one direction, it's good to avoid the other extreme, too.

Re. piercings and tattoos, hair color, etc.: you must know what you like and are comfortable with. If we concentrate on the inward and spiritual, it doesn't mean that a moderate amount of doing things to keep ourselves nice and presentable can't be nice, too, but it's not the main thing.

Above all, a daily Bible reading and prayer habit is essential, as is also meeting regularly with and enjoying the company of other Christians.

Blessings.
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Hi & thank you I do see your points I do have to remind myself that God is not an "All or nothing" God its me I put so much pressure on myself & yet God isnt like that at all. I'm also 100% percent with you on reading my Bible more frequently then I have looking to change that day by day. I do know a lot of nice hymn now that you mention it I even have new songs come to me I just need to get reconnected & revive my spirit.


Thanks :)
 
ReesesPieces said:
Stuggling with this right now Ive been reading a lot & watching a lot of different views on Secular music its origins, messages (open & Hidden) Even so called " Christian Approved" music I have a problem with because its still formed (in my opinion) after music that is ungodly/anti christ. I dont see how it is okay to still dressed like the world (too tight/loose clothing, gaudy jewelry, make up galore, fake hair, piercings & tattoo's etc) and say you also follow Christ that just does not seem right to me....Im also guilty of piercings & tattoo's.... Im not saying everyone does this but where do you draw the line?? Its all confusing to me where to stand on this issue. Im someone who loves music in general its hard for me to break away but thru prayer I know the chains will be broken. Really tough topic for me....and then that leads into other issues like Tv/ movies/ practically everything if you really think about it. Guess that's why we have the Holy Ghost to lead & guide us into ALL truth.
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I used to feel the same way regarding those things. Some things, like tight clothing, I still just wouldn't do period and for good reason.
For music, I just kinda have to doubt the things that are said about the music itself.
But I understand what you mean when you say it's a tough subject. It can be.

I've found that I can worship to contemporary Christian music just as much as I can worship to hymns. And while you can get caught up in the beat of the music so that it pleases the flesh, I think it depends upon the condition of your heart. Personally I tend to concentrate more on the lyrics on any given song, Christian or secular.

A lot of the hymns we have today were pretty controversial back in the day. (Some churches felt that the only acceptable worship songs are from the Psalms. Some churches like that still exist today.)
And the music for some of the hymns actually came from drinking songs, originally. (As did the music for The Star Spangled Banner, if I remember correctly. I think that was the case with Yankee Doodle, too. Of course, those are not hymns...but yeah.)

Not trying to tell you what to do. If you think you shouldn't listen to that kind of music, do what you think God wants.:thumbsup For some people it may be best to avoid certain music, if it causes them to stumble.
 
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