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How can you believe in something that can't be scientifically proven?

Like some of the true honest righteous scientists et al have said - so, you think we are all descended from a puddle of goo ? is that 'better', or is it any more "CREDIBLE" than being descendant from Adam and Eve (and Yhwh the Creator!) ?

Free choice - faith in 'goo'
or
Faith in Yhwh the Creator ! :)
 
OzSpen said:
:goodpost

What's your view on how we can use these various arguments (evidence) in conversation with non-believers? My general approach to to allow people as much opportunity as possible to 'vent' and then pick up one point to discuss that seems to be a core part of their worldview that seems to have questions associated.

I don't know what it is like in your part of the world, but here in Brisbane I've not experienced too many pastors and church leaders who are interested in equipping their people in apologetics. My observation is that many of these church leaders seem ill equipped to do this.

I'm in the final stages of advanced study and when that is completed (hopefully by the end of the year), I'll be offering an apologetics seminar to evangelical churches.
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sadly that is the case here in some parts. I learned of these arguments from ravi zacharais and debating creationism. I had to. I use wisdom when I do tell the lost.most of the time its just an argument with a harden heart. but I do need to witness more.
 
th1b.taylor said:
Sorry Jason but there is not a single secular scientist that will accept that as truth, It is their contention that it all happened by sheer circumstance. Oddly enough when i present them with the Chevy 427 parts thrown into a box and rocked to and fro for a few centuries they will cry fowl and assert that, of course it will never assemble itself. But that is exactly what they seem to suggest about God's Cereation.


Yes, but this does not help your first point at all.
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that is because they aren't open. look if we don't argue for this stuff. why then do we have Christian doctors. after all its just faith. imagined and unreal. we have to have a worldview that works and guides us.
 
Guys lets remember we do not all think or speak the same way.... and quit making personal arguments the forums are for debate....

2.4: Do not make an inflammatory remark just to get a response. Address issues not personalities. Respect where people are in their spiritual walk, and respect all others in general. Respect where others are in their spiritual walk, do not disrupt the flow of discussion or act in a way that affects others negatively including when debating doctrinal issues, in the defense of the Christian faith, and in offering unwelcome spiritual advice.

Please read the above paragraph... Ask your self what can i do to respect others?

Not necessarily directed at the last poster :)
 
jasonc said:
that is because they aren't open. look if we don't argue for this stuff. why then do we have Christian doctors. after all its just faith. imagined and unreal. we have to have a worldview that works and guides us.
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case in point, we are commanded by the lord to give an account(greek word is where we get the word to apologize) of why we believe what we believe.
 
jasonc said:
sadly that is the case here in some parts. I learned of these arguments from ravi zacharais and debating creationism. I had to. I use wisdom when I do tell the lost.most of the time its just an argument with a harden heart. but I do need to witness more.
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Ravi, Norm Geisler, Bill Craig, & John Montgomery (popularised by Josh McDowell) have been a great help for me. I recommend for the laity Stephen Gaukroger, It Makes Sense (1989. London: Scripture Union). It's a wonderful down to earth understanding of some of the major issues of apologetics. The edition I have comes complete with study guide for each chapter.
 
jasonc said:
that is because they aren't open. look if we don't argue for this stuff. why then do we have Christian doctors. after all its just faith. imagined and unreal. we have to have a worldview that works and guides us.
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:amen
 
OzSpen said:
Ravi, Norm Geisler, Bill Craig, & John Montgomery (popularised by Josh McDowell) have been a great help for me. I recommend for the laity Stephen Gaukroger, It Makes Sense (1989. London: Scripture Union). It's a wonderful down to earth understanding of some of the major issues of apologetics. The edition I have comes complete with study guide for each chapter.
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I used to listen ravi Zacharias. he was here just this may and spoke on the beach.
 
i had a brief encounter with a soldier who isn't sure of her beliefs. she stated i don't believe in atheism but neither do i believe in a god. so i stated, and agnostic i see. she said what is that. i said one who is unsure and either wants to know or doesn't know and doesn't care. she is closest to the later in that she doesn't care for that stuff. others were wanted to know what that meant. i should have said more.

so don't think we shouldn't know what to say.
 
OzSpen said:
In which part of the world is 'the beach' for you, where Ravi was speaking?
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vero beach, florida. it wasn't the beach but the barrier island has a park near the river. if you don't know vero much i would have to post a pic of the park.
 
jasonc said:
i had a brief encounter with a soldier who isn't sure of her beliefs. she stated i don't believe in atheism but neither do i believe in a god. so i stated, and agnostic i see. she said what is that. i said one who is unsure and either wants to know or doesn't know and doesn't care. she is closest to the later in that she doesn't care for that stuff. others were wanted to know what that meant. i should have said more.

so don't think we shouldn't know what to say.
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Why don't you start a thread with a theme about agnosticism and how to answer them? An agnostic is 'someone who is unsure about the question of God' (Norman L Geisler & Frank Turek 2004. I don't have enough faith to be an atheist. Wheaton, Illinois: Crossway Books, p. 23).

Perhaps a question under the theme of 'Communicating with Agnostics'. What do you think about such a thread under 'Apologetics & Theology' where we can have some healthy debate? Or is it considered OK to have such a topic here in The Lounge? I'm new to this forum.
 
jasonc said:
vero beach, florida. it wasn't the beach but the barrier island has a park near the river. if you don't know vero much i would have to post a pic of the park.
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Dr Google helped me locate this view of Vero Beach, FL. Is this anywhere near where Ravi was speaking?
directory_rotating_photos5image.jpg
 
OzSpen said:
Why don't you start a thread with a theme about agnosticism and how to answer them? An agnostic is 'someone who is unsure about the question of God' (Norman L Geisler & Frank Turek 2004. I don't have enough faith to be an atheist. Wheaton, Illinois: Crossway Books, p. 23).

Perhaps a question under the theme of 'Communicating with Agnostics'. What do you think about such a thread under 'Apologetics & Theology' where we can have some healthy debate? Or is it considered OK to have such a topic here in The Lounge? I'm new to this forum.
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i can.

and in that pic, that was taken quite recently. but it is over 2 years old. the open field on the east side(ocean) side is where he spoke. its connected to that spoil island that has that bridge and its called riverside park. sadly i was near that place but to far to hear him. the golf course to the south is where i was working :sad
 
OzSpen said:
Why don't you start a thread with a theme about agnosticism and how to answer them? An agnostic is 'someone who is unsure about the question of God' (Norman L Geisler & Frank Turek 2004. I don't have enough faith to be an atheist. Wheaton, Illinois: Crossway Books, p. 23).

Perhaps a question under the theme of 'Communicating with Agnostics'. What do you think about such a thread under 'Apologetics & Theology' where we can have some healthy debate? Or is it considered OK to have such a topic here in The Lounge? I'm new to this forum.
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http://christianforums.net/Fellowship/index.php?threads/agnosticism.54323/
 
jasonc said:
that is because they aren't open. look if we don't argue for this stuff. why then do we have Christian doctors. after all its just faith. imagined and unreal. we have to have a worldview that works and guides us.
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Jason, Please go to http://www.openbible.info/topics/thoughts_and_the_mind and dig out or use the internet to access a copy of the Nave's Topical and study this issue. The highlighted in red is, absolutely not the remarks that have sprung out of the Church.
 
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