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"gouge out your eye" . . . literal or figurative

Free said:
As I stated already, when all is said and done, it doesn't matter whether one takes this literally or figuratively since Jesus' point doesn't change--remove the source of the evil.
Agreed.
And if you cannot remove the source, remove whatever that source of evil is affecting. :)
 
follower of Christ said:
Free said:
As I stated already, when all is said and done, it doesn't matter whether one takes this literally or figuratively since Jesus' point doesn't change--remove the source of the evil.
Agreed.
And if you cannot remove the source, remove whatever that source of evil is affecting. :)


No offense but.... Sure would be a whole lot of castrated men if scriptures like that were taken literally! :chin


.
 
Relic said:
follower of Christ said:
Free said:
As I stated already, when all is said and done, it doesn't matter whether one takes this literally or figuratively since Jesus' point doesn't change--remove the source of the evil.
Agreed.
And if you cannot remove the source, remove whatever that source of evil is affecting. :)


No offense but.... Sure would be a whole lot of castrated men if scriptures like that were taken literally! :chin


.
Hey. You get no argument from me on that one...apparently not Jesus either :)

For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it."
(Matthew 19:12 ESV)
Maybe it is better to be a eunuch for the kingdoms sake if one cant get their sexual urges under control


.
 
follower of Christ said:
whirlwind said:
Both Nightmare and Cornelius are correct. :salute

We are the body of Christ and the parts of the body that offend the body must be severed until repentence by the offending part. It DOES NOT mean to cut off a literal hand or pluck out a literal eye anymore than the Bible means that we are to pick up literal snakes and drink literal poison.
:crazy
Hmmm.

I agree that plucking out an eye may not be the FIRST thing to try, but is it your view that it is better to go into hell with both eyes rather than into glory with neither ?

Having a flesh eye or a flesh hand or neither as part of one's physical body has nothing to do with gaining entrance to heaven. It is all spiritual. We are to repent for sins, not sever the offending appendage. Christ meant to cast out the part of the body of Christ that offends, whatever member of the body (person) that may be.
 
follower of Christ said:
Relic said:
[quote="follower of Christ":6g3r088k]
No offense but.... Sure would be a whole lot of castrated men if scriptures like that were taken literally! :chin

.
Hey. You get no argument from me on that one...apparently not Jesus either :)

For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it."
(Matthew 19:12 ESV)
Maybe it is better to be a eunuch for the kingdoms sake if one cant get their sexual urges under control

.
[/quote:6g3r088k]

But'cha know..... Lorraina Bobbitt .... we all know what she did to help her husband stop cheating.

But really, MOST people who have their " good senses" about them don't take that scripture literally. I'd rather pray the Lord discipline my mind than cut off a body part for not doing so. This is a mighty strange world we live in, mighty strange. And IF someone OBEYS the HOLY SPIRIT to abstain from sexual urges that are outside of the "decent" range.... they wouldn't have to resort to cutting off any body part at all BECAUSE, the HOLY SPIRIT would be in control NOT the carnal mind. :yes

.
 
[i said:
Relic[/i]][quote="follower of Christ":ryzovhwb]
Free said:
As I stated already, when all is said and done, it doesn't matter whether one takes this literally or figuratively since Jesus' point doesn't change--remove the source of the evil.
Agreed.
And if you cannot remove the source, remove whatever that source of evil is affecting. :)


No offense but.... Sure would be a whole lot of castrated men if scriptures like that were taken literally! :chin [/quote:ryzovhwb]
No offense taken but you too have misunderstood what it means to take this passage literally. If a man rapes a woman it isn't the male appendage that is the actual cause, it's the evil in his heart.
 
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Free, I haven't misunderstood the scripture. I was jesting.

I quite understand that all sin is set to take root in the minds eye, the heart of a person... We all MUST flee from sin, run to God and seek guidance from the Holy Spirit. IF more people would just say, "Get thee behind me Satan..." OR, "It is written..." , I'm sure, there would be more victory made manifest and the Glory of the Lord would be forthcoming, rather than regret of committing to the voice of sin.

:yes

.
 
Relic said:
But really, MOST people who have their " good senses" about them don't take that scripture literally.
I'd rather pray the Lord discipline my mind than cut off a body part for not doing so.
Id rather as well.
But at the end of the day we have to ask ourselves if there is anything we wouldnt do to keep from going into hell.

This is a mighty strange world we live in, mighty strange. And IF someone OBEYS the HOLY SPIRIT to abstain from sexual urges that are outside of the "decent" range.... they wouldn't have to resort to cutting off any body part at all BECAUSE, the HOLY SPIRIT would be in control NOT the carnal mind. :yes
I know a couple people, one is even a woman, who honestly might really need to become eunuchs if it is possible. They seem to be led about by their sexual organs. it would take either a miracle or castration to help them, Id believe.
And since Jesus shows that some become eunuchs for the kingdoms sake, I have to believe that a miracle isnt going to happen in many cases.
The Holy Spirit can do what He will, but if that is the answer, then why doesnt Jesus say to seek the Spirit instead of being a eunuch ?

Im not saying that we ought to lop off anything, what Im saying is that I believe very seriously that Jesus meant what He said in a very literal manner. :)
 
Free said:
No offense taken but you too have misunderstood what it means to take this passage literally. If a man rapes a woman it isn't the male appendage that is the actual cause, it's the evil in his heart.
I think we ALL understand that fact, free ;)

And that doesnt not mean that there isnt some source causing us to stumble.
Paul tells us to not do anything to cause a brother to stumble, doesnt he ?
That means even tho we are trying to do the right thing EXTERNAL (outside the heart) stimuli CAN work its way in there....and we CAN still allow ourselves to do the wrong thing.
With some of us we MUST be rid of the temptation ENTIRELY....just like an alcoholic....they dont try to drink socially any more...the ABSTAIN entirely, or theyre supposed to. Its not necessarily because they are evil hearted. Its because, like Paul shows, we can stumble because we are weak.

If I were so weak that I couldnt stop lusting when I saw other women, youd better believe Id prefer lopping something off rather than ending up in hell because of it.
:)
 
And when you can't stop lusting in your mind (our ability to mentally create those scenarios), are you going to cut your head off? :gah
 
Orion said:
And when you can't stop lusting in your mind (our ability to mentally create those scenarios), are you going to cut your head off? :gah

:crazy :biglol

Cut your head off to spite your lust... ????? :crazy

[attachment=0:3uahpp39]cut your head off to spite your lust.gif[/attachment:3uahpp39]
 
.

Now, all of a sudden, for some reason, I'm thinking about the RADICAL Muslims and how they are so very literal and think nothing of cutting off someone's head. And THAT IS NOT SO FUNNY!!! :shame :gah :bigfrown :crazy


.
 
Orion said:
And when you can't stop lusting in your mind (our ability to mentally create those scenarios), are you going to cut your head off? :gah
If someone is that bad off my guess is that they ARENT a true christian to begin with to even need to worry about Christs instruction.

You dont win the discussion with hypothetical nonsense, btw...
Christs point was VERY literal. It IS better to go into life with one eye than into hell with both.
Anyone not seeing that as literal really needs to take a look at the rest of the bible.
 
You say that only because it takes it to another level, but in all that matters, even cutting off a hand is a hypothetical nonsense. No one will ever do it, . . .YOU would never do it, no matter how much you think you would.
 
follower of Christ said:
Orion said:
And when you can't stop lusting in your mind (our ability to mentally create those scenarios), are you going to cut your head off? :gah
If someone is that bad off my guess is that they ARENT a true christian to begin with to even need to worry about Christs instruction.

You dont win the discussion with hypothetical nonsense, btw...
Christs point was VERY literal. It IS better to go into life with one eye than into hell with both.
Anyone not seeing that as literal really needs to take a look at the rest of the bible.

FoC,

I assume you are a guy .. (can't really tell who are the males or females in this forum !).

Have you ever lusted at a woman ?



:lol
 
Orion said:
You say that only because it takes it to another level, but in all that matters, even cutting off a hand is a hypothetical nonsense. No one will ever do it, . . .YOU would never do it, no matter how much you think you would.
Firstly you dont know me enough to make that call.
Secondly, gent, I ALREADY POSTED scripture where Jesus shows very clearly that some have become eunuchs for the kingdoms sake.
There are men all thru the history of this world who have done so...so lets NOT play this pathetic game that no one would ever remove a body part for a higher cause.
 
Tina said:
FoC,

I assume you are a guy .. (can't really tell who are the males or females in this forum !).

Have you ever lusted at a woman ?[/color]


:lol
Im married, so if the question is have I desired a woman sexually, the answer is yes.
To answer the next question, no, I dont lust after women not my wife.
To go further, if I were lusting after other women and couldnt get control of it no matter what I tried, yes, I might consider some extreme measure.
 
follower of Christ said:
Orion said:
You say that only because it takes it to another level, but in all that matters, even cutting off a hand is a hypothetical nonsense. No one will ever do it, . . .YOU would never do it, no matter how much you think you would.
Firstly you dont know me enough to make that call.
Secondly, gent, I ALREADY POSTED scripture where Jesus shows very clearly that some have become eunuchs for the kingdoms sake.
There are men all thru the history of this world who have done so...so lets NOT play this pathetic game that no one would ever remove a body part for a higher cause.

What??? So a few uneducated men of 2,000 years ago constitutes that someone would do this action today? Find me some evidence! Even so, cutting stuff off is the worst advice, especially in a time when infection would have been commonplace. IF the statement, supposedly stated by Jesus, was to be taken literally, . . . then it fails at addressing the REAL issue, the heart of the person. It can only have been figurative/shock factor.

Plus, the "creator of the universe, one full of knowledge of psychiastry, medicine, science" can only come up with "mame yourself if you do something bad", rather than working on the REAL issue?? :screwloose
 
follower of Christ said:
whirlwind said:
Both Nightmare and Cornelius are correct. :salute

We are the body of Christ and the parts of the body that offend the body must be severed until repentence by the offending part. It DOES NOT mean to cut off a literal hand or pluck out a literal eye anymore than the Bible means that we are to pick up literal snakes and drink literal poison.
:crazy
Hmmm.

I agree that plucking out an eye may not be the FIRST thing to try, but is it your view that it is better to go into hell with both eyes rather than into glory with neither ?

So plucking out ONE eye will solve the problem ? What prevents the other eye from doing the same?

I cannot believe you guys are even talking about this in a literal manner.
 
Cornelius said:
So plucking out ONE eye will solve the problem ? What prevents the other eye from doing the same?

I cannot believe you guys are even talking about this in a literal manner.

As "cutting off a hand" doesn't make the thief reformed, just mamed and jaded.

And when I dare take it to the logical conclusion, that being "cutting off your head if you can't stop lusting/creating scenarios in your mind", I am ridiculed for that, but it IS a valid point.

The statement can only be a "shock factor" thing, to make a person think about their actions.
 
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