Few Questions - Re:70AD

[Stormcrow]

{1} God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, {2} in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. Hebrews 1:1-2 (NASB)

{26} Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer often since the foundation of the world; but now once at the consummation of the ages He has been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. Hebrews 9:26 (NASB)

{25} Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery which has been kept secret for long ages past, {26} but now is manifested, and by the Scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the eternal God, has been made known to all the nations, leading to obedience of faith; Romans 16:25-26 (NASB)

{7} but in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, then the mystery of God is finished, as He preached to His servants the prophets. Revelation 10:7 (NASB)

{15} Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever." Revelation 11:15 (NASB)

The common thread that runs through all of these passages is the gospel of Christ. The "mystery of God" is the gospel of Christ:

{6} Yet we do speak wisdom among those who are mature; a wisdom, however, not of this age nor of the rulers of this age, who are passing away; {7}but we speak God's wisdom in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God predestined before the ages to our glory; {8} the wisdom which none of the rulers of this age has understood; for if they had understood it they would not have crucified the Lord of glory; 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 (NASB)

Just connecting the dots people may have missed.

 

[reba]

Enjoying the Sunday School lessons guys, THANKS

 

[Sinthesis]

Can I ask how you know that? Sounds like a good answer, but how you've come to that conclusion I'm interested in.

Google is your friend:

http://isit2day.com/ISIT2DAY/Jewish_Wedding.html

 

[Lehigh3]

Jesus was referencing a Jewish wedding custom whereby it is the father of the groom alone who decides when the groom should go claim his bride and the wedding commence. It is only the fact that this happened in the past which allows us to now know the time of the end.

The New Jerusalem coming down from heaven (the heavenly city of the faithful)
only arrived once. That was the time of the end for earthly old Jerusalem.

Notice that John in Rev.21 is to be shown "the bride" the Lamb's wife. Notice that the angel shows him the city.

This is when the Holy Spirit flows from God's throne.
Rev.22:1,2
1 Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

Compare this to Psalm 1.
1 Blessed is the one
who does not walk in step with the wicked
or stand in the way that sinners take
or sit in the company of mockers,
2 but whose delight is in the law of the LORD,
and who meditates on his law day and night.
3 That person is like a tree planted by streams of water,
which yields its fruit in season
and whose leaf does not wither—
whatever they do prospers. 4 Not so the wicked!
They are like chaff
that the wind blows away.
5 Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment,
nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous.
6 For the LORD watches over the way of the righteous,
but the way of the wicked leads to destruction.



The New Jerusalem city is where "righteousness dwells"

 

[Stormcrow]

Google is your friend:

http://isit2day.com/ISIT2DAY/Jewish_Wedding.html

From your source:

Next in the ceremonial order is the placement of the sealed cup of acceptance before the bride and groom as per the ancient Jewish Wedding custom during the betrothal ceremony.

You will be surprised to know that the groom actually proposes to the bride during this ceremony!

The groom is expected to pour out the wine from the cup for his bride and wait for her to drink it as a token of her love for him and acceptance of his marriage proposal.

This cup is regarded as a blood covenant. If the bride drinks the wine, the celebration begins with the groom giving his gifts to the bride. The groom then takes his leave of the bride to prepare the Chuppah. The bride promises to wait for him.

{27} And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you; {28} for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins. Matthew 26:27-28 (NASB)

{4} The woman was clothed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a gold cup full of abominations and of the unclean things of her immorality, Revelation 17:4 (NASB)

Two "women" given two cups. One drinks and becomes the bride - Christ's church made up of believing Jews and Gentiles. The other - the harlot (Israel's apostate priesthood) - does not and is cast off.



Thanks for the link Sinthesis. It brings the symbolism of the cup into focus.

 

[Hitch]

From your source:



{27} And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you; {28} for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins. Matthew 26:27-28 (NASB)

{4} The woman was clothed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a gold cup full of abominations and of the unclean things of her immorality, Revelation 17:4 (NASB)

Two "women" given two cups. One drinks and becomes the bride - Christ's church made up of believing Jews and Gentiles. The other - the harlot (Israel's apostate priesthood) - does not and is cast off.



Thanks for the link Sinthesis. It brings the symbolism of the cup into focus.

Good stuff gents, fits well with the 'chalice' over vial idea.

 

[n2thelight]

Matthew 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

So why are the wheat and tares still together?

 

[jasoncran]

:D

my grandmother and grandfather did that! they were married under the chuppa.

awesome i will tell my bro.

 

[Hitch]

Matthew 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

So why are the wheat and tares still together?

Why wouldnt they still be together?

 

[Elijah674]

Matthew 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

So why are the wheat and tares still together?

(this above is a parable.. see verse 31 KJ)

See also 2 Thess. 2
[1] Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
[2] That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
[3] Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Personally speaking, 'i' see the tares already being seperated by their free choice. Look at the Rev. 17:1-5 verses! And what is being documented in daily News sight. Are not the prophesid Rev. 17:1-5 called the Abomination of the Earth???

And God call's [HIS OWN] still there in ignorance.. OUT! Rev. 18:4. This is dramatically taking place!

--Elijah

 

[smaller]

Matthew 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

So why are the wheat and tares still together?

That is an exact allegorical picture of the construction of all of us individually.

It culminates in the destruction of TARES. The tares are? (any Word student should know this)

s

 

[n2thelight]

Why wouldnt they still be together?

What part of the verse is not clear .....

Okay,since the harvest is the end ,and the end happened in 70ad,the tares should not still be here....ie, the wicked....

In other words,as per the verse,when will they be seperated?

 

[Hitch]

What part of the verse is not clear .....

Okay,since the harvest is the end ,and the end happened in 70ad,the tares should not still be here....ie, the wicked....

In other words,as per the verse,when will they be seperated?

Is there some reason to believe the 'end' Christ spoke of in the parable is other than the consummate end, in fact the end of time?

 

[n2thelight]

Revelation 14:15
And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.


Revelation 14:16\
And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

When did the above take place???

 

[n2thelight]

Is there some reason to believe the 'end' Christ spoke of in the parable is other than the consummate end, in fact the end of time?

End of what time?

 

[Hitch]

End of what time?

36Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. 37He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.


What part of this explanation is not clear?

The 'end of the world' can be used hyperbolically just as it can be used at face value. In this explanation of the parable Christ speaking of the end of the old order, the Mosaic economy, or the end of time, I think its is the latter. I know some folks who apply this to the end of the old covenant era and it actually works pretty well.

 

[n2thelight]

36Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. 37He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.


What part of this explanation is not clear?

The 'end of the world' can be used hyperbolically just as it can be used at face value. In this explanation of the parable Christ speaking of the end of the old order, the Mosaic economy, or the end of time, I think its is the latter. I know some folks who apply this to the end of the old covenant era and it actually works pretty well.

Here's my point,had the end happened(all prophecy)in 70ad,the tares and the wheat should not still be together....

There should come a time when all wickedness is not among us,my question is,when does this happen?

 

[smaller]

End of what time?

I've observed that point and many similar with the fullpre's many times. IF the Jews of 70ad were applicable as 'they' presume, much of the N.T. is eliminated, such as with the tares. But even Hitch points to the 'consumate end.' Unfortunately they wiped out the roadmap when applying and then tossing all those scriptures.

You see Jesus' Words no longer apply as they were only for 'Mosaic' understandings.

pinch nose.

s

 

[Hitch]

Here's my point,had the end happened(all prophecy)in 70ad,the tares and the wheat should not still be together....

There should come a time when all wickedness is not among us,my question is,when does this happen?

Actually the end of time, perhaps better said , the end of history. Until then the evil and the good exist side by side.

I cant imagine any but the most spiritually inclined jewish scholars of the day entertaining the slightest notion that the kingdom so often seen in the Prophets would continue and in fact thrive after the dissolution of Israel.

 

[n2thelight]

Actually the end of time, perhaps better said , the end of history. Until then the evil and the good exist side by side.

I cant imagine any but the most spiritually inclined jewish scholars of the day entertaining the slightest notion that the kingdom so often seen in the Prophets would continue and in fact thrive after the dissolution of Israel.

So the end of history is different than the end of time,if so,are you (preterist) saying that there is no prophecy given to the end of time?