Deciphering

[Willie T]

CE,
You might enjoy this:
(just for something to think about.)
http://www.walkwiththeword.org/Aids/HowTo/Inductive_2-Observation.html

There are <CONTINUE> buttons at the bottom of each page.

 

[Christ_empowered]

thanks

 

[Willie T]

You're welcome. I only bother to send these things out when I feel the person/persons receiving them are true thinkers.

 

[Karl]

Perhaps the division between covenants should actually be between John and Acts? But I suppose it's the 400 year silence between the prophets and the gospels that suggests the appropriate division in time.

What silence, ...I'm sorry, but I chuckle when I see that, just because the Holy Spirit didn't inspire any prophets for those 400 years, doesn't mean He was silent, ...He wrote it in advance, just read the book of Daniel, those 400 years are one of the most precisely explained/detailed years of the history of this world.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

What silence, ...I'm sorry, but I chuckle when I see that, just because the Holy Spirit didn't inspire any prophets for those 400 years, doesn't mean He was silent, ...He wrote it in advance, just read the book of Daniel, those 400 years are one of the most precisely explained/detailed years of the history of this world.

I'm not pretending to know everything about that 400 year period. It's not even my own personal observation that made me aware of it. So educate us and tell us what the Holy Spirit spoke during that time period.

 

[Karl]

I told you, it's all written in the Book of Daniel, ...here's some history to set the scene, Alexander the Great was throwing a great party, he had conquered the known world, but he was in depression because there weren't any more countries to conquer, he became so drunk that he stumbled outside in a pouring rain storm, became sick with pneumonia and died a few days later, while on his death bed his four Generals asked him who was to be his successor, ...his reply, ...give it to the strongest! Dan 8:8, Chapters 10 & 11 detail this time period precisely, even speaks of Marc Anthony and Cleopatra (Hollywood has made movies about these silent 400 years), ....that was the dull, dry subject of 10th grade World History class, imagine my surprise years later when I read it in my Bible only this time it wasn't a stogy old history teacher teaching, but the Holy Spirit, ....and at that time I had a very good friend that was named Maccabee!

It's really a fascinating study, a small group of gorilla soldiers lead by Matthias Maccabees and his five sons defeated the mighty Roman legions, the Desolation of Abomination comes from this time period, there was a spectacular miracle concerning the relighting of the Menorah in the Temple, and much more, silent years, ...not hardly, like I said, the Holy Spirit gave it to them, and us, in advance, do your homework and you will find it a real blessing.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Ah, I see.....Catholic.

Guess I walked right into that one.

 

[for_his_glory]

the name ot and nt are from a heretic and yet that is another division that separated the Jewishness found in the bible from the church.

Does it truly matter if we call it OT or NT as the old is that of Torah, but yet taught chronologically in what it teaches all of us, Jew or Gentile, written from the beginning of creation up to the birth of Messiah by the accounts of the authors letters of each one that God gave to write. After that of Torah that ends with Malachi is a new testimony of Messiah from birth up until He returns again to set up the kingdom of God here on earth. That which was prophesied (Jesus) in the older writings of Torah now being fulfilled in the writings after Torah as for the Jew many still await the Messiah to come.

 

[jasonc]

Does it truly matter if we call it OT or NT as the old is that of Torah, but yet taught chronologically in what it teaches all of us, Jew or Gentile, written from the beginning of creation up to the birth of Messiah by the accounts of the authors letters of each one that God gave to write. After that of Torah that ends with Malachi is a new testimony of Messiah from birth up until He returns again to set up the kingdom of God here on earth. That which was prophesied (Jesus) in the older writings of Torah now being fulfilled in the writings after Torah as for the Jew many still await the Messiah to come.

you missed the point. most people separate the bible like that today. god is angry then, not much on mercy etc. jesus is. well I beg to differ. read up on isreal and see how patient god was.

 

[jasonc]

I told you, it's all written in the Book of Daniel, ...here's some history to set the scene, Alexander the Great was throwing a great party, he had conquered the known world, but he was in depression because there weren't any more countries to conquer, he became so drunk that he stumbled outside in a pouring rain storm, became sick with pneumonia and died a few days later, while on his death bed his four Generals asked him who was to be his successor, ...his reply, ...give it to the strongest! Dan 8:8, Chapters 10 & 11 detail this time period precisely, even speaks of Marc Anthony and Cleopatra (Hollywood has made movies about these silent 400 years), ....that was the dull, dry subject of 10th grade World History class, imagine my surprise years later when I read it in my Bible only this time it wasn't a stogy old history teacher teaching, but the Holy Spirit, ....and at that time I had a very good friend that was named Maccabee!

It's really a fascinating study, a small group of gorilla soldiers lead by Matthias Maccabees and his five sons defeated the mighty Roman legions, the Desolation of Abomination comes from this time period, there was a spectacular miracle concerning the relighting of the Menorah in the Temple, and much more, silent years, ...not hardly, like I said, the Holy Spirit gave it to them, and us, in advance, do your homework and you will find it a real blessing.

channukah is nigh

 

[for_his_glory]

I have found that the Bible is it's own best interpreter. If you don't understand a particular passage of scripture, sooner or later the Holy Spirit will pull all the different pieces of scripture related to that passage together to bring you the understanding you seek. Almost with out fail, doctrines that are false have left some piece of scripture out that prevents that doctrine from being true.

This is why it is so important to compare scripture with scripture as the Holy Spirit reveals all truth to that of what you are studying. I need nothing else other than the Bible and the Holy Spirit to teach me. When we are being taught by others it is so important to not take their word for it, but to try the spirits that are speaking through them as one is truth and the other error, 1John 4:1-6.

 

[for_his_glory]

Perhaps the division between covenants should actually be between John and Acts? But I suppose it's the 400 year silence between the prophets and the gospels that suggests the appropriate division in time.

The new covenant started in Matthew with the birth of Christ and John the Baptist being used to prepare the way of the Lord until the fulfillment of time was ready for Christ to be anointed of God to start His ministry here on earth. What was prophesied before Malachi and made ready at the end of Malachi before Matthew was a 400 year span.Not a lot of people know why there was a 400 year gap or may have never even heard there was.The 400 year span God was silent towards Israel. The nation of Israel was under going change after returning to Palestine from the Babylonian captivity. The Pharisees, Sadducees, and scribes came to positions of influence. The law and the priesthood of Aaron's line was being restored all before the prophecy of Messiah could be fulfilled in His coming.

 

[for_his_glory]

you missed the point. most people separate the bible like that today. god is angry then, not much on mercy etc. jesus is. well I beg to differ. read up on isreal and see how patient god was.

No, I did not miss your point. You are right that many do separate the old thinking that was just for the Jews, but miss the point that the old being rich in its beginning with history and prophecy for our understanding of the prophecy to be fulfilled in Christ birth, death and resurrection. One can not separate something that has to be a whole for complete understanding and knowledge.

 

[Deborah13]

I found it especially interesting that some of the books were originally combined, but we don't have them that way in our English Bibles. And I was blown away to see that our Bibles merely group Paul's letters in range from longest to shortest, giving no thought to the chronological order in which they were written. And there are other interesting things..........

But, I suspect that few people here read much of that stuff. Am I right?

The OT is the same, it isn't in the original order either. From what I have read Malachi was not the last book of the OT.
One of the first things I learned in my old AoG church were the dates of when the epistles are believed to have been written.
Here's something I just noticed recently. The date that I have for the writing of Hebrews is AD68. Considering the history of what was transpiring in Jerusalem at that time and what would happen in the very near future makes the message in Hebrews even more apparent as to why it was written and to whom.

 

[jasonc]

No, I did not miss your point. You are right that many do separate the old thinking that was just for the Jews, but miss the point that the old being rich in its beginning with history and prophecy for our understanding of the prophecy to be fulfilled in Christ birth, death and resurrection. One can not separate something that has to be a whole for complete understanding and knowledge.

yes but we really should stop calling it ot and nt, when its one book. it would best called first covenant, new covenant. possible with a section for genesis only. but then again that is so jewish its hard to separate it from the torah. its the basis.

 

[for_his_glory]

I told you, it's all written in the Book of Daniel, ...here's some history to set the scene, Alexander the Great was throwing a great party, he had conquered the known world, but he was in depression because there weren't any more countries to conquer, he became so drunk that he stumbled outside in a pouring rain storm, became sick with pneumonia and died a few days later, while on his death bed his four Generals asked him who was to be his successor, ...his reply, ...give it to the strongest! Dan 8:8, Chapters 10 & 11 detail this time period precisely, even speaks of Marc Anthony and Cleopatra (Hollywood has made movies about these silent 400 years), ....that was the dull, dry subject of 10th grade World History class, imagine my surprise years later when I read it in my Bible only this time it wasn't a stogy old history teacher teaching, but the Holy Spirit, ....and at that time I had a very good friend that was named Maccabee!

It's really a fascinating study, a small group of gorilla soldiers lead by Matthias Maccabees and his five sons defeated the mighty Roman legions, the Desolation of Abomination comes from this time period, there was a spectacular miracle concerning the relighting of the Menorah in the Temple, and much more, silent years, ...not hardly, like I said, the Holy Spirit gave it to them, and us, in advance, do your homework and you will find it a real blessing.

Without a deep study of the past we can not understand the purpose of the fulfillment. Here is a good site you might want to look at if interested that explains the goat and ram of Daniel chapter 8.
http://www.bibleinsight.com/goat.html

 

[Karl]

Ah, I see.....Catholic.

Guess I walked right into that one.

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????

What are you talking about,your pastor has never taught Daniel, ...evidently you have never read the book of Daniel, or studied ancient history, why don't you try googling "The Feast of Lights."

It will bless you

 

[jasonc]

aka channukah.

since its time.

http://www.chabad.org/holidays/chanukah/article_cdo/aid/102911/jewish/What-is-Hanukkah.htm

 

[for_his_glory]

The OT is the same, it isn't in the original order either. From what I have read Malachi was not the last book of the OT.
One of the first things I learned in my old AoG church were the dates of when the epistles are believed to have been written.
Here's something I just noticed recently. The date that I have for the writing of Hebrews is AD68. Considering the history of what was transpiring in Jerusalem at that time and what would happen in the very near future makes the message in Hebrews even more apparent as to why it was written and to whom.

This one says, that one says, but do they ever agree, usually not as the debates and arguments will always continue until the coming of the Lord when all truth is revealed. Dates and history have their place, but what is more important that we know the Christ taught to us in scripture from Genesis to Revelation. Each, whether it be labeled book, chapter, verse, story or overlapping of stories is all Gods word given to us by those God worked in and through to bring us to the full understanding and knowledge of Christ whom was before the foundation of the world. One can read the Bible like any other book, but will miss out on so much knowledge and wisdom that the Holy Spirit wants to teach us if they do not compare any one part with the whole.

 

[for_his_glory]

yes but we really should stop calling it ot and nt, when its one book. it would best called first covenant, new covenant. possible with a section for genesis only. but then again that is so jewish its hard to separate it from the torah. its the basis.

Testament is just that of which it is as in being each one who has given testimony relaying to all Jew first that of Gods spoken word before as in the older testaments of our forefathers and what they taught according to Gods spoken word and the newer testaments of those who literally walked with Jesus or after His ascending were anointed by the Holy Spirit to teach both Jew and Gentile.