Daniel's 70th Week

[Malachi]

Christians who believe in a post- or mid-tribulation Rapture generally overlook Daniel’s 70th week and its application to the nation of Israel. In Daniel 9:26,27 we find: And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. The Lord Jesus Christ was referring to precisely this prophecy when He said (Matthew 24:15,16): “When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:”
The prophecy of Daniel’s seventy weeks (Dan 9:24-27) is a prophecy applicable strictly to Israel (“Seventy weeks are determined upon THY PEOPLE” v.24) and everything that is stated in the Olivet Discourse applies to Israel.
The “weeks” of Daniel are literally “sevens” (Heb shabua), and are interpreted as either weeks of days or weeks of years (depending on context, see Old Testament Word Studies by William Wilson).
So a total of 70 x 7 = 490 years was determined “until the consummation” (v. 27). And Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) was “cut off” (crucified) precisely at the end of 483 years from “the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem” (v. 25).
However a period of seven years (one week) remains to be fulfilled because the Abomination of Desolation has not been erected in the Temple at Jerusalem, and even the Temple itself has not been restored.
It will be noticed above “that in the midst of the week” (3 ½ years after it begins) “the prince that shall come” (the Beast of Revelation 13, or the Man of Sin or the Son of Perdition or the Antichrist) shall “cause the sacrifice and oblation to cease”. So there will be Temple sacrifices at this time but after 3 ½ years the Beast shall put an end to those sacrifices, and erect an image in the Temple which will be required to be worshipped as God: .”.. and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.” (2 Thess 2:3,4).

This is the blasphemous Abomination of Desolation which will trigger the Great Tribulation, which is also “the time of Jacob’s [Israel’s) trouble” (Dan 12:1): And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.” This is exactly how Christ described the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:21).

 

[Kathi]

God has a time table.He is keeping things on schedule.

 

[Sinthesis]

If the Abomination of Desolation had not been erected in the Temple at Jerusalem, then why is the second Temple at Jerusalem not still there?

 

[Malachi]

If the Abomination of Desolation had not been erected in the Temple at Jerusalem, then why is the second Temple at Jerusalem not still there?

Not sure if I understand this properly. Antiochus Epiphanes (c. 167 BC) desecrated and plundered the Temple at the time of the Maccabees, but it was not destroyed.

However, because of the unbelief of Israel, the Temple was destroyed in 70 AD as the Lord had prophesied, and "not one stone was left upon another" (Lk 21:5,6). This was God's judgment ("the days of vengeance" Lk 21:22) on Israel. God dispersed the nation of Israel at that time (Lk. 21:24) -- "led away captive into all nations".

Because of the "times of the Gentiles" (Lk 21:24) the Muslim Dome of the Rock (7th century AD) sits on the Temple Mount today ("Jerusalem shall be trodden down underfoot" Lk 21:24) , but Jews in Israel have been preparing for quite some time to restore the Temple and Temple worship (see https://www.templeinstitute.org/). That will come to pass sooner or later. When the future Abomination of Desolation is erected, the Temple must already be in use and daily sacrifices must already be taking place, and a covenant must already be in place with "the prince that shall come" (Dan 9:26,27). He is the one who will erect the Abomination of Desolation ("the image of the beast" repeated four times in 2 verses).

See Revelation chapter 13:
11And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
12And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
15And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

 

[for_his_glory]

God speaks to us in scripture of a 3 1/2 year tribulation period not a seven year as Spanish Jesuit, Francisco Ribera proposed that the final seven years of the 70 weeks of Daniel was a future antichrist and that antichrist would bring an end to sacrifices in a rebuilt temple. This is where the supposed 7 years of tribulation comes from before the second coming of Christ, which is a false teaching. The 3 1/2 year tribulation period spoken of in scripture is as being time, times and half time which equals 1260 days = 3 ½ years or 3 ½ Times – Hebrew calendar only had 30 days for each month and this is where you get 1260 days or 3 ½ years.

[Scripture reference]

Revelation 12:14; Daniel 7:25; Daniel 12:7

1260 days – Revelation 11:3; Revelation 12:6

42 months – Revelation 11:2; Revelation 13:5

Compare Matthew 24:15 with Luke 21:20 and you will see the abomination of desolation Daniel spoke of is that Jerusalem will once again be compassed by armies in the end of days who will take over a newly rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem. The army is antichrist Papal Rome in whom the dragon (Satan) gives the beast (Papal Rome) it's power, seat and authority, Rev 13:2, will once again take it's seat in Jerusalem and this is why Jesus said in Matthew 24:2 one stone will not be upon another as Jesus will destroy this rebuilt Temple as it is taken over once again as the temple of an antichrist religious, economic and political system.

The abomination of desolation Daniel spoke of in Daniel 9 was in three parts as the Temple in Daniels time being rebuilt around 538 BC after Israel's exile in Babylon and were released from captivity when Babylon (Chaldean) was conquered by the Medes and the Persians. The second Temple in Jesus day, which Israel was under Roman authority through Pilate being its governor that had Jesus crucified and the third rebuilt Temple in the time of the end involving the whole body of Christ as Papal Rome will once again take its seat in Jerusalem being the final abomination that will cause desolation as when Christ returns God will then make an end of all the abominations (sin).

The abomination of desolation was 1260 years (a year is as a day with the Lord) of Papal Rome rule from 538AD with Emperor Justinian’s decree and under the military protection of Belisarius and the beast (Pope) until the deadly wound came in 1798 by General Berthier who made his entrance into Rome and abolished the papal government and established a secular one. This is also confirmed in Revelation 12:6 the church of Jesus would hide in the wilderness for exactly 1260 days (years) or 3 ½ years. This was the time when Rome persecuted the Christians and killed them which were approximately 500 million saints slain for the cause of their faith in Jesus. 1798 – 538 = 1260 days/years. Napoleon had closed down the Papal Church and the Papacy and its power was thought to be forever broken. The wound was largely healed in 1929 when Mussolini gave the Vatican back to the Pope and established it as a country in it's own right in the Lateran Treaty. Today the Vatican has formal diplomatic relations with almost every country in the world.

Revelation 13:3, 12; Matthew 24:15; Rev 12:6

 

[for_his_glory]

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final offering for the sacrifice of sin that fulfilled the sacrificial he giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to that of John baptizing Christ were the first 69 sevens. The last half of the 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent.

Daniel 9:24-27 establishes the timing of the first and second advents of Christ referred to as 70 weeks of years. The starting point of the 70 weeks of years was with the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, (Daniel 9:25). Gabriel gave Daniel this prophecy during the time of Israel's exiled in Babylon right before the first remnant of Jews were allowed to return to Jerusalem around 536 B.C. under Zerubbabel. Cyrus, King of Persia, issued a decree to Zerubbabel to rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem around 538 B.C., (2 Chronicles 36:22-23; Ezra 1:1-3; and Ezra 6:1-5). Jerusalem was in ruins at this time, having been destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar 70 years earlier in 586 B.C. The captivity had begun in 605 B.C., before the destruction of Jerusalem, when Nebuchadnezzar took Daniel and others to Babylon as hostages, Daniel 1:1-4.

The 490 years will be divided into three periods as follows: seven weeks (49 years) plus sixty-two weeks (434 years) plus one week (7 years). These are prophetic days. At the end of the first two periods (69 weeks or 483 years), the Messiah will be cut off, reference to the crucifixion, and that both Jerusalem and the Temple will be destroyed as the veil of the Temple was torn from top to bottom, Matthew 27:50. The prophecy concludes by focusing on the last week of years. It says that following the death of the Messiah the people (Disciples) of the prince (Messiah) shall destroy the city and the sanctuary (time of the Gentiles) as the flood means that the Gospel of Christ will be taught to Jew and Gentile all over the world and unto the end of the war (flesh and Spirit) desolations (sin) are determined. And he (Jesus) shall confirm the covenant (new covenant of grace) by making an end to all abominations that caused desolation or in other words make an end to all who would not accept Jesus as Lord and Savior. There is no mention in scripture of an Antichrist making a seven year peace treaty with Israel as antichrist is anyone who opposes that Jesus is the son of God, 1John 2:22,23. Many teach of a so called Antichrist, but scripture never defines just one, but says there are many as even now that are in the world, 1John 2:18.

The he in Daniel 9:27 is Jesus, not antichrist, who makes firm the covenant with many for one week (seven years). The word many refers to the Abrahamic covenant people of Israel in the OT and the true believers of Jesus as what he speaks in Matthew 26:28. We are now under the new covenant of grace that is confirmed by the life and death of Jesus that he has caused the sacrifice and oblation to cease as he fulfilled this on the cross with his last words, "It is finished".

In Jesus Olivet prophecy in Matthew 24 he gave signs of the end for not only the disciples to look out for, but for all of us to see the signs that lead to the return of Christ, but never mentions anything of a seven year peace treaty between an Antichrist or anyone. Jesus does mention both of the events Gabriel spoke of in Dan 9:27 with the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70, Matthew 24:2, and the abomination of desolation down further in vs. 15.

 

[Malachi]

This is where the supposed 7 years of tribulation comes from before the second coming of Christ, which is a false teaching.

Since 3 1/2 + 3 1/2 = 7, how can it be a "false teaching"?
A "week of years" is 7 years, just like a week of days is 7 days.

I believe somewhere along the way someone has said it is a "false teaching" because they did not closely examine the Scriptures, or did not want the Scriptures to disturb their settled mistaken beliefs. That happens all the time. One cannot even convince Christians with Scripture any longer.

 

[for_his_glory]

Daniel 9:24-27 establishes the timing of the first and second advents of Christ referred to as 70 weeks of years. The starting point of the 70 weeks of years was with the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, (Daniel 9:25). Gabriel gave Daniel this prophecy during the time of Israel's excile in Babylon right before the first remnant of Jews were allowed to return to Jerusalem around 536 B.C. under Zerubbabel. Cyrus, King of Persia, issued a decree to Zerubbabel to rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem around 538 B.C., (2 Chronicles 36:22-23; Ezra 1:1-3; and Ezra 6:1-5). Jerusalem was in ruins at this time, having been destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar 70 years earlier in 586 B.C. The captivity had begun in 605 B.C., before the destruction of Jerusalem, when Nebuchadnezzar took Daniel and others to Babylon as hostages, Daniel 1:1-4.

The 490 years will be divided into three periods as follows: seven weeks (49 years) plus sixty-two weeks (434 years) plus one week (7 years). At the end of the first two periods (69 weeks or 483 years), the Messiah will be cut off, reference to the crucifixion, and that both Jerusalem and the Temple will be destroyed. The prophecy concludes by focusing on the last week of years. It says that following the death of the Messiah and the destruction of Jerusalem, "the prince who is to come" will make a covenant with the Jewish people that will enable them to reinstitute their sacrificial system. This prince will come from the same people who destroyed the Temple (the Romans). 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 reveals the prince who is to come is that of the man of lawlessness, son of perdition.

Daniels first half of the 70 weeks:
First Advent of Messiah: From rebuilding the Temple to Messiah come
Daniels 69 weeks are 483 Solar years (Daniel 9:25),
7 weeks of years was 49 years rebuilding Jerusalem around 457B.C. (Ezra 7:11-26; 9:9)
62 weeks of years was the period of time leading up to Messiah the Prince in the beginning of his ministry in 27A.D. up to the crucifixion in 31A.D., (Daniel 9:26)

From the cross to the second advent of Messiah was a prophetic gap being the present Church age (Gentiles) which was a mystery not revealed to Daniel, Ephesians 3:4-10

Daniel's second half of the 70th week
The second advent of Messiah: From the time of Christ ministry to the cross
7 Lunar years or of great tribulations as described in (Daniel 7:13,14; 9:26,27; 12:1; Matthew Chapter 24). A covenant between Israel and the one who is to come (son of perdition)

 

[19DuggarFan]

If the Abomination of Desolation had not been erected in the Temple at Jerusalem, then why is the second Temple at Jerusalem not still there?

Excellent Question.

 

[JohnD]

Because the sacrificial system of the Mosaic Law was fulfilled by Christ on the Cross. And when the veil of the most holy place was rent in two from top to bottom the New Covenant began.

Hebrews 10:15-20 (KJV)
15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh

Hebrews 6:16-17 (KJV)
16 For men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife.
17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:

The Temple will be rebuilt and sacrificial system in place until 1290 days before the end of time.

Daniel 12:11 (KJV)
11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

And as you can plainly see THAT is when the abomination of desolation takes place.

 

[Sinthesis]

Because the sacrificial system of the Mosaic Law was fulfilled by Christ on the Cross. And when the veil of the most holy place was rent in two from top to bottom the New Covenant began.

Right, so why would God ever sanction a rebuilt temple and sacrificial system when we have the New Covenant, if the New Covenant is the reason the second temple was destroyed? Further, why did God wait 40yrs from the establishment of the New Covenant to destroy the temple and sacrificial system?

 

[Malachi]

Right, so why would God ever sanction a rebuilt temple and sacrificial system when we have the New Covenant, if the New Covenant is the reason the second temple was destroyed? Further, why did God wait 40yrs from the establishment of the New Covenant to destroy the temple and sacrificial system?

Sinthesis,
When we are considering God's ways with men, we need to remember that His ways are not our ways, and His thoughts are not our thoughts. God waited about 40 years after the finished work of Christ on the Cross so that the Gospel would be spread throughout the Roman Empire and all Jews from Judea and beyond would have an opportunity to repent and be converted. The majority of Jews resisted the Gospel and rejected Christ. Therefore God's judgment came upon Jerusalem, Judea and the Temple in 70 AD, following which the Jews were scattered to the four corners of the earth.

At the same time, God gave Israel a specific time frame at the end of which He would make "reconciliation for iniquity and [to] bring in everlasting righteousness" (Dan 9:24). Seventy "weeks" of years (490 years) were assigned from the time that Jerusalem would be restored and rebuilt (after the Babylonian captivity), and 69 "weeks" (483 years) were assigned until the crucifixion of Messiah. One "week" (7 years) has yet to be fulfilled, and it involves the coming of Antichrist and his Abomination of Desolation.

There are now serious plans in Israel to rebuild the Temple in order to fulfil this prophecy. After the Abomination of Desolation is set up, the Day of the Lord will begin and all the judgments of the 6th and 7th seals of Revelation will come upon earth. Only after that period will there be a new Millenial Temple (which is described in detail in the prophecy of Ezekiel).

If you sincerely want to understand these matters, study the Old Testament from Isaiah to Malachi and then fit the prophecies of Revelation into those prophecies. But you will need to set aside all preconceptions and humanistic thinking, and simply believe God. It may not make "sense" to humans, but it makes perfect sense to God.

 

[Sinthesis]

Nope, it simply does not make sense that God needs another physical Jewish temple in order to "bring in everlasting righteousness". Jesus' one week ministry supplied everything needed to reconcile the inequity of the law. When His doctrine was finally rejected through the stoning of Stephan, the 490wks for Daniel's people were finished, and the Gospel released to the rest of the world. Within a generation the Jews who rejected God would attempt to take their inheritance by force, suffering defeat, diaspora, and the destruction of their dear temple, which unlike Christ, would not be resurrected by God on the third day.

 

[jasonc]

Nope, it simply does not make sense that God needs another physical Jewish temple in order to "bring in everlasting righteousness". Jesus' one week ministry supplied everything needed to reconcile the inequity of the law. When His doctrine was finally rejected through the stoning of Stephan, the 490wks for Daniel's people were finished, and the Gospel released to the rest of the world. Within a generation the Jews who rejected God would attempt to take their inheritance by force, suffering defeat, diaspora, and the destruction of their dear temple, which unlike Christ, would not be resurrected by God on the third day.

gosh what about those atheistic jews who never were taught any thing about the temple life? what about those like ben gurion who gave up Judaism after the shoah and despised it until death? and ben gurion is the founder of modern isreal. funny aint it?or those gentiles whom covert to that? the temple hasn't the power to save nor is it needed.

 

[Malachi]

gosh what about those atheistic jews who never were taught any thing about the temple life? what about those like ben gurion who gave up Judaism after the shoah and despised it until death? and ben gurion is the founder of modern isreal. funny aint it?or those gentiles whom covert to that? the temple hasn't the power to save nor is it needed.

What does any of this have to do with the subject? The majority of Jews from the first coming of Christ to the second coming did not (and do not) believe in Yeshua ha Mashiach. That does not change God's Word in the least. The issue is Israel's false Messiah (Antichrist) followed by Israel's true Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) in the future, not in the past. That's what this thread is about.

 

[jasonc]

What does any of this have to do with the subject? The majority of Jews from the first coming of Christ to the second coming did not (and do not) believe in Yeshua ha Mashiach. That does not change God's Word in the least. The issue is Israel's false Messiah (Antichrist) followed by Israel's true Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) in the future, not in the past. That's what this thread is about.

does the bible actually teach that judiasm is genetic?
case in point. how many jews are actually practicing jews? in isreal 80%, but the founder of modern isreal was atheist. how many are adopted in to jewish families? of those how many had seed that live in isreal? if that is the case how much of isreal isn't really isreal? jews don't even like to say its genes and bloods but a faith. a jew is a jew by faith as well. if you mom aint a jew YOU aren't! so I ask how much jewish does count?

case in point. if isreal doesn't change. there is this concern.

http://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/intermarriage-statistics/

but that isn't isreal to you and they don't count. but wait..
http://www.interfaithfamily.com/new...mmunity/Jewish_Intermarriage_Statistics.shtml

tel aviv next to NEW YORK has the largest jewish population. but well they in new York ,of whence my family came to America from montreal and ere the Ukraine, don't count.so I guess jesus comes for them if today it would be mostly tel aviv that repents. of those how many are practicing jews? you tend to mix genes and faith. I don't. a jew I may be of lineage, but of faith I am NOT.

http://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/J...age-achieve-what-anti-Semitism-couldnt-346909

interesting read albeilt isreal isn't concerned. one of them links is trying to get an increase of jews by marriage. so I guess they see being a jew is bit more then of Abraham.

you never did address that if a jew repents and accept jesus outside of isreal and is a devout orthodox he isn't part of isreal?

 

[JLB]

Christians who believe in a post- or mid-tribulation Rapture generally overlook Daniel’s 70th week and its application to the nation of Israel. In Daniel 9:26,27 we find: And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. The Lord Jesus Christ was referring to precisely this prophecy when He said (Matthew 24:15,16): “When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:”
The prophecy of Daniel’s seventy weeks (Dan 9:24-27) is a prophecy applicable strictly to Israel (“Seventy weeks are determined upon THY PEOPLE” v.24) and everything that is stated in the Olivet Discourse applies to Israel.
The “weeks” of Daniel are literally “sevens” (Heb shabua), and are interpreted as either weeks of days or weeks of years (depending on context, see Old Testament Word Studies by William Wilson).
So a total of 70 x 7 = 490 years was determined “until the consummation” (v. 27). And Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) was “cut off” (crucified) precisely at the end of 483 years from “the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem” (v. 25).
However a period of seven years (one week) remains to be fulfilled because the Abomination of Desolation has not been erected in the Temple at Jerusalem, and even the Temple itself has not been restored.
It will be noticed above “that in the midst of the week” (3 ½ years after it begins) “the prince that shall come” (the Beast of Revelation 13, or the Man of Sin or the Son of Perdition or the Antichrist) shall “cause the sacrifice and oblation to cease”. So there will be Temple sacrifices at this time but after 3 ½ years the Beast shall put an end to those sacrifices, and erect an image in the Temple which will be required to be worshipped as God: .”.. and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.” (2 Thess 2:3,4).

This is the blasphemous Abomination of Desolation which will trigger the Great Tribulation, which is also “the time of Jacob’s [Israel’s) trouble” (Dan 12:1): And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.” This is exactly how Christ described the Great Tribulation (Matthew 24:21).

Thanks for your post.

And Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) was “cut off” (crucified) precisely at the end of 483 years from “the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem” (v. 25).

I agree with most everything here.

Remember, Jesus was "cut off" crucified outside the 70 week time frame.

25 "Know therefore and understand, That from the going forth of the command To restore and build Jerusalem Until Messiah the Prince, There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; The street shall be built again, and the wall, Even in troublesome. Daniel 9:25

The phrase Messiah the Prince refers to the Day the whole city came out and proclaimed Hosanna to the son of David.

The son of a king is a Prince.

Hosanna is a Messianic term that refers to YHWH.


The 69th week ended on that day, which has come to be known as Palm Sunday.

5 days later He was "cut off", but not for Himself.


That is why the scripture says... "And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;



JLB

 

[JLB]

What does any of this have to do with the subject? The majority of Jews from the first coming of Christ to the second coming did not (and do not) believe in Yeshua ha Mashiach. That does not change God's Word in the least. The issue is Israel's false Messiah (Antichrist) followed by Israel's true Messiah (the Lord Jesus Christ) in the future, not in the past. That's what this thread is about.

 

[Malachi]

does the bible actually teach that judiasm is genetic?

Before I respond to this, what is really necessary is that people (Christians included) step back and look at everything from God's viewpoint, not man's.

1. Let's put "Judaism" aside altogether. Judaism is Rabbinism, and Rabbinism is Pharisaism. The Lord already condemned the Pharisees as putting "the doctrines of men" (the Talmud) above the Word of God (the Tanach). Paul condemned this as "the religion of the Jews".
2. Is being a Hebrew genetic? Go to all the genealogies from Adam to Christ, and you will see that being a Hebrew (Noah-Shem-Eber-Abraham) is genetic.
3. Are Gentiles included in the lineage of Christ? Rahab, Ruth, and Bathsheba are not Hebrew but included through marriage. So marriage brings Gentiles into the Hebrews.

case in point. how many jews are actually practicing jews? in isreal 80%, but the founder of modern isreal was atheist. how many are adopted in to jewish families? of those how many had seed that live in isreal? if that is the case how much of isreal isn't really isreal? jews don't even like to say its genes and bloods but a faith. a jew is a jew by faith as well. if you mom aint a jew YOU aren't! so I ask how much jewish does count?

To God none of this is relevant. At the second coming of Christ, God's angels will know exactly who is included in "Israel" and who is not. God will know who are of th 10 tribes and who are of Judah and Benjamin. So nothing to worry about.

you never did address that if a jew repents and accept jesus outside of isreal and is a devout orthodox he isn't part of isreal?

1. If a Jew repents today, he becomes a part of the Church (Jew and Gentile in one Body) therefore his "Jewishness" means nothing to God -- "circumcision avails nothing, and uncircumcision avails nothing".
2. If a Jew is outside Israel's boundaries at the second coming of Christ, the Lord will cause him to come to Israel (naturally or supernaturally, that is in God's hands). If he has already repented, then he will be saved as a Jew. The Church will be complete at that time (Rom 11:25), and God will be dealing with the nation of Israel. There will be national repentance and national salvation.

Jason, you have to spend time in the Nebiim (Neviim) -- the Prophets -- section of the Bible from Isaiah to Malachi. Christians are not studying these books.

 

[reba]

Please remember while posting.... There are different views on end times that fall into our Statement of Faith.. Please respect other members views , Disagree yup for sure but keep it respectful...
pre.... mid.... post trib... are all ok here... post trib includes partial preterism..

This post is not directed at any one .. it is posted because the activity is up. thanks reba