Does the flesh rise

[n2thelight]

Why do most people seem to think your flesh body will rise when it's nowhere in scripture

 

[Marilyn C]

Why do most people seem to think your flesh body will rise when it's nowhere in scripture

I think perhaps people haven`t the correct terminology.

`The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. it is sown in dishonour, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body and there is a spiritual body.` (1 Cor. 15: 42 - 44)

What a wonderful hope.

Marilyn.

 

[Mister E]

Why do most people seem to think your flesh body will rise when it's nowhere in scripture

This should be fun.

They drank the Kool-Ade they were offered. Why do most people seem to think we were flying to, landing and walking, and roving on the moon beginning in the 1950’s? Because that’s what was served up on a spoon and consumed.

Many people believe what they are taught by rote.

 

[Free]

Why do most people seem to think your flesh body will rise when it's nowhere in scripture

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

So, what is it then that rises?

1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back?

 

[Whatever]

So, what is it then that rises?

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back?

1Co 15:42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable.
1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power.
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.

By flesh you seem to be thinking of us as we are know with hearts pumping blood and so forth. But a little acorn turns into a big Oak tree. So, we will be raised, but not in perishable, weak, natural bodies. I don't think anybody alive really understands what that will be like.

 

[for_his_glory]

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

So, what is it then that rises?

1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back?

Flesh and blood can not inherit the kingdom of God and we know not what we will be, but that we will be as Christ, 1 Corinthians 15:50-58; 1 John 3:2.

 

[Free]

1Co 15:42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable.
1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power.
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.

By flesh you seem to be thinking of us as we are know with hearts pumping blood and so forth. But a little acorn turns into a big Oak tree. So, we will be raised, but not in perishable, weak, natural bodies. I don't think anybody alive really understands what that will be like.

Flesh and blood can not inherit the kingdom of God and we know not what we will be, but that we will be as Christ, 1 Corinthians 15:50-58; 1 John 3:2.

I’m simply asking the OP what their understanding is.

 

[for_his_glory]

I’m simply asking the OP what their understanding is.

okie dokie

 

[n2thelight]

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

So, what is it then that rises?

1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back?

Why would you even want this flesh body back ?

 

[n2thelight]

I’m simply asking the OP what their understanding is.

My understanding is that we (the soul) have a flesh body that we hang out in , until death or the return of Christ ,whichever happens first.

Nowhere in scripture do I see where the flesh will rise

 

[n2thelight]

Where did Christ go after His death ,the 3 days ?

Where are the dead now ? Are they not under the alter of God ?Did not He say He brings them with Him at His return ?

The flesh is nothing but dirt ,elements and that's where it shall return .

 

[Free]

Why would you even want this flesh body back ?

My understanding is that we (the soul) have a flesh body that we hang out in , until death or the return of Christ ,whichever happens first.

Nowhere in scripture do I see where the flesh will rise

Where did Christ go after His death ,the 3 days ?

Where are the dead now ? Are they not under the alter of God ?Did not He say He brings them with Him at His return ?

The flesh is nothing but dirt ,elements and that's where it shall return .

Okay, but none of that answer my questions. I'll repost:

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

So, what is it then that rises?

1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back? Another way to look at it is, what happens to the flesh bodies of those who are "caught up together with [the risen]"?

 

[n2thelight]

Okay, but none of that answer my questions. I'll repost:

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

So, what is it then that rises?

1Th 4:17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

When and how do the dead get their flesh bodies back? Another way to look at it is, what happens to the flesh bodies of those who are "caught up together with [the risen]"?

So what I see here is a contradiction of scripture ,yet we know God don't make mistakes .

So let's go to 1Th

I Thessalonians 4:13 "But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope."

Here's the subject ,those who have died

I Thessalonians 4:14 "For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him."

If we believe, as a Christian, that Christ set the example for us; so that we will follow as He did, in dying, and rising again, then "to sleep" is to be dead from the flesh body. The Greek is a simple language, for it's structure allows one to be more precise. The subject in the frame of this verse is; "that ye not be ignorant as to where the dead are." If you're a Christian, you know and believe that Jesus Christ died, was buried, and on the third day arose and came out of the tomb. If you do not believe this, Paul classifies you as ignorant, and heathen [non-believer].

It was on the fortieth day that he ascended back to the Father. When Jesus ascended into heaven, all the souls went with him into heaven also, that had passed on, up to that point in time. The souls of some went to wait for that time of judgment, while others to the glory of God. Those that sleep [are dead] are not out there in a hole in the ground, but all Christians must believe that they arose to be with the Father, just like Christ did also. The dead are with God; all of them.

I Thessalonians 4:15 "For we say unto you, by the word of our Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent in no wise [precede] them which are asleep."

Paul says, "Behold I show you a mystery". In other words, Paul is going to reveal something so we will not be ignorant about it. "We shall not all sleep [die] but we shall all be changed." I Corinthians 15:51 Changed to what? The same thing the dead are, and that is the subject. All those still in the flesh body, at a certain moment [the sounding of the seventh trumpet] will shed this flesh body [corruptible and perishable body] and take on the new "incorruptible" body. Friend, That is the hope and salvation of the Christian.

To document this, in I Corinthians 15:50 we are told that "flesh and blood cannot inherit", or face Jesus Christ in His kingdom. Christ's kingdom will cover the entire earth, and that is why the flesh body must perish. The time of this change comes at the seventh trumpet, which is the last trump, and stated in verse 52, "for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed".

Do you think the spirits that Christ went and preached to for 3 days after His death were just spirits without substance?

We have TWO bodies (flesh, spirit) at death or at the return of Christ, whichever comes first, we step out of the flesh ,NEVER to EVER need it again

Why do you think the birds will eat the flesh of kings

Revelation 19:17 "And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;"

Revelation 19:18 "That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men both free and bond, both small and great."

This is what the prophet Ezekiel wrote about in Ezekiel 39:17.

Ezekiel 39:17 "And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord God; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to My sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood."


Ezekiel 39:18 "Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan."

I mean ,it even grieved God that He made man flesh, why would one think that we would ever need it again ?

We will return to the body that we had before being born of woman ​

 

[tdidymas]

Why do most people seem to think your flesh body will rise when it's nowhere in scripture

Paul wrote that we long to be clothed, when talking about death and resurrection - 2 Cor. 5:4
This means we will eventually be clothed with a body in the resurrection.

It is not mortal flesh, but will be flesh, because Jesus said He had flesh after He was raised - Lk. 24:39
John wrote "we do not know what we will be like..." meaning in the resurrection, we will not be clothed with the same kind of flesh we have now; "...but we shall be like Him..." meaning we will have flesh like Christ's.

Jesus said that in the resurrection we will be like the angels of heaven - Mat. 22:30

These verses tell us that when are raised from the dead, we will have bodies which are immortal, like angels and like Christ. And since Jesus said he had flesh, the bodies will be flesh. But also they will be spiritual bodies, as Paul wrote in 1 Cor. 15. The bottom line is that the bodies will have substance. We will not be just disembodied spirits without the "clothing" of bodies.

 

[n2thelight]

Paul wrote that we long to be clothed, when talking about death and resurrection - 2 Cor. 5:4
This means we will eventually be clothed with a body in the resurrection.

It is not mortal flesh, but will be flesh, because Jesus said He had flesh after He was raised - Lk. 24:39
John wrote "we do not know what we will be like..." meaning in the resurrection, we will not be clothed with the same kind of flesh we have now; "...but we shall be like Him..." meaning we will have flesh like Christ's.

Jesus said that in the resurrection we will be like the angels of heaven - Mat. 22:30

These verses tell us that when are raised from the dead, we will have bodies which are immortal, like angels and like Christ. And since Jesus said he had flesh, the bodies will be flesh. But also they will be spiritual bodies, as Paul wrote in 1 Cor. 15. The bottom line is that the bodies will have substance. We will not be just disembodied spirits without the "clothing" of bodies.

We already have a body inside of this flesh

II Corinthians 5:4 "For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life."

We that are now living in this tent of flesh called our human body, do groan with the burdens that we face in our everyday lives. In other words, while we are living in our flesh body, we do not worry about being clothed in this flesh body, as much as we are concerned with our clothing for our spiritual body. "Mortal" means liable to die, and this old tent of flesh and blood that we call our human body will pass on in due time. "..might be swallowed up of life", means that when we accept Christ there is no death to our lives. Death becomes swallowed up in eternal life.

Christ was risen in the flesh because it was written that He would not see corruption

Acts 13:35 "Wherefore He saith also in another psalm, `Thou shalt not suffer Thine Hoy One to see corruption:' "

This quote is from the sixteenth Psalm. This is referring to Jesus flesh.

Psalm 16:10 "For Thou wilt not leave My soul in hell; Neither wilt Thou suffer Thine Holy One to see corruption."

Even His (Christ)body was transfigured before He returned to Heaven.

We are already like the angels in Heaven, just inside of a flesh body

 

[tdidymas]

We already have a body inside of this flesh

II Corinthians 5:4 "For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life."

We that are now living in this tent of flesh called our human body, do groan with the burdens that we face in our everyday lives. In other words, while we are living in our flesh body, we do not worry about being clothed in this flesh body, as much as we are concerned with our clothing for our spiritual body. "Mortal" means liable to die, and this old tent of flesh and blood that we call our human body will pass on in due time. "..might be swallowed up of life", means that when we accept Christ there is no death to our lives. Death becomes swallowed up in eternal life.

Christ was risen in the flesh because it was written that He would not see corruption

Acts 13:35 "Wherefore He saith also in another psalm, `Thou shalt not suffer Thine Hoy One to see corruption:' "

This quote is from the sixteenth Psalm. This is referring to Jesus flesh.

Psalm 16:10 "For Thou wilt not leave My soul in hell; Neither wilt Thou suffer Thine Holy One to see corruption."

Even His (Christ)body was transfigured before He returned to Heaven.

We are already like the angels in Heaven, just inside of a flesh body

1. I disagree that we have two bodies simultaneously, one flesh and the other "inside" (whatever that means). 2 Cor. 5:1-5 is not speaking of having 2 bodies simultaneously. We groan now because we know that when we die (this body is destroyed), we will be unclothed, and so we groan for the resurrection when we will be clothed with immortality. Paul is relating a future event in contrast with the present.

2. No, we are not already like the angels in heaven. Jesus said we would be in the resurrection, which is a future event. That is, the resurrection of the dead and the translation of the living at that future time.

 

[Free]

So what I see here is a contradiction of scripture ,yet we know God don't make mistakes .

What contradiction?

So let's go to 1Th

I Thessalonians 4:13 "But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope."

Here's the subject ,those who have died

I Thessalonians 4:14 "For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him."

If we believe, as a Christian, that Christ set the example for us; so that we will follow as He did, in dying, and rising again, then "to sleep" is to be dead from the flesh body. The Greek is a simple language, for it's structure allows one to be more precise. The subject in the frame of this verse is; "that ye not be ignorant as to where the dead are." If you're a Christian, you know and believe that Jesus Christ died, was buried, and on the third day arose and came out of the tomb. If you do not believe this, Paul classifies you as ignorant, and heathen [non-believer].

It was on the fortieth day that he ascended back to the Father. When Jesus ascended into heaven, all the souls went with him into heaven also, that had passed on, up to that point in time. The souls of some went to wait for that time of judgment, while others to the glory of God. Those that sleep [are dead] are not out there in a hole in the ground, but all Christians must believe that they arose to be with the Father, just like Christ did also. The dead are with God; all of them.

I Thessalonians 4:15 "For we say unto you, by the word of our Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent in no wise [precede] them which are asleep."

You stopped short of verse 16, which I gave above:

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

You stated that "all the souls" went with Christ to heaven and that "The dead are with God; all of them." So, to repeat my first question again: What is it that then rises?

Paul says, "Behold I show you a mystery". In other words, Paul is going to reveal something so we will not be ignorant about it. "We shall not all sleep [die] but we shall all be changed." I Corinthians 15:51 Changed to what? The same thing the dead are, and that is the subject. All those still in the flesh body, at a certain moment [the sounding of the seventh trumpet] will shed this flesh body [corruptible and perishable body] and take on the new "incorruptible" body. Friend, That is the hope and salvation of the Christian.

To document this, in I Corinthians 15:50 we are told that "flesh and blood cannot inherit", or face Jesus Christ in His kingdom. Christ's kingdom will cover the entire earth, and that is why the flesh body must perish. The time of this change comes at the seventh trumpet, which is the last trump, and stated in verse 52, "for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed".

You are again ignoring important context. Look at verse 52-53:

1Co 15:50 I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
1Co 15:51 Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
1Co 15:52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.
1Co 15:53 For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality.

Paul says "that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." Yet, if the souls of believers are in heaven, then they have already inherited the kingdom of God and so must be imperishable. So, why does Paul make the points that 1) the dead are raised, and 2) that they are raised imperishable? Again, just what is it that is being raised? "Flesh and blood" refers to our bodies as they now are--predisposed to decay, sickness, and death, continually undergoing repair.

Verse 53 is pretty clear that it is the perishable body, the mortal body, that is changed. At no point does Paul say that we will shed our bodies. His whole point is that we will have changed physical bodies, "spiritualized" physical bodies, the same as Christ. Nowhere does Paul mention another body. That idea is foreign to his writings.

We have TWO bodies (flesh, spirit) at death or at the return of Christ, whichever comes first, we step out of the flesh ,NEVER to EVER need it again

Again, not only is this idea is foreign to Paul's writings, it is foreign to Scripture as a whole.

I mean ,it even grieved God that He made man flesh, why would one think that we would ever need it again ?

Where does the Bible says this?

We will return to the body that we had before being born of woman ​

We never had bodies before being born of woman. Do you have verses that say otherwise?

What you're essentially promoting is Gnosticism, where flesh is bad and spirit is good. That is heresy.

 

[Free]

Even His (Christ)body was transfigured before He returned to Heaven.

The one and only time the Bible speaks of Christ being transfigured was on the mountain, prior to his death and resurrection. He is still truly God and truly man, with his "spiritualized," physical resurrection body.

 

[n2thelight]

And the dead in Christ will rise first.

The dead have already risen .Can't help you with Paul's writing's as he clearly indicates that we have two bodies .
Our soul comes from Heaven to be placed in the flesh .

 

[n2thelight]

The one and only time the Bible speaks of Christ being transfigured was on the mountain, prior to his death and resurrection. He is still truly God and truly man, with his "spiritualized," physical resurrection body.

Do you think Christ returned to Heaven in a flesh body?