Indoctrination and being radicalised

[humble soul]

Though I wasn't aware at the time, I went through a period of strong radicalisation. I will mention that it was right wing political views. But don't wish this to become a political thread. All I'm saying is , that it is easy to get swept up in strong views and hatred of polar opposite views.
It's very gradual. You hardly notice. For me it came as a reaction to same sex marriage debates.
Now I look back and think it doesn't matter who is right or wrong. Don't get caught up in demonizing others. Have a view but don't get carried away. Humanize. Don't dehumanise. Avoid absolute views.
Now that might sound weak to some of you. But I want to take a moderate position and avoid all the mud slinging. It's not worth losing sleep over.

 

[Susannah]

I am thrilled you are a moderate. I am all over the place so I try to avoid labels. In some instances, I am a conservative. I do not believe in promiscuity or abortion. I believe people should stay married while the children are young, unless there is domestic violence. I do not think mothers of young children should have careers until their children are adolescents. On the other hand, I read the Living Bible and believe in Radical Love, which is loving others no matter what their race, politics or gender persuasion. I also think women should be equal to men and go into the ministry if they want. Who am I? As the movie says, I am "Desperately Seeking Susan." And I believe I found her when I found Christ and his commandment to love one another. I even gave up being a bully when talking to the credit card people on the phone. LOL

 

[Quantrill]

What a bunch of propaganda. Let me get my boots on.

Radicalization? This is a term commonly used for Islam and Muslims. This is why labeling certain Muslims as 'radical' is just a ploy. All of Islam is 'radical'. That is it's goal.

But, because everyone is getting used to the idea of a so called 'peaceful Islam' as opposed to a 'radical Islam', then it is just a stepping stone away from identifying Christians in the same light. And that is our enemy's purpose. Christians are being set up. And many Christians are participating in it.

Christianity now, they say, has it's radicals. And of course they are to be feared just like the Muslim radicals. Full of hate and violence, and anger. They just don't love their neighbor. And of course, they are the 'fundamentalist's'. The Bible believing Christians. The Born-again Christians. Conservatives in their faith and politics.

What a crock.

Quantrill

 

[Susannah]

I call it radical love because to people like you loving your Muslim neighbors seems radical. So instead you disregard the commandment to love you neighbor of another race. See the story of the Good Samaritan.

P.S. Regarding boots . . . When my husband died he left me two pairs of leather boots. Do you them. They are size 101/2

Nancy Sinatra . . . My boots are made for walking and I am going to walk all over you. Is this what you meant by "get my boots."

 

[Quantrill]

I call it radical love because to people like you loving your Muslim neighbors seems radical. So instead you disregard the commandment to love you neighbor of another race. See the story of the Good Samaritan.

Do I? Give me the Scripture where I am required to love my neighbor of another race just because they are of another race. Give me the Scripture and explain to me the 'story of the Good Samaritan' so I know you know what you are talking about.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

I call it radical love because to people like you loving your Muslim neighbors seems radical. So instead you disregard the commandment to love you neighbor of another race. See the story of the Good Samaritan.

P.S. Regarding boots . . . When my husband died he left me two pairs of leather boots. Do you them. They are size 101/2

Nancy Sinatra . . . My boots are made for walking and I am going to walk all over you. Is this what you meant by "get my boots."

I put on the boots when the BS gets deep. You asked.

Quantrill

 

[humble soul]

No comment. You don't need to hear my political views. Who cares anyway. It's all opinion. My view, your view, their view......bound to divide us.

 

[Susannah]

Do I? Give me the Scripture where I am required to love my neighbor of another race just because they are of another race. Give me the Scripture and explain to me the 'story of the Good Samaritan' so I know you know what you are talking about.

Quantrill

Christ said to love our neighbor. Someone asked him who was our neighbor was. He told the story of the Good Samaritan. A man was robbed and left at the side of the road. Jewish man walked by and left him there. But the Samaritan who was of a different race stopped to help him. He took him to a Tavern and paid for his care. The story is called the Good Samaritan and explains that Christ wants us to love others of a different race if they're good people. I know a lot of good Muslims. Some of my best friends are Muslims. We don't necessarily have to like them but we're required to love them. I'm on my cell phone so I cannot tell you where this is in the Bible but it's a pretty famous story. I'm surprised you haven't heard of it before with all your scholarly knowledge

 

[Quantrill]

Susannah

With all my scholarly knowledge? Am I a scholar because I ask for the verses you are alluding to? The story is found in (Luke 10:25-37). My point was not that I have never heard of the story. My point is that you stress this 'love thy neighbor' commandment as how to obtain eternal life, yet you don't know where it is located in the Bible.

You say the story is about how Christ wants us to love others of another race if they are good people. Strange, since Jesus said only God is good. (Luke 18:18-19) And, there is absolutely nothing in the story to indicate that the man who was robbed and beaten was a good man. That is not the point. And the point isn't that Christians should be kind to their fellow man. Nothing wrong with that of course. But that was not what Jesus is teaching here. And also, nothing is said of the race of the beaten man either. So, for all we know, the good Samaritan may have been helping another Samaritan.

A lawyer came up to Jesus with wrong motives. He was trying to trap Jesus with the law. He was a lawyer of the Mosaic Law. (Luke 10:25) (10:29) So he asks Jesus what he can do to inherit eternal life? Jesus knew his intent and threw the question right back at him. What does the law say? (10:26) The lawyer answered back citing (Deut. 6:5) and (Lev. 19:18) "Love the Lord they God" "Love thy neighbor" That is the essence of the Law.
And Jesus agreed with him saying 'go do likewise'. (Luke 10:28) In other words if you want eternal life by the Law, then go obey it. If the question of the lawyer had been an honest one, he would have at this point said, but I cannot keep the law, no matter how hard I try. But his question was a dishonest one. So the Bible tells us that he replied back to Jesus, "But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbor?"

Then Jesus gave the story of the Good Samaritan. (Luke 10:30-36) In this story Jesus points out the inability of the Law, as represented in the Jewish priest and the Levite who passed by the beaten man, to treat this man as a neighbor. (Luke 10:31-32) These could probably cite some Laws of cleanliness and how they were to not be polluted.

But the Samaritan came along and helped the man. And Jesus asked the lawyer who of these three was a neighbor. (Luke 10:36) The lawyer said, him that shows mercy. And Jesus told him to go and do likewise. (37)

The Law says, love God and love your neighbor....just like you like to always say. This young lawyer, who sought to justify himself, would always say the same. The man appealed to the law to inherit eternal life. Thus Christ took him to the law. He is found still without eternal life because he can't do it. Christ could have easily said at this time that he He is the Way, Truth, and Life and believe on Me for eternal life. But He didn't. The man wanted to justify himself. He walked away unsaved as a result.

Nothing wrong with loving God and being a good neighbor. But that doesn't get you eternal life. Only faith in Christ, where there is mercy.

Quantrill

 

[Susannah]

Faith without works is dead. Because he helped the man who was robbed he is a good person. His deedd are all the proof I need. You are obviously very intelligent and have a good memory. So you know every part of the Bible by heart. It's very sad to me that you would look down on others who don't have a good memory. I used to know the Bible completely. Now I have dementia and my memory is not so good so I retain the best parts. They are written on my heart.

 

[Quantrill]

Faith without works is dead. Because he helped the man who was robbed he is a good person. His deedd are all the proof I need. You are obviously very intelligent and have a good memory. So you know every part of the Bible by heart. It's very sad to me that you would look down on others who don't have a good memory. I used to know the Bible completely. Now I have dementia and my memory is not so good so I retain the best parts. They are written on my heart.

You simply ignored what I said.

I don't know every part of the Bible by heart. I own and study the Bible. I have a Concordance to help look up verses where I cant remember where they are located. I have the computer where you can google the verse and it will come up where it is located. All you had to do is google 'the good samaritan' and you would have known the verses where it was found.

You say you used to know the Bible completely. Seems strange. It is your view of the Bible that is questionable to me. You don't believe it is the Word of God. You only believe those parts of it you want to believe. You call God 'she' when God is masculine throughout the Bible. Don't blame this on dementia.

Quantrill

 

[Susannah]

It's true. I do think for myself except when the Holy Spirit talks to me and then I obey. She has not said much about you except that I should not underestimate you. She appreciates your sincerity and devotion, but she feels you have lost sight of the big picture. There is more to life than the scripture. There is a personal relationship with God. Tell me more about that part of your faith. How did you come to the Lord? What was it like for you?

I have learned that not everyone has a "on the road to Damascus" kind of experience, but I did. I used to work for a theology professor who wrote books about religion. He asked to take me to lunch one day. Over our meal he said, "I have been a devoted reader of the Bible and tried to be a good Christian, but I never had the spiritual experience you had." I reassured him that this was because he did not need one. I was a sinner and agnostic and God needed to get my attention. He did with three minutes of euphoria and a new faith that I had waited a lifetime for.

After this, I guess neglected the Bible because I was so high off my union with God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. Now it is time for me to go back to basics and I think God has put you in my life to help me with Bible study. You can channel God's word for me. If I can do anything to help you in return let me know. I KNOW this does not answer your post but this is what I have been asked to write to you. It comes from Spirit, my guardian angel. I hope you are available to do this. Let's start with which version of the Bible to read. Remember I have a slight of dementia so be patient with me.

 

[humble soul]

There is more to life than the scripture. There is a personal relationship with God.

Tend to agree. Though I admit I need to upgrade my understanding of important verses in the Bible. So easy to misconstrue verses like "turn the other cheek". Taking verses at face value is usually the wrong option.
Seems that some love the Bible. Love quoting it. Love arguing about it. I will never be like that. I respect it but I don't think it solves all life problems. We need to search other areas, read other books in my opinion. I could be wrong. Whatever works for you I guess.

 

[jasonc]

Though I wasn't aware at the time, I went through a period of strong radicalisation. I will mention that it was right wing political views. But don't wish this to become a political thread. All I'm saying is , that it is easy to get swept up in strong views and hatred of polar opposite views.
It's very gradual. You hardly notice. For me it came as a reaction to same sex marriage debates.
Now I look back and think it doesn't matter who is right or wrong. Don't get caught up in demonizing others. Have a view but don't get carried away. Humanize. Don't dehumanise. Avoid absolute views.
Now that might sound weak to some of you. But I want to take a moderate position and avoid all the mud slinging. It's not worth losing sleep over.

while i dont hold hatred of an opposing view, i remain what some call extreme right. i work for the govt and i have served, i have seen the govt shaft men and i am now fightin the irs. the irs doesnt care if you file for bankruptcy, they will file to dismiss you bankruptcy if you get behind. sorry the rules are the rules. the va, i have seen that shaft a few veterans who cant work and not change their mind and they will squirm. wiggle and lie to get out of paying you.

never mind the ft.hood deaths of somehow now 8 soldiers! so yeah that is why despite, years of so called reform( the va needs more money,and the army cant seem to stop the rapes and that has gone on since tail hook) yeah lets ban vulgar speech and porn mags and somehow that will stop rape. and yes that is true. im not suggesting that a believer should look at porn or have crude speech but to say that if you do these things you WILL rape is a bit much. how about we instead actually punish the rapist and stop commanders from hiding those that do these things from punishment!

 

[Susannah]

Great idea. When it comes to the IRS it's all about money. And we know what the Bible says about that.

 

[Quantrill]

It's true. I do think for myself except when the Holy Spirit talks to me and then I obey. She has not said much about you except that I should not underestimate you. She appreciates your sincerity and devotion, but she feels you have lost sight of the big picture. There is more to life than the scripture. There is a personal relationship with God. Tell me more about that part of your faith. How did you come to the Lord? What was it like for you?

I have learned that not everyone has a "on the road to Damascus" kind of experience, but I did. I used to work for a theology professor who wrote books about religion. He asked to take me to lunch one day. Over our meal he said, "I have been a devoted reader of the Bible and tried to be a good Christian, but I never had the spiritual experience you had." I reassured him that this was because he did not need one. I was a sinner and agnostic and God needed to get my attention. He did with three minutes of euphoria and a new faith that I had waited a lifetime for.

After this, I guess neglected the Bible because I was so high off my union with God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. Now it is time for me to go back to basics and I think God has put you in my life to help me with Bible study. You can channel God's word for me. If I can do anything to help you in return let me know. I KNOW this does not answer your post but this is what I have been asked to write to you. It comes from Spirit, my guardian angel. I hope you are available to do this. Let's start with which version of the Bible to read. Remember I have a slight of dementia so be patient with me.

I don't like the word 'she' when speaking of God. I don't like the word 'channel' when teaching the Word of God. I don't accept what you say about God telling you that I have lost sight of the big picture but that 'she' appreciates my sincerity. God is not a 'she'.

I believe you know already that I am a King James Version Bible person.

You must first believe the Bible is the Word of God. All of it. Not just the parts you want. Are you willing to start from there. If not, there is no reason to go any farther.

Quantrill

 

[humble soul]

You must first believe the Bible is the Word of God. All of it. Not just the parts you want

How often do you read the Book of Leviticus? Where's the love in that book? Full of rules and regulations. Book of Joshua full of violence...sorry not well versed in that one.
Arguing over the verses of the Bible seems to be your fave game. When we don't want to play, you accuse us of being fake Christians. There's more than one way to be Christian. But you want to narrow the goalposts. I call that narrow minded.

 

[Susannah]

It is true that I don't follow the Old Testament. I definitly see it is a history of the Jews and as a survivor of incest I could never get past the story of Lot sleeping with his daughters. And it's all about the law. I think this is why Jesus came down to earth to talk to us directly. He wanted us to move beyond the law into a personal relationship with him. The New Testament it's definitely the Word of God. So I guess I became a sinner when I took off my veil. So be it.

I will try to be more open-minded about the scripture in the New Testament. And for the sake of our conversation I will no longer use the female pronoun. I know the Holy Spirit is not female. It's just the way that I imagine the HS when I'm stressed. I don't think God cares how we imagine him. He just cares that we obey him for our own good. Because he loves us and he knows best. He knows much more about how to make us happy than we ourselves know. So every prayer I make I end with the words die will be done.

What passage in the New Testament do you want to discuss first? I'd like to start with the most important things and work our way down to the mundane. Oops I mean less important.

 

[Quantrill]

How often do you read the Book of Leviticus? Where's the love in that book? Full of rules and regulations. Book of Joshua full of violence...sorry not well versed in that one.
Arguing over the verses of the Bible seems to be your fave game. When we don't want to play, you accuse us of being fake Christians. There's more than one way to be Christian. But you want to narrow the goalposts. I call that narrow minded.

I always am reading through the Bible. When I finish, I start over again. So I read Leviticus when it is time.

There is not more than one way to be a Christian. There is only One way. Jesus Christ.

Quantrill

 

[humble soul]

There is not more than one way to be a Christian. There is only One way.

And yet there are so many versions of Christianity. Personally I don't think you rate Christian behaviour highly enough. And that is how we draw others to Christianity.
The saved paradigm that many non Catholics embrace is problematic in my view. One being that complacency sets in. " oh I'm saved..I can relax now. "No need to make any more effort." It harbours overconfidence imo.