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False teachers

  • Thread starter Thread starter Hitch
  • Start date Start date
i am curious, not that i listen to copeland, hinn, or those types of tv evangelists

but what if your pastor stated something that was doctrinally false?

i want to clarify something here.

That’s different. If someone teaches a doctrine that is false or makes a mistake in teaching. We should go to them and using scripture clearly show them why we think they have given a wrong message about the will of God.

But someone who comes along giving a clear prophecy that is clearly shown to be a false prophecy, that person we have no further need to listen to. People can make mistakes when it comes to their understanding of the Will of God. But to come out and clearly give a false prophecy makes that person either a Liar who has given a prophecy that they know is false. Or they have been given the prophecy by some spiritual source other than The Holy Spirit.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
a friend of mine hear faithtransforms listens to him alot and sent me a video.

she doesnt hold that whacked view at all. on that video he did state what i stated.


but with her i have educated her to the level that she realized that only God does what he wants to do and that we cant will things in faith. she agrees. just because we believe something and its in the bible outside of salvatioon doesnt mean God will do that as he has the bigger picture then we do.

and i cant speak forth the repentence of my grandma a jew and command her to come to christ.

but i can pray and believe that God in his timing will do just that save her.

if it happens or not its in God's control


I think it is good to pray for the conviction of the Holy Spirit to come upon those who we long to be saved. I however believe that each individual can reject this conviction. It takes a personal response in the affirmative to have salvation.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
I used to really like Copeland and others of the Word of Faith movement until I come to realize that they can get really off from the word of God. I remember Duplantis telling how God brought dead bodies to Adam and when Adam spoke and gave them a name then they came to life. Much of what they teach makes God simply a righteous force that can be used and man the one who is in charge. It is the same promise that satan gave to Eve, "you will be as gods".

I have seen some who seem to want to reduce God/Holy Spirit to something akin to a force. Reminds me of:

Daniel 11
36And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
37Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
38But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.





All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
False Teacher: John Hagee (Christian Zionist)

hagee.jpg


Quotes:

"I believe that every Jewish person who lives in the light of the Torah, which is the word of God, has a relationship with God and will come to redemption" (Houston Chronicle, April 30, 1988)

14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man
cometh unto the Father, but by me.
14:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and
from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.

"I'm not trying to convert the Jewish people to the Christian faith... In fact, trying to convert Jews is a waste of time. Jews already have a covenant with God and that has never been replaced by Christianity." (Houston Chronicle, April 30, 1988, sec, 6, pg. 1).

8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much
also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established
upon better promises.
8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place
have been sought for the second.
8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith
the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah:
8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the
day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of
Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded
them not, saith the Lord.


"Is it important to be right on the Israel question?" asks Hagee. "When you consider that being wrong brings you under the curse of God and headed for eternal, everlasting fire with the devil and his angels . . . it's important! Israel is not a 'take it or leave it' subject. It is a life and death matter . . . eternal life!"

9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they
are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
9:7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all
children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the
children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the
seed.

3:7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the
children of Abraham.

"The [Jewish] people wanted Him to be their Messiah, but He absolutely refused," . The Jews were not rejecting Jesus as Messiah, it was Jesus who was refusing to be the Messiah to the Jews!"

Jesus at the court of the Sanhedrin:

26:64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you,
Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of
power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

"Son of Man," an unmistakable reference to the Book of Daniel (7:13) which alludes to the Messiah.​

16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son
of the living God.
16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon
Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my
Father which is in heaven.

15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of
the house of Israel.

1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12:10 And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders
rejected is become the head of the corner:

“For I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek” (Romans 1:16).
 
dumb question? what you all do if some of these men repented and taught right and this is was waaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy before they did that?
 
dumb question? what you all do if some of these men repented and taught right and this is was waaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy before they did that?

Can you show me where Hagee stands up in front of a crowd of thousands and says this:

"Brothers and sisters, I have been wrong, I have been wrong about Israel. The state I have spent so much of my life defending is actually indefensible. It persecutes Christians. It violates God's covenant demands for obedience. It was created in sinful brutality. I led you astray into supporting an evil system that continues to crucify Christ in this world. I repent."


I doubt it.
 
The problem with Hagee and others like him are that they seem to be teaching the bible correctly for some time and they have a big following who are confident in that person, then the person gradually begins to move away from the biblical truth in a particular area and the members seem reluctant to call the man out on his error,so the error gets bigger and bigger until finally the man is actually teaching "another gospel" in that area.
Concerning the Jews, Hagee is completely out of his tree, those folks do not need to be told that they still have a covenant with God, they need to be told the same thing Paul told them, repent and turn to Jesus Christ or perish.
 
Mat 21:12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,
Mat 21:13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves


Mat 23:14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

25Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, pretenders (hypocrites)! For you clean the outside of the cup and of the plate, but within they are full of extortion (prey, spoil, plunder) and grasping self-indulgence.
 
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The problem with Hagee and others like him are that they seem to be teaching the bible correctly for some time and they have a big following who are confident in that person, then the person gradually begins to move away from the biblical truth in a particular area and the members seem reluctant to call the man out on his error,so the error gets bigger and bigger until finally the man is actually teaching "another gospel" in that area.
Concerning the Jews, Hagee is completely out of his tree, those folks do not need to be told that they still have a covenant with God, they need to be told the same thing Paul told them, repent and turn to Jesus Christ or perish.

Agreed:
2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

2Jn 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
 
Can you show me where Hagee stands up in front of a crowd of thousands and says this:

"Brothers and sisters, I have been wrong, I have been wrong about Israel. The state I have spent so much of my life defending is actually indefensible. It persecutes Christians. It violates God's covenant demands for obedience. It was created in sinful brutality. I led you astray into supporting an evil system that continues to crucify Christ in this world. I repent."


I doubt it.

do you apologize to us your wife when you do her wrong?

and when she calls you out, do you not struggle to say i'm sorry or do you just change the behavior?

pride, is a hard thing to overcome.

however, i did double check and he is still saying that lie.

several sites that are reliable verify this(as far as i can tell)

one of them was the messianic jews(who are an outreach to the jew!, and i love those guys)
 
http://ldolphin.org/quakes2.html


)INTRODUCTION

According to a number of Christian writers and teachers on Bible prophecy, Jesus predicted in the Olivet Discourse that a pronounced increase in the frequency and intensity of earthquakes would occur just prior to His return to the earth. Many of the same writers and teachers claim that the decade of the 1990s has experienced a pronounced increase in both the frequency and intensity of earthquakes as compared to the earlier decades of the twentieth century. This coincidence of Jesus' prophetic statement and recent seismic events is viewed by these writers and teachers as clear demonstration of the nearness of the return of Christ.
Hal Lindsey, the world's best known Bible prophecy teacher and author of 17 books on prophecy, writes in one of his latest books:
Earthquakes continue to increase in frequency and intensity, just as the Bible predicts for the last days before the return of Christ. History shows that the number of killer quakes remained fairly constant until the 1950s - averaging between two to four per decade. In the 1950s, there were nine. In the 1960s, there were 13. In the 1970s, there were 51. In the 1980s, there were 86. From 1990 through 1996, there have been more than 150. 1
What is the source of Lindsey's statistics? In his book Planet Earth 2000 A.D. Lindsey cites the United States Geological Survey (USGS) in Boulder, Colorado.2 Yet he does not give details of the report (author, date, report name, location, etc.).3 Lindsey's earthquake frequency numbers have been widely circulated by popular prophecy speakers such as Chuck Missler and Jack Van Impe.4 However, Missler and Van Impe do not give any further information on the source of Lindsey's statistics.
Grant R. Jeffrey, another Bible prophecy teacher and author of nine best-selling books, could be the source of Lindsey's statistics. Two years before Lindsey's statement was published, Jeffrey wrote:
However, since A.D. 1900, the growth in major earthquakes has been relentless. From 1900 to 1949 it averaged three major quakes per decade. From 1949 the increase became awesome with 9 killer quakes in the 1950's; 13 in the 60's; 56 in the 1970's and an amazing 74 major quakes in the 1980's. Finally, in the 1990's, as [sic] the present rate, we will experience 125 major killer quakes in this decade (Source: U.S. Geological Survey Earthquake Report, Boulder, Colorado).5
J. R. Church and Gary Stearman, editors of the magazine Prophecy in the News, argued that data show a pronounced increase in the frequency of the largest earthquakes in the 1990s. Church writes of a distinct increase in our century.6 Stearman gives specific numbers of earthquakes, and he cites as his source the October 11, 1995 issue of the newspaper Philadelphia Inquirer:
According to that newspaper the number of Richter magnitude 6.0 and greater earthquakes worldwide has been increasing from nine in the 1950s, to 13 in the 1960s, to 51 in the 1970s, to 86 in the 1980s, and to more than 100 in the 1990s.7
The computer-searchable archives of the Philadelphia Inquirer reveal no article on earthquake frequency in that newspaper on October 11, 1995 and no other issue of that newspaper during the decade of the 1990s.8 What is the source of Stearman's statistics? When several readers of Stearman's article confronted him with much more earthquake data than in the mysterious citation from the newspaper, he apologized in print for the bad statistics, but, then, after his apology, reaffirmed that earthquakes are indeed increasing.9
John Hagee, founder and pastor of the 15,000-member Cornerstone Church in San Antonio, authored the book Beginning of the End which became a New York Times bestseller. Hagee references a report from the National Earthquake Information Center of the U.S. Geological Survey: "…the number of large earthquakes (magnitude 6.0 or greater) have stayed relatively constant…." and notes within the government report "…the last decade has produced substantially fewer large earthquakes than shown in the long-term averages…."10 Remarkably, Hagee goes on to contradict directly the government report: "… it is true that the Bible predicts that earthquakes will increase in the last days, and the number of earthquakes measured has increased 1.58 times between 1983 and 1992."11 The documentation given to support the supposed increase is faulty. Adequate reason is not given as to why the conclusion of the government report (i.e. decreasing earthquakes) is to be rejected.12
A different set of earthquake frequency numbers appears in the recent writings of Peter and Paul Lalonde.:screwloose These new statistics are used to indicate a very large increase in earthquake frequency in the 1990s:
Well, according to sources from Energy, Mines and Resources Canada there were, from 1900 to 1969, about 48 earthquakes that registered at 6.5 or more on the Richter Scale. This is an average of 6 per decade. From 1970 to 1989 there were 33 earthquakes measuring 6.5 or more. This is an average of 17 per decade. From January 1990 to July 1990 there were 10 earthquakes of 6.5 or greater. This is 10 major earthquakes in just six months. And from July 1990 to October 1992 there were 133 earthquakes which measured at 6.5 or greater. This averages out to 600 per decade.13
What is the specific source within Energy, Mines and Resources Canada that supplied these statistics? Again, details are lacking.
In light of such slipshod documentation, we are concerned about the widespread claim within the Christian community that earthquakes are on the increase. Can these recent statements be supported by rigorous documentation? Or have the deployment of more seismographs during the last few decades made detection and cataloging of earthquakes more complete, thereby enhancing the perception of increase? Does the public have the perception that earthquakes are on the increase because earthquakes now afflict our larger urbanized populations, and, therefore, are more often reported by the media? We believe the public perception and media characterization promotes the self-sustaining "urban legend" even among the Christian Church.14 This "legend" widespread in western culture regards earthquakes of the twentieth century to be on the increase. We will cite data that directly confront the urban legend.
 
thanks i was looking for that. pm me that please as i want to forward that to a friend to whom i was discussing the vs matthew 24:7.

theres no baseline reference to that to compare for intesity and the bible doesnt say that the earthquakes will increase in intesity.
 
Well, there are presently many more earthquakes in my area then there has been since records were kept, that is an absolute fact, I don't know about the rest of the country, it does seem that we hear of more earthquakes now then we did years ago.
 
Well, there are presently many more earthquakes in my area then there has been since records were kept, that is an absolute fact, I don't know about the rest of the country, it does seem that we hear of more earthquakes now then we did years ago.

the problem here is that we have no baseline, and the way that verse is worded there no need to compare them and theres no mention of intensety, but instead with divers
 
Something else, that word EARTHQUAKE that Jesus used actually means SHAKING and can mean a storm and today would probably also mean bombs. I just thought of something, BOMBS, bombs would certainly be qualified as the SHAKINGS in different places. The storm at sea that the disciples were in was called the same thing as an earthquake(shaking).
 
Mat 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

Mar 13:8 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be earthquakes in divers places, and there shall be famines and troubles: these are the beginnings of sorrows.

Luk 21:11 And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

Which of these verses says there will be more earth quakes? Do i not see something?
 
Something else, that word EARTHQUAKE that Jesus used actually means SHAKING and can mean a storm and today would probably also mean bombs. I just thought of something, BOMBS, bombs would certainly be qualified as the SHAKINGS in different places. The storm at sea that the disciples were in was called the same thing as an earthquake(shaking).

if that was the case then the apostles wouldnt have a clue then aslo why not say war?

divers bombs? think about.

that doesnt add up.

here
Pompeii - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

i think jesus had that big one in mind and i think many of the apostles saw that and there were christian there that died.
 
Shortly ( not shortly in the dispy sense ofthe word) but shortly after Jesus spoke those words was the Cross. Was there not a shaking at the time of His murder?


Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
 
Well, there are presently many more earthquakes in my area then there has been since records were kept, that is an absolute fact, I don't know about the rest of the country, it does seem that we hear of more earthquakes now then we did years ago.
What is your location?
 
even in florida there has been some earthquakes, but that was simply a faultline that was merely inactive for a while, that is active but not much of a quake generator.
 
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