How do we determine the TRUTH?

[Imagican]

How are we, (those that desire to KNOW the truth), determine whether something IS or ISN'T The Truth?

Do we simply follow what is taught in the churches? Do we simply listen and learn from others? Do we just pray about it? Reading? Study?

Just curious. For it appears that many have simply accepted what others have TAUGHT them instead of using an sort of 'guide line' to lead in their acceptance of 'truth'.

Some claim that to find one's truth within the words of The Bible is Solo Scriptura. That this is NOT enough. Some claim that it takes 'special people' to discern the truth contained within The Word. There is indication that, 'before the writting of the Bible', one could obtain truth simply by being obedient and following God through HIs Son.

What say ye? How do we determine THE truth. Not JUST the truth as WE SEE IT, but the ACTUAL truth?

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Adullam]

The truth has power; the truth has fruit, the truth sets you free. I like to ask, what is your doctrine doing for you?

We white-knuckle truisms often as if they were truth itself. We also confuse facts with the truth.

The problem with determining truth is that there are layers to truth. We will often resist a deeper truth in order to preserve a truth that comforts us in some way. It is like the good getting in the way of the perfect. We often latch onto one interpretation of a verse, when there are deeper meanings that we turn aside from.

The truth ultimately is Jesus Christ. The truth is a living person. The truth melts away everything else through a divine encounter. This is taking the truth to it's ultimate end.

John

 

[John]

For me, Jesus said he is the Truth, which is either false or valid, Jesus and God are on par so when either of em say something i am gonna take it as truth. If something is inspired by God then i will also believe in its authenticity. For example God said he created the Earth i believe it, God said he made everything in 6 days..i believe it . Jesus rose from the dead...i believe it etc etc.

 

[Adullam]

For me, Jesus said he is the Truth, which is either false or valid, Jesus and God are on par so when either of em say something i am gonna take it as truth. If something is inspired by God then i will also believe in its authenticity. For example God said he created the Earth i believe it, God said he made everything in 6 days..i believe it . Jesus rose from the dead...i believe it etc etc.

The difficulty is seeing with and in the truth. For example, let's say the colour purple is the truth. Now, all Christians will agree with a blatant example of purple, as in a purple colour card used for selling paint. But the deeper we go into truth (into Christ) the more we can see slight shades of purple. It is the opposite of what one might think. Deeper truth doesn't get more purple!!! Rather, it is the increasing ability to see slight shades of purple in other colours.

God is a God who hides. The more we know Him, the more we see Him at all times. Walking in truth is literally walking in the light of eternity where one sees the world through God.

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John

 

[shad]

The truth has power; the truth has fruit, the truth sets you free. I like to ask, what is your doctrine doing for you?

John

I like that. Christianity is about how to live in God's way; it is not about just knowledge of God and Jesus.

I would like to add that as long as the doctrine goes, I interpret it as a whole context.

 

[Free]

There are several ways of determining biblical truth, all of which work together.

 

[researcher]

How are we, (those that desire to KNOW the truth), determine whether something IS or ISN'T The Truth?

Do we simply follow what is taught in the churches? Do we simply listen and learn from others? Do we just pray about it? Reading? Study?

Just curious. For it appears that many have simply accepted what others have TAUGHT them instead of using an sort of 'guide line' to lead in their acceptance of 'truth'.

Some claim that to find one's truth within the words of The Bible is Solo Scriptura. That this is NOT enough. Some claim that it takes 'special people' to discern the truth contained within The Word. There is indication that, 'before the writting of the Bible', one could obtain truth simply by being obedient and following God through HIs Son.

What say ye? How do we determine THE truth. Not JUST the truth as WE SEE IT, but the ACTUAL truth?

Blessings,

MEC

1Jn 2:27 And as for you, the anointing which ye received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any one teach you; but as his anointing teacheth you; concerning all things, and is true, and is no lie, and even as it taught you, ye abide in him.

Holy Spirit.

 

[Adullam]

How are we, (those that desire to KNOW the truth), determine whether something IS or ISN'T The Truth?

Do we simply follow what is taught in the churches? Do we simply listen and learn from others? Do we just pray about it? Reading? Study?

Just curious. For it appears that many have simply accepted what others have TAUGHT them instead of using an sort of 'guide line' to lead in their acceptance of 'truth'.

Some claim that to find one's truth within the words of The Bible is Solo Scriptura. That this is NOT enough. Some claim that it takes 'special people' to discern the truth contained within The Word. There is indication that, 'before the writting of the Bible', one could obtain truth simply by being obedient and following God through HIs Son.

What say ye? How do we determine THE truth. Not JUST the truth as WE SEE IT, but the ACTUAL truth?

Blessings,

MEC

1Jn 2:27 And as for you, the anointing which ye received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any one teach you; but as his anointing teacheth you; concerning all things, and is true, and is no lie, and even as it taught you, ye abide in him.

Holy Spirit.

He will lead you into all truth.

 

[JudaicChristian]

How are we, (those that desire to KNOW the truth), determine whether something IS or ISN'T The Truth?

Do we simply follow what is taught in the churches? Do we simply listen and learn from others? Do we just pray about it? Reading? Study?

Just curious. For it appears that many have simply accepted what others have TAUGHT them instead of using an sort of 'guide line' to lead in their acceptance of 'truth'.

Some claim that to find one's truth within the words of The Bible is Solo Scriptura. That this is NOT enough. Some claim that it takes 'special people' to discern the truth contained within The Word. There is indication that, 'before the writting of the Bible', one could obtain truth simply by being obedient and following God through HIs Son.

What say ye? How do we determine THE truth. Not JUST the truth as WE SEE IT, but the ACTUAL truth?

Blessings,

MEC

As a Christian it is your responsibility to know the truth, and not some one else, no not even your preacher. Truth is made known by the reason of the facts. That means there is a lot to study. All humans have error in them. If it is a subject that can not withstand debate, then it may not be the truth. If there is truly a contradiction in scripture, then it may not be true. Those who have translated our scripture into English use there own opinions in translation. So then it is a question if it is a TRANSLATION or an INTERPRETATION. Whatever doctrines are debated, those are the issues.

• Jude.

4. Because you are unaware that certain men have sneeked in, who are of a ancient order to their condemnation, these ungodly men turn the grace of our God into immorality, and deny that the only God is Yahwah, or that our lord Yahshua is the Messiah.
5. I will remind you although you once knew this, how Yahwah, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that did not believe.
6. Those messengers did not keep their first estate, and they were removed from their place, and He has reserved for them everlasting chains of darkness for that great day of judgment.

 

[epistemaniac]

the epistemological approaches of Presuppositionalists like John Frame and Greg Bahnsen, following Corenlius Van Til, seems to me to carry the best chance that we fallible humans may find truth. Also, Gordan Clark's approach (called "Scripturalism" by some) is close to the Presuppositional position. If you are not aware of this view, basically it says that unless you presuppose God, one cannot know anything with certainty. Of course the view is more complex but for more on this, see articles like
http://www.reformed.org/apologetics/index.html

blessings,
ken

 

[khalou]

You can't.

Here's a story-

A five year old is walking along, and accidentally kicks an anthill. He goes on his way, never realizing the panic he has created in the ant community.

The ants run around frantically trying to control the damage done, and try to make sense of the calamity that has befallen them. They notice the pattern made by the sole of the five year old's shoe, and wonder about that. There is a zig-zag pattern that was designed in China by an overworked sole designer that has recently given away a daughter in marriage. The ants couldn't possibly comprehend any of that, so they do the best they can.

Many of them come up with theories about ant behavior that may have possibly triggered such an event, and tell the other ants about their opinions.

The creator God that spoke all things into existence, unlike the five year old, has a plan for our own communities. We can no more understand His will than the ants can comprehend the author of their calamity. But we do have something. We have the Bible.

How could a book written so long ago even begin to explain the nature of our reality in any sort of detail? Faith demands that we adopt the sensibilities of its message, but how much of what's written is meant to detail the overall plan, and how much of what's written is meant to lead us in the right direction without actually explaining the Japanese designer and the eventual pattern of the sole of the five year old's sneaker?

A creator God would at least be as far advanced compared to our intellectual capabilities as the shoe industry might be to an ant. Maybe even more so, wouldn't you think?

I don't think the "truth" is achievable for those living on our plane of existence. We would certainly be arrogant to insist that we can come close to even a working comprehension of the reality of things.

A loving God would know this, and teach that we never judge, lest we be judged. Those ants that came up with their interpretations of the pattern of the great devastation just didn't have the intellectual amperage to be right. It would be the definition of arrogance on anyone's part to claim such an ability.

Love seems to be the message. Non-judgement. This reality in which we find ourselves is but the blink of an eye, and eternity awaits.

Why take a chance? If you seek to save your own life, you will certainly lose it.

Truth is determined in science by falsification. Scientists attempt to prove that what they believe is false. If there is no way to test their theories by proving them wrong, they don't touch them with a ten foot pole. It is an imperfect system, as we are an imperfect species, but by doing so, they cure diseases and come up with better ways of insulating our homes.

But that doesn't answer your question. Science may be imperfect, but it at least tries to not be like the ants that "know" about the zig-zag formations of the footware. :crazy

Christians need to NOT be like those ants. It is in our best interests to say "I don't know" because anything less translates to the fact that our God can be explained in human terms. In other words, Christians bring the creator of the universe down to our level by saying that we understand His plan.

What we need to do is faithfully follow the Barney version of the Bible- do not judge, do not pretend to know the mind of God, and love others. Just love others.

k

 

[Solo]

In reference to the OP of this thread, what is the truth of the following Scripture?

• 1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. 2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise;) 3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ephesians 6:1-3

 

[khalou]

In reference to the OP of this thread, what is the truth of the following Scripture?

• 1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. 2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise;) 3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ephesians 6:1-3

The promise here is plain. You will not acheive heaven or salvation by honouring your parents. You will, however, live long upon the earth. It seems to be a message of wisdom that speaks of earthly living. Good advice as opposed to a path to eternal salvation.

There are lots of passages in the Bible about such things. Advice on how to live upon the earth and live abundantly.

k

 

[Solo]

In reference to the OP of this thread, what is the truth of the following Scripture?

• 1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. 2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise;) 3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ephesians 6:1-3

The promise here is plain. You will not acheive heaven or salvation by honouring your parents. You will, however, live long upon the earth. It seems to be a message of wisdom that speaks of earthly living. Good advice as opposed to a path to eternal salvation.

There are lots of passages in the Bible about such things. Advice on how to live upon the earth and live abundantly.

k

khalou,

Please backup your answer to my question with whatever authority that you assess truth with, whether it is Scripture, Tradition, Opinion, Magisterium, etc.

Thank you,

Solo

 

[khalou]

In reference to the OP of this thread, what is the truth of the following Scripture?

• 1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. 2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise;) 3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ephesians 6:1-3

The promise here is plain. You will not acheive heaven or salvation by honouring your parents. You will, however, live long upon the earth. It seems to be a message of wisdom that speaks of earthly living. Good advice as opposed to a path to eternal salvation.

There are lots of passages in the Bible about such things. Advice on how to live upon the earth and live abundantly.

k

khalou,

Please backup your answer to my question with whatever authority that you assess truth with, whether it is Scripture, Tradition, Opinion, Magisterium, etc.

Thank you,

Solo

There is a promise there. There is only one.

"That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth"

The rest is instruction. If one follows the instruction, then the promise would follow.

k

 

[Solo]

There is a promise there. There is only one.

"That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth"

The rest is instruction. If one follows the instruction, then the promise would follow.

k

According to your original answer, do you not find it interesting that the first commandment of promise does not relate to eternal life, but only to a brief existance on this earth in a sinful, mortal, corrupt physical body?

 

[khalou]

Interesting?

Only if I also have a presupposition of what I might find.

k

 

[brakelite2]

I think what was said by an earlier poster was the key. We must want to know the truth before we receive it. Paul said that except we have a love of the truth we will be deceived.
This truth we must love is not just informative or scientific truth, but rather truth as a principle in the life. Truth as an instrument of righteousness. Truth as a concept, a way of life, an integrated part of our characters. Unless we first love that truth, knowing informative, scientific, or theological truth is an impossibility.
Before we can know truth, we must first also know it's author. For it is only through Him and by Him that truth comes to us.
We will never know all truth, neither in this life or eternity. What would heaven be like if we knew everything? It would be utterly and completely boring. But heaven will be far from boring, for we will never plumb the fullest depths of God, His creation, nor His purposes for us. Every new day will be a surprise, a new astonishing revelation of His love, His mercy, and His grace. We will never fully come to grips with why God loved us so much to give His only Son to become one of us, and to die in our behalf. This will be the joy of our study for eternity, and the greatest mystery of our present time that will never be solved, despite daily new revelations concerning it's depths.

But what truth we can know in Christ, we can be assured that it is enough truth. We can be assured that what God has revealed to us through the scriptures is sufficient to enable us to begin our relationship with Jesus and His Father, sufficient to begin to understand that God is love and we can trust Him without reservation, and sufficient to know that the very same God that raised Jesus from the dead will also raise our mortal bodies at the last trump and change them into immortal imperishable, perfect bodies that can never die. Sufficient truth to know how to prepare for eternity, sufficient to know our responsibilities, sufficient to know our obligations, and sufficient to know that though we may make mistakes and fall over from time to time, His grace is sufficient for us, and as long as we remain faithful, He will see us through to the end.
That my friends, is truth, and it is enough.

 

[Solo]

In reference to the OP of this thread, what is the truth of the following Scripture?

• 1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. 2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise;) 3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ephesians 6:1-3

The promise here is plain. You will not acheive heaven or salvation by honouring your parents. You will, however, live long upon the earth. It seems to be a message of wisdom that speaks of earthly living. Good advice as opposed to a path to eternal salvation.

There are lots of passages in the Bible about such things. Advice on how to live upon the earth and live abundantly.

k

It is quite interesting that what we ASSUME is truth is often times not truth; And until the Holy Spirit interprets the Scriptures for us, we have not a clue.

I too thought that the fifth commandment for children to honor their father and mother was one that if obeyed, one would live long on this earth in their physical life prior to dying. This is not truth. How do I know what the truth is in this matter? By the Holy Spirit leading me to the truth as described below:

My oldest son was killed in an automobile accident his senior year of high school. His last class let out at lunch time, and after he ate lunch at Wendy's, he and a friend left for work. On the way to work, the driver fell asleep and veered off of the highway into a disabled pickup truck on the shoulder. They hit on my son's side of the car and the parked pickup came in through the window and hit my son in the head. He was pronounced dead at the hospital after being life flighted. He was eighteen years old. There is not a child on this planet earth that has honored his father and mother more than my son did; and yet his life on this earth was not long on the earth.

I asked God for two weeks to explain how I could believe any of his promises if I could not believe the first commandment with a promise. I struggled with this "first commandment with promise" for two weeks asking God how I could believe anything that He had to say if I couldn't believe this portion of Scripture. God led me to the following Scripture:

• 1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. 4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away. 5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. 6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. 7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. Revelation 21:1-7

The first commandment of promise declares that all will be well with them and long will their days be on the earth for those who honor their father and mother; not on this sin filled earth where corruption exists, but on the new earth where there will be no more tears, no more pain, no more sorrow, no more crying, and no more death! Those who overcome by the blood of the lamb will have God Almighty as their Father, and they will be His sons.

 

[khalou]

I stand corrected.

Not so obvious after all.

k