Hypocritical?

[PDoug]

How come so many Christians support violence, sex (of any description), rape, asininity, profanity and obscene language - in fact everything they claim to be against - with their entertainment dollars? I’ve been trying to fathom this out for ages and haven’t been able to come up with a satisfactory answer. Maybe someone can help me.

I can’t imagine this thread going the distance since the theme doesn’t seem to be an issue with Christians. Why is it not an issue?

Because a man is justified by faith and not by works (Romans 3:28, Romans 4:1-8).

 

[DivineNames]

I think there may actually be a problem, with films not being as gratuitously violent as they used to be. I grew up on stuff like RoboCop and Schwarzenegger films, and I fear that Hollywood may have lowered its standards and its level of violence...

 

[SputnikBoy]

How come so many Christians support violence, sex (of any description), rape, asininity, profanity and obscene language - in fact everything they claim to be against - with their entertainment dollars? I’ve been trying to fathom this out for ages and haven’t been able to come up with a satisfactory answer. Maybe someone can help me.

I can’t imagine this thread going the distance since the theme doesn’t seem to be an issue with Christians. Why is it not an issue?

Because a man is justified by faith and not by works (Romans 3:28, Romans 4:1-8).

Well, okay. So let us continue to rape and pilage (or at least enjoy those who do) and praise the Lord! Strange - but typical - present day Christian logic. I wonder what Paul would REALLY think of this?

 

[SputnikBoy]

I think there may actually be a problem, with films not being as gratuitously violent as they used to be. I grew up on stuff like RoboCop and Schwarzenegger films, and I fear that Hollywood may have lowered its standards and its level of violence...

And therefore ... ...?

 

[Windozer]

Well, okay. So let us continue to rape and pillage (or at least enjoy those who do) and praise the Lord! Strange - but typical - present day Christian logic. I wonder what Paul would REALLY think of this?

Do you really think that those who rape and pillage are justified?

Do you really think that those who are justified enjoy those who do?

I wonder where you got that from?

And as for those who rape and pillage what power do you or I have to do anything about it?

Since when does taking a stand against something like that done any good? (in terms of changing anyone?)

A rapist knows before he commits the crime that society will not accept that kind of behavior.

So just what is your point? What am I missing?

 

[SputnikBoy]

How come so many Christians support violence, sex (of any description), rape, asininity, profanity and obscene language - in fact everything they claim to be against - with their entertainment dollars? I’ve been trying to fathom this out for ages and haven’t been able to come up with a satisfactory answer. Maybe someone can help me.

I can’t imagine this thread going the distance since the theme doesn’t seem to be an issue with Christians. Why is it not an issue?

Because a man is justified by faith and not by works (Romans 3:28, Romans 4:1-8).

Well, okay. So let us continue to rape and pilage (or at least enjoy those who do) and praise the Lord! Strange - but typical - present day Christian logic. I wonder what Paul would REALLY think of this?

Windozer ...my above remark was a tongue-in-cheek response to the comment (or scripture) given by PDoug. What PDoug is implying for having presented the scripture is that faith justifies every rotten thing that we might view and accept on the TV/DVD, etc. And, if he/she doesn't mean that, then he/she perhaps needs to clarify his/her position.

 

[Windozer]

Thanks for clarifying Sputnik,

 

[John the Baptist]

That the bottom line is, is OSAS. So it doesn't matter if one wants to or does go out and paint the town, or kill or whatever? only believe. You know, keep every day holy, huh? :o But the END result is that of Obadiah 1:16

---John

 

[PDoug]

Windozer ...my above remark was a tongue-in-cheek response to the comment (or scripture) given by PDoug. What PDoug is implying for having presented the scripture is that faith justifies every rotten thing that we might view and accept on the TV/DVD, etc. And, if he/she doesn't mean that, then he/she perhaps needs to clarify his/her position.

Yes, that is exactly what I mean. Why? Because that is exactly what Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:28, Romans 4:1-8, and a host of other scriptures mean. You and others simply cannot go around picking and choosing the scriptures you want to follow: you have to follow all the scriptures. Therefore if Galatians 5:4 forbids you from directly following the law (which you are advocating) you cannot do so, and then act as if you are squared away with God. Why? Because Galatians 5:4 promises that if you do so, you will lose your salvation. As I've said repeatedly, real faith causes the natural production of good works in a person. It is these good works you should seek after, not the ones you do by consciously pursuing conduct found in the law.

 

[John the Baptist]

John here: This post was for another, but it catches your stuff too!
________

You still do not get it! (i hope that, that is all the problem is) Read the whole chapter in context! Verse 1 & verse 5 tells you what the meeting of Acts 15 was all about!!! It was Not about the ETERNAL COVENANT OF GOD!!!

It states in Inspiration the Words of Moses LAW. Not the Godheads Royal Law! Now, what have you talked about above??? Burdens?? That is what God's Covenant is to you, a BURDEN???? (again, you need to have a Born Again MIND!)

And Necessary things?? READ Ecclesiastes 12:13-14! This the WHOLE DUTY OF MAN! Not any Jew either. Man as in Mankind! Which Keep the Commandments of GOD, that is the CONCLUSION OF THE *WHOLE MATTER! FOR GOD WILL BRING EVERY WORK INTO JUDGEMENT!! Again, for mankind!

Then, meats, blood, and strangled... Where on earth do you see anything like this in the 10 Commandments that God Himself wrote!???????Then you conclude faith with shipwreck! I suggest that you read Hebrews. 6:1-6 for this, and 2 Peter 2:19-22 & tell us how this was possible with your theology?

OK: Back into Acts 15. Check the center index verses! In Gal. 2:11-14 the issue was with Peter before them all.. over CIRCUMCISION. NOT THE TEN COMMANDMENTS or the SABBATH one that seems to be hated the most. by some here. Then come verses 16-18 with more of the works of the ceremonial law.

Take note! There is [NO WORK] in OBEDIENCE OF THE ETERNAL COVENANT!! Christ say's that "IF YE LOVE ME KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS".
That is not BONDAGE WHEN ONES LOVES CHRIST! It is only BONDAGE TO THEM THAT HAVE NOT BEEN BORN AGAIN!! Gal. 3:10 CALL'S IT THE "BOOK OF THE LAW". Again Moses law was written in a book by him & placed in the side of the Ark, not INSIDE where the eternal Covenant of the Godhead was kept. Deut. 31:9 & verses 24-26.

Then we see the Word of bondage, begardly elements and , where unto how ye turn again to the weak and beggarly elements.. Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you'. Gal. 4:9-10 in part. (you can tell God how you can get His eternal Covenant of Hebrews. 13:20 wound up in that???)
Then in Gal. 4:1-4 again we see NOTHING ABOUT THE ETERNAL COVENANT OF THE **GODHEAD!! [CIRCUMCISM]!! Circumcism is again the issue that Paul went up to Jerusalem for in the first place and about the law of Moses is what Inspiration documented!!

Now over in Ephesians 2:13-15 we see the law Moses pointed to CHRIST. (Even Gal. 3:19 told why it was added) Notice verse 15 of Ephesians. 2, it says "Having abolished the law of commandments contained in ORDINANCES ..." Again, not the Ten Commandments that God Himself wrote!

Did I miss going back to Acts 15? Well, you look at Acts 21:17-25, and you say that this is about the Covenant of God?? Paul is telling of the meeting that went on there with the brethren at Jerusalem. ".. how many thousands of the Jews there are which believe; [and they are all zealous of the law:] WHICH ONE FRIEND!!?? Acts 15:1 & Acts 15:5 had NOTHING to do with the covenant of God. It says circumcism & the *LAW OF MOSES. This is was the problem of the 'thousands of Jews that were there, that were zealous of the law' They knew of Paul having been preaching about what? Notice:

Verse 21 of Acts 21. And see if you can 'ditch' the Eternal Covenant of God by this verse? "And they are informed of thee, that thou teaches [all Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses], saying that they [ought not to CIRCUMCISE THEIR CHILDREN], NEITHER [TO WALK AFTER THE *CUSTOMS]."

This was Acts 15 TIME FRIEND. Again, you tell Paul that he does away with the Covenant of God! These Jewish converts at Jerusalem had heard about Paul and his (their) problem with Moses law & circumcism, and (for more proof!) Paul even at this time GOOFED BIG TIME! Verse 22-24. And verse 25? Is about God's 10 Commandment law?? Hog/wash! (just the Sabbath Day is really what the devil is really after, huh! Dan. 7:25!)

Verse 25 of Acts 21 is all about Acts 15's Circumcism & the Law of Moses!!.

"As touching the Gentile's which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe [NO SUCH THING,] (no such thing as what? the ONLY THING UNDER CONSIDERATION WAS THE LAW OF MOSES!!) save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication."

If you can find any 'hint' from this that the ten Commandment Everlasting Covenant is or was even attempted to be suggested at here, you are far the worse that that of just not being Born Again! See again Heb. 6:6.

 

[Windozer]

You have to follow all the scriptures

No I don't....The only one I need to follow is Jesus.

If you want to talk about following scripture. How about removing the part of your body that causes you to sin?

Matthew 5:29 NIV.
If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.

Matthew 5:30 NIV.
And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

Time to tally up???

 

[PDoug]

You have to follow all the scriptures

No I don't....The only one I need to follow is Jesus.

Yes, but it is the scriptures which tell you how to follow Jesus. Therefore you must follow the scriptures to follow Jesus.

Matthew 5:29 NIV.
If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.

[quote:972e0]Matthew 5:30 NIV.
And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

Time to tally up???[/quote:972e0]
If faith causes you to be saved (Ephesians 2:8-9) and remain justified (Romans 3:28), how can you sin so long as you have faith (1 John 3:9)? It follows there that if a part of you threatens or gets in the way of your having faith, you must cut it off. That is what that scripture means.

 

[Windozer]

Yes, but it is the scriptures which tell you how to follow Jesus. Therefore you must follow the scriptures to follow Jesus.

I suspect you can support that statement with scripture?

I heard it was the other way around...

I heard (some where in scripture) that the scriptures were meant to lead us to Jesus.

 

[PDoug]

Yes, but it is the scriptures which tell you how to follow Jesus. Therefore you must follow the scriptures to follow Jesus.

I suspect you can support that statement with scripture?

I heard it was the other way around...

I heard (some where in scripture) that the scriptures were meant to lead us to Jesus.

Please note the following:

Romans 10

17 Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ.

Having faith is how someone follows Christ; and the encouragement and instructions on how to have faith comes from the scriptures (Mark 11:22-24).

 

[Windozer]

Yes, but it is the scriptures which tell you how to follow Jesus. Therefore you must follow the scriptures to follow Jesus.

I suspect you can support that statement with scripture?

I heard it was the other way around...

I heard (some where in scripture) that the scriptures were meant to lead us to Jesus.

Please note the following:

Romans 10

17 Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ.

Having faith is how someone follows Christ; and the encouragement and instructions on how to have faith comes from the scriptures (Mark 11:22-24).

You can not follow Jesus unless you have faith. Therefore the scripture you have referred to is designed to get you to follow him.

 

[PDoug]

Yes, but it is the scriptures which tell you how to follow Jesus. Therefore you must follow the scriptures to follow Jesus.

I suspect you can support that statement with scripture?

I heard it was the other way around...

I heard (some where in scripture) that the scriptures were meant to lead us to Jesus.

Please note the following:

Romans 10

17 Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ.

Having faith is how someone follows Christ; and the encouragement and instructions on how to have faith comes from the scriptures (Mark 11:22-24).

You can not follow Jesus unless you have faith. Therefore the scripture you have referred to is designed to get you to follow him.

Yes. That is what I said originally. Please look at the innermost message in the quotes above.

 

[PDoug]

Windozer,

Remember, having faith is not merely believing in God: having faith is the practice of: saying what you want and believing that it will happen, or asking God for things and believing you will receive it (Mark 11:22-24). There is no scriptural foundation for the notion that having faith is merely, directly believing in God. Mark 11:22-24 on the other is a scripture in which Christ instructs us on how we should have faith. (Please read here, here, here, and here for more on the subject.) It is my testimony, that when you have faith consistent with Mark 11:22-24, you will see the natural production of good works in you that I keep talking about.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Windozer ...my above remark was a tongue-in-cheek response to the comment (or scripture) given by PDoug. What PDoug is implying for having presented the scripture is that faith justifies every rotten thing that we might view and accept on the TV/DVD, etc. And, if he/she doesn't mean that, then he/she perhaps needs to clarify his/her position.

Yes, that is exactly what I mean. Why? Because that is exactly what Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 3:28, Romans 4:1-8, and a host of other scriptures mean. You and others simply cannot go around picking and choosing the scriptures you want to follow: you have to follow all the scriptures. Therefore if Galatians 5:4 forbids you from directly following the law (which you are advocating) you cannot do so, and then act as if you are squared away with God. Why? Because Galatians 5:4 promises that if you do so, you will lose your salvation. As I've said repeatedly, real faith causes the natural production of good works in a person. It is these good works you should seek after, not the ones you do by consciously pursuing conduct found in the law.

My take on this issue has little or nothing to do with the law as such, PDoug. It's more to do with those professed Christians who sit in their pews on Sunday or Saturday morning listening to the Word of God while in the evening choose to involve themselves in things that are in complete opposition to the Word of God. In other words, they 'turn off God' merely to be entertained. Many of us do this and it isn't right. It also casts a bad image of our Christianity for others.

So, what does one's actually choosing to be - or not be - entertained with ungodly material have to do with the texts that you presented above, PDoug? Are you actually implying that if I find a movie/DVD, etc. offensive and in contradiction to my beliefs as a Christian and choose not to watch it that I lose my salvation? Strange logic but rather typical of today's Christian. And besides, you have your interpretation of these texts backwards.

 

[wavy]

You have to follow all the scriptures

No I don't....The only one I need to follow is Jesus.

Who followed the scriptures. :-D

To follow him is not an abstract concept like "thinking" about how good he was or anything like that. To follow him is to walk as he walked (1 John 2:6). And he had faith and complete trust in the Father. Even to the end of a horrible death. He taught directly out of the Word.

Read his request in John 17:17.

 

[Windozer]

There is no scriptural foundation for the notion that having faith is merely, directly believing in God.

PDoug...When you sit in a chair you have faith that the chair will hold you. It is the same when you have faith in God. If you do not have faith that God will take care of you, of what value is your faith? Do you need scripture backing to believe that?

If you do then perhaps Romans 1:17 NIV. will do it.

For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, [ Or is from faith to faith] just as it is written: "The righteous will live by faith." [ Hab. 2:4]

The righteous will live by faith in who?

Romans 3:22 NIV.

This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,

Jesus Christ...That is who.