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Dead To The World

netchaplain

Member
Those who are reborn will at times find themselves seemingly dissatisfied and unfeeling! This is always temporary, for faith strengthening (e.g. continuing to believe in Christ’s expiation for your sins), and is due to the ongoing presence of the “old man” within (Ro 7:17, 20). Whether or not we “endure” these trials “patiently (Heb 6:15), God still takes us through them, even if kicking and screaming; but it is more God-glorifying to go through without allowing it to “trouble” you (Jn 14:1, 27).
NC




Dead To The World

While the Cross has effectively cut the connection between the believer and the world, the resurrection has brought him into the power of new ties and associations. If in the Cross we see the world’s judgment about the Lord Jesus, in resurrection we see the Father’s judgment. The world crucified Him, but “God hath highly exalted Him” (Phl 2:9). Man gave Him the very lowest, God gave the very highest place; and, inasmuch as the believer is called into full fellowship with the Father in His thoughts about the Son, he is enabled (1Jo 4:4) to turn the tables upon the world (Jhn 16:33), and look upon it as a crucified thing (Gal 6:14).

If, therefore, the believer is on one cross and the world on another (Gal 6:14), the moral distance between the two is vast indeed. If it is vast in principle, so should it be in practice. The world and the Christian should have absolutely nothing in common (except for morality which unbelievers can have—NC); nor will they, unless in some measure deny his Lord and Master. The believer proves himself false to the Lord Jesus to the very same degree that he has fellowship with the world (which immature believers do, but God will eventually correct them - Phl 1:6; 2:13—NC).

All this is plain enough, but where does it put us as regards this world? Truly, it puts us outside it, and that completely (regardless of one’s maturity in Christ, you are considered fully separated from unbelievers in all they are and all they do; what a permanent encouragement and relief—NC). We are dead to the world (esp. considering its condemnation—NC) and alive with the risen Lord Jesus. We are at once partakers with Him in His rejection by the earth, and we are His acceptance in Heaven; and the joy of the latter makes us count as nothing the trials connected with the former (Rom 8:18). To be cast out of the world (seemingly being alone—NC), without knowing that I have a present place and portion on high, would be intolerable; but when the glories of heaven fill the soul’s vision—goodbye world!

But some may feel led to ask, “What is the world?” It would be difficult to find a term more inaccurately defined than “world,” or “worldliness.” The Word of God, however, has, with perfect precision, defined what “the world” is, when it marks it as that which is “not of the Father” (1Jo 2:16). Hence, the deeper my fellowship with the Father, the keener will be my sense of what is worldly. This is the divine way of teaching. The more you delight in the Father’s love, the more you reject the world (it’s easy at times to want fellowship with unbelievers when lonely—NC).

Now, who reveals the Father? The Son (Luk 10:22). How? By the power of the Holy Spirit (Jhn 14:26). Wherefore, the more I am enabled, by the Spirit, to drink in the Son’s revelation of the Father, the more accurate does my judgment become as to what is of the world. It is thus that discernment as to worldliness becomes refined. You can hardly attempt to define worldliness. It is, as had been said, “Shade off gradually form white to black.” This is most true. You cannot place a bound and say, “Here is where worldliness begins;” but the keen and exquisite sensibilities of the divine nature recoil from it; and all we need is to walk in the power of that life, in order to keep aloof from every form of worldliness.

“Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.” (Gal 5:16). Walk with the Father, and you shall not walk with the world (Jas 3:15). Cold distinctions and rigid rules will avail nothing. The power of the divine life, by the Holy Spirit, is what we want! We need to understand the meaning and spiritual application of the “three days’ journey into the wilderness,” whereby we are separated forever, not only from Egypt’s brick kilns and taskmasters, but also from its temples and alters (which were prominent for idol worship—NC).


— Charles Henry Mackintosh (1820-1896)





MJS daily devotional excerpt for August 26

“When the Lord Jesus’ love is before you, you find this love is drawing you from darkness to light. He begins by showing His desire for your spiritual advancement, and not by advancing you in earthly position.

“It is beautiful to see that the work of true love is to set aside darkness, or whatever would interfere with fellowship; and therefore it is not esteemed as it ought to be, because we are looking for something on the earth, and the tendency is to judge of His love by earthly gifts or favors down here.”

“We have died with the Lord Jesus out of our old Adam position: our old man was crucified with Him (for saints the old men is restrained on the Cross and is kept from causing believers to desire sin – Ro 6:6—NC). The flesh is in us still indeed, but in us a foreign thing; we are not in it before God, nor identified with it in any wise (Ro 8:9), but with Him in whom it was never found. We are in Him as He is, and where He is.

“Can we say quite confidently, each for himself, ‘Yes, we are identified with Him who represents us there before the eye of our Father—as He is, in whom no spot was ever found nor can be, but perfectness after God’s own heart wholly’?

“That is to be in Christ—a new creature. Our rule is, to walk in Him, as being what we really are—heavenly, citizens of heaven, pilgrims and strangers upon earth.” - Frederick William Grant (1834-1902)
 
I didn't wanna be dead to the world, but the world was dead to me, everything that I once held dear had become an abomination, that left me no choice.
 
The cross before us, the world behind us. Our focus has to be on the heavenly things and not on worldly things as we are just strangers passing through to our final destination.
 
Those who are reborn will at times find themselves seemingly dissatisfied and unfeeling! This is always temporary, for faith strengthening (e.g. continuing to believe in Christ’s expiation for your sins), and is due to the ongoing presence of the “old man” within (Ro 7:17, 20). Whether or not we “endure” these trials “patiently (Heb 6:15), God still takes us through them, even if kicking and screaming; but it is more God-glorifying to go through without allowing it to “trouble” you (Jn 14:1, 27).
NC
Yes, it's not our will but His be done. He knows what we need. He made us. We belong to Him. He will see us through to the end, if we let Him.
 
Hi, and thanks for the reply! "Dead to the world" is a phrase that describes one who is not living in sin, as the world does, it being mostly unsaved.
"Dead to the world" itself doesn't suffice, you must explain the alternative - how to be "alive in Christ" at the same time, how to have real, everlasting joy and pleasure in Him rather than anything this world has to offer. Is it a known fact that the greatest determinant of happiness is your relationship with other people, and therein lies the challenge in this age of "loneliness epidemic" - fellowship with other Christians. You can preach about fellowship with God all day with fancy schmancy "Christianese", as some folks on this forum do, I hope you're not one of them, but you can't have any fellowship with God without fellowship with other people, live streaming church service and studying the bible alone in your bedroom doesn't work.
 
Yes, it's not our will but His be done. He knows what we need. He made us. We belong to Him. He will see us through to the end, if we let Him.
Hi, and good encouraging reply! Yes, God causes every reborn soul to "please" Him (Phl 2:13); and it's irresistible so we will never desire anything more than this!
 
"Dead to the world" itself doesn't suffice, you must explain the alternative - how to be "alive in Christ" at the same time,
Hi, and good point, but first there must be the dyeing to self; old man or sin nature - Ro 6:6. It is our greatest opposition because it's the closest to us. Then we can die to the world so we can be alive to the Lord Jesus! One cannot be alive to Christ and attempt to fellowship with unbelievers (world), which God keeps the believer from (Phl 2:13).

I also wanted to mention that it is the most important to, as you mentioned, fellowship with other Christians, as it is a command in Scripture--"exhorting one another" (Heb 10:25). It's my belief that there is no greater encouragement than lifting one another in exhortation.
 
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Hi, and good point, but first there must be the dyeing to self; old man or sin nature - Ro 6:6. It is our greatest opposition because it's the closest to us. Then we can die to the world so we can be alive to the Lord Jesus! One cannot be alive to Christ and attempt to fellowship with unbelievers (world), which God keeps the believer from (Phl 2:13).

I also wanted to mention that it is the most important to, as you mentioned, fellowship with other Christians, as it is a command in Scripture--"exhorting one another" (Heb 10:25). It's my belief that there is no greater encouragement than lifting one another in exhortation.
But what if there is no other Christians around, you have nobody to talk to, let alone a fellow believer in Christ? How would you handle a season of loneliness when it has become a national epidemic?
 
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Hi, and good encouraging reply! Yes, God causes every reborn soul to "please" Him (Phl 2:13); and it's irresistible so we will never desire anything more than this!
Hi, from yet a different forum! Nice to see you here too. I grew discouraged with the forum that banned any talk of the Trinity. Take care...
 
But what if there is no other Christians around, you have nobody to talk to, let alone a fellow believer in Christ? How would you handle a season of loneliness when it has become a national epidemic?
I don't see an epidemic or drought in fellowship with Christians in Churches. Only Christian fellowship will do, you won't find this with unbelievers.
 
That's either because they are extremely immature in the Scriptures, or they are unsaved!
You're right to be loyal to historic doctrinal orthodoxy--not just religious tradition. Summarizing biblical doctrine into formulas is *not* evil!

However, I think volunteer moderation invites some of this. It isn't a deal-killer for me except for the fact that discussing the Trinity is part of what interests me, and opens the door to discussions with those who may not be fully Christian but are open.

We each have our own thing. I'm familiar with yours, and it's a good one! Can we call it Discipleship on steroids?? ;)
 
I don't see an epidemic or drought in fellowship with Christians in Churches. Only Christian fellowship will do, you won't find this with unbelievers.
That depends on what kind of church you're in. Surely, not in bible believing and teaching churches, but those are rare these days. If you don't have one in your area to attend to, then what are your options?
 
That was their experience apparently. Sorry that it is yours. I can discuss almost anything without hostility. But some people can't, it's true.
You may have heard of this "jar of life" analogy - you have a large jar, first you put in rocks, plenty of empty space left; then you slip in pebbels, there's still space; then you fill the remaining gaps with sand to volume, and it's finally full. However, if you change the order by putting in pebbles or sand first, there'll be no room for rocks. This is a famous demonstration to teach time management and priorities, but it also applies in a lot of other areas including the primary, secondary and tertiaru issues in Christianity. Primary issues are the essential beliefs, the core narrative of the bible - creation, desecration (or fall), redemption and glorification, that is the narrative of our life that shapes our worldview through which we perceive all the information input from the world, and that sets us apart from the world; secondary issues are denominational differences in practices and traditions, while tertiary issues are theologies and doctrines. The way I see it, trinity belongs to the third category, and this statement alone will upset a lot of folks who insist that trinity is the foundation of Christianity instead of those four pillars I named, they identify themselves as "trinitatian" first before a child of God and play identity politics against others, that's how they get hostile. And if you're obsessed with the "sand" that is these theological positions and stances, you won't have any mental capacity for the "pebbles" and "rocks" that really matter. Sorry for this rant, I don't mean to derail this thread, just to explain why trinity topic should be banned.
 
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