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How do you find heaven?

E

elijah23

Guest
Do you find heaven by obeying Jesus, or do you find heaven by reading lots of books?
 
elijah23 said:
Do you find heaven by obeying Jesus, or do you find heaven by reading lots of books?
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the way to heaven is through christ, and one must be born agian in order to see the kingdom of god.
 
I don't think that heaven is something that we find.
 
Free said:
I don't think that heaven is something that we find.
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It is in the midst of us:
[20] Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God was coming, he answered them, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed;
[21] nor will they say, `Lo, here it is!' or `There!' for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you." Luke 17:20-21 RSV
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then kingdom of god, isnt just heaven, i must correct myself

if heaven is here, then what is hell or death like?

the lord reigns from heaven but he has come to the earth.
 
jasoncran said:
then kingdom of god, isnt just heaven, i must correct myself

if heaven is here, then what is hell or death like?

the lord reigns from heaven but he has come to the earth.
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The kingdom of God should be heavenly. The lord's prayer even indicates "thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven." So regardless of what heaven or hell are like in the spiritual world. Our mission is to do the will of God on earth here as it is in heaven. Thus making it heavenly.
 
reconcile that with the verse quoted by elijah, the kingdom of god is indeed within us. but the world isn't under the lords direct rule, as he is allowing the time of the gentiles to continue for a season.

he allows satan to run things , if you doubt why did paul call satan the prince of the air, if he is bound at the cross and has no power to manipulate things.

this world aint running to jesus but away from him sadly.
 
jasoncran said:
reconcile that with the verse quoted by elijah, the kingdom of god is indeed within us. but the world isn't under the lords direct rule, as he is allowing the time of the gentiles to continue for a season.

he allows satan to run things , if you doubt why did paul call satan the prince of the air, if he is bound at the cross and has no power to manipulate things.

this world aint running to jesus but away from him sadly.
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Satan isn't running anything. Satan is only bringing out the worst in us and allowing us to feed him. This world is God's, and he would NEVER hand it over to satan.

Genesis 8:21
The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.

If God handed it over to Satan that would mean he would have broken his promise based on the actions of man.

And there is no way Satan would have outsmarted God or overpowered him to make him hand it over.

Job 41:11
Who has a claim against me that I must pay? Everything under heaven belongs to me.

We give satan power with our sins. That's the only power he has. He is only the accuser.
 
really the sinner, he needs a savior.

can the sinner rebuke the devil? or stop sinning and be holy.

was satan not involved in the likes of hitler,pol pot, or others.

in the book or revalation(to which you should read) the devil is given the ability to do miracles.the beast(the ac) is killed and yet who revives him? satan

he also kills the saints.
 
jasoncran said:
really the sinner, he needs a savior.

can the sinner rebuke the devil? or stop sinning and be holy.

was satan not involved in the likes of hitler,pol pot, or others.

in the book or revalation(to which you should read) the devil is given the ability to do miracles.the beast(the ac) is killed and yet who revives him? satan

he also kills the saints.
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The sinner does need a savior. That savior is Christ. This is true. In that verse of genesis, it even says every inclination of a mans heart from birth is evil. This is the nature of man, maybe God created us this way, so that we could recognized the difference between right and wrong; I don't know, I can only speculate. Even in the garden of eden if our hearts were created perfectly so that we weren't inclined to do evil satan wouldn't have had any sway over eve.

If the devil is given the ability to do miracles we can also speculate that this might be due to the power that we give him through our sins. If we take every effort to not sin and act like Christ we stop giving him power. If in the end it's God that gives him power than so be it, but I know I don't want to be responsible for it. How else would he have achieved that power all of a sudden unless it comes from the hearts of man?

You could say satan was involved in the likes of hitler and this is probably true; But I don't believe he was possessed or under the direct control of satan. It's the voice of satan that drives us to darkness. Accusing us of things and bringing out the worst in us. Thus in turn giving him more and more power.
 
You get on I-95 and head south till you can't go any farther. Take the first right after the second light and stay on that road until you come to a flight of stairs on the left side of the road. Start climbing...

But in all seriousness, Heaven is not found, it's given by the grace of God as a token of love. One can only receive this gift if they repent for their sins in the name of Jesus Christ and faithfully believe in their heart that Jesus is the Lord and Savior.
 
uh, no we are being killed by satan, how does being born again allowbeing slain by the devil save the lord lets him do it.

in the tribulation if we were just letting satan have his way in the trib then would there be some warning or some faithful spoken about in the book of revalation that stops satan?

but there's not, instead the souls of the martyred for the lord cry out for vengeance at the alter in the vision of the end times.
 
If satan is the god of this world so to speak, how do you explain that verse in job. How do you explain that verse in genesis. Unless of course God broke his promise, and God never breaks promises.
 
ORwarriOR said:
If satan is the god of this world so to speak, how do you explain that verse in job. How do you explain that verse in genesis. Unless of course God broke his promise, and God never breaks promises.
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simple read matthew 4 and the second temptation of christ, satan offers the whole kingdoms of men to the lord. notice the lord didnt say that satan didnt own or rule those but that man shall worship the lord thy god.

and i said that satan is allowed by the lord to reign over the earth, for a season,the lord holds him back in alot of areas and will allow him to have more power in the trib as part of the judgments.
 
jasoncran said:
ORwarriOR said:
If satan is the god of this world so to speak, how do you explain that verse in job. How do you explain that verse in genesis. Unless of course God broke his promise, and God never breaks promises.
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simple read matthew 4 and the second temptation of christ, satan offers the whole kingdoms of men to the lord. notice the lord didnt say that satan didnt own or rule those but that man shall worship the lord thy god.

and i said that satan is allowed by the lord to reign over the earth, for a season,the lord holds him back in alot of areas and will allow him to have more power in the trib as part of the judgments.
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Satan is also described as the father of lies by John, everything he says is a lie.

And again that logic goes against the genesis verse and the job verse.

Job 41:11
Who has a claim against me that I must pay? Everything under heaven belongs to me.

Satan may have influence but that doesn't mean he rules the world or owns any of it. It all belongs to God. And again if God gave it to satan that goes against the verse in genesis, because that would most definitely be a curse.
 
does prince of the air sound like a limited rule, yes the lord lets him rule. of course but we man gave him the deed to the earth. when adam sinned satan was allowed to run amok on the earth.

see the book of revalation again

it talks about the earth being redeemed and john cryind has no man could open the seals to that scroll but the lord said fear not and behold the lamb of god who was , was dead and is to come is worthy to open the seals

the earth is under the curse no doubt and the curse isnt removed till after the reign of the lord in the millenium and the final defeat of satan and his casting into gehenna.

then death itself is cast there as well.
 
jasoncran said:
does prince of the air sound like a limited rule, yes the lord lets him rule. of course but we man gave him the deed to the earth. when adam sinned satan was allowed to run amok on the earth.

see the book of revalation again

it talks about the earth being redeemed and john cryind has no man could open the seals to that scroll but the lord said fear not and behold the lamb of god who was , was dead and is to come is worthy to open the seals

the earth is under the curse no doubt and the curse isnt removed till after the reign of the lord in the millenium and the final defeat of satan and his casting into gehenna.

then death itself is cast there as well.
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Genesis 8:21
The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.

Why would the Lord curse the earth over the actions of adam when he promises here he would never curse the ground because of man. You are basically saying God broke his promise.
 
that is regard to the flood only,

then theres this

2 peter 3" BUT THE HEAVEANS AND THE EARTH WHICH ARE NOW, BY THE SAME WORD ARE KEPT IN STORE, RESERVED UNTO FIRE AGAINST THE DAY OF JUDGMENT AND PERDITION OF UNGODLY MEN"

then on to vs 10"
BUT THE DAY OF THE LORD WILL COME AS A THIEF IN THE NIGHT; IN THE WHICH HEAVANS SHALL PASS WAY WITH THE A GREAT NOISE, AND THE ELEMENTS SHALL MELT WITH FERVENT HEAT AND THE EARTH AND THE WORKS THAT ARE THEREIN SHALL BE BURNED UP"

VS 11" SEEING THEN THAT ALL THESE THINGS SHALL BE DISSOLVED, WHAT MANNER OF PERSONS OUGHT YE TO BE IN ALL HOLY CONVERSATION AND GODLINESS"

that suffices for me that the lord will judge the earth again with fire, and that is added to in the book of revalation as the new heaven and earth is described.

why? men refused the lord.
 
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