Exposing Hislop's "The Two Babylons"

[MrVersatile48]

Just time to post this relevant link:-

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 392#252392

Back soon...

17 mins left for today

Good job we Pentecostal/Charismatics - in all denominations - believe & seek to practise 'Body Ministry'

It is only as every joint & ligament in the Body of Christ fulfils its proper function that we see a healthy Body

Back with link @ that...

Meanwhile, a timely Word 4 Today from http://www.arcamax.com again:-




Today's Scripture

Knowing Him through His Word


Let, I pray thee, thy merciful kindness be for my comfort,
according to thy word unto thy servant.

Let thy tender mercies come unto me, that I may live:
for thy law is my delight.

Psalm 119:76,77 KJV

__________________

Deal bountifully with thy servant, that I may live,
and keep thy word.

Open thou mine eyes, that I may behold wondrous things
out of thy law.

I am a stranger in the earth:
hide not thy commandments from me.

Psalm 119:17-19 KJV

__________________

The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul:
the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart:
the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.

Psalm 19:7,8 KJV

__________________

Thanks be unto God for His wonderful gift:
Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God
is the object of our faith; the only faith
that saves is faith in Him.


Read Through the Bible in a Year

March 19: Matthew 18:21-35, Numbers 7-8, Ecclesiastes 6
Click Here for the complete schedule

Or Copy and paste this link into your browser:
http://www.arcamax.com/ttb-yr.html



Weekly Meditation

The Salvation of the Lord


And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law,

Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said,

Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word:

For mine eyes have seen thy salvation,

Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people;

A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

And Joseph and his mother marvelled at those things which were spoken of him.

And Simeon blessed them, and said unto Mary his mother, Behold, this child is set for the fall and rising again of many in Israel; and for a sign which shall be spoken against;

(Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.

Luke 2:27-35 KJV

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Timely reminder of 1 of the RC errors exposed in the blockbuster film, 'Passion Of The Christ'

It's the idea that Mary had to give her permission for Jesus to go to the cross - that she was thus, in authority over Him

Blasphemous rubbish!

& Pope JP2 gave away how he did more than any other pope to spread Mary-olatry, when he famously said of the film, 'It is as it was'

& by the big 'M' on his coffin

& by Papa Ratzi's words - which they are bound to have planned together beforehand

When Bene took over, I said online that all Bible-believing evangelicals urge him to take this opportunity to reject all the distinctive RC dogma & practices as clearly unbiblical

At 12, Jesus had to upbraid Mary & Joseph's interference: "Do you not know that I must be about My Father's business?"

Likewise later, when Mary & His younger brothers & sisters tried to interrupt His work..

"Who are My mother, sisters & brothers?

Those who obey God"

Just time now for a link to save @ 20 mins' retyping:-

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 687#252687

& to add, in correction of any undue pride in any nominally 'Protestant' readers, that evangelicals have more in common with nominal RCs than with nominal protestants who don't even believe in a Personal - let alone Almighty - Creator God

Let us pray that Thess, Phat & many other RCs 'come out of darkness into light..out of death & into life'

"God does not take pleasure in the death of any..but desires that all may come to repent & believe the gospel'

A link to "Where is Europe going?" - to encourage friends to see singer/BBC Radio 2 DJ Paul Jones & actress wife Fiona's quest on The 700 Club @ http://www.God.TV

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 710#252710

God bless all with ears to hear & eyes to see!

Must go!

 

[MrVersatile48]

Pontifex Maximus was a Babylon pagan occult title - as was 'college of cardinals'

Only in the 4th century did Rome claim pre-eminence for their Bishop of Rome

Tish, tish, bish!!

The keys on Papa Ratzi's uniform are of the 2-faced pagan Roman 'god' Janus

Cardinal means hinge

These bozos are just SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO unhinged, dudes!

 

[phatcatholic]

Mr.Versatile,

still waiting on you to prove the following:
--that similarity does equal causality,
--or that this causality argument of Hislop's would not have horrible implications for all of Christianity,
--or that our scholarly reference works do in fact substantiate what Hislop says about Nimrod and Semiramis,
--or that Hislop did not in fact misrepresent Wilkinson's Ancient Egyptians by selectively quoting it out of context and misquoting it altogether,
--or that what Hislop says about the round wafer would not in fact, by his logic, cause us to condemn God's use of the manna from heaven, which was also round,
--or that there is some historical basis for Hislop's explanation of the history of the celebration of Christ's birth on Dec. 25th,
--or that it is not in fact truly warranted, and even a biblical practice, to take something pagan and redeem it with Christian principles,
--or that b/c Semiramis and Mary had the same name, this does in fact somehow prove that the church's beliefs about Mary were thus the direct result of pagan beliefs about Semiramis????? :o

if you have proved anything at all in this list with your last posts in this thread, please point it out to me, for i am afraid i have missed it.

pax christi,
phatcatholic

 

[thessalonian]

Pontifex Maximus was a Babylon pagan occult title - as was 'college of cardinals'

Only in the 4th century did Rome claim pre-eminence for their Bish of Rome

Tish, tish, bish!!

You might get away with historical ineptitude with the common man but not on this board. It makes you look very foolish. Clement of Rome orders the leaders of Cornith in the first century to reinstate some leaders whom they had ousted. This letter he wrote was highly viewed as authoritive throughout the Christian world of the time, being distributed widely. Interestingly enough this happened while the Apostle John was in Ephesus, only 600 miles away. Rome was 600 miles away from Corinth.

Bishop Victor I I believe it was in the 2nd century was going to excommunicate the Quadramecians because they would not submit to him regarding the day easter was to be on. Irenaus disagreed with him but not once did he question his authority to do so. Stephen settled the issue of baptism of heretics. Liberus was the one that everyone was most concerned about regarding Athanasius trinitarian expose's. He was exiled over it. The anti-popes, Hippolatus and Novatian in the third century show that there was in fact an authority of the Roman Bishop over the whole Church, if one studies these events. You simply don't know what you are talking about and make off the cuff statements that you have not researched yourself. I could site more examples of the foolishness of your statement.

The keys on Papa Ratzi's uniform are of the 2-faced pagan Roman 'god' Janus

I don't see any two headed god in this dude. Sorry.

http://www.ewtn.com/pope/life/arms.asp

Cardinal

means hinge

Do you go to Church on Saturday or Sunday. Did you know your using pagan words to describe the day you go to Church. :o

I don't think it's the Catholic cardinals that are unhinged.

 

[phatcatholic]

thess..............don't take the bait bro. all of these issues he is raising are merely red herrings so that he can avoid replying to what i have continually asked him to address, tho to no avail. i even bolded one of my points, and put it in a large red font..........but nothing.

 

[thessalonian]

thess..............don't take the bait bro. all of these issues he is raising are merely red herrings so that he can avoid replying to what i have continually asked him to address, tho to no avail. i even bolded one of my points, and put it in a large red font..........but nothing.

:smt116

 

[MrVersatile48]

Evangelicals can click on the top of page 6 here, where I posted links to the book online & listed its contents

I just have time now to post this timely link:- 8-)

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... ht=#255006

I'm sure many readers are more than capable of adding whatever grabs them to the vast subject of this thread :

This epic will run & run, folks but only if you want it to! :-D

& folk tend to scroll down whatever they find boring... :evil:

to get to the good stuff!!! :multi:

The 2 clowns above consistently claim that all aspects can be covered in 1 mammoth post :roll:

Word..

to communicators...

from this ex-pro entertainer... :angel:

don't let 'em make you as boring as they are, OK? :

In fact, never give any mere human control over you

See 1 Cor 1:18-25

1 Corinthians 1:18-25 (New International Version)


Christ the Wisdom and Power of God

18For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
19For it is written:
"I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate."[a]

20Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

21For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.
22Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom,
23but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.

25For the foolishness of God is wiser than man's wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man's strength.

Footnotes:

1 Corinthians 1:19 Isaiah 29:14


Ask God what He wants you to write right now

That's what I always do

Back to fill my last 30 minutes with a breath-taking variety of posts...

 

[Dave...]

This whole dilemma can be solved very easily. If it's not the truth, not the Gospel according to God's Word, it is in fact a false religion. ALL false religion finds it source, or roots, in Babylon, this is what the Bible teaches. The seeds of that original false system of teaching are still with us today and will one day form the one world false religion.

All we need to do to prove that Catholicism is rooted in the Babylonian false religion is to prove that Catholicism is not the true Gospel, which has been done over and over on this forum.

Dave

 

[MrVersatile48]

Thanks for that succinct summary, Dave

Did anyone see that recent Revelation TV feature on 2/3 other books?

1 is "Babylon: Now & Then" by Sir Robert Anderson, the ex-Chief Constable

The guest talked about how, several times, God upbraided Israel for whoring after other 'gods' that are not real, but mere idols

He said that 10 popes had been made pope thru prostitutes: 1 of them was openly living with 1, who then got her son made pope too

AH: I didn't write down the 2nd book, but I'm sure it was called '50 Years As A Priest' - I'm sure http://www.christianbooks.com has a search facility to find writer's name

The author studied RC history, was very perturbed indeed by the sale of indulgences etc - as was Martin Luther, who began the Protest-ant movement with his famous 39 theses nailed to the door of Wittenburg Cathedral, intended to spark debate & bring reform back to Bible principles

RCC falsely claim that they go right back to Jesus' day

But check the RCC catechism's many errors - no way did true followers of Christ believe such obvious lies

& those lies crept in bit by bit, as RCC got more confident in its power to deceive

Anyway, the ex-priest asked his bishop about many villains that had become pope & could see he was only getting lies & smokescreen diversions in reply

The verses he kept hearing from God were about trees & their fruit

As Dave has hinted, anyone who knows the Bible well can just hit Vatican site, click catechism & see how many errors there are - all of which the RCs in this thread keep covered up

AH: a 3rd book mentioned on that program on http://www.rtv.com was "The Woman Riding The Beast" by Dave Hunt

Rev 17 has been printed in this thread

& folk can see the 'goddess' Europa on EU flags, coins & the statue outside EU Parliament, fulfilling Daniel 7 - that forecast a revived Roman Empire to crush, trample & devour victims till the 'Ancient of Days' crushes it

Must go!

Ian

 

[thessalonian]

Mr. V. We've been wating a long time and still not answers to phat's questions. Do you understand them?

Mr. V.

You like to use the same kind of logic that anti-trinitarians use against the trinity. Isn't that interesting. Must not be very good then I guess.

Blessings

 

[MrVersatile48]

The same questions have been posted 2/3 times on this page, & I'm sure they were on page 1, so there have been many answers - but there are always room for more, from those who may well understand the questions better than I :

Confessing your faith must be on-topic here, so this is from a search @ 'errors of RC catechism'

@ the UCCF forum, by D Brasted (= Universities/Colleges Christian Fell)



"Is Roman Catholicism Christianity?"


I am writing this to two audiences - to those of you in the Roman Catholic Church, and to Biblical, born-again believers in Jesus Christ. As we are propelled ever faster into the time of the end, I believe it is ever more important that people are made aware of one of Satan's greatest deceptions - the lie that Roman Catholicism is a valid form of biblical Christianity. Many of you will be protesting at this point at such a seemingly confrontational, discriminatory statement, but please hear me out because it concerns the most important question we could ever consider - our eternal destination.

The Word of God is very clear on the importance of pure doctrine. We are called to "Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season.

Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching." Why? "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables." (2 Timothy 4:2-4) Christianity as proclaimed in Scripture is "...the faith which was ONCE FOR ALL delivered to the saints." Jude 3 (my emphasis) There are dire warnings against preaching a gospel that is in any way different to that outlined in Scripture.

Galatians 1:8-9: "But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed."

But this is precisely what Roman Catholicism is - a different gospel. AND IT CANNOT SAVE.

Perhaps you are unaware of the actual teachings of Roman Catholicism. Allow me to go through some of these doctrines, comparing them to Scripture. Quotes will be from the Catholic Catechism of 1994, revised in 1997, as referenced on http://www.kofc.org/faith/catechism/catechism.cfm



Teachings on Mary...

According to Catholic teaching, Mary was sinless.

Section 491: The most Blessed Virgin Mary was, from the first moment of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege of almighty God and by virtue of the merits of Jesus Christ, Saviour of the human race, preserved immune from all stain of original sin.

Section 508: From among the descendants of Eve, God chose the Virgin Mary to be the mother of his Son. "Full of grace", Mary is "the most excellent fruit of redemption" (SC 103): from the first instant of her conception, she was totally preserved from the stain of original sin and she remained pure from all personal sin throughout her life.

But what does the Word of God say?

Romans 3:23: "...for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God..."
Luke 1:46-47: "And Mary said: "My soul magnifies the Lord, and my spirit has rejoiced in God my Saviour."

If Mary was sinless, then why does the Bible say ALL have sinned, and why does Mary need a Saviour?

According to Catholic teaching, Mary is Queen of Heaven, is involved in our salvation by her intercession, and was taken up bodily into Heaven.

Section 964: Mary's role in the Church is inseparable from her union with Christ and flows directly from it. "This union of the mother with the Son in the work of salvation is made manifest from the time of Christ's virginal conception up to his death"; it is made manifest above all at the hour of his Passion:

Thus the Blessed Virgin advanced in her pilgrimage of faith, and faithfully persevered in her union with her Son unto the cross. There she stood, in keeping with the divine plan, enduring with her only begotten Son the intensity of his suffering, joining herself with his sacrifice in her mother's heart, and lovingly consenting to the immolation of this victim, born of her: to be given, by the same Christ Jesus dying on the cross, as a mother to his disciple, with these words: "Woman, behold your son."

Section 966: "Finally the Immaculate Virgin, preserved free from all stain of original sin, when the course of her earthly life was finished, was taken up body and soul into heavenly glory, and exalted by the Lord as Queen over all things, so that she might be the more fully conformed to her Son, the Lord of lords and conqueror of sin and death." The Assumption of the Blessed Virgin is a singular participation in her Son's Resurrection and an anticipation of the resurrection of other Christians:

In giving birth you kept your virginity; in your Dormition you did not leave the world, O Mother of God, but were joined to the source of Life. You conceived the living God and, by your prayers, will deliver our souls from death.

Section 969: "This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation .... Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix."

But what does the Word of God say?

Galatians 3:13-14: "Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree"), that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith."

1 Timothy 2:5-6: "For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, who gave Himself a ransom for all..."

Romans 8:34: "It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us."

Hebrews 7:25: "Therefore He is also able to save to the uttermost those who come to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them."

Mary is NOT "Queen of Heaven", was NOT taken up bodily into Heaven to be exalted, is NOT our Mediator, and will NOT "deliver our souls from death" by her prayers!!!


Teachings on salvation...

According to Catholic teaching, salvation comes through the Catholic Church.

Section 819: "Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth" are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: "the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements." Christ's Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to "Catholic unity."

Secion 846: ...all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.

According to Catholic teaching, baptism is necessary for salvation and forgiveness of sins.

Section 1257: The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation. He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them. Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament. The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit." God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.

1263 By Baptism all sins are forgiven, original sin and all personal sins, as well as all punishment for sin. 66 In those who have been reborn nothing remains that would impede their entry into the Kingdom of God, neither Adam's sin, nor personal sin, nor the consequences of sin, the gravest of which is separation from God.

Section 1277: Baptism is birth into the new life in Christ. In accordance with the Lord's will, it is necessary for salvation, as is the Church herself, which we enter by Baptism.

But what does the Word of God say?

Ephesians 2:8-9: " For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast."

Romans 10 -10: "...if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

Galatians 2:16: "...a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified."

1 John 1 : "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Scripture is clear - we are saved solely through faith in Jesus Christ. Nothing else. Not baptism, not by belonging to a particular church, but faith alone. And even our faith is not of ourselves, but a gift from God. We simply confess our sins to God in true repentance, and "He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."


According to Catholic teaching, confession of our sins to a mere man is necessary for forgiveness.

Section 1493: One who desires to obtain reconciliation with God and with the Church, must confess to a priest all the unconfessed grave sins he remembers after having carefully examined his conscience. The confession of venial faults, without being necessary in itself, is nevertheless strongly recommended by the Church.

Section 1456: Confession to a priest is an essential part of the sacrament of Penance: "All mortal sins of which penitents after a diligent self-examination are conscious must be recounted by them in confession, even if they are most secret and have been committed against the last two precepts of the Decalogue; for these sins sometimes wound the soul more grievously and are more dangerous than those which are committed openly."

When Christ's faithful strive to confess all the sins that they can remember, they undoubtedly place all of them before the divine mercy for pardon. But those who fail to do so and knowingly withhold some, place nothing before the divine goodness for remission through the mediation of the priest, "for if the sick person is too ashamed to show his wound to the doctor, the medicine cannot heal what it does not know."

Section 1497: Individual and integral confession of grave sins followed by absolution remains the only ordinary means of reconciliation with God and with the Church.

But what does the Word of God say?

1 John 1 : "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Ephesians 1 : "In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace..."

Colossians 1:14: "the Son...in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins."

We are not forgiven of our sins because we confess them, for that would mean that any unconfessed sins would not be forgiven and we would therefore be damned.

We are forgiven because we are redeemed through Christ's sacrifice once and for all on the cross. He took our punishment upon Himself. Our confession to God is the means by which our fellowship with Him is restored and our guilt cleansed.


Teachings on Islam...

According to Catholic teaching, Muslims, among others, are in the plan of salvation.

Section 841: The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day.

But what does the Word of God say?

John 3:36: "He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

John 14:6: "Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

Galatians 1:8-9: "But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed."

Galatians 2:16: "...a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified."

Scripture is clear - salvation is through Jesus Christ alone. It is not enough to "acknowledge the Creator". Also, the Creator that Muslims worship is NOT the Creator God of the Bible - the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. For one, Allah "has no son". I could go further, but this is worth a discussion of its own...


Teachings about the Mass...

According to Catholic teaching, the Eucharist is a sacrifice, it is conducted in communion with the dead, and those who partake of it eat and drink the actual body and blood of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Section1365: Because it is the memorial of Christ's Passover, the Eucharist is also a sacrifice. The sacrificial character of the Eucharist is manifested in the very words of institution: "This is my body which is given for you" and "This cup which is poured out for you is the New Covenant in my blood." In the Eucharist Christ gives us the very body which he gave up for us on the cross, the very blood which he "poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."

Section 1370: To the offering of Christ are united not only the members still here on earth, but also those already in the glory of heaven. In communion with and commemorating the Blessed Virgin Mary and all the saints, the Church offers the Eucharistic sacrifice. In the Eucharist the Church is as it were at the foot of the cross with Mary, united with the offering and intercession of Christ

Section 1367: The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: "The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different." "And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory."

Section 1376: The Council of Trent summarizes the Catholic faith by declaring: "Because Christ our Redeemer said that it was truly his body that he was offering under the species of bread, it has always been the conviction of the Church of God, and this holy Council now declares again, that by the consecration of the bread and wine there takes place a change of the whole substance of the bread into the substance of the body of Christ our Lord and of the whole substance of the wine into the substance of his blood. This change the holy Catholic Church has fittingly and properly called transubstantiation."

But what does the Word of God say?

Deuteronomy 8:10-12: "There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, OR ONE WHO CALLS UP THE DEAD. For all who do these things are AN ABOMINATION TO THE LORD, and because of these abominations the LORD your God drives them out from before you." (my emphasis)

John 19:30: "So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "IT IS FINISHED!" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit." (my emphasis)
Hebrews 10:11-14: "And every priest stands ministering daily and offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But this Man, after He had offered ONE SACRIFICE for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God, from that time waiting till His enemies are made His footstool. For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified." (my emphasis)

Necromancy (communion with the dead) is expressly forbidden in Scripture. Christ's sacrifice on the cross was ONCE AND FOR ALL. The teaching of transubstantiation is not only complete nonsense, but cannibalism.


I have chosen only some of the teachings of Roman Catholicism here. It should be plainly obvious that these teachings are utterly contrary to God's Word. Roman Catholicism is clearly another gospel, and the Bible gives this warning: " ...if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed."

If you are a Roman Catholic, I urge you to consider what is written here and to search the 66 books of Scripture for the Truth that is the Lord Jesus Christ. Jeremiah 29:13: "And you will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart." Roman Catholicism will not save you.

Only faith in Jesus Christ - that He is the Son of God, that He died once and for all to take the punishment for our sin, and that He rose again - this alone will save you. Romans 10 -11: "...if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.""

To those of you who are born again believers in Jesus Christ, and have put your trust entirely in Him for your salvation, I hope and pray that the true identity of Roman Catholicism is now clear. It is another gospel - deceptively similar to the true gospel of Jesus Christ, but deadly to those who follow it. May the Lord give us wisdom and courage to share the true Gospel to those around us who are caught in this deception. It is my prayer that this has better prepared you for that task.

A final word to those who are truly born again but are still in the Roman Catholic Church. Get out! Revelation 18:4: "..."Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues." You cannot believe what the Roman Catholic Church teaches AND believe the clear teaching of Scripture - they are wholly incompatible. I urge you: choose the truth!

 

[thessalonian]

Mr. V,

According to Catholic teaching, baptism is necessary for salvation and forgiveness of sins.


But what does the Word of God say?

"Baptism now saves you" 1 pet 3:20
"Repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sins and you shall recieve the Holy Spirit" Acts 2:38
"Beleive and be baptized and you shall be saved" Mark 16

Yep that is what the Bible says. God uses the sign of baptism to bring the Holy Spirit in to our lives and it is the Holy Spirit that saves. We don't claim it is the water of baptism. It is the "laver of regeneration".


You should not post on Roman Catholicism. You do not understand it in the slightest.


This is exactly what it teaches.

Only faith in Jesus Christ - that He is the Son of God, that He died once and for all to take the punishment for our sin, and that He rose again - this alone will save you.

Amen bro. :angel: Though I would clarify, he took the eternal punishment. People are not let out of prisons when they kill someone because they declare Christianity. The health of a lifetime alcoholic does not immediately return when he becomes a BAC. His lost relationships are not restored. The lives of his children are still wounded.

The teaching of transubstantiation is not only complete nonsense, but cannibalism.

"Unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood you shall not have life within you"

"My flesh is TRUE FOOD, my blood is TRUE DRINK".

You call Christ's words nonsense.

By the way God is not the God of the dead but of the living. Moses and Elijah were alive when they appeared to Jesus. So are the saints in heaven. It's not necromacy. We don't try to obtain information from them. Don't make up definitions as you go to fit your own personal beliefs.
More twisting of Catholic teaching in your post but it's not worth my time. By the way perhaps you can do something other than cuts and pastes so we can see that you can think on your feet.

God bless

 

[thessalonian]

9 - Please keep posts down to a respectable length and provide source and/or links for your info. We want to respect copyrighted material. Plus, you stand a better chance of getting your post read if it contains a link with an excerpt from source that's relative to your point.
Refrain from all caps and bold, large fonts. Hotlinking of photos is PROHIBITED! We have a thread which explains how to post a photo. How to post a photo.

 

[MrVersatile48]

Just time to say google 'errors in RC history'

& 'discerning fact from fiction in history'

Thanks for the 2 posts, Thess: C U Sun, DV

Must go!

Ian

 

[MrVersatile48]

Interesting that, in the past 24 hours, no-one did & posted those suggested searches 8-)

Even more remarkable is that, in the (4 months?) gap on page 6, none of this thread's @ 1530 readers tried to reply to Phatcat's questions :o

I'd read 2 chapters a day of Proverbs, in the 15 days before coming back on this thread, & the 1 verse echoing & re-echoing in my mind now is how a wise man knows when to speak & when to keep silent

In those 4 months, I'd often linked to here, to encourage others to bring fresh voices to the subject, so I'm curious to hear the reactions of those readers, especially with the high views-to-posts ratio of this thread

How many clicked on links to the book?

What parts of it did you read?

Did you find that the huge blocks of text were unconducive to your reading much, if any, before giving up?

That's why, when I reprinted, on the thread @ RC confessional, Hislop's chapter 6, section 1 @ the Sovereign Pontiff

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 053#280053 - there are 4 short paras there B4 it starts, OK?

& its section 2 @ cardinals, priests, monks & nuns, - I broke it into much smaller paragraphs, & highlighted major summary lines in bold or italic -

(lost link thru autologout - right back)..

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 674#278674

just as I have always done in the Prayer Requests/Praise Reports forum, when posting info updates I'm sent

Back to link those 2 sections, as they're so vital to this thread, & to check if Chapter 1, section 1, was posted in here, similarly made more readable

Before I forget, here's a search result just done:-

AnswersMy Web | Search Services | Advanced Search | Preferences
Search Results1 - 10 of about 1,610,000 for telling facts from errors of history - 0.07 sec. (About this page)

WEB RESULTS

Bowling for Columbine: Documentary or Fiction?

David T. Hardy argues that the Michael Moore film is not worthy of the Best Documentary Oscar, and that it is both dishonest and fraudulent.

Category: Movie Titles > Bowling for Columbine (2003)
http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html - 56k - Cached - More from this site - Save


Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 911, Dave Kopel, Independence Institute

Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 9/11. Last revised: November 12, 2004. To the left is the poster for FarenHype 9/11 a new film released on DVD on October 5, 2004. Dave Kopel appears in the film. ... If the facts don't fit, shouldn't we acquit ... there are any genuine errors in this report, the errors will be ... an Illinois State University history professor, who wrote the letter ... http://www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysi ... it-911.htm - 285k - Cached - More from this site - Save

Spinsanity - Viewer beware: In "Bowling for Columbine," Michael Moore once again puts distortions and contradictions...
... films will take the facts and hard-core analysis and ... it turns out his "facts and hard-core analysis" are ... Bush-Quayle campaign ad, changing history to make a point ... http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20021119.html - 18k - Cached - More from this site - Save

Think Progress " That's Not Accurate: White House Alters Transcript of Press Briefing
... House Believers "Your History Aint My HIstory" Dont you know ... trying to hold you to facts instead of liberal dogma ... you receive word from Rove telling you which one you ... http://www.thinkprogress.org/2005/11/09 ... transcript - 171k - Cached - More from this site - Save

The White Family History Book Facts
The White Family History Book. Interesting Web-Sites. Worry, your family will never know that this white bread is. ... to a white family history please sign my guest ... A doll story telling a white mountain family history. Richard white's ... 3 type 2 errors in assessment of homology of developmental ... http://www.tree-of-families.com/the-whi ... -book.html - More from this site - Save

Lie Detector History Articles | Lie Detector History Facts
... That extent, the history of the lie detector offers a ... bodily changes resulting from the telling of a lie ... that produce few of these types of errors, such as those ... http://www.polygraph-facts.info/lie-det ... story.html - More from this site - Save

www.FactCheck.org Cheney & Edwards Mangle Facts


... candidates played loose with the facts at the second Presidential Debate ... They retired General Shinseki for telling him that ... go into the economic history books won't be known until ... http://www.factcheck.org/article.aspx@docID=275.html - 39k - Cached - More from this site - Save

Spinsanity - Dude, Where's My Intellectual Honesty?
... a slipshod journalist who has trouble getting his facts right ... least Moore is finally telling the truth about the US ... mass murderer in U.S. history, you got a free trip ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When I made my last, very fast post, on Sun, I had no idea what the search result would be, & I was full of wonder, of the sense of adventure :multi:

Had/have most readers lost those precious senses that make life exciting day by day & moment by moment? :roll:

I'll also link posts, made today, that show I ain't kidding when I say, as I've shared with many friends in this heatwave, that I've felt quite dizzy & faint, several times, & it's a sheer miracle that it's never been while crossing a busy road :

Guys, if the silences, questioned above, were thru thinking, 'I'll just see what Ian says next', think on (as we Northerners say) ....:angel:

the reason we old-timers encourage you young 'uns to have a go is that we know how vulnerable, fragile & mortal we are (compared to a car, bus or lorry on the busy roads we may just faint in 1 day) :-?

I know for a fact that some folk just read in 'Net forums, & never post, because the lively level of banter & sheer heat of some arguments, etc, just scare 'em, so they send me stuff to post for 'em :

As I said, (in 1 of my action-hero vocal impressions), to some fine young Christian men, in the last office I helped in, 'Guys, we are at war '- (spiritual war against Satan, that is) - 'ya need to toughen up'

& they were already strong guys

The 'Net is anonymous - ideal training ground to try your experiments & find your feet, yes?

I sincerely look forward to reading more & saying less as time goes on, OK?

Back to link...

Ian :-D

 

[thessalonian]

Dear Reader,

When discerning fact or fiction regarding Hislop, do take a gander at the articles linked by phatcatholic on the very first post of this thread. Some by reputable protestant authors. Make sure you read and understand on both sides of the issue and don't just accept what you read hook line and sinker based on your prejudices against Catholicism. Mr. Hislop's logic is proven to be false in many instances. His renderings of Catholic theology are twisted. This is quite clear to all except those who want him to be correct and so believe whatever he says without really questioning it deeply. Actually you don't even have to go to deep. Once again read hislop. but also go to the links on the first post of this thread. Mr. V of course will not recommend opposing articles because they burst his bubble.

 

[MrVersatile48]

Hi Thess!

Can I just admit here, as it goes with my last post, that when I tried to read PC's links on page 1 - both times - my eyes just started swimming

The word evangelical used to mean strictly Bible-believing, born-again Christian, but in fulfilment of prophecies like Matt 24 & 2 Tim 3, Jude 1, etc, many preachers have swallowed & regurgitated 'liberal/modernist' stuff, not realising they were being conned

Any such, do see http://www.ccci.org - (Campus Crusade for Christ - I'm sure they link still to Josh McDowell classics 'Evidence That Demands A Verdict' & More ....' - the 2nd exposes 'Higher Criticism' for what it really is, inter alia

Don't miss the 2 promised links, now put in my last post

Here's 2nd again B4 autologout:-

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 674#278674

Must go!

Ian

 

[thessalonian]

Can I just admit here, as it goes with my last post, that when I tried to read PC's links on page 1 - both times - my eyes just started swimming

Not telling me anything here. It is no surprize that you didn't read something that might change your thinking.

Logic,
Pagan groups had leaders and used names for them. Therefore anyone who uses those names is pagan. (Pontifus Maximus comes to mind). Well that's about as logical as anyone who uses the names of the days of the week which are after pagan gods is pagan. Just one of the many logical fallacies of Hislop's sloppy work. Tis sad. The Romans and Greeks developed a language and paganism influenced how that language expressed things. That does not make application of that language in the Christian context pagan. Let's see Mr. V. Today is Monday GASP! You moon worshipping pagan.

Hmmmm Moses was the head of the Jewish religion as was Joshua and others. They were pointif's. Oh my the Jews were pagans. The term can easily apply.

It would seem that anyone who's mind swims might have problems with logic. This has been demonstrated many times as he has been asked to refute some logical questions in this very thread and has been unable to do so.

 

[MrVersatile48]

Hi Guys!

I'll reply in bold, between points, if I can stay awake: I only had 2/3 hours sleep last night :

Can I just admit here, as it goes with my last post, that when I tried to read PC's links on page 1 - both times - my eyes just started swimming

Not telling me anything here. It is no surprize that you didn't read something that might change your thinking.


Any reader who clicks my profile..& 'find all posts by...' - any day - can see that, far from avoid questions that many folk 'brush under the carpet', I'm often the 1 who starts threads on 'em..does searches to learn more..I even re-started this thread, knowing it's 1 of the most difficult & wide-ranging :roll:

Logic,
Pagan groups had leaders and used names for them. Therefore anyone who uses those names is pagan. (Pontifus Maximus comes to mind).

Anyone who's read the chapter/section headings of Hislop - posted & quoted @ 5/6 times, between this thread & the 'Is RCC confessional unbiblical?' one, knows that there are many, many dogma & practices of RCC of both no Biblical justification & clear pagan origin

Well that's about as logical as anyone who uses the names of the days of the week which are after pagan gods is pagan. Just one of the many logical fallacies of Hislop's sloppy work.

Again, readers of both threads have seen Hislop's book reviewed as a meticulously researched classic

Tis sad.

Your diversionary smokescreens are sad, more like

The Romans and Greeks developed a language and paganism influenced how that language expressed things. That does not make application of that language in the Christian context pagan.

Paul talks, in 1 Corinthians 1, @ expressing spiritual truths in spiritual language & it's very sad how many RCC dogma & practices follow forbidden pagan occult patterns than Biblical ones

Let's see Mr. V. Today is Monday GASP! You moon worshipping pagan.

Why didn't your 'infallible magisterium' change all days named after pagan gods when they had the influence to do it?

Hmmmm Moses was the head of the Jewish religion as was Joshua and others. They were pointif's. Oh my the Jews were pagans. The term can easily apply.

Where does the Bible say that Moses & Joshua were pontiffs? I'm sure it doesn't

It would seem that anyone who's mind swims might have problems with logic. This has been demonstrated many times as he has been asked to refute some logical questions in this very thread and has been unable to do so.

Like I'm the only Brit affected by our worst heatwave ever in a land virtually without air conditioning? :roll:

Pharisees knew full well who Jesus was, but preferred holding onto their own power, prestige & privilege to doing what they shoulda done & told everyone to follow Jesus, as He was the Almighty in human form - that's why He is called 'the Lord' 8-)

How many times have I quoted 1 Corinthians 1 etc to show God is not found by human logic, but must be revealed by asking the Spirit of God to live in your heart as Lord of life thru repentance of sin & asking Christ to be Lord & Saviour?

I kinda knew this kinda post would await me from Mr Cover-Up here, so before I logged in, I yahoo'd RC cover-up & here's some results:-



Probe finds abuse cover-up in RC church - Breaking News - World - Breaking News
The Roman Catholic Church in Ireland covered up the sexual abuse of young people by priests over several decades in one diocese, a state probe has concluded. - ... 1130239526038.htmlsmh.com.auAAP2005-10-25Probe finds abuse cover-up in RC churchBreakingNewsWORLD ... http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/.../20 ... 26038.html - More from this site - Save



Irish probe finds abuse cover-up in Catholic Church
... Irish probe finds abuse cover-up in Catholic Church. The Catholic Church in Ireland covered up the sexual ... Irish probe into RC Church abuse claims (The Age/Australian Associated Press ... http://www.cathnews.com/news/510/132.php - 21k - Cached - More from this site - Save

Paedophile cover-up , involving top clergy , Garda and "celebrities"
... Cover-up of the activities of powerful and wealthy paedophiles in Ireland ... These are but a few examples of the RC church paedophile catalogue of crimes against children in Ireland ... http://www.missingpersons-ireland.freep ... ver-up.htm - 11k - Cached - More from this site - Save


Oh: Thess asked for sources @ my 1st post this page, so I'd best search its title, so he can't say it's just Hislop & UCCF who can read the RCC catechism & compare it with clear Bible teaching

Ian

 

[MrVersatile48]

How many readers saw that, at least twice in here & twice @ 'RCC unbiblical confessional' thread, I said that any reader can search catechism & compare with Bible teachings?

DCForum+ Version 1.2 - Viewing topic #24 - Is Roman Catholicism Christianity?
UCCF - Universities and Colleges Christian Fellowship - Linking Christian Unions throughout Britain who are committed to evangelism and http://www.discipleshipuccf.org.uk/dc/d ... 4&page=&... - 114k - Cached - More pages from this site - Save

DCForum+ Version 1.2 - Viewing message
... Subject: "Is Roman Catholicism Christianity?" Previous topic | Next topic ... #24, "Is Roman Catholicism Christianity?" I am writing this to two audiences - to those of you in the Roman ... http://www.uccf.org.uk/dc/dcboard.php?a ... &...&page= - 87k - Cached - More pages from this site - Save

Roman Catholicism
Links to resources which refute various teachings of the Roman Catholic Church and the Apocrypha www.angelfire.com/hi2/graphic1designer/worldreligions/romancatholic.html - 48k - Cached - More pages from this site -

Must go!

Ian