Food for thought

[casper]

Most chronically obese people have a deeper emotional connection to food. Everyone who has an inordinate pull to something that causes negative behaviour or manifestation sin life have a psychological or spiritual problem, unless there is a medical reason, such as hypothyroidism, or side effects to necessary medication and the like.

I beg to differ, one only has to look at all the overweight kids sitting in front of ex boxers, play stations and computers to know that in most cases its sheer laziness

 

[casper]

Proverbs 23:20-21 “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags.â€
Proverbs 28:7 “He who keeps the law is a discerning son, but a companion of gluttons disgraces his father.â€
Proverbs 23:2 “Put a knife to your throat if you are given to gluttony.â€

Being fat is not a sin. Being a glutton is. Some people are just born to be heavier than others. My best friend in school was highly athletic but her whole family was heavy. She was not a glutton, but biologically she was programmed to be big. Some people have thyroid conditions that make them big. Others just the metabolism slows down with age and without overeating, they just get big. Then there are the people that should be small but are big because they gorge. Then you have bulemics. They can be underweight but still gorge. They gorge and throw it up. You don`t have to be fat to gorge. Gorging is the sin not size!

As for treatment of animals. God never meant for animals to be in slaughter houses. The way He designed for animals to be killed for sacrifice and eating was with the most humane care possible. That was God`s design, but man in greed has become cruel and heartless to animals and that contradicts God`s design as seen in Proverbs 12:10
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"A good man takes care of his animals, but wicked men are cruel to theirs."[/FONT]

Good post espially the last line, Thankyou

 

[Strangelove]

I beg to differ, one only has to look at all the overweight kids sitting in front of ex boxers, play stations and computers to know that in most cases its sheer laziness

No but Casper you have to remember that those kids have deep emotional scars due to dying too many times on Call of Duty 4. Thats why they are eating too much and lazy. ;). So they are not accountable. Lolz.

 

[pjt]

I wish their was something in the Bible for us Christians demanding that we have more respect for animals. I think God means we have authority over them in more of a caretaker role, having respect for them.

This is a little off topic but since you are the author of this topic, I think it is okay to address this in more detail so I will.

You are absolutely right that God does mean we are the caretakers of animals. He did not give us animals to abuse. When He made creation, the animals, the plants, everything, He said each was “goodâ€. His creation was pleasing to Him. You don`t create something to abuse it, but to enjoy it. The Garden of Eden was paradise on earth and it was filled with animals that God loved and expected Adam and Eve to care for and treat with decency. Even the trees and flowers were to be cared for, not to be stomped on and ripped up meaninglessly, but to be cared for. That was the job of Adam and Eve in the garden to care for God`s creation. This was God`s plan from the very beginning. But it did not end in the Garden of Eden. God says He never changes. Our God of creation is the same God today and that is reflected throughout the Bible in the way it talks about animals. I mean when Balaam beat his donkey, God defended the donkey by letting it speak and say “why are you beating me?†God saw the injustice in Balaam`s actions and did not approve, just as He would not approve of people mistreating His creation today.

Another example is Matthew 6:26 Jesus said to look at the birds in the air, God cares enough for them that He feeds them. God is taking care of the birds, and if we are supposed to be Godly in our actions meaning we are to try follow God`s example, then we have to take care of the animals. Likewise Psalm 147:9 says “He giveth to the beast his food, and to the young ravens which cryâ€. God is attentive to the needs of His creation and wants us to be too.

In Psalm 50:10-11 God says, “For every beast of the forest is Mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills. I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are Mineâ€. Again God is showing He cares about the animals He created. And we see all throughout the Bible how animals are used for God`s glory. They don`t just exist to exist. They have a purpose in God`s creation and as children of God we need to respect God`s creation, not worship it as some would suggest, but respect it because it is created by the hand of our Almighty God. Back to the purpose of animals, part of their purpose is to bring praise to God as seen in Psalm 148:7-10 How can we mistreat anything that is created to bring praise to His holy name? We shouldn`t!

<O:pHere is another thing to consider. Humans are made in the image of God, but some animals were definitely made in the image of some of the heavenly beings that have animal like faces which is another indication that God gives enough esteem to animals to create them in the image of some of the Heavenly beings

God even has plans for animals when Christ comes again as reflected beautifully in Isaiah 11:6-9. God has a beautiful picture and plan for animals existing with mankind.

Moreover, to further show God`s affection for animals the Holy Spirit was seen coming down like a dove and Jesus is referred to as a lion and a lamb. If animals were to be seen as despicable and nasty, God never would have allowed His Son and Holy Spirit to be compared with mere animals. <O:p

There are more examples in the Bible to indicate that animals should not be treated cruelly by humans, but this is enough and all the time I have. But I would like to close by saying, I am not an animal right`s activist because they tend to put animals on the same level as humans which God did not do and does not intend for humans to do. He wants us to treat His creation with respect but at the same time He has given us animals as sources for food, clothing, and work so obviously animals are not the same as humans, but if we do have an animal in our care, we need to treat it right because that is the Biblical thing to do.

So yes, the Bible does address the topic of animals!
<O:p

 

[pjt]

Good post espially the last line, Thankyou

The last line God gets all the credit because it is directly from His Word, not my thoughts or commentary!

 

[casper]

No but Casper you have to remember that those kids have deep emotional scars due to dying too many times on Call of Duty 4. Thats why they are eating too much and lazy. ;). So they are not accountable. Lolz.

Oh yer never thought of that and what about all the Physiological/emotional damage from trying to figure out out to play the Ex-box and eat pizza at the same time Must be so stressful for them poor little sods.

 

[casper]

This is a little off topic but since you are the author of this topic, I think it is okay to address this in more detail so I will.

You are absolutely right that God does mean we are the caretakers of animals. He did not give us animals to abuse. When He made creation, the animals, the plants, everything, He said each was “goodâ€. His creation was pleasing to Him. You don`t create something to abuse it, but to enjoy it. The Garden of Eden was paradise on earth and it was filled with animals that God loved and expected Adam and Eve to care for and treat with decency. Even the trees and flowers were to be cared for, not to be stomped on and ripped up meaninglessly, but to be cared for. That was the job of Adam and Eve in the garden to care for God`s creation. This was God`s plan from the very beginning. But it did not end in the Garden of Eden. God says He never changes. Our God of creation is the same God today and that is reflected throughout the Bible in the way it talks about animals. I mean when Balaam beat his donkey, God defended the donkey by letting it speak and say “why are you beating me?†God saw the injustice in Balaam`s actions and did not approve, just as He would not approve of people mistreating His creation today.

Another example is Matthew 6:26 Jesus said to look at the birds in the air, God cares enough for them that He feeds them. God is taking care of the birds, and if we are supposed to be Godly in our actions meaning we are to try follow God`s example, then we have to take care of the animals. Likewise Psalm 147:9 says “He giveth to the beast his food, and to the young ravens which cryâ€. God is attentive to the needs of His creation and wants us to be too.

In Psalm 50:10-11 God says, “For every beast of the forest is Mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills. I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are Mineâ€. Again God is showing He cares about the animals He created. And we see all throughout the Bible how animals are used for God`s glory. They don`t just exist to exist. They have a purpose in God`s creation and as children of God we need to respect God`s creation, not worship it as some would suggest, but respect it because it is created by the hand of our Almighty God. Back to the purpose of animals, part of their purpose is to bring praise to God as seen in Psalm 148:7-10 How can we mistreat anything that is created to bring praise to His holy name? We shouldn`t!

<O:pHere is another thing to consider. Humans are made in the image of God, but some animals were definitely made in the image of some of the heavenly beings that have animal like faces which is another indication that God gives enough esteem to animals to create them in the image of some of the Heavenly beings

God even has plans for animals when Christ comes again as reflected beautifully in Isaiah 11:6-9. God has a beautiful picture and plan for animals existing with mankind.

Moreover, to further show God`s affection for animals the Holy Spirit was seen coming down like a dove and Jesus is referred to as a lion and a lamb. If animals were to be seen as despicable and nasty, God never would have allowed His Son and Holy Spirit to be compared with mere animals. <O:p

There are more examples in the Bible to indicate that animals should not be treated cruelly by humans, but this is enough and all the time I have. But I would like to close by saying, I am not an animal right`s activist because they tend to put animals on the same level as humans which God did not do and does not intend for humans to do. He wants us to treat His creation with respect but at the same time He has given us animals as sources for food, clothing, and work so obviously animals are not the same as humans, but if we do have an animal in our care, we need to treat it right because that is the Biblical thing to do.

So yes, the Bible does address the topic of animals!
<O:p

That's good to see there is stuff about the care of animals in the bible as I have already admitted I'm not that will versed in the bible. I used to be disgusted with the way animals were killed in the OT with regards to sacrifice and it even put me off the bible in the past, however when I thought deeply about it I figured they would have been killed with the utmost respect, so it was good of you to mention that this was the case, (in a previous post).

I'm glad Isaiah says God has a beautiful plan between man kind and animals as a I've been told before by Christians that there are no animals in heaven. In regards to where you say that some animals are made in the image of heavenly creatures, I was wondering where in the bible this is mentioned or are you just generalizing because of the way the bible (Mainly Revelation ) uses the image of animals.

Anyhow I hope one day all us Christians get it together in our treatment of animals and lead by example. I cant see it happening in the near future.

 

[Strangelove]

That's good to see there is stuff about the care of animals in the bible as I have already admitted I'm not that will versed in the bible. I used to be disgusted with the way animals were killed in the OT with regards to sacrifice and it even put me off the bible in the past, however when I thought deeply about it I figured they would have been killed with the utmost respect, so it was good of you to mention that this was the case, (in a previous post).

I'm glad Isaiah says God has a beautiful plan between man kind and animals as a I've been told before by Christians that there are no animals in heaven. In regards to where you say that some animals are made in the image of heavenly creatures, I was wondering where in the bible this is mentioned or are you just generalizing because of the way the bible (Mainly Revelation ) uses the image of animals.

Anyhow I hope one day all us Christians get it together in our treatment of animals and lead by example. I cant see it happening in the near future.

Casper you might be interested in this thread:

http://www.christianforums.net/f15/poisening-populace-chemtrails-medication-modified-foods-31892/

We talk a bit about GM foods and Organic farms vs factory farms and some other interesting stuff. Theres a good documentary in there somewhere called 'End of Liberty' you can youtube it if it's not on the thread anymore.

Doc.

Oh yer never thought of that and what about all the Physiological/emotional damage from trying to figure out out to play the Ex-box and eat pizza at the same time Must be so stressful for them poor little sods.

LOLZ!

 

[Alabaster]

So are you saying that people are not accountable for their sins because they are simply emotionally scarred?? :

Why do you make conclusions from things I never say? Just read what I say and accept that.

Nowhere have I ever said that obesity is not a result of sin. But you cannot just paint an obese person with a broad brush of judgment by saying they are gluttonous. There are many layers to a person and each layer must be addressed by God as a person yields to the leading of God toward wholeness.

 

[pjt]

That's good to see there is stuff about the care of animals in the bible as I have already admitted I'm not that will versed in the bible. I used to be disgusted with the way animals were killed in the OT with regards to sacrifice and it even put me off the bible in the past, however when I thought deeply about it I figured they would have been killed with the utmost respect, so it was good of you to mention that this was the case, (in a previous post).

I'm glad Isaiah says God has a beautiful plan between man kind and animals as a I've been told before by Christians that there are no animals in heaven. In regards to where you say that some animals are made in the image of heavenly creatures, I was wondering where in the bible this is mentioned or are you just generalizing because of the way the bible (Mainly Revelation ) uses the image of animals.

Anyhow I hope one day all us Christians get it together in our treatment of animals and lead by example. I cant see it happening in the near future.

Ezekiel 1:7,10 Ezekial gets to see a vision of Heaven and sees these creatures with 4 faces. The feet were like calf feet and the faces were like a man, an eagle, a lion, and an ox.

On this topic, another very beautiful parable regarding animals was when David sinned by having a man killed and taking his wife. You can read the story in 2 Samuel 12, God sends Nathan to David and tells him about a rich man that took a poor man`s "one little ewe lamb" that ate with the man, was being raised with his children, and even slept on is bosom. The Bible says that little lamb "was unto him as a daughter", but the rich man took that poor man`s little lamb and had it for a dinner party. When David heard this, he was so angry he declared as king that that man shall "surely die.. because he had no pity". Actually this was a story God gave to Nathan to tell David to make him realize he had done the same thing by taking his wife and killing him. God could have used any story but God did not see it as silly that a man could love his lamb like a daughter. And David who was a shepherd before a king did not see it as silly either. He wanted the man dead for doing such a thing! This "little ewe lamb" (notice the enduring language used in the Bible to describe the lamb) had great value in the eyes of God and David. Of course the value was also tied with the poor man`s feelings for his lamb, but that also is showing part of the purpose of God creating animals to bring such love to the human heart. Creation is to live in harmony together so animals, humans, and nature are to live in harmony. God did not make an animal kingdom, a human kingdom and a plant kingdom all separately. He blended them all together in the Garden of Eden to live together peacefully and to be a source of joy to each other.

 

[pjt]

I should clarify with my last post in case you don`t take the time to read the story yourself that the anger towards the rich man was not because he ate a lamb. Eating a lamb was perfectly acceptable and normal, but because he had a big flock of sheep of his own. He did not need to take anyone else`s sheep to have something to eat. His flock was a part of his wealth that could be eaten or traded without emotional hurt, while the poor man`s lamb was a pet never meant to be eaten or sold. It was really an emotional treasure for that man which the rich man completely disregarded. So it was far more than theft, it was just a complete disregard for that man`s feelings for his lamb.

 

[Strangelove]

Why do you make conclusions from things I never say? Just read what I say and accept that..

I didn't make any conclusion I was asking you a question. Hence the 4 question marks at the end. Sheesh.

Nowhere have I ever said that obesity is not a result of sin. But you cannot just paint an obese person with a broad brush of judgment by saying they are gluttonous. There are many layers to a person and each layer must be addressed by God as a person yields to the leading of God toward wholeness.

No one is painting a single obese person...singular. We are making a generalization about all obese people. Are we allowed to do that or have you're small church cell groups come to the concencus that we can't?

 

[Alabaster]

I didn't make any conclusion I was asking you a question. Hence the 4 question marks at the end. Sheesh.

Seems to me that you are trying to put words in people's mouths.

No one is painting a single obese person...singular. We are making a generalization about all obese people. Are we allowed to do that or have you're small church cell groups come to the concencus that we can't?

If you want to make broad generalizations about a group, then you will be mischaracterizing a whole bunch.

What has a cell church got to do with this?

 

[Strangelove]

If you want to make broad generalizations about a group, then you will be mischaracterizing a whole bunch.

So we are not allowed to make generalizations? Is that what you are saying?

(That was a question not a statement)

 

[casper]

I should clarify with my last post in case you don`t take the time to read the story yourself that the anger towards the rich man was not because he ate a lamb. Eating a lamb was perfectly acceptable and normal, but because he had a big flock of sheep of his own. He did not need to take anyone else`s sheep to have something to eat. His flock was a part of his wealth that could be eaten or traded without emotional hurt, while the poor man`s lamb was a pet never meant to be eaten or sold. It was really an emotional treasure for that man which the rich man completely disregarded. So it was far more than theft, it was just a complete disregard for that man`s feelings for his lamb.

Thanks for that I do remember reading about it in the past I think David sent this man to the front line knowing he would be killed. I never really thought deeply about the the parable in regards to animal welfare but you are right, it is a nice parable and shows gods love for animals. I hope god punished king David, did he ?


Anyhow I remember somewhere in the OT god commanded the king of the Israelite (cant remember if it was king David) to not only kill all the people of the opposing tribe but to also kill all the livestock and domesticated animals, I wonder why he did this ???. Animals couldn't be mentally corrupted like humans.

 

[jasoncran]

Thanks for that I do remember reading about it in the past I think David sent this man to the front line knowing he would be killed. I never really thought deeply about the the parable in regards to animal welfare but you are right, it is a nice parable and shows gods love for animals. I hope god punished king David, did he ?


Anyhow I remember somewhere in the OT god commanded the king of the Israelite (cant remember if it was king David) to not only kill all the people of the opposing tribe but to also kill all the livestock and domesticated animals, I wonder why he did this ???. Animals couldn't be mentally corrupted like humans.

the philistines of a city i cant recall.
and david reaped what he sowed. he lost that first son of baathsheba and aslo absolom turned on him and he chief adviser.

and it was king saul. the animals may have been used for sacrifice or were prepped thus unclean and God then was very big on them being clean and unclean.

 

[Alabaster]

So we are not allowed to make generalizations? Is that what you are saying?

(That was a question not a statement)

You are allowed to generalize about any group of people you wish. Just don't be surprised when those who don't fit come around and royally trounce you.

 

[casper]

the philistines of a city i cant recall.
and david reaped what he sowed. he lost that first son of baathsheba and aslo absolom turned on him and he chief adviser.

and it was king saul. the animals may have been used for sacrifice or were prepped thus unclean and God then was very big on them being clean and unclean.

Oh yer, thanks , I remember now, and also wasn't his wives or mistress's taken from him or was that Saul or some other king

 

[jasoncran]

Oh yer, thanks , I remember now, and also wasn't his wives or mistress's taken from him or was that Saul or some other king

abasolom slept with them and david later in a sense divorced them as he didnt go into them at all.

 

[Strangelove]

You are allowed to generalize about any group of people you wish. Just don't be surprised when those who don't fit come around and royally trounce you.

Constricting freedom of speach followed by threat of physical violence!

Classic hive mind mentality. You have been well conditioned indeed.

Thanks for thoroughly exposing yourself.