Did Jesus take on the sins of the whole world?

[Deidr]

I'm a Baptist; So if I could have some Baptist answers I'd appreciate it.

So my question is did Jesus die for the sins of the Gentiles are they considered part of the "world"

I know that God told Peter what God had made clean let no man call unclean.

But what scriptures can I refer to that prove He died for the Gentiles as part of the whole world.

If the Gentiles were never under the law then how are they freed from the law they were never under?

But if by freeing the Jews under their contract or Covenant through His death so that He can be Lord of all through the Spirit what did that look like in scripture.

With that said what did His death mean for the Gentiles and How?

It seems so that He could marry another.

So what does it mean That God loved the World?
"World"

 

[Deidr]

I'm a Baptist; So if I could have some Baptist answers I'd appreciate it.

So my question is did Jesus die for the sins of the Gentiles are they considered part of the "world"

I know that God told Peter what God had made clean let no man call unclean.

But what scriptures can I refer to that prove He died for the Gentiles as part of the whole world.

If the Gentiles were never under the law then how are they freed from the law they were never under?

But if by freeing the Jews under their contract or Covenant through His death so that He can be Lord of all through the Spirit what did that look like in scripture.

With that said what did His death mean for the Gentiles and How?

It seems so that He could marry another.

So what does it mean That God loved the World?
"World"

My Notes

kjv

​

16 [For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.]

I'm going to try a few Ideals on to see how they fit.

First ideal:

God loved all His creation so He gave his son to die for those under the law to include all His creation to live in terms with His Spirit.

For if you live in terms of the Spirit you don't fulfill the lust of the flesh.

When Jesus kept His father's will He did not live for Himself He lived(PURPOSED) rather out Gods will. AND GOD IS SPIRIT

SO WHAT WOULD IT MEAN TO LIVE IN TERMS OF THE SPIRIT?
MAYBE LIVING FOR GOD'S PURPOSES?

That would certainly make sense seeing that Willard talked about salvation in the aspect of being caught up in what God is doing now on earth.
That certainly would be a relationship.
It is true for many in how we would like to be in a relationship- the share in one another's lives by being caught up in what the other is doing.

Maybe that is why listening is a top priority in having relationships.

So back to St John 3:16 passage above:
Another Ideal I'd like to try on is substituting saved for having everlasting life.

So what is everlasting life?
Let's go to net.bible.org classic version and find out

Well this was a hard one...
Because the opposite of perish would be to stop perishing..

When a person is perishing they are in the state of dying until their dead.

So it would seem everlasting life would be the state in which they stop perishing. Maybe in this case in which they are given life. [Born from above]

The more interesting word in 3:16 is believeth
This word is in a continual state, which without looking it up I would think it means to continually believe.

What would you continually believe in Him for?
For Life, right?. To stop dying.(perishing) or to stop death.
Which seems to me restoration of the Spirit to Spirit communion.

The question is now when one is born they must continue in trusting Jesus for life?

So where is that actual Justification status? IS there really a status? If so is St.John 3:16 saying just that.


You have Been Given Everlasting Life as the state of perfection in order to live in accords to it.

Here's the thing, the scripture does not say stop perishing which would mean dying
It says perish which would mean die.

It sound like whoever continues to believe, put trust in Christ will stop themselves from death to be engulfed with the Spirit of Christ. Which in term is "everlasting life" the Person.

My thoughts of course-
Now that you have received the life or Spirit of Christ. We walk in steps with it by doing what is righteous.

So is this why anyone that does righteous is acceptable to God(my words) meaning Gentiles are not brought in by the law but through righteous acts. While the destruction of the old system enabled God to be A God to all?

 

[Hidden In Him]

So my question is did Jesus die for the sins of the Gentiles are they considered part of the "world"

I know that God told Peter what God had made clean let no man call unclean.

But what scriptures can I refer to that prove He died for the Gentiles as part of the whole world.

This first section sounds like you are asking about Universalism.

Let me start by saying "taking on the sins of the world" (your title) is not the same thing as "dying for the sins of the world" (your opening statements).

The first connotes entering into covenant with them, and that only happens if they accept Him by faith. The second is true of every human being who ever lived, it's just that not many have accepted the offer that was made available through Christ's death on a cross on their behalf.

God loved all His creation so He gave his son to die for those under the law to include all His creation to live in terms with His Spirit.

No. God died for the Jews who were under law. He died for the Gentiles who became a law unto themselves by obeying the law written on their hearts even though they were never under law.

I'm trying to follow your train of thought, but you seem to be convoluting a number of things together in ways that are somewhat unnatural to their contexts, so it would take some digging to figure out exactly where your hang up is theologically, i.e. where it is that you may be making a critical mistake in your thinking.

I'm not Baptist, though I once was for a time, so maybe you would be looking for someone else's input. If so, my apologies for intruding on your thread.

Blessings in Christ,
Hidden In Him

 

[Randy]

Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

he says:
“It is too small a thing for you to be my servant
to restore the tribes of Jacob
and bring back those of Israel I have kept.
I will also make you a light for the Gentiles,
that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.”

Who did Jesus send Paul to and for what purpose?

 

[Deidr]

Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

he says:
“It is too small a thing for you to be my servant
to restore the tribes of Jacob
and bring back those of Israel I have kept.
I will also make you a light for the Gentiles,
that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.”

Who did Jesus send Paul to and for what purpose?

Hi Randy is this a preterism Question

 

[Randy]

Hi Randy is this a preterism Question

ok

 

[Deidr]

This first section sounds like you are asking about Universalism.

I'm not

Let me start by saying "taking on the sins of the world" (your title) is not the same thing as "dying for the sins of the world" (your opening statements).

I I was most curious in that statement with the term World.

Do you think that Jesus took on the sins of the world by dying for them?

The first connotes entering into covenant with them, and that only happens if they accept Him by faith.

that is -taking on the sins of the world...?
Can you be specific with scripture as the theses and explain.tks

The second is true of every human being who ever lived,

And here you mean dying for the sins of the world...
that could be, because salvation is in Him.
But give a scriptural reference for me please...tks

it's just that not many have accepted the offer that was made available through Christ's death on a cross on their behalf.

Scripture

No. God died for the Jews who were under law.

I said that

He died for the Gentiles who became a law unto themselves

Where is the scripture for this...I know the part about becoming a law unto themselves is written. But dying for that cause is where I would want you to give reference to tks

by obeying the law written on their hearts even though they were never under law.

I'm trying to follow your train of thought, but you seem to be convoluting a number of things together in ways that are somewhat unnatural to their contexts

That may be your opinion..you would have to state what it is and where I've done that. For I see myself as asking questions of something I'm trying to understand clearly.

, so it would take some digging to figure out exactly where your hang up is theologically, i.e. where it is that you may be making a critical mistake in your thinking.

No digging..I'm trying to understand in what aspect did Jesus die for the Gentiles when they were not under the law- if that is, they are considered part of the meaning of the world.

Did He die for the sins of The Gentiles? Or is sin merely forgiveness in Christ because He has been given the authority to forgive sin. Even before He went to the cross?

I'm not Baptist, though I once was for a time, so maybe you would be looking for someone else's input. If so, my apologies for intruding on your thread.

Not to many people understand my statements.
I'd rather have people work out scripture to discuss then try to teach from their Denominational view point.

Blessings in Christ,

Back at ya

Hidden In Him

 

[Hidden In Him]

Do you think that Jesus took on the sins of the world by dying for them?

Again, sister, your terminology is wrong here. He "takes on" the sins of those who repent and receive forgiveness through His blood. He died for the sins of the world, but He did not "take on" the sins of the world. Two different things.

Perhaps it would be better to discuss specific passages in context, so the verses you are referring to can be rightly divided word for word.

that could be, because salvation is in Him.
But give a scriptural reference for me please...tks

Scripture

LoL. I'd be glad to discuss any passage with you, but this is more originating from you than me, so the question is what scriptures did you have in mind when you started this thread? I'm not being evasive, it's just that this is your concern and not mine (i.e. not something I was thinking about atm), so it would have to be you to tell me what scriptures were the focus of this line of questioning.

 

[Deidr]

Hi Randy is this a preterism Question

Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

he says:
“It is too small a thing for you to be my servant
to restore the tribes of Jacob
and bring back those of Israel I have kept.
I will also make you a light for the Gentiles,
that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.”

Who did Jesus send Paul to and for what purpose?

So you are implying that (salvation) here means
Jesus Dying on the cross for the penalty of sin for His chosen, and by this, (that salvation) of Him dying for the Jews that, this will tranfer to the gentiles?

In your words using scripture as reference:
What is his "salvation" that may reach the ends of the earth?

 

[Hidden In Him]

Jesus Dying on the cross for the penalty of sin for His chosen, and by this, (that salvation) of Him dying for the Jews that, this will tranfer to the gentiles?

You have a strange way of putting together sentences that makes it difficult to answer you.

So you are implying that (salvation) here means
Jesus Dying on the cross for the penalty of sin for His chosen

Correct.

and by this, (that salvation) of Him dying for the Jews that, this will tranfer to the gentiles?

The only way to make legible sense of this set of phrases is to rewrite it, and forgive me if I miss your intent, but this the best I can make out. The question is "By His dying on a cross for the Jews, does this transfer to the Gentiles?"

If that's the question, it transfers only if they believe, just as with the Jews.

 

[Deidr]

Again, sister, your terminology is wrong here. He "takes on" the sins of those who repent and receive forgiveness through His blood. He died for the sins of the world, but He did not "take on" the sins of the world. Two different things.

Oh good information...well said..now what was I asking..I have a 5 sec memory..thats why I must make connections so I can remember.

So what you are saying Is Jesus has not forgiven the sins of the World.

but in Him the sins of the world are where sins are forgiven.

So what did He do then....Did He just make light of the fact that sins are forgiven in Him? By?......your answer.

Perhaps it would be better to discuss specific passages in context, so the verses you are referring to can be rightly divided word for word.



LoL. I'd be glad to discuss any passage with you, but this is more originating from you than me, so the question is what scriptures did you have in mind when you started this thread? I'm not being evasive, it's just that this is your concern and not mine (i.e. not something I was thinking about atm), so it would have to be you to tell me what scriptures were the focus of this line of questioning.

 

[Deidr]

You have a strange way of putting together sentences that makes it difficult to answer you.



Correct.


The only way to make legible sense of this set of phrases is to rewrite it, and forgive me if I miss your intent, but this the best I can make out. The question is "By His dying on a cross for the Jews, does this transfer to the Gentiles?"

If that's the question, it transfers only if they believe, just as with the Jews.

And what are they to believe? That Jesus was sent by God to be the place where sins are forgiven ....

 

[Deidr]

You have a strange way of putting together sentences that makes it difficult to answer you.



Correct.


The only way to make legible sense of this set of phrases is to rewrite it, and forgive me if I miss your intent, but this the best I can make out. The question is "By His dying on a cross for the Jews, does this transfer to the Gentiles?"

If that's the question, it transfers only if they believe, just as with the Jews.

So let me put this together, correct me if I'm wrong.

Jesus Died to free the Jews off under the law so they could be married to the Spirit and not the letter.
So this is the Jews
However the Gentiles now have access to the Father through the same spirit (message)when they believe that Jesus is the son of God.

 

[Deidr]

So let me put this together, correct me if I'm wrong.

Jesus Died to free the Jews off under the law so they could be married to the Spirit and not the letter.
So this is the Jews
However the Gentiles now have access to the Father through the same spirit (message)when they believe that Jesus is the son of God.

So all this is saying is by the name of Jesus every knee must bow. And God help put that in perspective by using the Jews to fulfill prophesy so that the world can see that salvation or deliverence is open to anyone that accepts Jesus as King, Son of God, ruler, Creator...etc

 

[Randy]

So you are implying that (salvation) here means
Jesus Dying on the cross for the penalty of sin for His chosen, and by this, (that salvation) of Him dying for the Jews that, this will tranfer to the gentiles?

In your words using scripture as reference:
What is his "salvation" that may reach the ends of the earth?

Jesus prayed for those who believed in Him and those who would come to believe in Him through their message. He stated He wasn't praying for the whole world.
By Gods will His salvation was sent to the whole world.
In the world those who received Jesus and believed in Him God gave the right for them to be called the children of God.
children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So what did He do then....Did He just make light of the fact that sins are forgiven in Him?

No. Why would you think I was saying that?

Jesus Died to free the Jews off under the law so they could be married to the Spirit and not the letter.
So this is the Jews
However the Gentiles now have access to the Father through the same spirit (message)when they believe that Jesus is the son of God.

Nearly correct, yes. Although when you say "through the same spirit" it should be capitalized, and is a reference to the Spirit Himself as our Teacher, not just to the message being taught.

 

[Deidr]

So now I see why God is no respect or of person..
Because to seek righteousness shows one has a repentive heart.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So now I see why God is no respect or of person..
Because to seek righteousness shows one has a repentive heart.

Absolutely.

 

[Deidr]

Jesus prayed for those who believed in Him and those who would come to believe in Him through their message. He stated He wasn't praying for the whole world.
By Gods will His salvation was sent to the whole world.
In the world those who received Jesus and believed in Him God gave the right for them to be called the children of God.

children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

Please explain your interpretation of this last part...tks

 

[Deidr]

No. Why would you think I was saying that?


Nearly correct, yes. Although when you say "through the same spirit" it should be capitalized, and is a reference to the Spirit Himself as our Teacher, not just to the message being taught.

So I thought I was getting an A+ lol


So are you saying that....what I thought you were saying has nothing to do with it. I figure that is not all of the reason.