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Heaven Or Paradise?

What does the Bible mean by Eternal Life?

  • Eternal Life in Heaven

    Votes: 3 30.0%

  • Eternal Life on a New Earth or Garden of Eden

    Votes: 3 30.0%

  • Something else (Please explain)

    Votes: 4 40.0%
  • Total voters
    10
The_Epsicle

The_Epsicle

Member
This is intended to be a lighthearted debate because in the end it doesn't truly matter what you believe on this front since we'll all find out either way, the important thing is that you believe Jesus took on the punishment for your sins, so the specifics of what we will discuss here has no bearing on your eternal salvation.

I was talking with some friends of mine when the topic of eternal life was brought up by someone and one of my friends who is also a pastor stated this: "Nowhere in the Bible does it say we go to heaven when we die, it mentions 'paradise' and the city that God is preparing for us will be 'heavenly' but it does not say we will go to heaven it simply promises eternal life for all who believe." bear in mind this was some time ago so these are not exact quotes, one of my friends responded "so what do you think paradise will be like?" and he replied "Go back to Genesis and look at what little we know of the garden of Eden, it was paradise, and I believe that we will be restored to the a paradise like the garden of Eden because that's our place, we are both spiritual and physical beings whereas the animals are only physical so their place is on earth and the angels are only spiritual and their place is in heaven, we are both and will serve God like Adam and Eve served God before the Fall." he then went on to describe his belief about eternal life to be more like what we were doing at that time, talking about God, singing and praying together to the glory of our God except that in paradise we would have been restored to full communion with God.

All of that being said, what do you guys think? I've done some reading and as far as I can tell, nowhere in the Bible does it say Christians will go to heaven, but it does promise eternal life, paradise and serving God forever. I don't have time to find verses right now but I wanted to open this up to discussion to see what you guys think.
 
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Peter's words are good enough for me. If a new earth filled with righteousness is what he was looking for, that sounds good to me.
 
I think most people like to take words literally... When I hear people use it, its in the context of an actual name for the place after death. In reality we will never know where we go but, that doesn't matter for its going to be awesome either way.
 
I am always very amazed at how often God's abode is mixed into the New Jerusalem. Eternal LIFE is just that.
 
It was a little tough to vote because as I understand it, at this point in time, we go to number one until number two is ready.
 
Kenny_ms said:
It was a little tough to vote because as I understand it, at this point in time, we go to number one until number two is ready.
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Jesus indicated we go to Paradise. Luke 23:43 (NIV) and as He also indicated that no man has ever seen God, John 1:18 (NIV) and also indicated that Abraham's side was Paradise, Luke 16:19-31 (NIV), we see there is a place where the dead go temporarily until the NEW Earth is created and the NEW Jerusalem comes down to it to be God's residence for Eternity.
 
"Nowhere in the Bible does it say we go to heaven when we die, it mentions 'paradise' and the city that God is preparing for us will be 'heavenly' but it does not say we will go to heaven it simply promises eternal life for all who believe."
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This argument is so specious it is hardly worth addressing. Jesus does indeed say (indirectly) that believers will go to Heaven (Jn 14:2,3):
In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

So let's analyze these verses:
1. Who is Jesus? God
2. Is Jesus "the Lord from Heaven"? Yes
3. Is "my Father" God the Father? Yes
4. Is the Father's house Heaven? Yes

This should be more than enough.
 
Deborah13 said:
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Peter's words are good enough for me. If a new earth filled with righteousness is what he was looking for, that sounds good to me.
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Deborah13, I have come to see the new heavens and the new earth as the new temple of Lord. The Righteousness that Dwells within our Hearts, which is the new temple of the Lord, is the Spirit of Christ. For He is the Lord our Righteousness (Jer 23:5).

Chopper started a bible study thread on Why so many animal sacrifices? and he looks at 2 Chron 7. This was a sacrifice for the dedication of the temple. The chapter is an interesting read to say the least when it comes to the temple and how the Lord fills it.
 
Stan1953 said:
Jesus indicated we go to Paradise. Luke 23:43 (NIV) and as He also indicated that no man has ever seen God, John 1:18 (NIV) and also indicated that Abraham's side was Paradise, Luke 16:19-31 (NIV), we see there is a place where the dead go temporarily until the NEW Earth is created and the NEW Jerusalem comes down to it to be God's residence for Eternity.
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Stan, where is Paradise?

As I understand it there are 3 heavens and don't put too much faith in this as I just recently read it:

1) Between the ground on earth up to the where we break out into space (The song "8 Miles High" comes to mind here

2) Then from there, all we see in the universe. "The heavens" if you will and that sounds right to me after hearing the phrase all my life.

3) Then Gods Heaven. Oops, it's all Gods but you see what I mean.

Truth? not sure, but point being, if that is true, and we go anywhere other than earth when we die, we go to Heaven. I have no doubt it's Paradise as the book does say that, whatever paradise is. I've seen mans topical version of Paradise, but not sure what Gods version is....I'd guess it's a nice place to be.

#)
 
Kenny_ms said:
:hipsAlright, who voted "Something else"
Stan? Saintman? :)
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I voted "Something ese". Eternal life is eternal and perfect union and communion with the Godhead after all the saints have been perfected(Rev 21:3-5). And the eternal home of the saints will be in the New Jerusalem which will come down out of Heaven and which also contains Paradise and the Tree of Life (Rev 21:10; 22:1-6). Until the New Jerusalem actually descends out of Heaven, all the saints are in Heaven before God's throne (Heb 12:22-24).
 
Curious.if the tree of life is that literal then literally outside of heaven on the earth is hell?
 
Interesting... I'm hearing some opinions I hadn't considered before and that's good. I'm not wholly convinced we will spend all of eternity in Heaven but I could see why some of you would think a portion of eternity would be spent in Heaven.

To clarify some terminology when I refer to heaven I mean the spiritual realm of God and the angels, when I refer to Earth I mean the physical realm of God, humans, and animals. Both can be referred to in an eternal life setting.

I am of the opinion(since that is all it is) we do not go to heaven when we die, but rather are at that exact moment of our death taken to judgement day, so there will be no waiting for your friends who died after you because you'll all get there at the same time, I don't believe in soul sleep but I believe you will actually be taken to judgement day immediately. After which I believe we will be in full communion with God like Adam and Eve where until the Fall, and Adam and Eve served and worshiped God by speaking directly to him face to face and tending to His Garden of Eden.

Also some more clarification, I do not read Revelation in a literal setting because it is a book of prophecy and thus will be written in a confusing way until these things finally happen.
 
Malachi said:
I voted "Something ese". Eternal life is eternal and perfect union and communion with the Godhead after all the saints have been perfected(Rev 21:3-5). And the eternal home of the saints will be in the New Jerusalem which will come down out of Heaven and which also contains Paradise and the Tree of Life (Rev 21:10; 22:1-6). Until the New Jerusalem actually descends out of Heaven, all the saints are in Heaven before God's throne (Heb 12:22-24).
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I was assuming the OP meant the New Jerusalem when they stated the choice, "The new earth."

jasonc said:
Curious.if the tree of life is that literal then literally outside of heaven on the earth is hell?
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I think, not positive, but I think there probably is an actual tree of life and as I understand it, Hell is beneath the surface of the earth. So, all that stuff we've always heard about "down there" concerning Hell...it has some basis.
 
Stan1953 said:
I am always very amazed at how often God's abode is mixed into the New Jerusalem. Eternal LIFE is just that.
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Stan, the question, at least by the multiple choice answers, seems to be asking "where". Or are you saying, the new Jerusalem will not be our home? Or are you saying Gods abode will not be in the new Jerusalem?

And yea, eternal life is, eternal life...hard to argue with that, but I don't think anyone is.

and as He also indicated that no man has ever seen God,

The_Epsicle reminds me that Adam was a man and he and God walked and talked together. But in defense of what you said, Adam had a different body than us so....
 
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The_Epsicle said:
To clarify some terminology when I refer to heaven I mean the spiritual realm of God and the angels, when I refer to Earth I mean the physical realm of God, humans, and animals. Both can be referred to in an eternal life setting.
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You don't think there is a Physical Heaven? If not, why?

The_Epsicle said:
I am of the opinion(since that is all it is) we do not go to heaven when we die, but rather are at that exact moment of our death taken to judgement day, so there will be no waiting for your friends who died after you because you'll all get there at the same time, I don't believe in soul sleep but I believe you will actually be taken to judgement day immediately. After which I believe we will be in full communion with God like Adam and Eve where until the Fall, and Adam and Eve served and worshiped God by speaking directly to him face to face and tending to His Garden of Eden.
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Why do you believe that? True that I didn't supply verses to back up my thoughts but that's because they were pretty much mainstream. I mention that so you know why I'm asking for scripture to substantiate your not so mainstream ideas, or anything for that matter, when I provided nothing.

And as you say, this is all just opinion so no big deal but we all base our opinions on something.
 
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